Air Con - damn it's getting hotter.

[thequietman]

Not sure this is the right place for this.

I have noticed it is getting increasingly hotter this year, so going to get aircon for the bedroom. Fans did the trick before but not so much now.

Anyway seen a Samsung inverter today at 12750 baht. Free installation. The B/room is only 12 ft by 12 ft, so I figure a 9000 BTU is sufficient. Am I correct? If anything I need one with 6000 btu but there don't appear to be units this small in any of the stores.

The intention is to have it on the evenings while we sleep, so I figure about 7 hours a day. Is my electric bill going to sky rocket or are aircon's fairly efficient?

Many thanks for any input or advice.

[Happy Grumpy]

Sounds about right.

I recently had a 9000btu installed in extra room of about that size.

I have noticed it is getting increasingly hotter this year

Funny how that happens as it moves from cool season to hot season.

Edited March 22, 2016 by Happy Grumpy

[Tywais]

144 sqf = 13sqm so 9k BTU is not a problem. One of our bedrooms is about 20sqm and windows on the north and east and 9k does fine.

If you never used air in your place it will be a quite noticeable increase in your bill. Depending on if you are getting government rates of about 4.5B/unit I would guess between 500-1000 Baht increase.

[IMHO]

Depends on other factors, not just square footage.

Try this calculator: http://www.daikin.co.th/service-btu-calculation/

[cooked]

Depends on other factors, not just square footage.

Try this calculator: http://www.daikin.co.th/service-btu-calculation/

Nice site. However it doesn't consider whether the roof space is insulated or not. According to them I need a 999BTU inverter, I have a 12000BTU AC and it is 'adequate'.

[IMHO]

Depends on other factors, not just square footage.

Try this calculator: http://www.daikin.co.th/service-btu-calculation/

Nice site. However it doesn't consider whether the roof space is insulated or not. According to them I need a 999BTU inverter, I have a 12000BTU AC and it is 'adequate'.

Sure, every place has it's own factors, and for some the Daikin site might also over-spec it a little too. If you know your roof is uninsulated and extra hot, or your ceilings are higher than normal, you will need extra BTU to compensate.

The key thing about that calc is it's relevance to Thailand - other ones online seem to always under-spec the actual BTU needed, in real, Thai life.

Edited March 22, 2016 by IMHO

[Lamkyong]

http://www.thaivisa....ost__p__2940809

[steven100]

9000 BTU is fine .... 16sq m

[Ace of Pop]

Beware of friends who have gone INVERTER. They never tire of telling you how much they now save.Ive got 4 newish ones but still can't match the thousands they save each month..[emoji471][emoji23]

[Bullie]

For a simular sized bedroom our electricity bill went up 1200 baht on average. How ever, the bedroom catches the afternoon sun, has a relatively high ceiling and is poorly insulated.

So... really nothing compared to my previous monthly heating bills back in cold northern Europe.

[Lamkyong]

For a simular sized bedroom our electricity bill went up 1200 baht on average. How ever, the bedroom catches the afternoon sun, has a relatively high ceiling and is poorly insulated.

So... really nothing compared to my previous monthly heating bills back in cold northern Europe.

was that rise up to or up by

[terminatorchiangmai]

Go for the 12.000 BTU version, cools the room down faster and makes less noise because you can turn the fan down very low.

Mine is always on 27c with low fan speed which is nice and cool for a room of 16 square meter.

Edited March 23, 2016 by terminatorchiangmai

[Tywais]

Go for the 12.000 BTU version, cools the room down faster and makes less noise because you can turn the fan down very low.

Mine is always on 27c with low fan speed which is nice and cool for a room of 16 square meter.

Need to be careful about oversizing, it can actually cost more in operational costs and a reduced comfort level as it short cycles preventing controlling humidity and going from warm to cold room as it cycles. A lot of articles out there discussing this.

The Oversized Air Conditioner: The Reason Bigger Isn’t Always Better

One of the myths surrounding central cooling systems is that bigger is always better. In reality, an oversized air conditioner will leave you less comfortable with higher energy bills and a more costly up-front cost. Ironically, a system that’s too large will cool your home too fast, leaving behind humidity and pockets of warm air.

When a cooling system is too large, the evaporator coil inside the air handler doesn’t have time to get cold enough to condense sufficient water vapor from your home. What water vapor that does condense may not accumulate to a high enough level to run down the drain pan into the drainpipe. As the condensation sits, it tends to evaporate first, exacerbating indoor humidity and its negative effects such as mold growth.

The ideal relative humidity you should have indoors year-round is 30 to 50 percent. If you’re not sure what yours is, find an inexpensive humidity meter and test the level in your home in several places. If it’s high, you may have an oversized air conditioner.

Another way to tell if your system is too large is to keep track of how long it runs during a normal cycle. If it runs 10 minutes or less, it could be too large. An oversized cooling appliance turns on and off frequently, running in short cycles. This drives up electric bills because cooling systems use the most energy when they first start. The amount of wear also increases each time the system starts.

http://eacair.com/blogs/the-oversized-air-conditioner-the-reason-bigger-isnt-always-better

OVERSIZED

An oversized air conditioner is susceptible to short cycling, inadequate dehumidification and large temperature variations in the house.

Causes: Oversized air conditioners are usually the result of a design or installation problem.

Implications: Oversized units will have a shortened life expectancy and will provide a less comfortable environment. The largest comfort issue is the lack of dehumidification. Because the temperature drops rapidly with an oversized unit, there isn't enough air movement across the coil to extract the water from the house air. This results in a house that is cool, but with a humid, swamp-like environment. Since compressors experience most damage on start-up, short cycles also mean more start-ups and a shorter life.

Strategy: Other than the rough guideline test, it is difficult to know whether and how much the unit is oversized. Some utilities indicate that a unit may be as much as 25 percent oversized without adverse effect. The temptation to oversize becomes irresistible to installers with respect to heat pumps. Since heat pumps have to deal with a much larger temperature differential from outside to inside, the tendency is to make the heat pump large enough to meet the heating demand. This makes it too large for the cooling load. There are some 44 strategies to address this problem, but within this context, we are watching for oversized cooling units.

http://www.ashireporter.org/HomeInspection/Articles/Air-Conditioning-Capacity/2339

[fey]

cheaper to move to a colder climate

[vaultdweller0013]

One of the advantages of inverters is that they can run at a range of BTU's. So, that "9000" BTU Samsung Inverter will actually run from a minimum of 3510 BTU to a max of 10920 BTU (I happen to have the Samsung brochure sitting next to me).

If you do go with a Samsung, make sure you are getting the inverter model -- they have quite annoyingly given the same model name (AR5000, AR7000) to both inverter and non-inverter units, unlike, for example, Daikin, where Smash = non-inverter, Smile/Smart/Erika/Urusara = inverter. Further, the inverter and non-inverter units look identical except for a "Digital Inverter" badge on the inverter units.

As for sizing, 600 BTU/sq. m is a good baseline. I did some hackish Manual J(*) heat loss calculations to size ac in a house in Khon Kaen and the numbers came up between 550 BTU/sq. m and 650 BTU/sq. m. In the actual install (Daikin Inverter units) it was around 600 BTU/sq. m in the largest room. The bedrooms were all small so the lowest was 682 BTU/sq. m, since the smallest units you can get are in the 9000 BTU area. In the recent heat wave in KK, the AC units kept up well, so if anything, they were oversized.

(*) Manual J is the standard in the US for calculating heat loss and sizing AC units. My calculations were hacked together just as a sanity check on the sizing. The two main issues with using Manual J in Thailand were that the software only has the climate data for US locations and I had to guess at the U-values for "red brick" wall construction. I generally tried to err on the side of requiring additional cooling. I ended up using Key West, FL as the location, but increased the outdoor temp to 105F and used 75F at 50% relative humidity as the indoor temp.

[Bullie]

For a simular sized bedroom our electricity bill went up 1200 baht on average. How ever, the bedroom catches the afternoon sun, has a relatively high ceiling and is poorly insulated.

So... really nothing compared to my previous monthly heating bills back in cold northern Europe.

was that rise up to or up by

Let's settle on increased by

[Ahnsahn]

One of the advantages of inverters is that they can run at a range of BTU's. So, that "9000" BTU Samsung Inverter will actually run from a minimum of 3510 BTU to a max of 10920 BTU (I happen to have the Samsung brochure sitting next to me).

If you do go with a Samsung, make sure you are getting the inverter model -- they have quite annoyingly given the same model name (AR5000, AR7000) to both inverter and non-inverter units, unlike, for example, Daikin, where Smash = non-inverter, Smile/Smart/Erika/Urusara = inverter. Further, the inverter and non-inverter units look identical except for a "Digital Inverter" badge on the inverter units.

As for sizing, 600 BTU/sq. m is a good baseline. I did some hackish Manual J(*) heat loss calculations to size ac in a house in Khon Kaen and the numbers came up between 550 BTU/sq. m and 650 BTU/sq. m. In the actual install (Daikin Inverter units) it was around 600 BTU/sq. m in the largest room. The bedrooms were all small so the lowest was 682 BTU/sq. m, since the smallest units you can get are in the 9000 BTU area. In the recent heat wave in KK, the AC units kept up well, so if anything, they were oversized.

(*) Manual J is the standard in the US for calculating heat loss and sizing AC units. My calculations were hacked together just as a sanity check on the sizing. The two main issues with using Manual J in Thailand were that the software only has the climate data for US locations and I had to guess at the U-values for "red brick" wall construction. I generally tried to err on the side of requiring additional cooling. I ended up using Key West, FL as the location, but increased the outdoor temp to 105F and used 75F at 50% relative humidity as the indoor temp.

Which model # and (BTU rating) Daikin AC unit did you have installed in your largest room? Which KK store location did you buy it from?

I am looking to cool a room that is 3.90m x 5.80m in a single level house w/ non-insulated concrete(lite?) tile roof.

Edited March 23, 2016 by Ahnsahn

[willyumiii]

Semi related:

I had my AC serviced this week.

The service man told me that when my Thai wife called to schedule the service he knew she must be married to a farang.

I asked how he could tell.

He said, Thai people never call until AC is broken,

Farang have AC serviced before the hot season starts and they break down from lack of service.

He smiled and said " Farang plan ahead, very good!"

[KittenKong]

Beware of friends who have gone INVERTER. They never tire of telling you how much they now save.Ive got 4 newish ones but still can't match the thousands they save each month..

I have a 21k inverter model Hitachi which cools my entire condo. It runs 24/7 at 28 degrees and my total electricity bill is usually between 1400-2000, which includes fridge/freezer, hot water, washing machine, oven, large PC on 24/7, very large TV and various audio/video appliances.

Before fitting the inverter model my bill was around 3500-5000B. Obviously I cant be sure how much of my savings are due to the aircon being new and how much to it being an inverter.

But if buying again I would certainly buy an inverter if only because it doesnt make a noise when it starts/stops.

Edited March 24, 2016 by KittenKong

[Ace of Pop]

I did notice a reduction wit an inverter Fridge/ Freezer,but the Air Con isn't so easy with Kids N Doors

[vaultdweller0013]

One of the advantages of inverters is that they can run at a range of BTU's. So, that "9000" BTU Samsung Inverter will actually run from a minimum of 3510 BTU to a max of 10920 BTU (I happen to have the Samsung brochure sitting next to me).

If you do go with a Samsung, make sure you are getting the inverter model -- they have quite annoyingly given the same model name (AR5000, AR7000) to both inverter and non-inverter units, unlike, for example, Daikin, where Smash = non-inverter, Smile/Smart/Erika/Urusara = inverter. Further, the inverter and non-inverter units look identical except for a "Digital Inverter" badge on the inverter units.

As for sizing, 600 BTU/sq. m is a good baseline. I did some hackish Manual J(*) heat loss calculations to size ac in a house in Khon Kaen and the numbers came up between 550 BTU/sq. m and 650 BTU/sq. m. In the actual install (Daikin Inverter units) it was around 600 BTU/sq. m in the largest room. The bedrooms were all small so the lowest was 682 BTU/sq. m, since the smallest units you can get are in the 9000 BTU area. In the recent heat wave in KK, the AC units kept up well, so if anything, they were oversized.

(*) Manual J is the standard in the US for calculating heat loss and sizing AC units. My calculations were hacked together just as a sanity check on the sizing. The two main issues with using Manual J in Thailand were that the software only has the climate data for US locations and I had to guess at the U-values for "red brick" wall construction. I generally tried to err on the side of requiring additional cooling. I ended up using Key West, FL as the location, but increased the outdoor temp to 105F and used 75F at 50% relative humidity as the indoor temp.

Which model # and (BTU rating) Daikin AC unit did you have installed in your largest room? Which KK store location did you buy it from?

I am looking to cool a room that is 3.90m x 5.80m in a single level house w/ non-insulated concrete(lite?) tile roof.

I have 2 x Daikin Smart Inverter (Model # FTKM18NV2S); the room is 70 sq. The max BTU for this model is 21200, which gives about 605 BTU/sq. m.

I bought them through an authorized dealer I found through Daikin's website. I'm not sure of the actual name as it was only in Thai; I think it was "Fairy Electric", but I do know the shop was located at 120 Ruen Rom Road. They have a big Daikin sign in front, so it is hard to miss. Actual communication with the shop was all in Thai. I also new the exact models I wanted so I wasn't looking for and advise. So I don't know a good English speaking dealer. Other that that, I was in a bit of a rush to get the units installed, so I did not have time to shop around and ended up only getting a small discount off of list price.

Below is a table of all of the Daikin and Mitsubishi Electric Inverter model that I put together as a quick reference to use when deciding on the units for the house. 3.9x5.8 would give a size of 22.62 sq. m. At 600 BTU/sq m, this would give 13572 BTU. So, a Daikin Smart FTKM12NV2S or Smile Smile FTKC12PV2S would probably work (Urusara and Erika are nice, but VERY expensive). A Mitsu Electric Super MSY-GK13VA would probably be OK as well. If the room has a lot of windows, faces South or West, or if you like to keep it really cold or want to cool down the room very fast, you may want to go one size higher.

(edit: the table didn't paste well, so I've attached as a PDF version)

ac_size_summary.pdf

Edited March 24, 2016 by vaultdweller0013

[Ahnsahn]

One of the advantages of inverters is that they can run at a range of BTU's. So, that "9000" BTU Samsung Inverter will actually run from a minimum of 3510 BTU to a max of 10920 BTU (I happen to have the Samsung brochure sitting next to me).

If you do go with a Samsung, make sure you are getting the inverter model -- they have quite annoyingly given the same model name (AR5000, AR7000) to both inverter and non-inverter units, unlike, for example, Daikin, where Smash = non-inverter, Smile/Smart/Erika/Urusara = inverter. Further, the inverter and non-inverter units look identical except for a "Digital Inverter" badge on the inverter units.

As for sizing, 600 BTU/sq. m is a good baseline. I did some hackish Manual J(*) heat loss calculations to size ac in a house in Khon Kaen and the numbers came up between 550 BTU/sq. m and 650 BTU/sq. m. In the actual install (Daikin Inverter units) it was around 600 BTU/sq. m in the largest room. The bedrooms were all small so the lowest was 682 BTU/sq. m, since the smallest units you can get are in the 9000 BTU area. In the recent heat wave in KK, the AC units kept up well, so if anything, they were oversized.

(*) Manual J is the standard in the US for calculating heat loss and sizing AC units. My calculations were hacked together just as a sanity check on the sizing. The two main issues with using Manual J in Thailand were that the software only has the climate data for US locations and I had to guess at the U-values for "red brick" wall construction. I generally tried to err on the side of requiring additional cooling. I ended up using Key West, FL as the location, but increased the outdoor temp to 105F and used 75F at 50% relative humidity as the indoor temp.

Which model # and (BTU rating) Daikin AC unit did you have installed in your largest room? Which KK store location did you buy it from?

I am looking to cool a room that is 3.90m x 5.80m in a single level house w/ non-insulated concrete(lite?) tile roof.

I have 2 x Daikin Smart Inverter (Model # FTKM18NV2S); the room is 70 sq. The max BTU for this model is 21200, which gives about 605 BTU/sq. m.

I bought them through an authorized dealer I found through Daikin's website. I'm not sure of the actual name as it was only in Thai; I think it was "Fairy Electric", but I do know the shop was located at 120 Ruen Rom Road. They have a big Daikin sign in front, so it is hard to miss. Actual communication with the shop was all in Thai. I also new the exact models I wanted so I wasn't looking for and advise. So I don't know a good English speaking dealer. Other that that, I was in a bit of a rush to get the units installed, so I did not have time to shop around and ended up only getting a small discount off of list price.

Below is a table of all of the Daikin and Mitsubishi Electric Inverter model that I put together as a quick reference to use when deciding on the units for the house. 3.9x5.8 would give a size of 22.62 sq. m. At 600 BTU/sq m, this would give 13572 BTU. So, a Daikin Smart FTKM12NV2S or Smile Smile FTKC12PV2S would probably work (Urusara and Erika are nice, but VERY expensive). A Mitsu Electric Super MSY-GK13VA would probably be OK as well. If the room has a lot of windows, faces South or West, or if you like to keep it really cold or want to cool down the room very fast, you may want to go one size higher.

(edit: the table didn't paste well, so I've attached as a PDF version)

ac_size_summary.pdf

I really appreciate all your efforts - nice list! I will go strictly with Daikin inverter and choose the highest rated from their Smile / Smart Series: for 11.3 sqm room - 9k BTU, for (2) 22.6 sqm rooms - 12k BTU and 15k BTU (for south facing corner room w/ windows). I was even able to eventually locate the AC dealer on Google Earth...Google Maps tried to direct me to a back alley bldng a few blocks away!

[IMHO]

One of the advantages of inverters is that they can run at a range of BTU's. So, that "9000" BTU Samsung Inverter will actually run from a minimum of 3510 BTU to a max of 10920 BTU (I happen to have the Samsung brochure sitting next to me).

If you do go with a Samsung, make sure you are getting the inverter model -- they have quite annoyingly given the same model name (AR5000, AR7000) to both inverter and non-inverter units, unlike, for example, Daikin, where Smash = non-inverter, Smile/Smart/Erika/Urusara = inverter. Further, the inverter and non-inverter units look identical except for a "Digital Inverter" badge on the inverter units.

As for sizing, 600 BTU/sq. m is a good baseline. I did some hackish Manual J(*) heat loss calculations to size ac in a house in Khon Kaen and the numbers came up between 550 BTU/sq. m and 650 BTU/sq. m. In the actual install (Daikin Inverter units) it was around 600 BTU/sq. m in the largest room. The bedrooms were all small so the lowest was 682 BTU/sq. m, since the smallest units you can get are in the 9000 BTU area. In the recent heat wave in KK, the AC units kept up well, so if anything, they were oversized.

(*) Manual J is the standard in the US for calculating heat loss and sizing AC units. My calculations were hacked together just as a sanity check on the sizing. The two main issues with using Manual J in Thailand were that the software only has the climate data for US locations and I had to guess at the U-values for "red brick" wall construction. I generally tried to err on the side of requiring additional cooling. I ended up using Key West, FL as the location, but increased the outdoor temp to 105F and used 75F at 50% relative humidity as the indoor temp.

Which model # and (BTU rating) Daikin AC unit did you have installed in your largest room? Which KK store location did you buy it from?

I am looking to cool a room that is 3.90m x 5.80m in a single level house w/ non-insulated concrete(lite?) tile roof.

I have 2 x Daikin Smart Inverter (Model # FTKM18NV2S); the room is 70 sq. The max BTU for this model is 21200, which gives about 605 BTU/sq. m.

I bought them through an authorized dealer I found through Daikin's website. I'm not sure of the actual name as it was only in Thai; I think it was "Fairy Electric", but I do know the shop was located at 120 Ruen Rom Road. They have a big Daikin sign in front, so it is hard to miss. Actual communication with the shop was all in Thai. I also new the exact models I wanted so I wasn't looking for and advise. So I don't know a good English speaking dealer. Other that that, I was in a bit of a rush to get the units installed, so I did not have time to shop around and ended up only getting a small discount off of list price.

Below is a table of all of the Daikin and Mitsubishi Electric Inverter model that I put together as a quick reference to use when deciding on the units for the house. 3.9x5.8 would give a size of 22.62 sq. m. At 600 BTU/sq m, this would give 13572 BTU. So, a Daikin Smart FTKM12NV2S or Smile Smile FTKC12PV2S would probably work (Urusara and Erika are nice, but VERY expensive). A Mitsu Electric Super MSY-GK13VA would probably be OK as well. If the room has a lot of windows, faces South or West, or if you like to keep it really cold or want to cool down the room very fast, you may want to go one size higher.

(edit: the table didn't paste well, so I've attached as a PDF version)

ac_size_summary.pdf

I really appreciate all your efforts - nice list! I will go strictly with Daikin inverter and choose the highest rated from their Smile / Smart Series: for 11.3 sqm room - 9k BTU, for (2) 22.6 sqm rooms - 12k BTU and 15k BTU (for south facing corner room w/ windows). I was even able to eventually locate the AC dealer on Google Earth...Google Maps tried to direct me to a back alley bldng a few blocks away!

Take a look at the Smile Plus series (3rd gen R32) - compared to the "smile no plus" ones, these have a infra red sensor to detect people in the room, and increases the temp by 2 degrees when there's not. The Smart series add to that motorized left/right swing, which can be very useful in some rooms/placements.

[Ahnsahn]

Which model # and (BTU rating) Daikin AC unit did you have installed in your largest room? Which KK store location did you buy it from?

I am looking to cool a room that is 3.90m x 5.80m in a single level house w/ non-insulated concrete(lite?) tile roof.

I have 2 x Daikin Smart Inverter (Model # FTKM18NV2S); the room is 70 sq. The max BTU for this model is 21200, which gives about 605 BTU/sq. m.

I bought them through an authorized dealer I found through Daikin's website. I'm not sure of the actual name as it was only in Thai; I think it was "Fairy Electric", but I do know the shop was located at 120 Ruen Rom Road. They have a big Daikin sign in front, so it is hard to miss. Actual communication with the shop was all in Thai. I also new the exact models I wanted so I wasn't looking for and advise. So I don't know a good English speaking dealer. Other that that, I was in a bit of a rush to get the units installed, so I did not have time to shop around and ended up only getting a small discount off of list price.

Below is a table of all of the Daikin and Mitsubishi Electric Inverter model that I put together as a quick reference to use when deciding on the units for the house. 3.9x5.8 would give a size of 22.62 sq. m. At 600 BTU/sq m, this would give 13572 BTU. So, a Daikin Smart FTKM12NV2S or Smile Smile FTKC12PV2S would probably work (Urusara and Erika are nice, but VERY expensive). A Mitsu Electric Super MSY-GK13VA would probably be OK as well. If the room has a lot of windows, faces South or West, or if you like to keep it really cold or want to cool down the room very fast, you may want to go one size higher.

(edit: the table didn't paste well, so I've attached as a PDF version)

ac_size_summary.pdf

I really appreciate all your efforts - nice list! I will go strictly with Daikin inverter and choose the highest rated from their Smile / Smart Series: for 11.3 sqm room - 9k BTU, for (2) 22.6 sqm rooms - 12k BTU and 15k BTU (for south facing corner room w/ windows). I was even able to eventually locate the AC dealer on Google Earth...Google Maps tried to direct me to a back alley bldng a few blocks away!

Take a look at the Smile Plus series (3rd gen R32) - compared to the "smile no plus" ones, these have a infra red sensor to detect people in the room, and increases the temp by 2 degrees when there's not. The Smart series add to that motorized left/right swing, which can be very useful in some rooms/placements.

Thanks for pointing that out and in turn helping me make the best choice. I had thought just the opposite: that it was the Smart series that had the infra red sensor technology. Since I will be wed to these AC units for >10 years, it's the efficiency rating of the unit that's guiding my choice. The improvement of the Smile Plus series over the original Smile series is impressive but, if I am looking at the stats correctly, the SEER ratings of the Smart series seem to be slightly better than those of the Smile Plus series. Are SEER ratings a dependable indicator of an AC units efficiency?

[vaultdweller0013]

Smile Plus appears to be very new, so I did not look at them when considering my options or putting together the list.

However, from looking at the Daikin website, it looks while the normal Smile series does not have the IR sensor, both the Smile Plus and Smart series do.

As for SEER -- this should give you a reasonable indication of efficiency, but there are a couple of caveats (at least based on my research of SEER in the US, since I can't actually read the Thai standards for SEER).

1. SEER is calculated over a range of temperatures so depending on how your cooling load matches the assumed temperature range it may or may not be accurate.
2. The benefits of SEER increase diminish as the SEER gets larger. That is, you will see a bigger savings going from a SEER of 13 to 15 than you would see going from 15 to 17.
3. Some units still have their efficiency stated in EER, which is not directly comparable to SEER.

So, in general, I would only use it as a rough guideline, but I wouldn't put too much weight on it when making the decision, especially if working at the higher SEER values 19/20+.

[fred110]

Hi OP, where did you see that Samsung unit on sale? I need one also, I had Samsung, it was great, very quiet, cool.

[Ahnsahn]

Smile Plus appears to be very new, so I did not look at them when considering my options or putting together the list.

However, from looking at the Daikin website, it looks while the normal Smile series does not have the IR sensor, both the Smile Plus and Smart series do.

As for SEER -- this should give you a reasonable indication of efficiency, but there are a couple of caveats (at least based on my research of SEER in the US, since I can't actually read the Thai standards for SEER).

1. SEER is calculated over a range of temperatures so depending on how your cooling load matches the assumed temperature range it may or may not be accurate.
2. The benefits of SEER increase diminish as the SEER gets larger. That is, you will see a bigger savings going from a SEER of 13 to 15 than you would see going from 15 to 17.
3. Some units still have their efficiency stated in EER, which is not directly comparable to SEER.

So, in general, I would only use it as a rough guideline, but I wouldn't put too much weight on it when making the decision, especially if working at the higher SEER values 19/20+.

It's very helpful to know those SEER points especially when comparing the higher rated SEER units to each other. IMHO mentioned the fact that the Smile Plus series (vs its original Smile series) uses Daikins 3rd gen R32 technology! With LOS being a tropical locale, it would be nice if they would use a one temperature / humidity EER rating that is more reflective of the national temperatures to rate AC units here.

I also need to install AC in the L-shaped living room / kitchen pictured in the attachment. What AC units would you recommend and where to place them?

[bankruatsteve]

I would go with 18K BTU on the N wall. If you likely to have AC most of the time, then inverter unit would make sense.

[8OA8]

I'm about to renew all my AC units in my condo as the existing equipment is all pretty much at the end of its life, however I'm hesitant on the way to go forward since visiting the http://www.daikin.co.th/service-btu-calculation/#.

When I look at the power consumption figures comparison for my living room (6.5m x 5.6m) on the Daikin site, there is a large difference when I compare between the new duct type (inverter), same as I currently have, but with Inverter, at using Baht 29,340/yr electricity and the new Inverter wall mounted units using Baht 17,722/yr electricity.

Has anyone ever switched over from the built in units and gone for replacing them with wall mounted units? If yes should I just aim to have them fitted where the current duct outlet grilles are located and have a tradesman make the necessary support work for them to fix the wall unit to?

Appreciate feedback from anyone with this experience, even if they didn't go ahead with the change but replaced with the original style and can advise the reason for replacing the existing ducted units with new ducted units.

[IMHO]

I'm about to renew all my AC units in my condo as the existing equipment is all pretty much at the end of its life, however I'm hesitant on the way to go forward since visiting the http://www.daikin.co.th/service-btu-calculation/#.

When I look at the power consumption figures comparison for my living room (6.5m x 5.6m) on the Daikin site, there is a large difference when I compare between the new duct type (inverter), same as I currently have, but with Inverter, at using Baht 29,340/yr electricity and the new Inverter wall mounted units using Baht 17,722/yr electricity.

Has anyone ever switched over from the built in units and gone for replacing them with wall mounted units? If yes should I just aim to have them fitted where the current duct outlet grilles are located and have a tradesman make the necessary support work for them to fix the wall unit to?

Appreciate feedback from anyone with this experience, even if they didn't go ahead with the change but replaced with the original style and can advise the reason for replacing the existing ducted units with new ducted units.

The best ducted types I've seen are still using tech from the mid 2000's - i.e. first gen inverters and r410A refrigerant - the worst are still using R22 with old fashioned compressor cycling. Performance and efficiency is a long, long way from the newest R32 inverter wall units.

For a room your size, you'd probably only going to use a single wall unit. Actually yes you are, I just used the calculator

I have two of the FTKM33NV2S systems the Daikin site recommends for you. These things blow serious volumes of cold air - you don't just feel a breeze, they blow papers off tables 4M away One thing you need to be mindful of is that it's not silent - it's not terribly loud - in a living room they're OK, but in a bedroom it'd bother you. The smaller systems are much quieter (and blow much less air) if that's a concern.

This model also has motorized left/right swing as well as up/down, so don't put them in a corner - ideally you'd want it in the middle of a wall somewhere where it's going to be able to distribute the air evenly around the room.

A couple of other things to consider:

1. The indoor unit is BIG. It's 1.2M wide and 34cm high - and you want to leave minimum 5cm gap (ideally 10cm) to the ceiling above it as that's where the air inlet is - which means the bottom of the unit is going to be 39-44cm from the ceiling.

2. These wall units do not have pumps for getting rid of condensate water like ducted systems do - so they have to be installed in a location where the drain pipe always flows downhill from the indoor unit.