Evidence from UK's National Crime Agency 'critical' in sentencing Koh Tao killers to death

jimmybkk · February 25, 2016

Is it actually established translators were threatened? Or is it gossip based on hearsay, gone through some revisions as such is known to do?

The problem as I see with all the conspiracy theories, why I'm not convinced in the latest one at least, is a regular reliance on repeating messages so as to turn them into facts- such as above.

I'm almost convinced there is a small group of gossip mongers, a gaggle I've seen written, based on Samui who have never had their narrative of events challenged in a public manner. They control local press, issue FB meme based on errors, attempt various FB bannings, issue personal attacks on forums, and otherwise attempt censor any kind of discourse that counters their scripts.

While I was of the general impression Nom Sod and clan may well have been guilty as hell, and the B-2 not involved, just reading the seriously deficient arguments here has me wondering. Did the B-2 ( or just the one) partake into the initial rape party? Did he actually drag his friend into the accusation in order to give himself an alibi, which backfired a bit, especially for the friend?

Meanwhile a Thai translator being used by Sky News in court has said she's been "warned off" helping journalists by the Thai "Mafia".

http://news.sky.com/story/1515906/backpacker-murder-dna-setback-for-defence

Exactly, no name, no nothing, no quotes from local press, just crap reporting.

This is a direct named quote however and maybe should be listened to?

Ms Witheridge's family said: "Speculation, rumour and theory have been incredibly hurtful to our family and Hannah's friends, making an already unthinkable time harder to bear.

since you bring it up - it seems that you didn't read what Hannah's sister said recently about the case, go have a look

"Is it actually established translators were threatened?"

It was reported by 2 foreign journalists, one for Sky News and one for The Guardian (http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/dec/24/british-backpacker-case-thailand-on-trial-hannah-witheridge-david-miller). Both reputable enough organizations. I'm inclined to believe it to be true. Do you have any info that they conspired to mislead their readers/viewers, or do you just doubt everything a journo says until you are able to find something to corroborate the story? It must take you forever to read the morning papers...

"Or is it gossip based on hearsay, gone through some revisions as such is known to do?"

Well, wasn't she the translator for the Sky News journalist who reported that she had quit because she had been threatened... I woulda thought that he was closely enough involved for it not to warrant the "gossip based on hearsay" label.

"The problem as I see with all the conspiracy theories, why I'm not convinced in the latest one at least, is a regular reliance on repeating messages so as to turn them into facts- such as above"

Priceless... But I totally have to agree with you on this... It's just sooooooo obvious that she wasn't really threatened by any mafia. I'm guessing she just quit over something completely innocent and that the reporter and the rest of the Sky TV News team came up with this story to get more viewers... Oh but wait... Hmmm... wouldn't that be a consp..... Nahhh.... Forget it...

"Did the B-2 ( or just the one) partake into the initial rape party? Did he actually drag his friend into the accusation in order to give himself an alibi, which backfired a bit, especially for the friend?"

Hmmm... baseless and wild speculation cunningly disguised as introspective musings that unwittingly, due to the depth of your introspection, you typed into a public internet forum to take their place amongst all the other rumours and all the other gossip...Good job!

jayjay78 · February 25, 2016

Look where

Laura Witheridge

21 hrs ·

So, as some of you may have already seen- there has been another death of yet another British National on koh tao. I wasn’t going to post anything, not until I logged on here this morning to see that a friend had shared the link warning people not to go there… it wasn’t the sharing of the link or the warning that triggered this lengthy status, as I hope people do share these things and try and warn people not to go… it was the ignorant comment someone had made about how Thailand is ‘the most beautiful place in the world’ that frustrated me this morning. Aesthetically, on a postcard or photograph, maybe… However, literally… I have to disagree. Lots of things ‘look’ beautiful. You only have to consider a lion, or tiger… beautiful to look at, yes… but get too close and they will tear you apart and feed you to their young. My point being that aesthetic beauty can lure you into a very dangerous trap.

Since Hannah was taken from us, I am continually asked whether I will warn the World about the dangers of Thailand… I am asked if I will warn people because I might just ‘save someone’s life’. This person’s comment serves as a perfect example of why I would be wasting my time. People can be ignorant and many, probably the majority, have very short memories. Countless times, I have logged in to facebook and seen statuses made by people who know both Hannah and I, who have gone out there anyway. They think it wont happen to them… Well, guess what? Neither did we. No one is immune. Many thai’s hate westeners and they have little to no regard for human life. I don’t say this lightly, or without reason. Let me share a few facts with you about this ‘beautiful’ place you speak of…

Many of the thai people have no regard for human life. My evidence for this statement: firstly, some quotes of the things said to my bereaved, heart broken family by the judges and court officials at the trial of the two Burmese migrants-

* “why are you here? Why do you care? She is dead already”

* “why are you so bothered? Just go home and make another one”

* “why are you making such a fuss, she will be back in 30 days as

something else, she may have better luck next time”

Would it surprise you if I told you that the thai’s view drug possession as a more serious offence than rape or murder? Or that the vast majority of the thai police force are corrupt? What if I told you that when we went to Thailand to bring Hannah home, we were offered the opportunity to go to the Royal Thai police headquarters for an ‘official update’… but that, on arrival, we were taken into a large room, left for 5 minutes before the door opened and around 200 journalists were allowed into the room and we were ambushed by this mob of hungry journalists shoving cameras in our faces… The thai police chief had no intentions of giving us an update… after all, the bungled investigation meant he had nothing to tell us. The invitation was so that he could make money out of our misery. The press had paid him generously for 5 minutes to capture photographs of our family. The photograph on this post serves as evidence of this: http://bangkok.coconuts.co/…/we-need-digest-trial-outcome-s…

What if I told you that since we lost Hannah there have been many more suspicious deaths on koh tao. You probably haven’t heard of them all, as not all were British Nationals. The deaths, where possible, are covered up as suicides and accidents. This would have happened with Hannah, if it had not been for the hideous brutality of her passing. I highly suspect that with this latest tragedy, the thai’s will say that it was an accidental death caused by drugs. Hiding the truth and offering a story that suits, is something that they do often… My thoughts are with Luke Miller’s family and friends.

What if I told you that I have had many death threats from thai people since they murdered my sister? That they defaced photographs of me saying that the killers had only done ‘half the job’… what if I told you that people commented on these photographs saying things like ‘there is still time’, and ‘tick tock tick tock’. What if I told you that I have been sent crime scene photographs? What if I told you that I have been chased in my car? What if I told you that the thais offered us ‘compensation’ to try and keep us quiet? Obviously we were absolutely appalled and told them to shove it.

What if I told you that I am now frightened of my own shadow? That I am constantly looking over my shoulder? That I am exhausted, but frightened to sleep because of the nightmares? I miss my sister desperately. My heart is heavy and my mind is tired.

Still think Thailand is beautiful? If your answer is still ‘yes’ then I would suggest you watch the following:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRi8AqoXxio&app=desktop

Please feel free to share this post

https://www.facebook.com/laura.witherid…/…/10153150628116986

JLCrab · February 25, 2016

Crab, you make it like this is his first trip from KT to BKK after a night of partying. Logically he had done it many times before and very probably already had things lined up for this trip. Nothing for him to figure out. This was a milk run for him.

I agree but the efforts to leave the island at around 5 or 6 AM or so to make the flight have been described as 'desperate' efforts -- if this was a milk run he would probably get the speedboat several hours earlier. And from all accounts, the guy, after a hard night of partying, might just routinely say: " Screw it -- so I'm late for class." and catch a later more convenient flight from Samui or Surat Thani.

As long as I'm here, the trial report suggested that the prosecution introduced evidence that no one was seen bothering or following the late Ms. Witheridge:

"The senior investigating officer did insist there was no evidence to suggest she was followed from the bar."

So as this was direct testimony introduced by the prosecution, the defense would have been able to introduce its own witnesses or evidence to refute the statement. They didn't.

http://www.edp24.co.uk/news/crime/hannah_witheridge_murder_trial_defence_team_hope_to_re_test_crucial_forensic_evidence_1_4164482

He probably would have... He might have...

Hardly an alibi.

Also, what the defence did or didn't do makes no difference to what happened on the night in question.

If you ask me the defense focused on missing or tainted evidence, when they should have been tearing apart the prosecutions case.

The defense would not have had to identity who that person or persons were -- just that the the defense provided witnesses such as other visitors from UK who spent time with the deceased that evening who so observed ... there are 2 young men now sitting in jail and to them I would presume the proceedings did and still do make a difference.

catsanddogs · February 25, 2016

Is it actually established translators were threatened? Or is it gossip based on hearsay, gone through some revisions as such is known to do?

The problem as I see with all the conspiracy theories, why I'm not convinced in the latest one at least, is a regular reliance on repeating messages so as to turn them into facts- such as above.

I'm almost convinced there is a small group of gossip mongers, a gaggle I've seen written, based on Samui who have never had their narrative of events challenged in a public manner. They control local press, issue FB meme based on errors, attempt various FB bannings, issue personal attacks on forums, and otherwise attempt censor any kind of discourse that counters their scripts.

While I was of the general impression Nom Sod and clan may well have been guilty as hell, and the B-2 not involved, just reading the seriously deficient arguments here has me wondering. Did the B-2 ( or just the one) partake into the initial rape party? Did he actually drag his friend into the accusation in order to give himself an alibi, which backfired a bit, especially for the friend?

Meanwhile a Thai translator being used by Sky News in court has said she's been "warned off" helping journalists by the Thai "Mafia".

http://news.sky.com/story/1515906/backpacker-murder-dna-setback-for-defence

Exactly, no name, no nothing, no quotes from local press, just crap reporting.

This is a direct named quote however and maybe should be listened to?

Ms Witheridge's family said: "Speculation, rumour and theory have been incredibly hurtful to our family and Hannah's friends, making an already unthinkable time harder to bear.

The whole investigation has been riddled with reporting with no names attached. Come to your own conclusions as to why.

Friends say Hannah and David left bar between 3 and 4am.

The person who phoned police when bodies discovered was not named and name not logged.

Person who took last known photo of Hannah and David declined to be named.

Person who was rumoured to have had argument with Hannah and David not named.

People who posted unofficial crime scene photos to web not named.

Westerners seen walking around with Hannah and David shortly before their deaths not named.

Fat guy and Asian woman seen at 1.26 and 1.56 in spitting distance of running man on CCTV not named.

Almost everyone who spoke to reporters in regards to a mafia presence on Koh Tao not named.

Number 9 man who shook hands with David who police no doubt tracked down not named.

Foreign woman seen running at the time of crimes who police wanted to track down not named.

Close aide (wanted man) of village headman who police said was likely to know something about the murders who fled to Bangkok not named as at 24.9.14.

Person or people who changed the crime scene and picked up all the items of clothing from the sand and placed them on the rock not named.

Person or people who stole the black trousers from the crime scene not named. Ditto wine bottle.

12 original suspects most of whom were not named.

3 westerners seen playing guitar and singing on beach before crime not named.

Local expat business people living on the island who said blame often fell to Burmese community asked not to be named.

Officials who 'lost' Hannah's clothing following Thai autopsy not named.

Police officials who taxi driver reported to have offered him a bribe not named.

Two French girls who McAnna said gave statements to police saying they heard screaming at time of crime not named.

Anyone and everyone who were the last to see Hannah and David alive not named.

Everyone who was reported to have been at the beach party with Hannah and David before their deaths not named. That's every single person!

People who claimed Nomsod had scratches and bruises on his body when seen in Bangkok following the murders not named.

Friends/teachers who could vouch for Nomsod's presence in Bangkok when the crimes were committed not named.

"I have witnesses - university friends and lecturers who saw me at the apartment where I reside. They include the apartment residents. They are all ready to testify to help me. Also there is surveillance camera footage showing me staying at the university and the apartment," he added. - See more at: http://news.asiaone.com/news/crime/thai-pm-vows-crackdown-koh-tao-vices#sthash.aGNUOLCZ.dpuf

http://news.asiaone.com/news/crime/thai-pm-vows-crackdown-koh-tao-vices

Close friend of Chris Ware who told the Mirror the idea Chris Ware could kill David and a girl was incomprehensible asked not to be named.

Running man still not named having previously been named as Mon (by himself).

People who Laura Witheridge claimed made threats to her and her family not named.

catsanddogs · February 25, 2016

Crab, you make it like this is his first trip from KT to BKK after a night of partying. Logically he had done it many times before and very probably already had things lined up for this trip. Nothing for him to figure out. This was a milk run for him.

I agree but the efforts to leave the island at around 5 or 6 AM or so to make the flight have been described as 'desperate' efforts -- if this was a milk run he would probably get the speedboat several hours earlier. And from all accounts, the guy, after a hard night of partying, might just routinely say: " Screw it -- so I'm late for class." and catch a later more convenient flight from Samui or Surat Thani.

As long as I'm here, the trial report suggested that the prosecution introduced evidence that no one was seen bothering or following the late Ms. Witheridge:

"The senior investigating officer did insist there was no evidence to suggest she was followed from the bar."

So as this was direct testimony introduced by the prosecution, the defense would have been able to introduce its own witnesses or evidence to refute the statement. They didn't.

http://www.edp24.co.uk/news/crime/hannah_witheridge_murder_trial_defence_team_hope_to_re_test_crucial_forensic_evidence_1_4164482

How can the the police, prosecution or anyone for that matter state Hannah was not followed from the bar when no one can produce any evidence she even left the bar? Or that David left the bar? CCTV evidence of them going in - none of them exiting...something's not right.

stephenterry · February 25, 2016

So the defence should have said so you have evidence that she left the bar?

stephenterry · February 25, 2016

Clearly Thai thugs committed the crimes. That the court decided otherwise is protecting them. And as the appeal judges are based in Surat thani they will continue to support their fellow samui judges. Probably the only court that could be independent is Chiang Mai

JLCrab · February 25, 2016

Clearly Thai thugs committed the crimes. That the court decided otherwise is protecting them. And as the appeal judges are based in Surat thani they will continue to support their fellow samui judges. Probably the only court that could be independent is Chiang Mai

If you say so, must be so.

However, if indeed the crimes were committed by a bunch of 'Thai thugs' absent the one guy who everyone on here says was there but not one person has ever publicly said that he was there, would the same millions of dollars and code-of-silence among a large cast of characters been deployed -- why would powerful persons want to protect those persons if the key thug really was not there?

Edited February 25, 2016 by JLCrab

JLCrab · February 25, 2016

Crab, you make it like this is his first trip from KT to BKK after a night of partying. Logically he had done it many times before and very probably already had things lined up for this trip. Nothing for him to figure out. This was a milk run for him.

I agree but the efforts to leave the island at around 5 or 6 AM or so to make the flight have been described as 'desperate' efforts -- if this was a milk run he would probably get the speedboat several hours earlier. And from all accounts, the guy, after a hard night of partying, might just routinely say: " Screw it -- so I'm late for class." and catch a later more convenient flight from Samui or Surat Thani.

As long as I'm here, the trial report suggested that the prosecution introduced evidence that no one was seen bothering or following the late Ms. Witheridge:

"The senior investigating officer did insist there was no evidence to suggest she was followed from the bar."

So as this was direct testimony introduced by the prosecution, the defense would have been able to introduce its own witnesses or evidence to refute the statement. They didn't.

http://www.edp24.co.uk/news/crime/hannah_witheridge_murder_trial_defence_team_hope_to_re_test_crucial_forensic_evidence_1_4164482

How can the the police, prosecution or anyone for that matter state Hannah was not followed from the bar when no one can produce any evidence she even left the bar? Or that David left the bar? CCTV evidence of them going in - none of them exiting...something's not right.

Still there has not one person who has publicly come forward and stated that anyone was confronting the late Ms. Witheridge with propositions sexual or otherwise. Not even persons who were with her that evening and have returned to UK.

stephenterry · February 25, 2016

I'm merely stating that the appeal judges wouldn't dismiss the conviction. They might lessen the sentence to life imprisonment, and I doubt that the defence won't take that to the supreme court. Pragmatism could prevail as there's zero chance the authorities will back down. That's my take on it. I hope I am wrong but I don't hold out much hope.

JLCrab · February 25, 2016

I'm merely stating that the appeal judges wouldn't dismiss the conviction. They might lessen the sentence to life imprisonment, and I doubt that the defence won't take that to the supreme court. Pragmatism could prevail as there's zero chance the authorities will back down. That's my take on it. I hope I am wrong but I don't hold out much hope.

I would seem that a properly strutcured Defense Appeal would allow the Appeals Court to say that, while they will not say whether the 2 convicted are not directly or indirectly complicit in these crimes, the Appeals Court does not see proof beyond reasonable doubt. The RTP can then say that they disagree with the decision and that they have arrested and brought to trial the true killers and that they will not be looking elsewhere.

... and someone who is suggested to have rigged and financed this whole operation might be happy with such an outcome.

DiscoDan · February 25, 2016

Clearly Thai thugs committed the crimes. That the court decided otherwise is protecting them. And as the appeal judges are based in Surat thani they will continue to support their fellow samui judges. Probably the only court that could be independent is Chiang Mai

Clearly they are Burmese that committed the crime and are in jail, if it is the court is protecting them how comes all the truthers are now attacking the defense team & Andy Hall ?

Robert Holmes said at the end of the trial the defense did not do enough to discredit the dna evidence, and if found guilty this would be why,

But if it is so clear that Thais committed the crime maybe you would like to share the evidence you have ?

balo · February 25, 2016

This is a theory like many other theories, is it possible to make it to Bangkok that fast ? Yes I guess so but that would mean a lot of luck on the way ,

Nomsod was not seen on the island , he was not seen at the airport , unless airport officials suddenly decided to hide CCTV images after a call from the influential "mafia" dad. This is all far-out speculations.

Nomsod is shown in the 3 Running Man videos. Nomsod is probably shown in parts of the 59 hours of videos that RTP won't show - and that's not counting the hours of CCTV which Mon refused to hand over to RTP. ....and not counting the CCTV which RTP deemed "too unimportant to even look at" , which may have shown boats leaving the island in the hour after the crime. And there's Maung Maung, a Burmese DJ at AC bar who is said to have claimed to have seen NS in one of the bars that Sunday night. No one is surprises that MM the DJ split to Burma, never to be heard from. Of course, prosecution didn't want the other MM (formerly of the B3) testifying. He also split to Burma, to be incognito. And RTP/prosecution didn't want anything from Sean - who similarly was scooted out of Thailand a.s.a.p. and not heard from again. Those are 3 potential witnesses which Thai authorities (working hand in hand with the Headman's people) don't want to hear a peep from. There are probably others. Even Thai cops admitted that some islanders are too afraid to speak the truth of what they heard/saw.
As for airport: Can we see CCTV of passengers entering or leaving that Monday morning flight to Bkk from Chumpon? Can we see the passenger manifest? Of course not. It's all part of the bungled cover-up which goes all the way up to the self-appointed PM. We, the general public seeking truth & justice will also never see/hear about cell phone histories from that night and the next day. Similarly, we will never see/hear about any money transactions between the Headman's people (including Mon, Headman's wife, NS, NS's lawyer) which likely involved top brass cops. RTP aren't going to incriminate themselves, are they? ha ha ha, they're laughing all the way to the bank. While Nomsod can dress in flimsy white cotton smock with a gold crown, showing the world what a devout lovely Buddhist boy he is.

Note: Bribing is common in Thailand. It's more often done indirectly, rather than from a principle player to the other principle player. It's more common for money or valuables to be transferred clandestinely via a family member or trusted acquaintance. Thaksin transferred money to his chauffeur and maid. Later, he had agents try to transfer money to a judge. A lawyer is often a good conduit, because even if he's caught carrying something, he can claim 'lawyer/client confidentiality.' On the day after the OJ murders in L.A., OJ's lawyer went in alone to visit OJ at his mansion, then came out carrying a suitcase. Cops couldn't stop or search the lawyer, who was grinning the whole time the press cameras were on him. Go figure.

Again this is you speculating as always, the running man video is not evidence good enough to suggest it is Nomsod, Mon or anyone else . Nomsod has not been seen on the island . Mon and B2 we can be sure about were there that night. Edited February 25, 2016 by balo

stephenterry · February 25, 2016

Clearly Thai thugs committed the crimes. That the court decided otherwise is protecting them. And as the appeal judges are based in Surat thani they will continue to support their fellow samui judges. Probably the only court that could be independent is Chiang Mai

Clearly they are Burmese that committed the crime and are in jail, if it is the court is protecting them how comes all the truthers are now attacking the defense team & Andy Hall ?

Robert Holmes said at the end of the trial the defense did not do enough to discredit the dna evidence, and if found guilty this would be why,

But if it is so clear that Thais committed the crime maybe you would like to share the evidence you have ?

Perhaps you would like to share the evidence that the B2 committed the crimes, because the RTP certainly didn't, and the court just accepted their word. Well, in my world, no court of justice in any civilised country would just accept the prosecution's word - they have to produce evidence that is beyond reasonable doubt, and that evidence has to be verified, substantiated, and validated. Needless to say, that wasn't forthcoming here in Samui.

It's perfectly clear to me that Thai thugs are being shielded from prosecution for the heinous crimes they committed in a rage of revenge against a defenceless woman who rejected their advances. Clear as daylight to any reasonable and rational person who has been following this case from day 1.

So sorry, but there is no point arguing with me, you're biased and wrong, and that's my final word to you on this thread. And if you continue to persist I will report you for flaming.

smedly · February 25, 2016

Clearly Thai thugs committed the crimes. That the court decided otherwise is protecting them. And as the appeal judges are based in Surat thani they will continue to support their fellow samui judges. Probably the only court that could be independent is Chiang Mai

Perhaps you would like to share the evidence that the B2 committed the crimes, because the RTP certainly didn't, and the court just accepted their word. Well, in my world, no court of justice in any civilised country would just accept the prosecution's word - they have to produce evidence that is beyond reasonable doubt, and that evidence has to be verified, substantiated, and validated. Needless to say, that wasn't forthcoming here in Samui.

It's perfectly clear to me that Thai thugs are being shielded from prosecution for the heinous crimes they committed in a rage of revenge against a defenceless woman who rejected their advances. Clear as daylight to any reasonable and rational person who has been following this case from day 1.

So sorry, but there is no point arguing with me, you're biased and wrong, and that's my final word to you on this thread. And if you continue to persist I will report you for flaming.

exactly correct

stander · February 25, 2016

Clearly Thai thugs committed the crimes. That the court decided otherwise is protecting them. And as the appeal judges are based in Surat thani they will continue to support their fellow samui judges. Probably the only court that could be independent is Chiang Mai

Clearly they are Burmese that committed the crime and are in jail, if it is the court is protecting them how comes all the truthers are now attacking the defense team & Andy Hall ?

Robert Holmes said at the end of the trial the defense did not do enough to discredit the dna evidence, and if found guilty this would be why,

But if it is so clear that Thais committed the crime maybe you would like to share the evidence you have ?

Perhaps you would like to share the evidence that the B2 committed the crimes, because the RTP certainly didn't, and the court just accepted their word. Well, in my world, no court of justice in any civilised country would just accept the prosecution's word - they have to produce evidence that is beyond reasonable doubt, and that evidence has to be verified, substantiated, and validated. Needless to say, that wasn't forthcoming here in Samui.

It's perfectly clear to me that Thai thugs are being shielded from prosecution for the heinous crimes they committed in a rage of revenge against a defenceless woman who rejected their advances. Clear as daylight to any reasonable and rational person who has been following this case from day 1.

So sorry, but there is no point arguing with me, you're biased and wrong, and that's my final word to you on this thread. And if you continue to persist I will report you for flaming.

The evidence was presented to the court, the prosecution and defence presented their case and provide counter arguments and they were found guilty.

They had the power of the judicial process to protect their rights and still have while the appeal is in process.

Now, you may not agree or like the verdict, but that's the facts.

IslandLover · February 25, 2016

Moonsterk, on 25 Feb 2016 - 04:50, said:

jayjay78, on 25 Feb 2016 - 04:42, said:

Moonsterk, on 25 Feb 2016 - 04:33, said:

Is it actually established translators were threatened? Or is it gossip based on hearsay, gone through some revisions as such is known to do?

The problem as I see with all the conspiracy theories, why I'm not convinced in the latest one at least, is a regular reliance on repeating messages so as to turn them into facts- such as above.

I'm almost convinced there is a small group of gossip mongers, a gaggle I've seen written, based on Samui who have never had their narrative of events challenged in a public manner. They control local press, issue FB meme based on errors, attempt various FB bannings, issue personal attacks on forums, and otherwise attempt censor any kind of discourse that counters their scripts.

While I was of the general impression Nom Sod and clan may well have been guilty as hell, and the B-2 not involved, just reading the seriously deficient arguments here has me wondering. Did the B-2 ( or just the one) partake into the initial rape party? Did he actually drag his friend into the accusation in order to give himself an alibi, which backfired a bit, especially for the friend?

Meanwhile a Thai translator being used by Sky News in court has said she's been "warned off" helping journalists by the Thai "Mafia".

http://news.sky.com/story/1515906/backpacker-murder-dna-setback-for-defence

Exactly, no name, no nothing, no quotes from local press, just crap reporting.

This is a direct named quote however and maybe should be listened to?

Ms Witheridge's family said: "Speculation, rumour and theory have been incredibly hurtful to our family and Hannah's friends, making an already unthinkable time harder to bear.

Christy, I already told you that Sky News reporter JONATHAN SAMUELS confirmed that his translator had been warned off. If anybody has a link to the video interview with him outside the courtroom at the beginning of the trial, please post it because I couldn't be bothered to look for it.

IslandLover · February 25, 2016

greenchair, on 25 Feb 2016 - 04:56, said:greenchair, on 25 Feb 2016 - 04:56, said:greenchair, on 25 Feb 2016 - 04:56, said:

jayjay78, on 25 Feb 2016 - 03:43, said:jayjay78, on 25 Feb 2016 - 03:43, said:jayjay78, on 25 Feb 2016 - 03:43, said:
greenchair, on 25 Feb 2016 - 03:21, said:greenchair, on 25 Feb 2016 - 03:21, said:greenchair, on 25 Feb 2016 - 03:21, said:
Oh thank you aleg for bringing that to the forum attention.

I have read parts of it, but will read in full later. The noids will certainly be upset, but at the end of the day we should read all of the information available. I see that Davids inquest is in.

Yes better catch up on your homework seems your lagging somewhat dear, this was first brought to the forums and everyone elses attention when Andy Hall first tweeted it 5 weeks ago. [noids].............bless

Jan 13, 2016 - Andy Hall @Atomicalandy Jan 13. MWRN Justice: Koh Tao Murder Case fundraiser provides full court verdict English translation ...

Well that's so sad my friend Jay because when I tried to get into aleg post but I see I must have drop box that I don't have. And unfortunately the noids are not adept at links. Could you possibly supply the link to it from one noid to a shill.

Bless .

Greenchair, all you have to do is register with Drop Box via their website (with your email address and user name) and download the PDF. It is a large file, around 41 pages.

Edited February 25, 2016 by IslandLover

JLCrab · February 25, 2016

Mr. Samuels wrote on 9 JULY 2015 that his translator had been warned off by the Mafia and on 10 JULY 2015 he was submitting dispatches from the Samui Courtroom on his Twitter account.

DiscoDan · February 25, 2016

Moonsterk, on 25 Feb 2016 - 04:50, said:

jayjay78, on 25 Feb 2016 - 04:42, said:

Moonsterk, on 25 Feb 2016 - 04:33, said:

Is it actually established translators were threatened? Or is it gossip based on hearsay, gone through some revisions as such is known to do?

The problem as I see with all the conspiracy theories, why I'm not convinced in the latest one at least, is a regular reliance on repeating messages so as to turn them into facts- such as above.

I'm almost convinced there is a small group of gossip mongers, a gaggle I've seen written, based on Samui who have never had their narrative of events challenged in a public manner. They control local press, issue FB meme based on errors, attempt various FB bannings, issue personal attacks on forums, and otherwise attempt censor any kind of discourse that counters their scripts.

While I was of the general impression Nom Sod and clan may well have been guilty as hell, and the B-2 not involved, just reading the seriously deficient arguments here has me wondering. Did the B-2 ( or just the one) partake into the initial rape party? Did he actually drag his friend into the accusation in order to give himself an alibi, which backfired a bit, especially for the friend?

Meanwhile a Thai translator being used by Sky News in court has said she's been "warned off" helping journalists by the Thai "Mafia".

http://news.sky.com/story/1515906/backpacker-murder-dna-setback-for-defence

Exactly, no name, no nothing, no quotes from local press, just crap reporting.

This is a direct named quote however and maybe should be listened to?

Ms Witheridge's family said: "Speculation, rumour and theory have been incredibly hurtful to our family and Hannah's friends, making an already unthinkable time harder to bear.

Christy, I already told you that Sky News reporter JONATHAN SAMUELS confirmed that his translator had been warned off. If anybody has a link to the video interview with him outside the courtroom at the beginning of the trial, please post it because I couldn't be bothered to look for it.

Did the guy doing the threatening show is Thai Mafia ID card ?

Funny all those reporters there & no one managed to get a photo of this person?

Also trying to expose forum members personal info is against Thai visa forum rules.

StealthEnergiser · February 25, 2016

Clearly Thai thugs committed the crimes. That the court decided otherwise is protecting them. And as the appeal judges are based in Surat thani they will continue to support their fellow samui judges. Probably the only court that could be independent is Chiang Mai

Clearly they are Burmese that committed the crime and are in jail, if it is the court is protecting them how comes all the truthers are now attacking the defense team & Andy Hall ?

Robert Holmes said at the end of the trial the defense did not do enough to discredit the dna evidence, and if found guilty this would be why,

But if it is so clear that Thais committed the crime maybe you would like to share the evidence you have ?

Perhaps you would like to share the evidence that the B2 committed the crimes, because the RTP certainly didn't, and the court just accepted their word. Well, in my world, no court of justice in any civilised country would just accept the prosecution's word - they have to produce evidence that is beyond reasonable doubt, and that evidence has to be verified, substantiated, and validated. Needless to say, that wasn't forthcoming here in Samui.

It's perfectly clear to me that Thai thugs are being shielded from prosecution for the heinous crimes they committed in a rage of revenge against a defenceless woman who rejected their advances. Clear as daylight to any reasonable and rational person who has been following this case from day 1.

So sorry, but there is no point arguing with me, you're biased and wrong, and that's my final word to you on this thread. And if you continue to persist I will report you for flaming.

Maybe he can also present evidence what mon was doing running around the crime scene for about 55 minutes before calling Police Lieutenant Jakkapan Kaewkao, the islands top cop who was 5 minutes away.

DiscoDan · February 25, 2016

Clearly Thai thugs committed the crimes. That the court decided otherwise is protecting them. And as the appeal judges are based in Surat thani they will continue to support their fellow samui judges. Probably the only court that could be independent is Chiang Mai

Clearly they are Burmese that committed the crime and are in jail, if it is the court is protecting them how comes all the truthers are now attacking the defense team & Andy Hall ?

Robert Holmes said at the end of the trial the defense did not do enough to discredit the dna evidence, and if found guilty this would be why,

But if it is so clear that Thais committed the crime maybe you would like to share the evidence you have ?

Perhaps you would like to share the evidence that the B2 committed the crimes, because the RTP certainly didn't, and the court just accepted their word. Well, in my world, no court of justice in any civilised country would just accept the prosecution's word - they have to produce evidence that is beyond reasonable doubt, and that evidence has to be verified, substantiated, and validated. Needless to say, that wasn't forthcoming here in Samui.

It's perfectly clear to me that Thai thugs are being shielded from prosecution for the heinous crimes they committed in a rage of revenge against a defenceless woman who rejected their advances. Clear as daylight to any reasonable and rational person who has been following this case from day 1.

So sorry, but there is no point arguing with me, you're biased and wrong, and that's my final word to you on this thread. And if you continue to persist I will report you for flaming.

plenty of evidence over 400 pages, and no evidence or witnesses to suggest that the scenario you have made up is true.

Edited February 25, 2016 by DiscoDan

IslandLover · February 25, 2016

Khun Han, on 25 Feb 2016 - 05:31, said:
It's not the 'JD' character that posters have mentioned, is it?

No. It is a person that is usually engaged in dissing Thailand at every opportunity.

IslandLover · February 25, 2016

stephenterry, on 25 Feb 2016 - 06:59, said:

Moonsterk, on 25 Feb 2016 - 06:43, said:

stephenterry, on 25 Feb 2016 - 05:20, said:

Khun Han, on 25 Feb 2016 - 05:01, said:
So now we get a taste of how this thread is going. Engage at your peril. Eventually, every attempt at responding will be met by two or three verbose replies full of infuriating deceit and misdirection, and the thread will soon go haywire. Just look at the Luke Miller thread to see where this one's going.

Nothing's changed. Nowadays, I refrain for engaging with any that post inflammatory comments. If a poster is not going to accept an account by a reputable Sky News reporter, then that's his problem, not mine. Although speculation, I wouldn't be surprised if more people were threatened by the Thai mafia, but kept quiet.

Clearly, AH is an irritant to Thai authorities, but he's high enough profile as to be only subjected to repeat court appearances and ongoing hassle. It is also my understanding that the Appeals court examine only the written appeal, which must be based on the existing 'evidence', and do not call upon any witnesses while considering their verdict. In which case, AH would not be called before the court.

So why was an irritant allowed to be seen as participating in this defense? What was the gain?

Ask him. He has a twitter/FB page.

She can't, she's already been blocked.

bannork · February 25, 2016

So am I right in assuming there has been no formal recording of harassment of Hannah in the AC bar, have any witnesses/ tourists come forward to say, ' yes, this guy.... was putting on her but she wasn't interested'

Is there any finger pointing by the AC bar patrons of particular suspects ? Surely by now this must have been revealed if it happened.

If not,then the brutal vengence/anger that is clear in the savage way Hannah was murdered must have originated from an incident outside, either on the street or on the beach,.

Was she hit on by one or more of the people she passed in the street, one or some of the football players for example?

it could be the 'mafia of Koh Tao' had nothing to do with it- after all to kill on your own doorstep and to leave the bodies there in full view doesn't make sense.

Edited February 25, 2016 by bannork

DiscoDan · February 25, 2016

Clearly Thai thugs committed the crimes. That the court decided otherwise is protecting them. And as the appeal judges are based in Surat thani they will continue to support their fellow samui judges. Probably the only court that could be independent is Chiang Mai

Clearly they are Burmese that committed the crime and are in jail, if it is the court is protecting them how comes all the truthers are now attacking the defense team & Andy Hall ?

Robert Holmes said at the end of the trial the defense did not do enough to discredit the dna evidence, and if found guilty this would be why,

But if it is so clear that Thais committed the crime maybe you would like to share the evidence you have ?

Perhaps you would like to share the evidence that the B2 committed the crimes, because the RTP certainly didn't, and the court just accepted their word. Well, in my world, no court of justice in any civilised country would just accept the prosecution's word - they have to produce evidence that is beyond reasonable doubt, and that evidence has to be verified, substantiated, and validated. Needless to say, that wasn't forthcoming here in Samui.

It's perfectly clear to me that Thai thugs are being shielded from prosecution for the heinous crimes they committed in a rage of revenge against a defenceless woman who rejected their advances. Clear as daylight to any reasonable and rational person who has been following this case from day 1.

So sorry, but there is no point arguing with me, you're biased and wrong, and that's my final word to you on this thread. And if you continue to persist I will report you for flaming.

Maybe he can also present evidence what mon was doing running around the crime scene for about 55 minutes before calling Police Lieutenant Jakkapan Kaewkao, the islands top cop who was 5 minutes away.

It happened in front of his resort and his gardener alerted him to the murders they went through all this at court.

Chetzee · February 25, 2016

Crab, you make it like this is his first trip from KT to BKK after a night of partying. Logically he had done it many times before and very probably already had things lined up for this trip. Nothing for him to figure out. This was a milk run for him.

I agree but the efforts to leave the island at around 5 or 6 AM or so to make the flight have been described as 'desperate' efforts -- if this was a milk run he would probably get the speedboat several hours earlier. And from all accounts, the guy, after a hard night of partying, might just routinely say: " Screw it -- so I'm late for class." and catch a later more convenient flight from Samui or Surat Thani.

As long as I'm here, the trial report suggested that the prosecution introduced evidence that no one was seen bothering or following the late Ms. Witheridge:

"The senior investigating officer did insist there was no evidence to suggest she was followed from the bar."

So as this was direct testimony introduced by the prosecution, the defense would have been able to introduce its own witnesses or evidence to refute the statement. They didn't.

http://www.edp24.co.uk/news/crime/hannah_witheridge_murder_trial_defence_team_hope_to_re_test_crucial_forensic_evidence_1_4164482

How can the the police, prosecution or anyone for that matter state Hannah was not followed from the bar when no one can produce any evidence she even left the bar? Or that David left the bar? CCTV evidence of them going in - none of them exiting...something's not right.

Still there has not one person who has publicly come forward and stated that anyone was confronting the late Ms. Witheridge with propositions sexual or otherwise. Not even persons who were with her that evening and have returned to UK.

..... so how do you account for the rumour just hours after the deaths that there was an altercation in AC bar . Some one said something, i guess in the broader sense that was in public ... certainly it was enough to get the police interested in making a visit to AC bar and testing some of the staff .

But wait that was the same visit that drugs were found on site and that was just brushed aside ... just another example of one rule for me and another for you on KT beach .

As a rule no smoke without fire ! which of course applies to Nomsod . Just how did his name pop up to start with ? Did someone want to drop him in the frame coz he's a spaky handed Lothareo , and they had a grudge against him . I can't see that can you ? SO that leaves the other scenario , where he was actually there on KT , involved or not !

the trouble is as i have said before that mud sticks .... it's as true for the burmese convicted as it is for Nsod who despite 18 months of denial remains in the frame ......

bannork · February 25, 2016

.. so how do you account for the rumour just hours after the deaths that there was an altercation in AC bar- excellent Chetzee, who was the quarrel between?

greenchair · February 25, 2016

So the defence should have said so you have evidence that she left the bar?

There lies the problem, there were many things the defense could have defended. They chose to go on about gaet analysis and the psychology of a killer .

StealthEnergiser · February 25, 2016

Thailand: Justice looks elusive in Koh Tao murders trial

by Asian Correspondent Staff |

9th July 2015

| @ascorrespondent

As the trial of two Burmese migrants for the murders of British backpackers Hannah Witheridge and David Miller on Koh Tao last year entered its second day, serious doubts remained over the ability of Thai authorities to deliver justice.

Zaw Lin and Wai Phyo, both 22, were charged in December last year, less than three months after the bodies of Miller, 24, and Witheridge, 23, were found on Sept. 15 on a beach on Koh Tao. Autopsies showed the British backpackers had suffered severe head wounds and Witheridge had been raped.

Jonathan Samuels

✔‎@jonathansamuels

Our Thai translator at backpacker murder trial says she's been 'warned off' by 'the Mafia'. Elements here clearly fear a fair trial. #kohtao

12:33 PM - 9 Jul 2015

https://asiancorrespondent.com/2015/07/thailand-justice-looks-elusive-in-koh-tao-murders-trial/