Anti-Trump protesters clash with police at Utah rally

[up2u2]

It is in stark contrast to the BLM protesters that crashed Bernie's rally. Bernie was very respectful and his team attempted to negotiate some mic time for them to be heard.

No Bernie didn't. He took the coward's way out and exited the stage as fast as he could. It was also the smart thing to do but not very good optics. Contrast that with Trump turning and moving toward the guy who tried to jump on stage behind him last week.

Americans (as well as many other nationalities) would overwhelmingly choose the candidate who faced potential danger coming at him from behind over the candidate who fled at the first sight of a female protester.

Gimme a break. The only reason he ducked and turned is that he didn't know where he should run. Very indecisive. Americans and other nationalities don't like this.

So he should have beat up on two girls. Get a grip. lol

[chuckd]

You need to put that gun in the deep hole you have been digging.

The protesters would need to have a photo ID to get inside the Supreme Court chambers.

Wouldn't want any of them to feel disenfranchised so best to just keep them in their safe zones and not let them out into the cold, cruel world.

Are you a rocket surgeon?

I must admit it does make me laugh when Right Wingers get all excited over a few people waving placards. They make it sound like the world is about to end. What escapes them is it is a result of their candidate Trump being a blow-hard racist and attacking religious groups and ethnic minorities and they hit the streets and give the slightest push back and Republicans lose their minds. It is in stark contrast to the BLM protesters that crashed Bernie's rally. Bernie was very respectful and his team attempted to negotiate some mic time for them to be heard. No threats about the 'good o'l days when people were taken out on stretchers' or 'i'd like to punch them in the face' or 'take their jackets and throw them out in the cold' or whining the incident will lead the news and not Trump diatribe. Chuckd it is all about being respectful of people.

Trump simply is not Presidential material. He cannot run an election campaign without inciting riots in the streets. If he can't run a simple Candidate campaign he is simply not qualified to run the Nation. It is that simple.

No I am not a rocket surgeon. Why do you need one?

A "few people" might be 10-15. A mob would be 500-5,000. Moveon.org and blacklivesmatter brought out a mob to disrupt a scheduled political meeting.

They weren't "in the streets". They took over a venue paid for by the Trump campaign. You do play fast and easy with the facts.

Do you often blame the victim when crimes are being committed?

Interesting, but not surprising, that you would merely surrender the microphone, ala Bernie Sanders, rather than stand up for your constitutional right to peaceably assemble.

That might be the Australian or socialist way but not the American way.

You say..." Chuckd it is all about being respectful of people."

I may have missed it but there was no respect being shown to Trump and his supporters by the protesters or is respect a one way street only earned by socialist liberals.

[grumpyoldman]

Left winghers, democrats, socialists etc etc are the biggest hypocrites of the human race! They believe in freedom of speech, unless they disagree with you!!

Right wing folk generally say it how it is, wear their hearts on their sleeves and pull no punches, lefties don't like that. So instead they feel the need to riot at every opportunity to silence the Republican (not to mention play the race card in every argument)

Trump is coming, the lefties are worried, really worried, which is why these demonstrations are taking place.

Rothschild and Rockerfeller run the US of A anyway, if not the world. Everyone else is just a puppet

Yes, I guess if being a hypocrite means disagreeing with calling women "fat pigs, dogs, slobs and disgusting animals" well, I guess I'm a hypocrite.

If disagreeing with saying "Islam hates us" means I'm a hypocrite, well I guess I am. (BTW does Islam have a phone #, email maybe?)

If disagreeing with building walls that are completely nonsensical, economically retarded to boot, I guess I'm a hypocrite.

If disagreeing with ridiculing handicapped people, I guess I'm a hypocrite.

Need I go on Walter ?

Clinton is going to whoop whoever the GOP puts up in November because she's smart, experienced, compassionate and she'll step into the office 100% better equipped than the Donald, or whoever the GOP wants to run.

Dems the facts jacks.

[HooHaa]

apparently they throw down hard in Utah.

who knew?

[Boon Mee]

As The Donald goes about throwing out the 'Old Order', there's bound to be a few upset lefties and SJW's who get their collective knickers in a twist, eh?

Edited March 21, 2016 by Boon Mee

[up2u2]

I must admit it does make me laugh when Right Wingers get all excited over a few people waving placards. They make it sound like the world is about to end. What escapes them is it is a result of their candidate Trump being a blow-hard racist and attacking religious groups and ethnic minorities and they hit the streets and give the slightest push back and Republicans lose their minds. It is in stark contrast to the BLM protesters that crashed Bernie's rally. Bernie was very respectful and his team attempted to negotiate some mic time for them to be heard. No threats about the 'good o'l days when people were taken out on stretchers' or 'i'd like to punch them in the face' or 'take their jackets and throw them out in the cold' or whining the incident will lead the news and not Trump diatribe. Chuckd it is all about being respectful of people.

Trump simply is not Presidential material. He cannot run an election campaign without inciting riots in the streets. If he can't run a simple Candidate campaign he is simply not qualified to run the Nation. It is that simple.

No I am not a rocket surgeon. Why do you need one?

A "few people" might be 10-15. A mob would be 500-5,000. Moveon.org and blacklivesmatter brought out a mob to disrupt a scheduled political meeting.

They weren't "in the streets". They took over a venue paid for by the Trump campaign. You do play fast and easy with the facts.

Do you often blame the victim when crimes are being committed?

Interesting, but not surprising, that you would merely surrender the microphone, ala Bernie Sanders, rather than stand up for your constitutional right to peaceably assemble.

That might be the Australian or socialist way but not the American way.

You say..." Chuckd it is all about being respectful of people."

I may have missed it but there was no respect being shown to Trump and his supporters by the protesters or is respect a one way street only earned by socialist liberals.

Of course it is the American way. Good Americans saw Trump for what he is, a bully and a racist attacking people based on their religion and ethnicity and inciting violence and they hit the streets and stood up to him. More power to them I say. As you clearly pointed out the Constitution provides them that right. It is obvious Trump isn't up to being President. A few protesters and his campaign falls to pieces and Trump does a runner. Bully's tend to do that when someone stands up to them.

Sorry Trumps got no courage mate. Big mouth but can't back it up.

Trump a victim lol What does he need a hug?

It is difficult to take you seriously Chuckd

[chuckd]

It is in stark contrast to the BLM protesters that crashed Bernie's rally. Bernie was very respectful and his team attempted to negotiate some mic time for them to be heard.

No Bernie didn't. He took the coward's way out and exited the stage as fast as he could. It was also the smart thing to do but not very good optics. Contrast that with Trump turning and moving toward the guy who tried to jump on stage behind him last week.

Americans (as well as many other nationalities) would overwhelmingly choose the candidate who faced potential danger coming at him from behind over the candidate who fled at the first sight of a female protester.

Gimme a break. The only reason he ducked and turned is that he didn't know where he should run. Very indecisive. Americans and other nationalities don't like this.

So he should have beat up on two girls. Get a grip. lol

The two girls that took over the stage should have been spanked like the children they are.

The big black guy that joined them at the 1:12 mark should have been arrested...not surrendered to.

Bernie and his staff exhibited they have the backbones of a jellyfish.

[Usernames]

As The Donald goes about throwing out the 'Old Order', there's bound to be a few upset lefties and SJW's who get their collective knickers in a twist, eh?

According to this, the millennials, who are at the core of Sanders' gimme more free stuff crowd, are too f'n lazy to fix a bowl of cereal for their breakfasts. Seems to me that a person that has never even figured out how to feed themselves shouldn't be allowed to vote. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/02/23/this-is-the-height-of-laziness/?tid=sm_fb

[up2u2]

The two girls that took over the stage should have been spanked like the children they are.

The big black guy that joined them at the 1:12 mark should have been arrested...not surrendered to.

Bernie and his staff exhibited they have the backbones of a jellyfish.

Often the smart thing to do is stand back and let people make fools of themselves. I suppose as a Trump supporter you would suggest Bernie threatens people and have them sucker punched and kicked and stomped on by supporters. Say how he would like to punch them in the face or take them out on a stretcher like the good old days. How's that goin for ya? lol

Chuckd, Trump and his supporters are whining about something that is all of their own doing. You want get any sympathy from me. Continually incite violence don't come whining too me.

[Linzz]

I must admit it does make me laugh when Right Wingers get all excited over a few people waving placards. They make it sound like the world is about to end. What escapes them is it is a result of their candidate Trump being a blow-hard racist and attacking religious groups and ethnic minorities and they hit the streets and give the slightest push back and Republicans lose their minds. It is in stark contrast to the BLM protesters that crashed Bernie's rally. Bernie was very respectful and his team attempted to negotiate some mic time for them to be heard. No threats about the 'good o'l days when people were taken out on stretchers' or 'i'd like to punch them in the face' or 'take their jackets and throw them out in the cold' or whining the incident will lead the news and not Trump diatribe. Chuckd it is all about being respectful of people.

Trump simply is not Presidential material. He cannot run an election campaign without inciting riots in the streets. If he can't run a simple Candidate campaign he is simply not qualified to run the Nation. It is that simple.

No I am not a rocket surgeon. Why do you need one?

A "few people" might be 10-15. A mob would be 500-5,000. Moveon.org and blacklivesmatter brought out a mob to disrupt a scheduled political meeting.

They weren't "in the streets". They took over a venue paid for by the Trump campaign. You do play fast and easy with the facts.

Do you often blame the victim when crimes are being committed?

Interesting, but not surprising, that you would merely surrender the microphone, ala Bernie Sanders, rather than stand up for your constitutional right to peaceably assemble.

That might be the Australian or socialist way but not the American way.

You say..." Chuckd it is all about being respectful of people."

I may have missed it but there was no respect being shown to Trump and his supporters by the protesters or is respect a one way street only earned by socialist liberals.

Of course it is the American way. Good Americans saw Trump for what he is, a bully and a racist attacking people based on their religion and ethnicity and inciting violence and they hit the streets and stood up to him. More power to them I say. As you clearly pointed out the Constitution provides them that right. It is obvious Trump isn't up to being President. A few protesters and his campaign falls to pieces and Trump does a runner. Bully's tend to do that when someone stands up to them.

Sorry Trumps got no courage mate. Big mouth but can't back it up.

Trump a victim lol What does he need a hug?

It is difficult to take you seriously Chuckd

Trump gained kudos for closing down his rally early by looking responsible. Trump gained kudos by default because protesters blocked the highway. Trump welcomes any and all attention, he is a master publicist. Bad news is better than no news. Bad news is good publicity because bad news travels further and quicker. This is the hallmark of his campaign and it's working well because his opponents oblige.

The masses share no identity with the political, judicial, academic, the "educated" or officialdom that despises them and divides America today. To his supporters he is a billionaire with guts and street cred. Opinion on TVF is a microcosm of all these factors

[Walter Travolta]

Left winghers, democrats, socialists etc etc are the biggest hypocrites of the human race! They believe in freedom of speech, unless they disagree with you!!

Right wing folk generally say it how it is, wear their hearts on their sleeves and pull no punches, lefties don't like that. So instead they feel the need to riot at every opportunity to silence the Republican (not to mention play the race card in every argument)

Trump is coming, the lefties are worried, really worried, which is why these demonstrations are taking place.

Rothschild and Rockerfeller run the US of A anyway, if not the world. Everyone else is just a puppet

Yes, I guess if being a hypocrite means disagreeing with calling women "fat pigs, dogs, slobs and disgusting animals" well, I guess I'm a hypocrite.

If disagreeing with saying "Islam hates us" means I'm a hypocrite, well I guess I am. (BTW does Islam have a phone #, email maybe?)

If disagreeing with building walls that are completely nonsensical, economically retarded to boot, I guess I'm a hypocrite.

If disagreeing with ridiculing handicapped people, I guess I'm a hypocrite.

Need I go on Walter ?

Clinton is going to whoop whoever the GOP puts up in November because she's smart, experienced, compassionate and she'll step into the office 100% better equipped than the Donald, or whoever the GOP wants to run.

Dems the facts jacks.

Disagreeing with something does not make one a hypocrite.

You are mistaken if you think that I class you as a hypocrite simply for dis-agreeing with me.

My belief of a hypocrite is easy to understand if my previous posts have been clearly read. But keep on trying to twist what I say so it advocates your post. Hilary is pretty good at that too

[Chicog]

I was listening to a radio show yesterday where they estimated that if Trump had wanted to buy the airtime he has already had from the major networks, he would have had to have spent around $1.8 BILLION.

So not a complete mug really.

All of that is free advertising for the Trump brand whatever he does.

[Pinot]

I was listening to a radio show yesterday where they estimated that if Trump had wanted to buy the airtime he has already had from the major networks, he would have had to have spent around $1.8 BILLION.

So not a complete mug really.

All of that is free advertising for the Trump brand whatever he does.

He'll need to find something to do after losing the November election and declaring victory. Steaks, Wine, Casinos are out. What about breakfast cereal? Or popcorn? I got it...condoms. "Only Trumps Extra Large Can Stop More Yous!"

No?

[keemapoot]

I was listening to a radio show yesterday where they estimated that if Trump had wanted to buy the airtime he has already had from the major networks, he would have had to have spent around $1.8 BILLION.

So not a complete mug really.

All of that is free advertising for the Trump brand whatever he does.

Well, after this little experiment in marketing is over after the Republican Convention, the Trump brand will have great value and I'm sure there will be many new product endorsement deals for Trump in:

Wall building products

All Made in the USA products, especially those actually made in China.

Mobile Home Communities

Any make of pickup truck

Domestic Tour Groups to see Trump Tower and Casinos

Self-Defense Training (focused only on offense and beat-downs)

[inbangkok]

duplicate post edited out.

From the guy who was giving me shit about not mastering the "quote" feature correctly.....lol

You are seriously special little chuck........

[Chicog]

I was listening to a radio show yesterday where they estimated that if Trump had wanted to buy the airtime he has already had from the major networks, he would have had to have spent around $1.8 BILLION.

So not a complete mug really.

All of that is free advertising for the Trump brand whatever he does.

Well, after this little experiment in marketing is over after the Republican Convention, the Trump brand will have great value and I'm sure there will be many new product endorsement deals for Trump in:

Wall building products

All Made in the USA products, especially those actually made in China.

Mobile Home Communities

Any make of pickup truck

Domestic Tour Groups to see Trump Tower and Casinos

Self-Defense Training (focused only on offense and beat-downs)

Surely a chain of Mexican restaurants has to be top of the list?

Oh, and rape alarms. Don't forget rape alarms.

[boomerangutang]

Republicans would make the Wizard of Oz blush.

They say they're in favor of a free marketplace, yet are always trying to put tariffs and other protections on trade to make the playing field uneven.

They say they're not socialist, yet are at the head of federal feeding trough screaming for tens of billions of federal dollars to bail out their losing businesses.

Trump says he's such a great deal maker, but he's gone bankrupt four times, and has avoided paying back loans.

Isn't marriage a bit like a deal? He had two prior marriages, and each one entailed oaths & promises, and in each case he broke those promises.

It isn't mysterious why Chris Christie is in cahoots with Trump. They both have shady histories with some of Trump's failed businesses in Atlantic City.

Carson said there are two Trumps, but didn't elaborate. Are we supposed to assume he flip-flops between an ok Trump and an irrational/angry/ignorant Trump? When a special-interest group or a foreign leader speaks with Trump, which Trump will they get? Can one Trump transform to the other Trump in mid-sentence? Actually, there's proof of that in his speeches, in filmed interviews, and during the debates. The hot-head flip-flopping uninformed Trump seems to dominate the reasonable Trump. Great for a NY real estate hyper-salesman, not good for a president with a finger on the button. Yet for all I've written here, I think Cruz could be worse. Bring back Romney as a candidate. At least he won't be likely to drop N bombs on countries if/when a foreign leader offends or angers him.

[Dumbastheycome]

Yup. Them there is loading dem canons! Fire at will boyos! It's all gotta come down anyways!

No problem. Them in the Steinbunker is awaitin the day of the chosen.

You want how many $teindollar?

[boomerangutang]

I was listening to a radio show yesterday where they estimated that if Trump had wanted to buy the airtime he has already had from the major networks, he would have had to have spent around $1.8 BILLION.

So not a complete mug really.

All of that is free advertising for the Trump brand whatever he does.

Well, after this little experiment in marketing is over after the Republican Convention, the Trump brand will have great value and I'm sure there will be many new product endorsement deals for Trump in:

Wall building products

All Made in the USA products, especially those actually made in China.

Mobile Home Communities

Any make of pickup truck

Domestic Tour Groups to see Trump Tower and Casinos

Self-Defense Training (focused only on offense and beat-downs)

Surely a chain of Mexican restaurants has to be top of the list?

Oh, and rape alarms. Don't forget rape alarms.

TRUMP PINATAS

...shaped to look like his enemies, which there are many. Trump hates many people, institutions and several countries. One line of Trump Pinatas could be shaped like the constitution - because he doesn't adhere to it re; a president's duty to nominate S.Court justices.

Some other shape ideas for Trump Pinatas:

The Pope, Mexico, Losers (shaped like Africa), Rosie Odonnel, Fox News logo, and Trump's favorite enemy, News Reporters.

What would spill out when a Trump Pinata is broken? Maybe; little fake paper dollars, to symbolize Trump's hyper inflated wealth boast.

[Chicog]

Republicans would make the Wizard of Oz blush.

They say they're in favor of a free marketplace, yet are always trying to put tariffs and other protections on trade to make the playing field uneven.

Au contraire.

They're all for signing these free trade agreements and then moving their plants overseas so they can make the same shit for a third of the price and sell it back to the US at a profit, while stashing said profits in offshore accounts (c.f. Mitt Romney).

[chuckd]

duplicate post edited out.

From the guy who was giving me shit about not mastering the "quote" feature correctly.....lol

You are seriously special little chuck........

Are you a rocket surgeon also?

[mopar71]

It is in stark contrast to the BLM protesters that crashed Bernie's rally. Bernie was very respectful and his team attempted to negotiate some mic time for them to be heard.

No Bernie didn't. He took the coward's way out and exited the stage as fast as he could. It was also the smart thing to do but not very good optics. Contrast that with Trump turning and moving toward the guy who tried to jump on stage behind him last week.

Americans (as well as many other nationalities) would overwhelmingly choose the candidate who faced potential danger coming at him from behind over the candidate who fled at the first sight of a female protester.

Why on earth would you beat up on two girls. Now that would be cowardly. What is it with Right Wingers and first response always being violence?

Who said anything about beating up two girls? You're making things up to cover for the fact that Bernie really acted like a p-----. He should have given them a stern look and told them to sit down. No need to beat anyone up.

What is it with left wingers and always wanting to lie? However it does help explain why so many love Hillary..she is just like them.

[mopar71]

The two girls that took over the stage should have been spanked like the children they are.

The big black guy that joined them at the 1:12 mark should have been arrested...not surrendered to.

Bernie and his staff exhibited they have the backbones of a jellyfish.

That is a sickening display of cowardice. It is difficult to watch the whole thing. Sanders doesn't have any security on stage? Surely they could find some burly women up there in Washington state to provide security and who would have no problem clearing the stage of these spoiled brats making demands.

[JHolmesJr]

Wow...speechless at the behaviour of those two nappy haired gangstas clamoring for the mike.

Bernie...powerless...for shame.

[up2u2]

Why on earth would you beat up on two girls. Now that would be cowardly. What is it with Right Wingers and first response always being violence?

Who said anything about beating up two girls? You're making things up to cover for the fact that Bernie really acted like a p-----. He should have given them a stern look and told them to sit down. No need to beat anyone up.

What is it with left wingers and always wanting to lie? However it does help explain why so many love Hillary..she is just like them.

Yeah that would have worked. lol The unfortunate thing is the protesters had an opportunity to make their point but just ended up looking foolish. BLM protesters have a valid point to make. Pity they didn't actually take the opportunity to make it.

[Linzz]

Republicans would make the Wizard of Oz blush.

They say they're in favor of a free marketplace, yet are always trying to put tariffs and other protections on trade to make the playing field uneven.

They say they're not socialist, yet are at the head of federal feeding trough screaming for tens of billions of federal dollars to bail out their losing businesses.

Trump says he's such a great deal maker, but he's gone bankrupt four times, and has avoided paying back loans.

Isn't marriage a bit like a deal? He had two prior marriages, and each one entailed oaths & promises, and in each case he broke those promises.

It isn't mysterious why Chris Christie is in cahoots with Trump. They both have shady histories with some of Trump's failed businesses in Atlantic City.

Carson said there are two Trumps, but didn't elaborate. Are we supposed to assume he flip-flops between an ok Trump and an irrational/angry/ignorant Trump? When a special-interest group or a foreign leader speaks with Trump, which Trump will they get? Can one Trump transform to the other Trump in mid-sentence? Actually, there's proof of that in his speeches, in filmed interviews, and during the debates. The hot-head flip-flopping uninformed Trump seems to dominate the reasonable Trump. Great for a NY real estate hyper-salesman, not good for a president with a finger on the button. Yet for all I've written here, I think Cruz could be worse. Bring back Romney as a candidate. At least he won't be likely to drop N bombs on countries if/when a foreign leader offends or angers him.

The 2 Trumps are the pre-election Trump and the post election Trump if elected, like all Presidents unable to carry out the majority of promises.

But like all elections, plenty of excitement hoopla plus doom and gloom preceding them.

[lovelomsak]

American politics is sick. That country is sick. When people can just do what ever they want when ever they want,hiding behind gender or race the country has to rethink some of their civil policies.

[mopar71]

Why on earth would you beat up on two girls. Now that would be cowardly. What is it with Right Wingers and first response always being violence?

Who said anything about beating up two girls? You're making things up to cover for the fact that Bernie really acted like a p-----. He should have given them a stern look and told them to sit down. No need to beat anyone up.

What is it with left wingers and always wanting to lie? However it does help explain why so many love Hillary..she is just like them.

Yeah that would have worked. lol The unfortunate thing is the protesters had an opportunity to make their point but just ended up looking foolish. BLM protesters have a valid point to make. Pity they didn't actually take the opportunity to make it.

BLM would have a valid point to make except that they care as much about black lives in their own neighborhoods as the KKK does.

[edited out a bunch of facts that BLM ignores about blacks killing each other at alarming rates]

No, Black Lives Matter is just another leftist organization that raises money by pretending to be something it is not...a group that actually cares about people. And there are plenty of suckers out there who fall for it.

This is what I do like about Bernie...he is the only honest one on the Left.

Have any of you Democrats ever asked yourself why Sanders has never identified himself as a Democrat?? Because even he knows how FOS they are.

[SpokaneAl]

Just keeping it classy . . . not.

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2016/03/peta-lashes-out-at-anti-trump-protester-who-slapped-police-horse/

[mopar71]

Republicans would make the Wizard of Oz blush.

They say they're in favor of a free marketplace, yet are always trying to put tariffs and other protections on trade to make the playing field uneven.

They say they're not socialist, yet are at the head of federal feeding trough screaming for tens of billions of federal dollars to bail out their losing businesses.

Trump says he's such a great deal maker, but he's gone bankrupt four times, and has avoided paying back loans.

Isn't marriage a bit like a deal? He had two prior marriages, and each one entailed oaths & promises, and in each case he broke those promises.

It isn't mysterious why Chris Christie is in cahoots with Trump. They both have shady histories with some of Trump's failed businesses in Atlantic City.

Carson said there are two Trumps, but didn't elaborate. Are we supposed to assume he flip-flops between an ok Trump and an irrational/angry/ignorant Trump? When a special-interest group or a foreign leader speaks with Trump, which Trump will they get? Can one Trump transform to the other Trump in mid-sentence? Actually, there's proof of that in his speeches, in filmed interviews, and during the debates. The hot-head flip-flopping uninformed Trump seems to dominate the reasonable Trump. Great for a NY real estate hyper-salesman, not good for a president with a finger on the button. Yet for all I've written here, I think Cruz could be worse. Bring back Romney as a candidate. At least he won't be likely to drop N bombs on countries if/when a foreign leader offends or angers him.

The 2 Trumps are the pre-election Trump and the post election Trump if elected, like all Presidents unable to carry out the majority of promises.

But like all elections, plenty of excitement hoopla plus doom and gloom preceding them.

I wonder how many Obama supporters remember the pre-election Obama of 2008?

Obama went from "there is no red America, no blue America, only the United States of America" to "elections have consequences, I won, get over it" and then mastering identity politics to pit Americans against each other for 7 years.

Then there is the bit about transparency and how the American people would be able to read bills online for 7 days before signing it into law...then they passed Obamacare on Xmas Eve night and Nancy Pelosi admitted to not even knowing what was in it herself.

Obama sounded soooo good during the election and became a miserable failure to the American people afterwards. Hopefully, if Trump does get elected, he will do a 180 degree turn from clownish-bully (no, he IS NOT a racist-fascist) to an actual serious statesman.Yeah, doesn't seem likely, does it?