Disabled Brit, 79, jumps to his death from Pattaya condo

[Walter Travolta]

he should go to Netherland, where euthanasia is legal, he would get a shot instead of jumping to death, poor guy RIP

And who was it that gave Holland or Switzerland for that matter, the right to play God?...RIP fellow countryman.

Maybe the individuals who wish to no longer want to live gave these 2 countries "the right to play god" ?

After all, "god" is a figment of people's imagination, invented in the mind to give oneself a feeling of peace, strength, hope etc

So, to answer your question - read line 1

Not being antagonistic, just saying that it's up to the individual if they want their time to end, no-one else.

Cheers

[John1012]

John Angus. A highly intelligent,likeable, previously extremely fit old gentleman. I shall remember you with affection. RIP.

[bazza40]

he should go to Netherland, where euthanasia is legal, he would get a shot instead of jumping to death, poor guy RIP

And who was it that gave Holland or Switzerland for that matter, the right to play God?...RIP fellow countryman.

So I assume you are anti-euthanasia. Who gave you the right to play God? Explain the difference to me.

[chiang mai]

Agree with #6 and #12, why is it so damn popular with old farang guys here in Thailand to jump? I don't get it.

Once started there is no return, no chance that it might not work, certainty is everything I imagine. And let's face it, a single bullet to the brain would achieve the same result but 9 mm's are hard to find and most people, apart from most Americans, have never held one before.

[bazza40]

so for people who get ALS, cancer, who live on artificial breathing, you think it is not humane to get a shot?

stupid guy you are, come on.....that is humane way to go if you suffer too much....

Well if I'm a stupid guy,that must make God more stupid in your opinion.There are no if's or buts in number 6/10 commandments.We are humans not animals,we have morphine to take care of the pain.I understand this is a huge debate,but in our sweet little freedom of speech socalled democracy,i'm entitled to my opinion as much as you are yours,which I respect but don't agree with.

Garbage. Morphine does not take care of the pain. Two of my friends died of cancer, and they both told me the morphine only dulled it. Palliative care is a construct of the religions. You're entitled to your opinion. You are not entitled to inflict it on others.

Christopher Hitchens said it best. " Men do not do evil so cheerfully as in the name of religion".

[bazza40]

Sorry my friend but humans aren't trees! Death has two doors, paradise or hell. make sure you choose the right one!

Are you speaking from personal experience, it would lend credence to your assertion.

I am reminded of the line from James Clavell's Shogun, when a Jesuit priest says about the death of the Taiko: You've lost the Kingdom of God, poor man". His wife Ochiba retorts " What if your Kingdom of God is up a barbarian's back passage?"

[johnhw]

he should go to Netherland, where euthanasia is legal, he would get a shot instead of jumping to death, poor guy RIP

And who was it that gave Holland or Switzerland for that matter, the right to play God?...RIP fellow countryman.

so for people who get ALS, cancer, who live on artificial breathing, you think it is not humane to get a shot?

stupid guy you are, come on.....that is humane way to go if you suffer too much....

Well if I'm a stupid guy,that must make God more stupid in your opinion.There are no if's or buts in number 6/10 commandments.We are humans not animals,we have morphine to take care of the pain.I understand this is a huge debate,but in our sweet little freedom of speech socalled democracy,i'm entitled to my opinion as much as you are yours,which I respect but don't agree with.

Problem with your godly kind's version of free speech, you never cease trying every wich way to impose it on the rest of us sinners Edited March 21, 2016 by johnhw

[parafareno]

just go to netherland...and the doc will administer a shot, so it will not be a suicide...

you should all watch the VICE documentary on euthanasia, very nice one.....

one woman just decided to end it because of her up mind......she seem to have it together...but she was approved and she got a shot.......

Edited March 21, 2016 by parafareno

[Lorn]

he should go to Netherland, where euthanasia is legal, he would get a shot instead of jumping to death, poor guy RIP

And who was it that gave Holland or Switzerland for that matter, the right to play God?...RIP fellow countryman.

so for people who get ALS, cancer, who live on artificial breathing, you think it is not humane to get a shot?

stupid guy you are, come on.....that is humane way to go if you suffer too much....

Well if I'm a stupid guy,that must make God more stupid in your opinion.There are no if's or buts in number 6/10 commandments.We are humans not animals,we have morphine to take care of the pain.I understand this is a huge debate,but in our sweet little freedom of speech socalled democracy,i'm entitled to my opinion as much as you are yours,which I respect but don't agree with.

Actually there are ifs and buts in commandment 6. It is not "Thou shalt not kill"- which is a very poor simplified translation. The correct translation is not to commit murder- or unjustified, unlawful killing. Therefore self-defense, capital punishment, warfare, suicide do not apply.

[wabothai]

he should go to Netherland, where euthanasia is legal, he would get a shot instead of jumping to death, poor guy RIP

And who was it that gave Holland or Switzerland for that matter, the right to play God?...RIP fellow countryman.

God? Different fictional authorities say different things. Asked the Tooth Fairy just the other day, and she pontificated that it's okay, long as you pay off all dental bills before you do yourself.

Euthanasia is NOT legal in Holland. Only in very rare cases will it be allowed.

[balo]

Very sad to read this, just what goes though the mind to take your own life.

Whatever it was, it's over now. RIP.

Terrible pain can cause this , and he was probably on heavy medication.

But if he was really that ill, a hospital would be my choice , unless it was uncurable.

[farcanell]

Tragic indeed. It seems that quite a fair amount of old men prefer jumping from high buildings than taking some amazing pills and going on one last journey before just not waking up anymore. Jumping shouldn't be an option for anybody and the most important reason being total fear, pain and discomfort seconds before traveling to other pastures. If somebody really doesn't want to continue in this realm for whatever reason, mostly being illness, old age or depression then take the most humane way out. Remember that after you throw yourself off a building or in front of a train, bus or other fast moving object there are people who have to clean up the mess and I don't care what anyone says about this, it is always traumatizing for the ambulance personnel/cleaning staff and what about passerby's? Did any jumper ever think about somebody walking below and what would happen if suddenly a person would fall on top of them of explode on the ground close to them? What an irresponsible way to take your life. Selfish as so to speak, without talking about the family members left behind. So when you decide that you can't continue anymore for whatever reason, legit or not, and you have made your mind up to discontinue your time on this planet; do so in a responsible way! Euthanasia should always happen with guidance of professionals

RIP Mr Angus

I can't help but agree... Euthanasia should be allowed, such that some dignity in death can be preserved

But jumping... No no no.... In Thailand there are so many drugs available that laying down for a long sleep is a far better option, or even a slashed wrist in a warm bathtub, would be better

But with a persons decision to jump... IMO, you can't be too harsh on them, as they are obviously not of sound mind, nor thinking rationally, and with so much publicity about jumping, it has become a favored method, unfortunately, because it scars the life of so many people.

As to a suicide being a selfish act, i can't agree.... As I see it as a desperate act... But I do agree that jumping is irresponsible

Australia and New Zealand ( going by a kiwi's post only) do not generally advertise suicides, as it's known that a rash of suicides will follow, emboldened by the origional suicide

Anyway, I'm sure that now the plunge has been taken, the chap is finally free of the pain and the worries of life, and in a better place, regardless of Christianity's view that suicide is a mortal sin. So RIP old fella, and I hope you enjoy the other side.

And as for the resultant sorrow felt by those left behind, people should instead consider that the taking of his own life, was a better option than living it in misery, and they should be more considerate and respectful of the jumpers plight, than their own mourning... Perhaps even a little ashamed that they were not there in a time of need.

[billd766]

Tragic indeed. It seems that quite a fair amount of old men prefer jumping from high buildings than taking some amazing pills and going on one last journey before just not waking up anymore. Jumping shouldn't be an option for anybody and the most important reason being total fear, pain and discomfort seconds before traveling to other pastures. If somebody really doesn't want to continue in this realm for whatever reason, mostly being illness, old age or depression then take the most humane way out. Remember that after you throw yourself off a building or in front of a train, bus or other fast moving object there are people who have to clean up the mess and I don't care what anyone says about this, it is always traumatizing for the ambulance personnel/cleaning staff and what about passerby's? Did any jumper ever think about somebody walking below and what would happen if suddenly a person would fall on top of them of explode on the ground close to them? What an irresponsible way to take your life. Selfish as so to speak, without talking about the family members left behind. So when you decide that you can't continue anymore for whatever reason, legit or not, and you have made your mind up to discontinue your time on this planet; do so in a responsible way! Euthanasia should always happen with guidance of professionals

RIP Mr Angus

I can't help but agree... Euthanasia should be allowed, such that some dignity in death can be preserved

But jumping... No no no.... In Thailand there are so many drugs available that laying down for a long sleep is a far better option, or even a slashed wrist in a warm bathtub, would be better

But with a persons decision to jump... IMO, you can't be too harsh on them, as they are obviously not of sound mind, nor thinking rationally, and with so much publicity about jumping, it has become a favored method, unfortunately, because it scars the life of so many people.

As to a suicide being a selfish act, i can't agree.... As I see it as a desperate act... But I do agree that jumping is irresponsible

Australia and New Zealand ( going by a kiwi's post only) do not generally advertise suicides, as it's known that a rash of suicides will follow, emboldened by the origional suicide

Anyway, I'm sure that now the plunge has been taken, the chap is finally free of the pain and the worries of life, and in a better place, regardless of Christianity's view that suicide is a mortal sin. So RIP old fella, and I hope you enjoy the other side.

And as for the resultant sorrow felt by those left behind, people should instead consider that the taking of his own life, was a better option than living it in misery, and they should be more considerate and respectful of the jumpers plight, than their own mourning... Perhaps even a little ashamed that they were not there in a time of need.

I agree with you 100%.

As I see it, when you get old there are 3 or more choices for us all.

1 If you are married then most probably your wife and family will look after you, as you looked after them.

2 If you are in a long term girlfriend relationship you could be lucky and end up the same way but possibly not.

3 If your are living on your own it is far more difficult.

You can hire someone to look after you which will be relatively expensive in the longer term bearing in mind that many of us are sort of big and fat. That will require 2 Thais just to turn you over and help you get up if you fall, or even to help you to the toilet and shower,

If you have enough money then you can go to a hospital but that is not a long term option.

If you have family back where you came from then you can throw yourself on their mercy and ask for their help and care.

You can go back to your home country and ask the local government for help in finding a home/nursing home and you may get lucky or not but it will take all of the money and assets that you have.

Now if none of the above work you are left with the stark reality that there are very few options left to you which is where we all came in at the OP.

You can try to live it out on your own until it really doesn't work anymore or you can choose to end your life when it gets too much for you.

Personally I am married and I have made a living will saying do NOT resuscitate me and go when the time comes. I have told my wife, family and friends that I don't want to go into hospital and be hardwired/plumbed into all the wonderful machinery that hospitals have nowadays for a few more days/weeks/months of what will be a miserable existence. I would rather the money that it will cost to go to my Thai family for THEIR future, not mine.

I have made a lot of enquiries on a relatively dignified and hopefully painless way to go and I think I have worked it out. My main worry is that somebody will have to clear up after me.

I can't be a jumper as we only live in a 2 story house and by that time I will be living downstairs anyway.

It is not all doom and gloom as I have had a great life and have had a few regrets and it was very much worth living for.

When comes the time I will be able (I hope) in the words of Frank Sinatra, to do it my way.

Have a great rest of your lives and remember it isn't over until the fat lady sings, and there ain't that many fat Thai ladies.

[gk10002000]

"He had been suffering with some serious health problems which had intensified over the last two weeks and had told her of his plan to commit suicide earlier in the day.

However, she dismissed his plans as she did not believe he would be able to remove himself from his wheelchair and jump from his condo without assistance."

Could it have been assisted suicide? Sounds likely.

Against the law? Almost certainly.

Morally wrong? Definitely not.

IMHO

have read many similar stories where the Wife, GF etc. make similar statements. But they are hearsay. There is no confirmation he said such a thing. I hope a proper investigation is done by the locals (won't be) or by his family or friends (doubtful), checking into financial things.

[farcanell]

I can't help but agree... Euthanasia should be allowed, such that some dignity in death can be preserved

But jumping... No no no.... In Thailand there are so many drugs available that laying down for a long sleep is a far better option, or even a slashed wrist in a warm bathtub, would be better

But with a persons decision to jump... IMO, you can't be too harsh on them, as they are obviously not of sound mind, nor thinking rationally, and with so much publicity about jumping, it has become a favored method, unfortunately, because it scars the life of so many people.

As to a suicide being a selfish act, i can't agree.... As I see it as a desperate act... But I do agree that jumping is irresponsible

Australia and New Zealand ( going by a kiwi's post only) do not generally advertise suicides, as it's known that a rash of suicides will follow, emboldened by the origional suicide

Anyway, I'm sure that now the plunge has been taken, the chap is finally free of the pain and the worries of life, and in a better place, regardless of Christianity's view that suicide is a mortal sin. So RIP old fella, and I hope you enjoy the other side.

And as for the resultant sorrow felt by those left behind, people should instead consider that the taking of his own life, was a better option than living it in misery, and they should be more considerate and respectful of the jumpers plight, than their own mourning... Perhaps even a little ashamed that they were not there in a time of need.

I agree with you 100%.

As I see it, when you get old there are 3 or more choices for us all.

1 If you are married then most probably your wife and family will look after you, as you looked after them.

2 If you are in a long term girlfriend relationship you could be lucky and end up the same way but possibly not.

3 If your are living on your own it is far more difficult.

You can hire someone to look after you which will be relatively expensive in the longer term bearing in mind that many of us are sort of big and fat. That will require 2 Thais just to turn you over and help you get up if you fall, or even to help you to the toilet and shower,

If you have enough money then you can go to a hospital but that is not a long term option.

If you have family back where you came from then you can throw yourself on their mercy and ask for their help and care.

You can go back to your home country and ask the local government for help in finding a home/nursing home and you may get lucky or not but it will take all of the money and assets that you have.

Now if none of the above work you are left with the stark reality that there are very few options left to you which is where we all came in at the OP.

You can try to live it out on your own until it really doesn't work anymore or you can choose to end your life when it gets too much for you.

Personally I am married and I have made a living will saying do NOT resuscitate me and go when the time comes. I have told my wife, family and friends that I don't want to go into hospital and be hardwired/plumbed into all the wonderful machinery that hospitals have nowadays for a few more days/weeks/months of what will be a miserable existence. I would rather the money that it will cost to go to my Thai family for THEIR future, not mine.

I have made a lot of enquiries on a relatively dignified and hopefully painless way to go and I think I have worked it out. My main worry is that somebody will have to clear up after me.

I can't be a jumper as we only live in a 2 story house and by that time I will be living downstairs anyway.

It is not all doom and gloom as I have had a great life and have had a few regrets and it was very much worth living for.

When comes the time I will be able (I hope) in the words of Frank Sinatra, to do it my way.

Have a great rest of your lives and remember it isn't over until the fat lady sings, and there ain't that many fat Thai ladies.

Well said, you old rogue

But..., it's a bit surprising how many posters have similar inclinations, given the uproar every time there is a "suicide" article herein.

This has been the most interesting and informative of threads on suicides that I have yet seen, which will probably give comfort to some guilty minds ?

Edited March 23, 2016 by farcanell

[joepattaya1961]

Not really on-topic, but why is it "Pattaya Condo" in the headline?

It's freakin' 12 km from Pattaya in Baan Amphur.

[MisterBKK]

I wanted to tell you a little about John and his life. I will share the small piece that I know.

 

I knew John for over 10 years. I met him while Geocaching in Bangkok. He was an avid Geocaching fan and set many caches around Thailand. I found one of his, we started talking on email, then met and did some Geocaching together. 

 

John really enjoyed life, he was passionate about many topics. He was intellectually curious., always working on puzzles and ciphers. A very intelligent man. He had an active online life and posted many many items here on Thaivisa.

 

John's Thai maid had a son. This boy grew to become a very important part of John's life. He would teach the boy english, pick him up from school on bikes, teach him the computer, iPad, puzzles, etc. He would stop with the boy and let him investigate every bug or flower along the way. He had infinite patience and love for this boy. Sometimes the 5 minute ride back home would last more that an hour due to all the questions and observing on the way.

 

John would take care of the boy, he would watch him for the mother , he would financially take care of many items for him - schooling, books, clothes, interesting toys, etc. Note - John is not the boys father. The Thai lady is married and now has a second child. Please, the thread has been distracted enough, let's not go there.

 

John was feeling a lot of pain at the end. I last saw him on Feb 15th, about a month before he died. He was a tough old guy that would not burden anyone and did not want to continue with his pain. Looking back, his last email to me said "don't email back because I won't read it", I actually thought he was mad at me about something. I wrote back, but of course he was saying that he won't be able to read it. He knew what he was going to do.

 

For the trolls - I'm sorry John did not end his life in the manner that you decided was best for him. I would appreciate you  deciding to leave your negative and off-topic posts for somewhere else in respect to this man's life. Whether he lived or died with your approval and up to your expectation... it was his life.

 

I do know that the relationship he had with this Thai boy really gave him a lot to live for in his later years and really changed this boy's life. I hope he has enough seeds sewn to continue an intellectually curious life.

 

I am posting some photos here, so you see John in life and not as the blurred image laying on the ground. I put some up of him and I, of some of his friends, and with the Thai boy. He was a nice man and a good friend.

 

John was always up for some fun - Sanook mak!

John and I on a Geocaching adventure

Having fun

More fun

Grand Palace tour - no, that is not the Thai boy's mother

John and the Thai boy

This is in Toys R Us, he loved those trains "Woo Woos" he called them

Breakfast with John

 

Beergarden in Patts

Biking home from school

Teaching the computer, or watching Pingu - not sure which...

He would let the boy write all over his floors with washable markers, they would build train tracks and imaginary towns in his condo

With some of his good friends

 

After swimming

Last picture I took of John - Feb 15th, 2016. We had a nice walk and great conversation that day.

[Dexlowe]

^^^ @MisterBKK -- I haven't read this thread, nor do I intend to as I get the gist of it all. I have read your post, however, and seen the pix, so I just want to say thanks for the way you have rounded out the story of John and given us a perspective on a good man's life through the photos. In a small way, you have given us a legacy of John, a man none of us knew or probably would ever have known had he lived for much longer, and for that I thank you again. Few of us will ever get that chance. Rest in peace, John.

[Golden Triangle]

MisterBKK, I have just read your story and looked at your photos, it bought a tear to my eyes, thank you sir.

[Caxa]

Thank you MisterBKK.

I hope the trolls you refer to feel suitably ashamed.

[Patsycat]

Tears in my eyes too!!  Thank you for taking the time to tell us about your friend.  He seems to have been a loving and fun loving guy.

 

RIP

[robertthebruce]

So so sad...

 

he looked a great friendly guy......

 

nice of you to share the photos and his story...

 

Thanks for Sharing.....

 

 

[gk10002000]

In just about every story there seems to be a Thai who said, we had a fight, or he was distressed, or something like that.  It all sounds so fishy.

[The man from udon]

On 21/03/2016 at 8:23 AM, captspectre said:

seems a terrible and painful way to kill yourself! if I were to think about killing myself, I would take a bunch of pills, get my favorite booze, sit down on a comfortable chair, put my favorite movies on my DVD and just sit back and take the "trip"! no pain no fuss and no one getting mad at me for messing up their car roof! plus I would look pretty for my funeral!

I don't think he would of felt any pain at the velocity he was travelling at.i would call it a very sad and messy way to end your life.