eBay, FedEx and customs charges

[recom273]

I have ordered many things around the value of 30B-2000B from eBay which have been delivered by my postman without incurring duty charges.

This is the second pair of motorbike boots I have bought from China, the first pair were about 1500b and they lasted 18 months through the rainy season and fell apart .. In other words, cheap Chinese junk. The price this time around was 2,200B including free shipping.

I ordered another pair, I was really surprised to get an email from the seller telling me he dispatched them via FedEx.

They turned up this morning, with a FedEx invoice asking for 800B in duty, there are a couple of posts here stating that FedEx and the customs dept overcharge.

For some quality items, unavailable in Thailand, that delivered with speed, then yes - no problem, I have paid duty on an official customs invoice delivered by EMS, at the post office, ( 1,700b on something costing in excess of 5,000B ) but some guy with a FedEx invoice on some cheap shoes .. No thanks.

I declined the parcel, denying all knowledge of the contents.

Does anyone know if the procedure from now on ?

[tx22cb]

FWIW, sharing my recent experience.

I bought something from Ebay earlier this year, with the product shipped from Europe - it came via courier (FedEx or DHL - I forget).

Courier charged for Import Duties/Taxes and a small processing fee. They attached a receipt from Customs for the Import Duties/Taxes, so it was legit and not "overcharged".

The Courier's small processing fee (which was transparent and itemized) was reasonable - I'd rather Courier deal with Customs than me trying to do it myself with a special trip to Customs House or whatever.

What next?

When you "declined the parcel, denying all knowledge of the contents", did you sign anything or make a verbal statement to that effect to FedEx? If so, FedEx will contact the Sender to try to reclaim the 800 Baht that FedEx paid. The Seller might be surprised, as he will now have proof that the product reached the Buyer, and the Seller might contact you later.

You could then try to negotiate with the Seller to share the Import duty, but he's probably stated that these costs are for the Buyer, so that's going to be tough.

If the product is unclaimed and the Seller does not want to incur additional cost to have it returned, it will probably be sold off to try to recoup the Duty and storage costs.

[thaibry]

FWIW, sharing my recent experience.

I bought something from Ebay earlier this year, with the product shipped from Europe - it came via courier (FedEx or DHL - I forget).

Courier charged for Import Duties/Taxes and a small processing fee. They attached a receipt from Customs for the Import Duties/Taxes, so it was legit and not "overcharged".

The Courier's small processing fee (which was transparent and itemized) was reasonable - I'd rather Courier deal with Customs than me trying to do it myself with a special trip to Customs House or whatever.

What next?

When you "declined the parcel, denying all knowledge of the contents", did you sign anything or make a verbal statement to that effect to FedEx? If so, FedEx will contact the Sender to try to reclaim the 800 Baht that FedEx paid. The Seller might be surprised, as he will now have proof that the product reached the Buyer, and the Seller might contact you later.

You could then try to negotiate with the Seller to share the Import duty, but he's probably stated that these costs are for the Buyer, so that's going to be tough.

If the product is unclaimed and the Seller does not want to incur additional cost to have it returned, it will probably be sold off to try to recoup the Duty and storage costs.

And you eBay and PayPal accounts may be withdrawn.

[recom273]

FWIW, sharing my recent experience.

I bought something from Ebay earlier this year, with the product shipped from Europe - it came via courier (FedEx or DHL - I forget).

Courier charged for Import Duties/Taxes and a small processing fee. They attached a receipt from Customs for the Import Duties/Taxes, so it was legit and not "overcharged".

The Courier's small processing fee (which was transparent and itemized) was reasonable - I'd rather Courier deal with Customs than me trying to do it myself with a special trip to Customs House or whatever.

What next?

When you "declined the parcel, denying all knowledge of the contents", did you sign anything or make a verbal statement to that effect to FedEx? If so, FedEx will contact the Sender to try to reclaim the 800 Baht that FedEx paid. The Seller might be surprised, as he will now have proof that the product reached the Buyer, and the Seller might contact you later.

You could then try to negotiate with the Seller to share the Import duty, but he's probably stated that these costs are for the Buyer, so that's going to be tough.

If the product is unclaimed and the Seller does not want to incur additional cost to have it returned, it will probably be sold off to try to recoup the Duty and storage costs.

No I didn't sign anything - I contacted the seller and told them a parcel just arrived, it could have been theirs or another seller and FedEx wanted some money - so without looking at the contents - couldn't tell.

They said its not due for delivery until Wednesday according to FedEx website.

There was no customs invoice, just a FedEx invoice.

To be honest, I'm not paying duty on a cheap pair of boots when it could have been avoided, I think the duty is also excessive. The only other time I paid duty was sent via EMS from Europe, paid via the post office - an effortless exercise and a fair total price for a quality item.

In this case, it's not a fair price.

I was thinking that the parcel will be undelivered and returned to the seller, who can just refund.

After 2 years I had one bad experience after another with Chinese sellers.

I have a jacket sold as adults and I received a child's jacket .. The guy messed about, kept my 1200b for a 3 months, I was awarded a full refund but I still have a junior MX jacket in my possession that it's not worth the seller claiming back ( anyone ?), I presume, the same plan with these boots.

The seller gambles that I will either pay up or uses FedEx to hold the boots ransom while he benefits from the turnover of cash.

[gk10002000]

why do you keep going back to chinese sellers if you are having so many problems? Once or twice OK, things happen, but you say you have had one bad experience after another

[Don Mega]

lol. so you burned Bt.2200 out of spite.

It is well known and many threads exist about fedex/dhl etc etc charging you directly for the import taxes.

From an online calculator....

[robblok]

Seller probably wont like it and will have costs.. they have proof it went to your door. You might be forced to pay anyway. Seller is not liable for tax you are.

[recom273]

why do you keep going back to chinese sellers if you are having so many problems? Once or twice OK, things happen, but you say you have had one bad experience after another

I don't .. The first time was a couple of weeks ago, now this .. That's in 2-3 years of using eBay sellers.

[recom273]

Seller probably wont like it and will have costs.. they have proof it went to your door. You might be forced to pay anyway. Seller is not liable for tax you are.

Just out of interest, What proof ?

Some guy turns up at my door and wants 800b otherwise he's not giving me a box .. I tell him, I will pass on that one, thanks.

The eBay seller says I won't receive the parcel until Wednesday.

[recom273]

lol. so you burned Bt.2200 out of spite.

It is well known and many threads exist about fedex/dhl etc etc charging you directly for the import taxes.

Exactly .. That's why I don't use fedex .. Had the seller posted dispatch through fedex I would have passed, I think there is a little bit of a disclosure issue.

I didn't burn 2200B I hope I saved 800B .. Let's wait and see.

[p_brownstone]

FWIW, sharing my recent experience.

I bought something from Ebay earlier this year, with the product shipped from Europe - it came via courier (FedEx or DHL - I forget).

Courier charged for Import Duties/Taxes and a small processing fee. They attached a receipt from Customs for the Import Duties/Taxes, so it was legit and not "overcharged".

The Courier's small processing fee (which was transparent and itemized) was reasonable - I'd rather Courier deal with Customs than me trying to do it myself with a special trip to Customs House or whatever.

What next?

When you "declined the parcel, denying all knowledge of the contents", did you sign anything or make a verbal statement to that effect to FedEx? If so, FedEx will contact the Sender to try to reclaim the 800 Baht that FedEx paid. The Seller might be surprised, as he will now have proof that the product reached the Buyer, and the Seller might contact you later.

You could then try to negotiate with the Seller to share the Import duty, but he's probably stated that these costs are for the Buyer, so that's going to be tough.

If the product is unclaimed and the Seller does not want to incur additional cost to have it returned, it will probably be sold off to try to recoup the Duty and storage costs.

No I didn't sign anything - I contacted the seller and told them a parcel just arrived, it could have been theirs or another seller and FedEx wanted some money - so without looking at the contents - couldn't tell.

They said its not due for delivery until Wednesday according to FedEx website.

There was no customs invoice, just a FedEx invoice.

To be honest, I'm not paying duty on a cheap pair of boots when it could have been avoided, I think the duty is also excessive. The only other time I paid duty was sent via EMS from Europe, paid via the post office - an effortless exercise and a fair total price for a quality item.

In this case, it's not a fair price.

I was thinking that the parcel will be undelivered and returned to the seller, who can just refund.

After 2 years I had one bad experience after another with Chinese sellers.

I have a jacket sold as adults and I received a child's jacket .. The guy messed about, kept my 1200b for a 3 months, I was awarded a full refund but I still have a junior MX jacket in my possession that it's not worth the seller claiming back ( anyone ?), I presume, the same plan with these boots.

The seller gambles that I will either pay up or uses FedEx to hold the boots ransom while he benefits from the turnover of cash.

Why on earth should the Seller refund you? I sure as h#ll would not!

You Ordered something and later found out you had to pay Import Duty into Thailand - not the Sellers fault at all. "In this case it's not a fair price" you say - take it up with Fed-ex or the Thai Customs Department.

The Seller has proof that the purchase was delivered but you rejected it - if you choose not to accept it, why should he be penalised?

I don't think either eBay or Paypal will be at all sympathetic to you and will side with the Buyer - and so they should!

Patrick

[Sheryl]

You need to specify to the seller that you do NOT want a courier used. Suggest regular post, registered mail instead (if they are concerned about loss, this may address that).

In most countries courier is the most reliable way to send something. In Thailand they guarantee problems.

[robblok]

Seller probably wont like it and will have costs.. they have proof it went to your door. You might be forced to pay anyway. Seller is not liable for tax you are.

Just out of interest, What proof ?

Some guy turns up at my door and wants 800b otherwise he's not giving me a box .. I tell him, I will pass on that one, thanks.

The eBay seller says I won't receive the parcel until Wednesday.

fedex can say they made a delivery and you did not accept it. Its proof enough and will be documented. Just wait and see. That is why people use fedex because they register things like that. Then its between ebay the seller and you. If ebay thinks this is proof enough you will loose.

[recom273]

FWIW, sharing my recent experience.

I bought something from Ebay earlier this year, with the product shipped from Europe - it came via courier (FedEx or DHL - I forget).

Courier charged for Import Duties/Taxes and a small processing fee. They attached a receipt from Customs for the Import Duties/Taxes, so it was legit and not "overcharged".

The Courier's small processing fee (which was transparent and itemized) was reasonable - I'd rather Courier deal with Customs than me trying to do it myself with a special trip to Customs House or whatever.

What next?

When you "declined the parcel, denying all knowledge of the contents", did you sign anything or make a verbal statement to that effect to FedEx? If so, FedEx will contact the Sender to try to reclaim the 800 Baht that FedEx paid. The Seller might be surprised, as he will now have proof that the product reached the Buyer, and the Seller might contact you later.

You could then try to negotiate with the Seller to share the Import duty, but he's probably stated that these costs are for the Buyer, so that's going to be tough.

If the product is unclaimed and the Seller does not want to incur additional cost to have it returned, it will probably be sold off to try to recoup the Duty and storage costs.

No I didn't sign anything - I contacted the seller and told them a parcel just arrived, it could have been theirs or another seller and FedEx wanted some money - so without looking at the contents - couldn't tell.

They said its not due for delivery until Wednesday according to FedEx website.

There was no customs invoice, just a FedEx invoice.

To be honest, I'm not paying duty on a cheap pair of boots when it could have been avoided, I think the duty is also excessive. The only other time I paid duty was sent via EMS from Europe, paid via the post office - an effortless exercise and a fair total price for a quality item.

In this case, it's not a fair price.

I was thinking that the parcel will be undelivered and returned to the seller, who can just refund.

After 2 years I had one bad experience after another with Chinese sellers.

I have a jacket sold as adults and I received a child's jacket .. The guy messed about, kept my 1200b for a 3 months, I was awarded a full refund but I still have a junior MX jacket in my possession that it's not worth the seller claiming back ( anyone ?), I presume, the same plan with these boots.

The seller gambles that I will either pay up or uses FedEx to hold the boots ransom while he benefits from the turnover of cash.

Why on earth should the Seller refund you? I sure as h#ll would not!

You Ordered something and later found out you had to pay Import Duty into Thailand - not the Sellers fault at all. "In this case it's not a fair price" you say - take it up with Fed-ex or the Thai Customs Department.

The Seller has proof that the purchase was delivered but you rejected it - if you choose not to accept it, why should he be penalised?

I don't think either eBay or Paypal will be at all sympathetic to you and will side with the Buyer - and so they should!

Patrick

Why ?

1. I didn't pay for the item to be fedex'd and the seller didn't announce this in his eBay advertisement.

2. Can I see an official invoice from customs and excise ? .. The invoice was from a third party. Yes, got a call from FedEx - I tried to talk, they asked me if I can speak Thai then put the phone down.

3. The seller offers a money back guarantee if I'm not happy with the goods .. I'm not happy with the goods - he's entitled to charge me for the delivery.

[Don Mega]

Good luck getting a refund.

I must ask though how were you not happy with the goods you never accepted the delivery ?.

[recom273]

Good luck getting a refund.

I must ask though how were you not happy with the goods you never accepted the delivery ?.

Thanks .. Because I owned a pair of these boots before .. For 1500B they were OK, for 2200B they were acceptable - but for 3500B they don't match my expectations.

Anyway - whatever - we will address this on Wednesday, when the seller acknowledges that I the goods aren't in my possession.

I didnt mean to come across like a cheap whiner in this post, the boots just aren't worth 3500B - What happens in the worse case scenario ?

They are returned to me and I end up paying the duty then I take them to the post office and send them back - what happens to the 800B duty that I paid to FedEx?

[Don Mega]

In that scenario you will wear the 800b.

However if Fedex have to attempt a second delivery after you refused the first don't be surprised if there is suddenly additional handling charges as well, also the coin to return to sender will come from your pocket too.

If it were me (well it was once upon a time but only the once) I would suck it up and put it down to experience.... and next time do my homework in regards to import taxes and duties (Fedex are not ripping you, just acting as the middle man).

These days I refuse to buy a single thing unless the seller is wiling to send normal post, even then you will occasionally get stung for import duties and taxes and guess who collects them.... the post office (once again they play the middleman).

[recom273]

In that scenario you will wear the 800b.

However if Fedex have to attempt a second delivery after you refused the first don't be surprised if there is suddenly additional handling charges as well, also the coin to return to sender will come from your pocket too.

If it were me (well it was once upon a time but only the once) I would suck it up and put it down to experience.... and next time do my homework in regards to import taxes and duties (Fedex are not ripping you, just acting as the middle man).

These days I refuse to buy a single thing unless the seller is wiling to send normal post, even then you will occasionally get stung for import duties and taxes and guess who collects them.... the post office (once again they play the middleman).

Cheers .. I appreciate the advice - I will give them a buzz and yeah, write it off to experience. I guess it's an 800B fee that I will pay to avoid the grief of getting my money back from the seller, and I can also leave feedback to say I wasn't happy ( Chinese sellers don't like this )

[CharlieH]

Economic sense, pay the 800.

To return them will cost, and you will lose the original non refundable postage to you to start with.

Assuming the seller acknowledges the return and doesnt do to you exactly what you tried doing to him.

Pay it, experience, learn from it, move ln.

Remember for future reference, NEVER use a courier (where possible).

[p_brownstone]

In that scenario you will wear the 800b.

However if Fedex have to attempt a second delivery after you refused the first don't be surprised if there is suddenly additional handling charges as well, also the coin to return to sender will come from your pocket too.

If it were me (well it was once upon a time but only the once) I would suck it up and put it down to experience.... and next time do my homework in regards to import taxes and duties (Fedex are not ripping you, just acting as the middle man).

These days I refuse to buy a single thing unless the seller is wiling to send normal post, even then you will occasionally get stung for import duties and taxes and guess who collects them.... the post office (once again they play the middleman).

Cheers .. I appreciate the advice - I will give them a buzz and yeah, write it off to experience. I guess it's an 800B fee that I will pay to avoid the grief of getting my money back from the seller, and I can also leave feedback to say I wasn't happy ( Chinese sellers don't like this )

No eBay Seller likes negative feedback, particularly when the problem is not of their making but devolves solely from the attitude and general ineptitude of the Buyer.

In the past eBay merely had a "Buyer Protection" policy and the Seller had little recourse to protect themselves from spiteful actions such as you propose - fortunately, fairly recently, eBay has recognised that Sellers also need protection from blind injustice and they have instituted a "Report a Buyer" feature.

I sincerely hope that the Seller in this case uses this feature and eBay takes some concrete action, perhaps by banning you completely, to protect other Sellers.

Patrick

[recom273]

Economic sense, pay the 800.

To return them will cost, and you will lose the original non refundable postage to you to start with.

Assuming the seller acknowledges the return and doesnt do to you exactly what you tried doing to him.

Pay it, experience, learn from it, move ln.

Remember for future reference, NEVER use a courier (where possible).

Cheers man, when you get woken up at 7.30 by some guy wanting 800B, and after reading threads here - it's not quite the right start to the day.

How many times do we have to write things off to experience in this country ?

I thought I did have a policy of not buying from sellers that use couriers. If the seller had disclosed this I would have skipped it, but other posters make me sound like the bad guy who should be banned.

After reading Mr dons fair advise, I called the courier and paid up.

[robblok]

Economic sense, pay the 800.

To return them will cost, and you will lose the original non refundable postage to you to start with.

Assuming the seller acknowledges the return and doesnt do to you exactly what you tried doing to him.

Pay it, experience, learn from it, move ln.

Remember for future reference, NEVER use a courier (where possible).

Cheers man, when you get woken up at 7.30 by some guy wanting 800B, and after reading threads here - it's not quite the right start to the day.

How many times do we have to write things off to experience in this country ?

I thought I did have a policy of not buying from sellers that use couriers. If the seller had disclosed this I would have skipped it, but other posters make me sound like the bad guy who should be banned.

After reading Mr dons fair advise, I called the courier and paid up.

Its more that you should have asked the seller, in this case the seller is an innocent party in all of this and would have had to bear the costs. I see things from your side too, but its fair duty no rip off. I have been taken to the cleaners a few times too by the taxman here. Now I check before if they use a courier or not.. and even then your parcel can get taken out. I just accept taxes (dont like them but see it as luck of the draw) but I would not put that problem with a seller. They do the best they can.

[FracturedRabbit]

If sellers use some form of tracking number (very dangerous without), it will come into the country via EMS and be delivered via the post office. The parcel may or may not be caught for duty on the way in, can be a bit of a lottery. If it comes in via Fedex they will pass it through customs as part of their process and it is more likely to be picked up; plus as mentioned you will have to pay a (small) handling charge. The real horrors can be TNT and DHL who, for reasons unclear, may not process it on entry and you are left having to sort it out yourself.

Never had a problem with EMS, and prefer to use Fedex when something is particularly urgent because they are very speedy.

[recom273]

Its more that you should have asked the seller, in this case the seller is an innocent party in all of this and would have had to bear the costs. I see things from your side too, but its fair duty no rip off.

Glad you can see my side, cheers. Actually I did get an invoice from customs and it stated the price, no extras for FedEx and the seller rounded down the taxable amount to the last $00.

Yeah I should have checked, it's very rare that I spend over 1000b - which is the threshold, right ?

But there is a place to add method of shipping .. To which the seller placed 'economy int shipping'

These guys aren't traditional eBay sellers, they are drop-shippers using every method possible to get more custom.

I bought a cheap garmin etrex 10 from the states, the shipper disclosed postage by USPS. I checked other sellers who wanted pre-paid duty and after a month or so of checking the prices, took the plunge - didn't get stung for duty, but atleast I was expecting to be and at least I had factored this into the final cost and even with the duty it was still a cheap GPS unit.

These boots were an expensive mistake - especially when the missus came home from work and decided that they were a gift for her. Double-y robbed.

[recom273]

And if anyone is reading this on the horrors of eBay in Thailand .. I very rarely have issues, just the last two deliveries, on the whole it's a good service.

No, EMS and delivery by Thai / China post are two different services.

You can have a tracked parcel that arrives via Thai post, I have never paid duty on a Thai post delivery.

Just because it has tracking number it doesn't mean that it will arrive by EMS. The EMS riders wear orange and blue jackets.

[robblok]

Its more that you should have asked the seller, in this case the seller is an innocent party in all of this and would have had to bear the costs. I see things from your side too, but its fair duty no rip off.

Glad you can see my side, cheers. Actually I did get an invoice from customs and it stated the price, no extras for FedEx and the seller rounded down the taxable amount to the last $00.

Yeah I should have checked, it's very rare that I spend over 1000b - which is the threshold, right ?

But there is a place to add method of shipping .. To which the seller placed 'economy int shipping'

These guys aren't traditional eBay sellers, they are drop-shippers using every method possible to get more custom.

I bought a cheap garmin etrex 10 from the states, the shipper disclosed postage by USPS. I checked other sellers who wanted pre-paid duty and after a month or so of checking the prices, took the plunge - didn't get stung for duty, but atleast I was expecting to be and at least I had factored this into the final cost and even with the duty it was still a cheap GPS unit.

These boots were an expensive mistake - especially when the missus came home from work and decided that they were a gift for her. Double-y robbed.

You got the same size as your missus ? Or am i missing something ?

Anyway sometimes we get lucky with customs sometimes not. I get send kilos of cheese from the Netherlands and most often there is no tax on it but sometimes there is (parents send it). Loads of stuff I buy on ebay gets through without taxes some is taxed.. its luck of the draw not always about the value.

[arunsakda]

FDX is acts as a registered customs agent for Thai Customs, and that is one reason why they are so speedy. Nothing gets bogged down with

actual customs, but FEDEX does not let ANYTHING slide either.

It is scandalous that duty gets charged on the full landed value including intangibles such as shipping and insurance!

When you really need a part or document fast however it is really an amazing service. I've had a document sent from USA to Chiang Mai in less than 30 hours.

[Don Mega]

It is scandalous that duty gets charged on the full landed value including intangibles such as shipping and insurance!

Happens world over.

[robblok]

It is scandalous that duty gets charged on the full landed value including intangibles such as shipping and insurance!

Happens world over.

standard practice.. otherwise creative people would lower the price of good and increase shipping and insurance. Plus this gives more tax, the taxman wants its cut.

What is scandalous is that I had 2 120lb dumbells send over from the USA (special kind) and I had an invoice for shipping and the dumbbells and they did not accept it and recalculated the shipping on weight basis. While the shipping costs were fair already 700$ but they calculated based on weight 270 lbs (stand included) and I had to pay an extra 4.000 tax on top of the already high tax.

[arunsakda]

Surprised they don't charge a duty on the duty.