US military units to stay for South China Sea patrols

[LawrenceChee]

The current CCP Govt has no history of starting a large scale war while the USA have accumulated quite a resume in the last 50 years...hence its current actions seems strangely familiar....

In 50 years name one "large scale war" the US has started. Bet you cant.

While you are at the questions, please name one single time the CCP military has ever come to the rescue of another sovereign country in times of need.

Let's see the Chinese have been involved in humanitarian acts when there are natural disasters for every large scale disaster

if you mean by rescue "implied interfering and poking your noses into something you should not " then yes China loses to USA on this regard

[Publicus]

^hehe, Clinton is Super Hilary to you, and we all understand that. You do state correctly though, that China does both fear and respect Clinton more so than any of the other candidates. This is well documented in international, China, and Asian journals and press.

I just have one question: can Hilary walk on water?

Ahh yes, The Nutcake Rule applies in the absolute that no positive word about Hillary Clinton is ever allowed, anywhere, anytime, for any reason without an equal and opposite attack. And then some. And then an awful lot more.

Even people who are generally measured and moderate in respect of most issues and public figures can and do invariably jump and indeed pounce in their personal animosity towards the lady Hillary Clinton.

When the topic of HRC arises the swarm of rightwhingenuts descends, as do otherwise normally rational people, in pursuit of their bents. No positive word is allowed or is allowed to stand unmolested.

My post discussed all the present surviving candidates of each party for the office of Potus in relation to the CCP and its PRC. Yet the attack post focuses on only one of 'em, Hillary Clinton. The focus is as per usual and typical concerning HRC, and it is by the usual suspects.

The whole of it is abnormal. In the extreme.

Here is abnormal...in the extreme:

When a Potus Hillary Clinton announces there'll be a meeting to settle the SCS stuff and that everyone needs to be there, then everyone will be there. Nobody will come out of it happy but just about everything will be wrapped up. Only Potus will be smiling and that is all that will count or matter.

Wow, Madame President will be truly omniscient, and awesome. She will call all the shots, everyone will snap to attention, and only she will walk away from any exchange with China as a winner.

Woo, have another short one my friend, or write another treatise on her majesty.

Wow, Madame President will be truly omniscient, and awesome.

That and all the rest of it is your construct. This poster said what he said, not what you were impelled/compelled to post to suit yourself instead.

To reiterate, no mention of Hillary Clinton goes unassailed in the extreme by the fringe whingers or unattended by those who have their own particular personal bent.

Say one thing positive about Hillary Clinton and the pages of virulent attacks against her and the statement extend indefinitely. Repeatedly and repeating the same stuff. Over and again and on and on.

Forget CCP or whatever the substantive topic, is how the Clinton bashers react. It's all about HRC so attack, attack, attack her and never mind anything else.

Only rarely will a chronic and incurable attacker of HRC briefly address the substantive topic in the anti-Clinton assault. This is because the mind is always fixated on and against HRC. The bashers almost never attend to the topic, just bash HRC. They've always got the rag on against Hillary Clinton.

[2fishin2]

China is not going to re-take Taiwan ...integration is the key , a concept I know trigger happy idiots find hard to fathom as they grow up learning only bombing works

Then why all the offensive weapons in the China straight aimed directly at Taiwan?

Why are they building military bases in the spratleys?

It's has been reduced every year as a result of negotiations and good ties that are improving ...so why did it take this long for you guys to visit Cuba till Obama ...trade is not lifted yet ? What are you waiting for ?

This thread is about the US patrols and presence in the South China Sea and not about Cuba.

Reduced every year is fully incorrect.

Still waiting on your answer to the military buildup and development of the Spratleys....

[2fishin2]

The current CCP Govt has no history of starting a large scale war while the USA have accumulated quite a resume in the last 50 years...hence its current actions seems strangely familiar....

In 50 years name one "large scale war" the US has started. Bet you cant.

While you are at the questions, please name one single time the CCP military has ever come to the rescue of another sovereign country in times of need.

Let start with Iraq shall we or are we arguing the grammatical point of getting involved vs started

The death kill rate is higher ...for this we thank the yanks for that ...every military campaign resulted in the death of civilians and ongoing conflicts / suffering

Again dont start with the strawman arguments....debate the OP.

And what countries has the CCP rescued or defended anywhere?

[2fishin2]

The current CCP Govt has no history of starting a large scale war while the USA have accumulated quite a resume in the last 50 years...hence its current actions seems strangely familiar....

In 50 years name one "large scale war" the US has started. Bet you cant.

While you are at the questions, please name one single time the CCP military has ever come to the rescue of another sovereign country in times of need.

Let's see the Chinese have been involved in humanitarian acts when there are natural disasters for every large scale disaster

if you mean by rescue "implied interfering and poking your noses into something you should not " then yes China loses to USA on this regard

Still not answering my questions are ya.

Im saying the CCP defends nor helps no country in the world except for North Korea. That speaks volumes and volumes about the CCP attitude.

[keemapoot]

Ahh yes, The Nutcake Rule applies in the absolute that no positive word about Hillary Clinton is ever allowed, anywhere, anytime, for any reason without an equal and opposite attack. And then some. And then an awful lot more.

Even people who are generally measured and moderate in respect of most issues and public figures can and do invariably jump and indeed pounce in their personal animosity towards the lady Hillary Clinton.

When the topic of HRC arises the swarm of rightwhingenuts descends, as do otherwise normally rational people, in pursuit of their bents. No positive word is allowed or is allowed to stand unmolested.

My post discussed all the present surviving candidates of each party for the office of Potus in relation to the CCP and its PRC. Yet the attack post focuses on only one of 'em, Hillary Clinton. The focus is as per usual and typical concerning HRC, and it is by the usual suspects.

The whole of it is abnormal. In the extreme.

Here is abnormal...in the extreme:

When a Potus Hillary Clinton announces there'll be a meeting to settle the SCS stuff and that everyone needs to be there, then everyone will be there. Nobody will come out of it happy but just about everything will be wrapped up. Only Potus will be smiling and that is all that will count or matter.

Wow, Madame President will be truly omniscient, and awesome. She will call all the shots, everyone will snap to attention, and only she will walk away from any exchange with China as a winner.

Woo, have another short one my friend, or write another treatise on her majesty.

Wow, Madame President will be truly omniscient, and awesome.

That and all the rest of it is your construct. This poster said what he said, not what you were impelled/compelled to post to suit yourself instead.

To reiterate, no mention of Hillary Clinton goes unassailed in the extreme by the fringe whingers or unattended by those who have their own particular personal bent.

Say one thing positive about Hillary Clinton and the pages of virulent attacks against her and the statement extend indefinitely. Repeatedly and repeating the same stuff. Over and again and on and on.

Forget CCP or whatever the substantive topic, is how the Clinton bashers react. It's all about HRC so attack, attack, attack her and never mind anything else.

Only rarely will a chronic and incurable attacker of HRC briefly address the substantive topic in the anti-Clinton assault. This is because the mind is always fixated on and against HRC. The bashers almost never attend to the topic, just bash HRC. They've always got the rag on against Hillary Clinton.

I'm afraid most of us don't share your doe-eyed boyish adoration of Hilary Clinton, who can do no wrong.

Some of us think she is competent, and have stated so on this forum, and also think she is fallible, and prone to errant judgment and abuse of process and position in pursuit of her ambitions to power.

Anti-Clinton attacking is hardly the topic, it's maybe how she will handle the SCS situation, as she is highly likely to be the next POTUS. So, yes, let's focus on that, and not let our eyes glaze over as we visualize her unilateral glories vs. China before they occur.

[LawrenceChee]

The current CCP Govt has no history of starting a large scale war while the USA have accumulated quite a resume in the last 50 years...hence its current actions seems strangely familiar....

In 50 years name one "large scale war" the US has started. Bet you cant.

While you are at the questions, please name one single time the CCP military has ever come to the rescue of another sovereign country in times of need.

Let's see the Chinese have been involved in humanitarian acts when there are natural disasters for every large scale disaster

if you mean by rescue "implied interfering and poking your noses into something you should not " then yes China loses to USA on this regard

Still not answering my questions are ya.

Im saying the CCP defends nor helps no country in the world except for North Korea. That speaks volumes and volumes about the CCP attitude.

Yes try having a mad case like North Korea Kim at your doorstep, he has a huge amount of weapons that can kill your citizens

So far China assisted the world by negotiating with them and they are only firing pot shots into the sea

I say that is biggest assistance ever without military deaths ; don't for one moment imagine the world can deal with a massive North Korea refugees situations

If you cannot see the value in that , I Guess you are one of those who advocate bombings instead of talking ...well done right wing hawk ...sure is a good boost to world peace

[LawrenceChee]

The current CCP Govt has no history of starting a large scale war while the USA have accumulated quite a resume in the last 50 years...hence its current actions seems strangely familiar....

In 50 years name one "large scale war" the US has started. Bet you cant.

While you are at the questions, please name one single time the CCP military has ever come to the rescue of another sovereign country in times of need.

Let's see the Chinese have been involved in humanitarian acts when there are natural disasters for every large scale disaster

if you mean by rescue "implied interfering and poking your noses into something you should not " then yes China loses to USA on this regard

Still not answering my questions are ya.

Im saying the CCP defends nor helps no country in the world except for North Korea. That speaks volumes and volumes about the CCP attitude.

What's the definition of defend ? What military campaign in the 15 years have brought more peace to those countries ?

You say defend but there is definitely opinion out there it is unnecessary interference and creation of resource grabbing

[LawrenceChee]

China is not going to re-take Taiwan ...integration is the key , a concept I know trigger happy idiots find hard to fathom as they grow up learning only bombing works

Then why all the offensive weapons in the China straight aimed directly at Taiwan?

Why are they building military bases in the spratleys?

It's has been reduced every year as a result of negotiations and good ties that are improving ...so why did it take this long for you guys to visit Cuba till Obama ...trade is not lifted yet ? What are you waiting for ?

This thread is about the US patrols and presence in the South China Sea and not about Cuba.

Reduced every year is fully incorrect.

Still waiting on your answer to the military buildup and development of the Spratleys....

No different from USA having camps in Okinawa and Guam ; its for strategic launch and defence.

Talk to Comrade P ...he's an expert on military nagging and tactics / capabilities of the USA forces

[2fishin2]

China is not going to re-take Taiwan ...integration is the key , a concept I know trigger happy idiots find hard to fathom as they grow up learning only bombing works

Then why all the offensive weapons in the China straight aimed directly at Taiwan?

Why are they building military bases in the spratleys?

It's has been reduced every year as a result of negotiations and good ties that are improving ...so why did it take this long for you guys to visit Cuba till Obama ...trade is not lifted yet ? What are you waiting for ?

This thread is about the US patrols and presence in the South China Sea and not about Cuba.

Reduced every year is fully incorrect.

Still waiting on your answer to the military buildup and development of the Spratleys....

No different from USA having camps in Okinawa and Guam ; its for strategic launch and defence.

Talk to Comrade P ...he's an expert on military nagging and tactics / capabilities of the USA forces

This is the only post of yours Im going to respond to. Let me help you out with some information you obviously know nothing about except what you have heard or propaganda you might have read.

I as a US service member, was stationed in Japan for 10 years, 6 in Okinawa, 4 in mainland. After retirement I worked for the USAF as a civilian for another 10 years.

Please hear this, there is absolutely no, I repeat no strategic launch capabilities in Okinawa, none. The main reason we are in the Pacific is because our friends the Japanese and Koreans want us there. Its for their defense and theirs only. No other reason but that. The problem happening now is the CCP buildup in the south china sea and Spratleys. This has been causing concern for many years and is escalating now. But for those actions there would be no problems at all.

I know all about this and let me reiterate again you are absolutely 100% incorrect in your statements.

[boomerangutang]

The current CCP Govt has no history of starting a large scale war while the USA have accumulated quite a resume in the last 50 years...hence its current actions seems strangely familiar....

The Chinese sent an army into Tibet in the 1950's. It knew Tibet's army was woefully ill-equipped. Tibet's few field cannon were the same style used in America's civil war of 95 years prior. China had numerous tanks. The invasion of Tibet was right after wwII and at a time when communications were poor quality. It was too swift for English or US troops to come to Tibet's aid. A key component was a Tibetan leader who conspired to bomb his own castle full of munitions at just the time when the Chinese started their invasion. He was probably paid by Chinese agents to do so. Tibet may not qualify as 'a large war' but it's a large territory - somewhat like a giant rock fortress.

There are similarities with the current Chinese territory grab in the SCS. They're enacting a preemptive territory grab with no advance notice. They're quickly militarizing the islands. Concurrently, they're showering the Chinese sheeple with false proofs that the islands have always been Chinese. Earlier, someone mentioned how the Chinese populace would go ballistic if there was a preemptive military strike on the islands. That's true, and a large measure of that would cyber warfare. Another issue: at any given time, there are tens of thousands of Americans in China, mostly tourists, but also in other capacities. There's no doubt Americans in China would be brutally targetted, if a US strike took place. The same wouldn't happen in the US (Americans targeting visiting Chinese) because Americans are culturally different in that way - much more restrained and fair-minded.

[LawrenceChee]

China is not going to re-take Taiwan ...integration is the key , a concept I know trigger happy idiots find hard to fathom as they grow up learning only bombing works

Then why all the offensive weapons in the China straight aimed directly at Taiwan?

Why are they building military bases in the spratleys?

It's has been reduced every year as a result of negotiations and good ties that are improving ...so why did it take this long for you guys to visit Cuba till Obama ...trade is not lifted yet ? What are you waiting for ?

This thread is about the US patrols and presence in the South China Sea and not about Cuba.

Reduced every year is fully incorrect.

Still waiting on your answer to the military buildup and development of the Spratleys....

No different from USA having camps in Okinawa and Guam ; its for strategic launch and defence.

Talk to Comrade P ...he's an expert on military nagging and tactics / capabilities of the USA forces

This is the only post of yours Im going to respond to. Let me help you out with some information you obviously know nothing about except what you have heard or propaganda you might have read.

I as a US service member, was stationed in Japan for 10 years, 6 in Okinawa, 4 in mainland. After retirement I worked for the USAF as a civilian for another 10 years.

Please hear this, there is absolutely no, I repeat no strategic launch capabilities in Okinawa, none. The main reason we are in the Pacific is because our friends the Japanese and Koreans want us there. Its for their defense and theirs only. No other reason but that. The problem happening now is the CCP buildup in the south china sea and Spratleys. This has been causing concern for many years and is escalating now. But for those actions there would be no problems at all.

I know all about this and let me reiterate again you are absolutely 100% incorrect in your statements.

If that's the case then heed the local residents wishes and protests , pull out and head home as the bases have never been welcomed by the Okinawa residents. Yeap if there is no launch ability or Defence ability , I guess you guys are there only for the cultural dance experiences of the Naha prefecture

I know about the Chinese military and govt bodies in the south, there is no intent to attack.

[2fishin2]

China is not going to re-take Taiwan ...integration is the key , a concept I know trigger happy idiots find hard to fathom as they grow up learning only bombing works

Then why all the offensive weapons in the China straight aimed directly at Taiwan?

Why are they building military bases in the spratleys?

It's has been reduced every year as a result of negotiations and good ties that are improving ...so why did it take this long for you guys to visit Cuba till Obama ...trade is not lifted yet ? What are you waiting for ?

This thread is about the US patrols and presence in the South China Sea and not about Cuba.

Reduced every year is fully incorrect.

Still waiting on your answer to the military buildup and development of the Spratleys....

No different from USA having camps in Okinawa and Guam ; its for strategic launch and defence.

Talk to Comrade P ...he's an expert on military nagging and tactics / capabilities of the USA forces

This is the only post of yours Im going to respond to. Let me help you out with some information you obviously know nothing about except what you have heard or propaganda you might have read.

I as a US service member, was stationed in Japan for 10 years, 6 in Okinawa, 4 in mainland. After retirement I worked for the USAF as a civilian for another 10 years.

Please hear this, there is absolutely no, I repeat no strategic launch capabilities in Okinawa, none. The main reason we are in the Pacific is because our friends the Japanese and Koreans want us there. Its for their defense and theirs only. No other reason but that. The problem happening now is the CCP buildup in the south china sea and Spratleys. This has been causing concern for many years and is escalating now. But for those actions there would be no problems at all.

I know all about this and let me reiterate again you are absolutely 100% incorrect in your statements.

If that's the case then heed the local residents wishes and protests , pull out and head home as the bases have never been welcomed by the Okinawa residents. Yeap if there is no launch ability or Defence ability , I guess you guys are there only for the cultural dance experiences of the Naha prefecture

I know about the Chinese military and govt bodies in the south, there is no intent to attack.

You must be a troll because you know nothing of global politics or military in general. Your comments are completely uneducated, lacking any substance. Pure propaganda and rhetoric.

You might be correct about the south though....its all about the land and oil you want to take. Lets wait until the UN Tribunal is finished about the attempted land grab and militarization of that area. This situation has been building for a long time and will cause major issues because of the Chinese attempt to grab islands all for the sole purpose of oil and disruption of the South China Sea.

Typical Communist aggression.

[Publicus]

It's has been reduced every year as a result of negotiations and good ties that are improving ...so why did it take this long for you guys to visit Cuba till Obama ...trade is not lifted yet ? What are you waiting for ?

This thread is about the US patrols and presence in the South China Sea and not about Cuba.

Reduced every year is fully incorrect.

Still waiting on your answer to the military buildup and development of the Spratleys....

No different from USA having camps in Okinawa and Guam ; its for strategic launch and defence.

Talk to Comrade P ...he's an expert on military nagging and tactics / capabilities of the USA forces

The poster doesn't need to talk to any of your CCP comrades nor does he need to speak to this poster. The poster made the central point when he stated in his post above:

Please hear this, there is absolutely no, I repeat no strategic launch capabilities in Okinawa, none

China Tests Nuclear Missile That Can Strike All Parts of the United States

The Chinese regime went ahead with tests of its newest ballistic missile on April 12, which can allegedly carry up to 10 nuclear warheads to any part of the United States.

It conducted the tests while also expressing discord over an upcoming decision from an international arbitration court about China’s claims to the South China Sea. The case, brought to court by the Philippines, could discredit China’s claims to the region.

It also notes the tests came just three days before Defense Secretary Ash Carter visited a U.S. aircraft carrier in the South China Sea, and around the same time that a high-ranking Chinese general “made an unusual visit to a disputed South China Sea island.”

http://asia.nikkei.com/Politics-Economy/International-Relations/China-praises-Cambodia-s-position-on-South-China-Sea

"Strategic" launch capabilities for those who might not be acquainted with the terminology refers to nuclear weapons. Few people like to use the term "nuclear weapons" so virtually each of the nuclear powers use the one word "strategic." Strategic weapons.

US for instance has the Strategic Command, led by a four-star that is in possession and control under Potus and SecDef of most of the US arsenal of strategic weapons ready to launch. The US Strategic Air Command is its bomber force of nuclear capable aircraft commanded by a USAF four-star, since the 1950s.

CCP has had this DF-41 intercontinental missile under development for 15 years, so this test was not an off the wall thingy. Indeed, the test could have been carried out say, three months ago, or say, three months from this month. But it was not. The test was executed this month.

There is apprehension that CCP is moving, or is about to move, things nuclear to the islands it has either occupied or constructed in violation of the ILOS. And now we anticipate CCP will move imminently againstt he Scarborough Shoal of the Philippines which is 620 miles (1000 km) from the China coast.

CCP Dictators are getting themselves and the rest of us into a very dangerous and messy series of escalations.

[LawrenceChee]

China is not going to re-take Taiwan ...integration is the key , a concept I know trigger happy idiots find hard to fathom as they grow up learning only bombing works

Then why all the offensive weapons in the China straight aimed directly at Taiwan?

Why are they building military bases in the spratleys?

It's has been reduced every year as a result of negotiations and good ties that are improving ...so why did it take this long for you guys to visit Cuba till Obama ...trade is not lifted yet ? What are you waiting for ?

This thread is about the US patrols and presence in the South China Sea and not about Cuba.

Reduced every year is fully incorrect.

Still waiting on your answer to the military buildup and development of the Spratleys....

No different from USA having camps in Okinawa and Guam ; its for strategic launch and defence.

Talk to Comrade P ...he's an expert on military nagging and tactics / capabilities of the USA forces

This is the only post of yours Im going to respond to. Let me help you out with some information you obviously know nothing about except what you have heard or propaganda you might have read.

I as a US service member, was stationed in Japan for 10 years, 6 in Okinawa, 4 in mainland. After retirement I worked for the USAF as a civilian for another 10 years.

Please hear this, there is absolutely no, I repeat no strategic launch capabilities in Okinawa, none. The main reason we are in the Pacific is because our friends the Japanese and Koreans want us there. Its for their defense and theirs only. No other reason but that. The problem happening now is the CCP buildup in the south china sea and Spratleys. This has been causing concern for many years and is escalating now. But for those actions there would be no problems at all.

I know all about this and let me reiterate again you are absolutely 100% incorrect in your statements.

If that's the case then heed the local residents wishes and protests , pull out and head home as the bases have never been welcomed by the Okinawa residents. Yeap if there is no launch ability or Defence ability , I guess you guys are there only for the cultural dance experiences of the Naha prefecture

I know about the Chinese military and govt bodies in the south, there is no intent to attack.

You must be a troll because you know nothing of global politics or military in general. Your comments are completely uneducated, lacking any substance. Pure propaganda and rhetoric.

You might be correct about the south though....its all about the land and oil you want to take. Lets wait until the UN Tribunal is finished about the attempted land grab and militarization of that area. This situation has been building for a long time and will cause major issues because of the Chinese attempt to grab islands all for the sole purpose of oil and disruption of the South China Sea.

Typical Communist aggression.

You have 10 years in the military and I have that same amount in the Govt bodies and more in doing business in China

Mutual respect is what you are missing , hurling insults is a typical western response that is Low class and you almost like Comrade P ; thank god there are a lot of moderates in this forum who constantly write to me asking me to ignore the likes of you guys

Try talking , insulting people's intelligence is dumb especially when you don't know anything about me or what I do. I am confident because of the information I have.

[2fishin2]

LC then please enlighten us in why the CCP has started taking reefs and land 1000 kilometers outside their land borders, which is also within 300 kilometers of the Philippines and inside their economic zone? A sovereign nation is again being encroached upon by the CCP for what purpose? I already know the answer its oil and control of the South China Sea and its economic area. Why is there a UN tribunal being conducted about these illegal activities? Why has the CCP ignored UN request to participate in the tribunal?

All of this is because of the CCP aggression in the area. Nothing more nothing less. And just because you missed it I have over 20 years in the Japan.

Please explain what is happening as the world also wants to know....

[Publicus]

No blockade will happen because it cannot be enforced and no aggression from the Chinese to provoke the first move ; everyone is more worried what the meddling Americans will do next

They are almost running out of places for their flawed foreign policy engagement

As for the next POTUS , the Govt in China knows it's only 4 years ...so how bad can it be .... It's a dynasty for a reason they can patiently wait out the 4 years and wait for the next person

Meanwhile dredging goes on today ..:.

Xi Jinping is under public attack in the Party media. Of course published attacks against Xi get deleted immediately. Still, Xi Jinping has amassed more power than Mao and he's just named himself Commander in Chief of the armed forces. He wuz it anyway, he just didn't have the formal title. So now Xi has pronounced himself something else again too.

Xi believes raising hell in the SCS will unite the Party and thus the country behind him. Xi is however too far gone for that. His Party enemies will go after him no matter what, all in the name of the Party and for the honor of China. Xi will still be there tomorrow and for a while yet, but he's had to cover his rice all over the place for some time now.

Two former PLA supreme commanders are in prison for unsuccessful coup attempts, one dying of -- what was it now -- oh yes, cancer. Initial reports conflicted, one saying Gen Ruan Zhibo had died of an "incurable illness" (coup plotting) while the PLA reported he'd committed suicide. Gen Guo Boxiong is in prison as is his coup pal Chongqing chief Bo Xilai. Bo's coup was busted when his police chief showed up in the middle of the night at the US Consulate in Chengdu to spill the beans and unsuccessfully seek political asylum in the USA (denied because of CCP internal political stuff).

By one report....

With the ouster of Guo and Xu before him, Xi and Wang Qishan, Politburo Standing Committee member and head of the powerful Central Commission for Discipline Inspection, have made it clear that the ‘new’ PLA will not tolerate a senior military leadership that has its loyalties anywhere but the CMC. Learning from Mao’s purges of senior generals during the Cultural Revolution, which has its 50th anniversary next month, Xi understands the value of asserting personal control over the military.

http://thediplomat.com/2016/04/xi-jinpings-pla-ambitions-why-guo-boxiong-had-to-go/

Here's the most direct report of the new and vocal public opposition to Xi....

Recently a letter claiming to be written by “171 loyal Chinese Communist Party members” called for immediately stripping Chinese Communist Party (CCP) leader Xi Jinping of all his posts in the Party, Army, and government.

The open letter listed five counts of Xi’s wrongdoing, including organizational, legal, diplomatic, military, and personal life. It called for “the immediate convening of an emergency meeting of the CPC Central Committee, and an emergency NPC meeting to discuss the above-mentioned five serious wrongdoings, and stripping Xi of all his posts in the Party, military, and government.”

This letter and a previous one, published during the Party’s “Two Sessions” meetings and titled “Loyal Party members call upon Xi to resign” were exactly of the same nature. The first letter advised Xi to resign, and it threatened, “We are concerned that the intensifying power struggle within the Party may threaten the safety of you and your family.”

http://www.southasiaanalysis.org/node/1978

Here's a deeper dive account by D.S. Rajan, Distinguished Fellow at the Channi Center for China Studies in India....

As Andrew Nathan, a noted Sinologist correctly points out (Cracks in Xi Jinping’s Fortress?, China File conversation, March 21, 2016),”the issue of CDIC document is an act of remonstrance : although it emanates from a posture of loyalty to the leader, it presents a more serious challenge. Chinese political tradition gives great value to “loyal remonstrance” (jiàn, 谏), in which one warns a powerful figure as a way of serving him, at the risk of one’s head.

Remonstrance comes from within the leader’s camp, rather than from opponents. And, as the historical and literary allusions in the document suggest, it comes about when the leader is in great danger—from himself. Observers will puzzle over whether the head of the CDIC, Xi’s close comrade-in-arms Wang Qishan, knew about this document in advance. Even if he did not, the fact that it appeared on the website of the Party’s own enforcement arm suggests that Xi’s most fervent supporters are the ones most worried about the path he has taken.”

http://www.c3sindia.org/china-internal/5580

It is not only those loyal to Xi who are publicly complaining and making demands of Xi. Reformers and anti-reformers in the CCP have been targeted by Xi's supposed anti-corruption campaign which has focused almost entirely on his political opponents and political enemies.

The faction of former president and master conspirator Jiang Zemin is Xi's primary purge target. Now the Jiang faction is reported to be behind a move to have all 86 million CCP members vote for the next Party chairman in 2017 when Xi is up for a second five-year term, one vote each, and to vote to elect members of the Central Committee, Politburo. The Central Committee itself votes to appoint the president and the PM with five others who rule the PRC day to day. Nobody has heard what PM Li Kijiang thinks of all of this in his position as vice chairman of the Standing Committee, of which Xi is chairman.

The CCP inside the PRC is beginning to look like the Republican party in the United States.

As to the impact of the current turmoil at the top of the CCP on the South China Sea, it's been said with an increasing frequency that the only thing we have to fear more than a rising China is a falling China. SCS is Xi's ace in the hole...or so he believes.

Anyone who might want more sources about this that are also credible sources should contact me. I'm also advised of these matters by friends I continue to have in the PRC itself, people strongly opposed to Xi who'd said to me18 months ago that the time to stop Xi was then or he'd be unstoppable. Better late than never.

[tonbridgebrit]

This is the only post of yours Im going to respond to. Let me help you out with some information you obviously know nothing about except what you have heard or propaganda you might have read.

I as a US service member, was stationed in Japan for 10 years, 6 in Okinawa, 4 in mainland. After retirement I worked for the USAF as a civilian for another 10 years.

Please hear this, there is absolutely no, I repeat no strategic launch capabilities in Okinawa, none. The main reason we are in the Pacific is because our friends the Japanese and Koreans want us there. Its for their defense and theirs only. No other reason but that. The problem happening now is the CCP buildup in the south china sea and Spratleys. This has been causing concern for many years and is escalating now. But for those actions there would be no problems at all.

I know all about this and let me reiterate again you are absolutely 100% incorrect in your statements.

Okay, I've noticed that the issue of Okinawa in Japan has come along. Yes, the issue of American military bases is part of the general issue of China and the USA in the Far East.

Now then, the US military bases in Okinawa. Do the people of Okinawa want those American soldiers there ? What about the Tokyo government ?

Okay, this article is from the New York Times, it's from four years ago, but I think the issues remain the same.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/15/world/asia/okinawan-views-on-us-military-presence-are-nuanced.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

A quote from the New York Times article [The biggest setback came two years ago, when the prime minister at the time, Yukio Hatoyama, broke an election promise to move the base off the island entirely, which only seemed to confirm Tokyo’s willingness to allow the Americans to remain on Okinawa.]

Okay, everybody is welcome to read the article I've put up above. I really do think that most of the people of Okinawa would rather NOT have the American miltary on their island.

[tonbridgebrit]

This is the only post of yours Im going to respond to. Let me help you out with some information you obviously know nothing about except what you have heard or propaganda you might have read.

I as a US service member, was stationed in Japan for 10 years, 6 in Okinawa, 4 in mainland. After retirement I worked for the USAF as a civilian for another 10 years.

Please hear this, there is absolutely no, I repeat no strategic launch capabilities in Okinawa, none. The main reason we are in the Pacific is because our friends the Japanese and Koreans want us there. Its for their defense and theirs only. No other reason but that. The problem happening now is the CCP buildup in the south china sea and Spratleys. This has been causing concern for many years and is escalating now. But for those actions there would be no problems at all.

I know all about this and let me reiterate again you are absolutely 100% incorrect in your statements.

And here's a more recent article, from the BBC. From last year, April, 2015.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-32476954

Regarding the issue of re-locating a US base in Okinawa to another part of Okinawa, from the above article, a quote [but for most Okinawans, 60km is not nearly far enough. They want to see the US Marines moved much further - say Guam for instance, or even better, Australia.]

Oh, so the actual people of Okinawa would like to see the US soldiers moved to Guam or Australia, and NOT to another part of Okinawa. Is that the case ?

The American military presence in the Far East. Are they the solution to the problem ? OR, are they part of the problem ?

[tonbridgebrit]

And also, the Philippines. Do they feel threatened by the "Chinese menace" ? Is it a good idea to have American soldiers in the Philippines ?

The Americans pulled out back in 1991 and 92. Are the Americans going to be back in Subic Bay ??

[Publicus]

I'm afraid most of us don't share your doe-eyed boyish adoration of Hilary Clinton, who can do no wrong.

Some of us think she is competent, and have stated so on this forum, and also think she is fallible, and prone to errant judgment and abuse of process and position in pursuit of her ambitions to power.

Anti-Clinton attacking is hardly the topic, it's maybe how she will handle the SCS situation, as she is highly likely to be the next POTUS. So, yes, let's focus on that, and not let our eyes glaze over as we visualize her unilateral glories vs. China before they occur.

Your posts here continue to reflect your own attitude toward Hillary Clinton and not mine. You are trying to assign to me thoughts, emotions, and an attitude I do not have nor have I ever had toward any political figure in the USA (or elsewhere more immediately).

Governments throughout the region to include CCP expect HRC to be the next Potus and they expect new and different actions in relation to the SCS and the region. HRC was the SecState who initiated the Rebalance and Pivot to the Pacific. Her rationale is credible, i.e., East and South Asia respectively are the growth areas of the global economy outside of the USA and the United States needs to be involved here.

Beyond that, with CCP carrying on the the East Sea against Japan and in the SCS against Asean and the Maritime Global Commons that the SCS is, we will see what will happen.

The strong majority of American voters chose Barack Obama as Potus in 2008 and in 2010 because they believed he was the man of the time to deal with the priority matters domestic and internationally. That is true for better and for worse, depending on one's political and cultural biases. Likewise for Hillary Clinton in 2016.

One can expect the increasing mess in the SCS to get some new and significant sorting out beginning next year. One can also expect a Potus Clinton will retain the hawk Ashton Carter as SecDef as they are on the same page just about verbatim.

[Publicus]

The current CCP Govt has no history of starting a large scale war while the USA have accumulated quite a resume in the last 50 years...hence its current actions seems strangely familiar....

In 50 years name one "large scale war" the US has started. Bet you cant.

While you are at the questions, please name one single time the CCP military has ever come to the rescue of another sovereign country in times of need.

Let's see the Chinese have been involved in humanitarian acts when there are natural disasters for every large scale disaster

if you mean by rescue "implied interfering and poking your noses into something you should not " then yes China loses to USA on this regard

In China the ultimate criterion it either obey or disobey. Those who obey are rewarded with good position and pay, while those who disobey are punished.

Youse guyz never learn. Youse don't get it, have never got it, won't ever get past yourselves.

After Stingy Aid to Typhoon Victims, China Tries Damage Control

With a relief team finally on its way to the Philippines, China is trying to control the damage from its petty response to the Typhoon Haiyan tragedy.

A 17-member disaster relief team from the China Red Cross prepares to depart for the Philippines, in Beijing, on Nov. 20

Photograph by Ng Han Guan/AP Photo

The storm may have killed thousands of people and brought to a halt a large swath of China’s neighbor to the south, but since the world’s new economic giant is feuding with the Philippines about disputed islands in the South China Sea, the leadership in Beijing decided to take advantage of a humanitarian catastrophe to teach President Benigno Aquino who’s boss.

China initially offered a paltry $100,000 in aid and, after an international outcry, raised that figure to $1.6 million. It’s as if Dr. Evil decided to go into the disaster-relief business: “One point six million dollars!” Hence the headlines worldwide expressing outrage that China, the world’s second-largest economy, was offering less money than do-it-yourself furniture maker Ikea.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2013-11-20/after-stingy-aid-to-typhoon-haiyan-victims-china-tries-damage-control

US Marines board aircraft bound for the Philippines to help with disaster relief after Typhoon Haiyan.

UPDATE: Aircraft carrier USS George Washington underway to disaster zone.

http://breakingdefense.com/2013/11/philippine-typhoon-showcases-us-strategic-edge-over-china/

China has no soul. No common sense. No brains. China is the autistic country.

We also see graphically why Bloomberg News is banned in the CCP China by its Dictators -- prohibited, censored, closed out of.

The Hopeless Country.

[keemapoot]

I'm afraid most of us don't share your doe-eyed boyish adoration of Hilary Clinton, who can do no wrong.

Some of us think she is competent, and have stated so on this forum, and also think she is fallible, and prone to errant judgment and abuse of process and position in pursuit of her ambitions to power.

Anti-Clinton attacking is hardly the topic, it's maybe how she will handle the SCS situation, as she is highly likely to be the next POTUS. So, yes, let's focus on that, and not let our eyes glaze over as we visualize her unilateral glories vs. China before they occur.

Your posts here continue to reflect your own attitude toward Hillary Clinton and not mine. You are trying to assign to me thoughts, emotions, and an attitude I do not have nor have I ever had toward any political figure in the USA (or elsewhere more immediately).

Governments throughout the region to include CCP expect HRC to be the next Potus and they expect new and different actions in relation to the SCS and the region. HRC was the SecState who initiated the Rebalance and Pivot to the Pacific. Her rationale is credible, i.e., East and South Asia respectively are the growth areas of the global economy outside of the USA and the United States needs to be involved here.

Beyond that, with CCP carrying on the the East Sea against Japan and in the SCS against Asean and the Maritime Global Commons that the SCS is, we will see what will happen.

The strong majority of American voters chose Barack Obama as Potus in 2008 and in 2010 because they believed he was the man of the time to deal with the priority matters domestic and internationally. That is true for better and for worse, depending on one's political and cultural biases. Likewise for Hillary Clinton in 2016.

One can expect the increasing mess in the SCS to get some new and significant sorting out beginning next year. One can also expect a Potus Clinton will retain the hawk Ashton Carter as SecDef as they are on the same page just about verbatim.

I agree that Carter, or someone equally hawkish, will remain in a Clinton admin. For sure, Clinton is the most qualified, respected, and well-reasoned of the POTUS candidates to deal with China effectively, and I consider her pivot or less offensive to allies elsewhere new rephrasing "rebalance" to Asia was the right thing and hope she expands the scope of that.

In spite of electioneering rhetoric to the contrary, I fully expect her to sign into law the TPP with support of both parties, and show US leadership in the region in a positive way. This will also help curb China's expansion if Vietnam and Malaysia avail themselves of strategic moves to contain China in the SCS.

There will be no quick and easy resolution and Clinton will not have a walk in the park as you intimated. In spite of hawkish rhetoric, I find it hard to believe that Clinton would break form and order a blockade as you suggest as I consider her more practical and sophisticated than that, and she gets it that world commerce and US would be adversely affected.

Sent from my GT-N5100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[LawrenceChee]

LC then please enlighten us in why the CCP has started taking reefs and land 1000 kilometers outside their land borders, which is also within 300 kilometers of the Philippines and inside their economic zone? A sovereign nation is again being encroached upon by the CCP for what purpose? I already know the answer its oil and control of the South China Sea and its economic area. Why is there a UN tribunal being conducted about these illegal activities? Why has the CCP ignored UN request to participate in the tribunal?

All of this is because of the CCP aggression in the area. Nothing more nothing less. And just because you missed it I have over 20 years in the Japan.

Please explain what is happening as the world also wants to know....

Hmmm ...the answers are pretty clear and if you have spent 20 years in Japan and didn't get that , I Guess you were reading the wrong sets of newspaper or journals

It does irk the west China has learnt fast what works and what does not

If you critique China for the great firewall , imagine a same unit poring over business journals etc and then having a panel advise the Govt what will work best learning from the mistakes of the west.

I would say the mystique of the east more often than not learns faster from the west because we have no media pressure to be in the limelight

While others in this forum repeatedly attacked the openness of the Chinese society , I see gradual improvements which for me is the right pace of development for a county vey mixed in urban and agriculture landscape

I apologise of this comment comes a little racially wrong ....America prides itself on being open and free with the right to speech and action, however in promoting all of that, the Chinese have looked at it and still see racism , police brutality , rednecks and opinionated people who don't seem to make the best decisions with the most open of environment and information sharing

You would probably forgive the communist government like CCP to thread carefully as they really don't want to get into trillions of debts , a society constantly fraught with demonstrations , and gunfights and killings of kids in schools because of a documents signed hundreds of years ago.

Because the doctrine of the CCP is communist and we have social responsibilities , as a party I would say it has improved gradually at its own pace , almost like a child exploring and seeing what works best

An example I can give is diary , after the last milk scandal which by the way the folks were executed ( I like that swift justice no glib Lawyers here trying to find a technicality) , countries were evaluated who we can learn from ; USA was rejected for 2 reasons ...the presence of mad cow disease and also the logistical distance to travel and perhaps risk of supply. Many others were reviewed and rejected by the panel for various reasons.

Eventually New Zealand was accepted as a country supplier to learn the know how and establish the supply chain for Fortresu .

The west have their concept of openness and the east have our own. There is no right / wrong it's a matter of preference ...if you ever get invited to a closed door session , you can see the intellect of the discussions there.

The idea why SCS is so important to China is evident, we are just learning how not to spark a war for it. We have learnt.

Trade winds is the key ....

[LawrenceChee]

As for the article posted by Comrade P over aid, it has always been a habit for eastern countries to give reasonable sums and expect the private sector to contribute

Have you seen what Singapore contributed to all the neighbouring ASEAN natural disasters over the years ? It's one of the richest country in ASEAN and yet it's donation is always modest as the private donations make up the rest

Let's not forget May of the generous pledges made by western countries is not yet paid ...so while on media it looks really good, not having paid well shall we conclude then the intention was for the media ?

I have given a 5 figure sum myself to the typhoon disaster through the Chinese chamber of commerce of Guangzhou

Learn how to have a positive mind before you critique a country as soulless , it comes across sullen and wrong ....

China has lots of kind souls and if you think the CCP Govt is evil , chuckle that's fine most people in most countries think the same of their governments

Welcome to the world of politics ....

[tonbridgebrit]

Vietnam is an extremely industrious and intelligent ASEAN country

Most of the Vietnamese I have met in the business circles are extremely good negotiators and very sharp with details

I admire them a while lot and their women are the literal backbone of the country !

Here is the history of CCP armed military violence and aggression against Vietnam to include during recent years over the SCS.

An excerpt:

In September and October 1978, Prime Minister Pham Van Dong paid official visits to the Philippines and Malaysia and signed agreements with the President and the Prime Minister of the two countries to resolve the disputes over the East Sea (internationally known as the South China Sea) by peaceful means.

In this period, the relationship between the two countries was strained. China shifted from the viewpoint that the Hoang Sa is a"dispute" to "Hoang Sa belong to China as an indisputable fact."

On February 17th 1979, China mobilized 600,000 troops to attack the six northern border provinces of Vietnam. After two weeks of heavy losses, the Chinese troops withdrew.

In March 2013, Sina.com launched the topic "Fight to defend sovereignty" to praise the Chinese military for"seizing opportunities" to "crush the unruly of Vietnam". Quoting General Yue Qiang, Sina.com boldly declared: "The clashes between China and Vietnam showed the trend of no intervention of big countries when their interests are not affected. China should take advantage of and promote it."

http://english.vietnamnet.vn/fms/special-reports/155232/china-s-ambition-and-the-lessons-from-gac-ma.html

The intervention of "big countries" referenced in the quote has now begun.

US Navy freedom of navigation exercises are underway as are joint FON exercises of the US and the Philippines. More joint exercises involving more Asean and neighboring countries will come, to include Australia and India. The coming soon ruling of the International Court of Arbitration will provide the legal basis of it.

US Pacific Fleet and US Pacific Air Forces with allies will then be able to take a decisive action to block CCP sustaining their isolated SCS islands, both the natural ones and the artificial ones that are in violation of the ILOS. Consequently, CCP has to consider the course it is taking in the SCS.

US and Japan's determination in the East Sea over the Senkaku Islands (2011-13) has simmered CCP Boyz down there, requiring them to turn their covetous attention to the SCS. CCP will soon find out they will fare no better in the SCS than they did in the East Sea where they flopped and had to fall silent and inactive. In respect of CCP and the SCS, it will take a while yet and a few incidents too, but CCP will realise the same fate there as well.

The Phils are not Japan by any means or stretch, but CCP is enabling opposition to it to succeed by creating serious objection to it throughout the entire India-South China Sea-Western Pacific region. This is occurring in the waters and seas from Shanghai to Shenzhen and Hainan Island. The grand lesson for CCP new dynasty of Chinese emperors in business suits is that no country is an island no matter its bully size or its absolutist mindset, no matter its authoritarian traditions and imperious history, or of its arbitrary culture.

Okay, I've just noticed this post from Publicus !!

Okay, lets get something sorted out here. China took part in some small confrontations with Vietnam after America had fought the Vietnam War with Vietnam. To suggest that America's conflict with Vietnam was huge, it was about one hundred times GREATER than Vietnam's lttle conflict with China, would be putting it lightly !!!!!!

Today, in Vietnam, there is a historical figure called Ho Chi Minh, who is regarded by the Vietnamese people as being a national hero and Founding Father of modern-day Vietnam. Ho Chi Minh, he fought a war AGAINST the USA. We all know that there was a massive war that America fought against Vietnam. Hollywood made a whole load of war films based on the Vietnam War. All those movies do actually show America fighting against the Vietnamese.

One of those movies was Rambo, First Blood, Part 2.

Above is a picture of the film/movie.

Yes, Sylvester Stallone goes to Vietnam, to fight against Vietnamese soldiers. Vietnam was about America against Vietnam. It was NOT about America and Vietnam fighting against China. Americans make themselves look silly if or when they talk about Chinese aggression against Vietnam, bearing in mind that America killed about one hundred times more Vietnamese than China did. And it's also silly trying to imply that America is 'friends' with Vietnam in a struggle against China.

[Publicus]

I'm afraid most of us don't share your doe-eyed boyish adoration of Hilary Clinton, who can do no wrong.

Some of us think she is competent, and have stated so on this forum, and also think she is fallible, and prone to errant judgment and abuse of process and position in pursuit of her ambitions to power.

Anti-Clinton attacking is hardly the topic, it's maybe how she will handle the SCS situation, as she is highly likely to be the next POTUS. So, yes, let's focus on that, and not let our eyes glaze over as we visualize her unilateral glories vs. China before they occur.

Your posts here continue to reflect your own attitude toward Hillary Clinton and not mine. You are trying to assign to me thoughts, emotions, and an attitude I do not have nor have I ever had toward any political figure in the USA (or elsewhere more immediately).

Governments throughout the region to include CCP expect HRC to be the next Potus and they expect new and different actions in relation to the SCS and the region. HRC was the SecState who initiated the Rebalance and Pivot to the Pacific. Her rationale is credible, i.e., East and South Asia respectively are the growth areas of the global economy outside of the USA and the United States needs to be involved here.

Beyond that, with CCP carrying on the the East Sea against Japan and in the SCS against Asean and the Maritime Global Commons that the SCS is, we will see what will happen.

The strong majority of American voters chose Barack Obama as Potus in 2008 and in 2010 because they believed he was the man of the time to deal with the priority matters domestic and internationally. That is true for better and for worse, depending on one's political and cultural biases. Likewise for Hillary Clinton in 2016.

One can expect the increasing mess in the SCS to get some new and significant sorting out beginning next year. One can also expect a Potus Clinton will retain the hawk Ashton Carter as SecDef as they are on the same page just about verbatim.

I agree that Carter, or someone equally hawkish, will remain in a Clinton admin. For sure, Clinton is the most qualified, respected, and well-reasoned of the POTUS candidates to deal with China effectively, and I consider her pivot or less offensive to allies elsewhere new rephrasing "rebalance" to Asia was the right thing and hope she expands the scope of that.

In spite of electioneering rhetoric to the contrary, I fully expect her to sign into law the TPP with support of both parties, and show US leadership in the region in a positive way. This will also help curb China's expansion if Vietnam and Malaysia avail themselves of strategic moves to contain China in the SCS.

There will be no quick and easy resolution and Clinton will not have a walk in the park as you intimated. In spite of hawkish rhetoric, I find it hard to believe that Clinton would break form and order a blockade as you suggest as I consider her more practical and sophisticated than that, and she gets it that world commerce and US would be adversely affected.

Sent from my GT-N5100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Blockade is a possibility. It may become a likelihood or even a probability no matter who is Potus.

Adversity per se does not necessarily rule out a matter irrespective of what it is. Readers may know for example that the US judicial system is an adversarial one in which two sides slug it out to win in a court presided over by an umpire and truth be damned. If truth occurs during any litigation it is a coincidence or a happenstance, perhaps realised occasionally on appeal but not guaranteed in any event.

A blockade has been vetted through the Naval War College and the National War College and the Pentagon. The two main scenarios are a general blockade of the entire CCP coast north to south in a war situation or a limited blockade in the SCS or the East Sea separately according to time and circumstance.

There are many blockade variables that have been identified and examined from history up to the present. Included of course is President Kennedy's blockade of Cuba during the missile crisis of 1962. The United States has never dismissed a naval blockade as a military option which means blockade is a viable military doctrine and that it can be used again.

Prez Nixon blockaded Haiphong harbor and some other Vietnam harbors with mines as the primary instrument supported mainly by submarines. It is a Naval doctrine the US does continue to consider viable and has used more than once since WW2.

Blockade is applicable against the CCP because it is China, i.e., it has a huge population that is almost completely dependent on its sprawling coastline of numerous ports; 21st century China is hugely dependent on sea trade and commerce. It is no longer isolated, closed or minimally dependent on sea trade or global commerce.

Blockade is a military option that is passive-active. It contrasts to launching missiles or bombers or sailing a fleet up the Yellow River or some such attempt at adventurism or other kinds of recklessness. In the SCS a blockade would be to guarantee the flow of trade and commerce in the international sea lanes and it would put the arm to CCP's military buildup or threats or harmful CCP military actions once taken in the Sea.

Asean defense ministers know all of this and more. So do US treaty allies Japan, South Korea, Philippines, Thailand, Australia, New Zealand. India is well aware and so is Beijing. CCP has defenses against missiles, bombers, land armies, fleets sailing up its rivers, paratroopers dropping in for a Sunday tea.

CCP however hasn't any means to break a naval blockade without sailing a naval fleet into it. CCP's ASW (anti-submarine warfare) is feeble, virtually non existent. Its minesweeping is equally weak as CCP has had to focus on building capital surface ships for its woeful navy and attack submarines that to USN sonar sound like a Thai longboat motor.

A key factor would be the international shipping lanes through the SCS. Any attempt by CCP to disrupt or interrupt the flow of commerce would be a point of no return for everyone involved or affected.

The freedom of navigation exercises and operations will also be an indicator of whether a SCS limited naval blockade would be a viable option. The more regional governments that initiate participation in joint navigation exercises and operations, the more likely a blockade would be widely supported and subscribed. The Phils are doing it now, Vietnam is verging on it, Malaysia is examining it under threat of what CCP says are "scientific observation" ships in Malaysia territorial waters. Singapore is publicly mum but they would participate in joint exercises.

Once the International Court of Arbitration issues its ruling, governments of the region will have the rationale to proceed in joint patrols. (NZ PM John Key just this week told Beijing to bugger off with its threats of trade punishments if NZ didn't break with the regional stance to resist and confront CCP over the SCS.) Australia is doing air recon over the Sea and is waiting for the Court to rule before deciding on joint naval operations with US and others. Japan has announced it will conduct certain air recon over the Sea and it has donated more than $100 million in small naval and coast guard craft to the Phils.

Chances of a Munich in the SCS are slim and none, and slim has left town already.

[boomerangutang]

I know about the Chinese military and govt bodies in the south, there is no intent to attack.

No, of course the Chinese don't intend to attack. Why attack, when you can sail in and take over.

If I could take over your house by just walking in and residing in one of you bedrooms, wow, that would be cool. I wouldn't have to threaten or fight, ....just walk in and lay down on your bed. If anyone asked, I'd just say, "hey, no problem, this house has always been mine. I came to this property years ago and did something in the bushes. It's always been mine." BTW, this would only work if I was a lot bigger than you and had more weapons.

The idea why SCS is so important to China is evident, we are just learning how not to spark a war for it. We have learnt.

Trade winds is the key ....

Of course China doesn't want a war, and certainly wouldn't spark the start of one. If China can gain territory without military conflict, then so much the better, from a Chinese perspective. Anyone who doesn't like it, or who rattles swords in its face, is an aggressor. Heck, even ants, termites and bees put up resistance when another life form takes up residence in its territory.

[boomerangutang]

Some Chinaman takes a crudely drawn little map on a scrap of paper, and takes five seconds to scribble a nine dash line on it and voila! Miracle! He just enlarged China's territory an area the size of India. Wow, that was easier than taking Tibet in the 1950's! Where next? Hmmmm. Let's see. Here's a map of Sakhalin Island, .....or maybe Madagascar. Yea, Madagascar, they don't have a strong military, and they've got a lot of natural resources, even though their environment is on the skids. If we take over Madagascar, who's going to get in our way? We can simply say, "hey, don't be so uptight. A Chinese ship landed on this island in the 1600's. You want proof? Here's proof, a picture of the ship on this piece of paper. See this map with a dashed line around the island? That's proof that China owns it. China is a big, populous, money-rich country now, so what we want, we get."

[LawrenceChee]

Vietnam is an extremely industrious and intelligent ASEAN country

Most of the Vietnamese I have met in the business circles are extremely good negotiators and very sharp with details

I admire them a while lot and their women are the literal backbone of the country !

Here is the history of CCP armed military violence and aggression against Vietnam to include during recent years over the SCS.

An excerpt:

In September and October 1978, Prime Minister Pham Van Dong paid official visits to the Philippines and Malaysia and signed agreements with the President and the Prime Minister of the two countries to resolve the disputes over the East Sea (internationally known as the South China Sea) by peaceful means.

In this period, the relationship between the two countries was strained. China shifted from the viewpoint that the Hoang Sa is a"dispute" to "Hoang Sa belong to China as an indisputable fact."

On February 17th 1979, China mobilized 600,000 troops to attack the six northern border provinces of Vietnam. After two weeks of heavy losses, the Chinese troops withdrew.

In March 2013, Sina.com launched the topic "Fight to defend sovereignty" to praise the Chinese military for"seizing opportunities" to "crush the unruly of Vietnam". Quoting General Yue Qiang, Sina.com boldly declared: "The clashes between China and Vietnam showed the trend of no intervention of big countries when their interests are not affected. China should take advantage of and promote it."

http://english.vietnamnet.vn/fms/special-reports/155232/china-s-ambition-and-the-lessons-from-gac-ma.html

The intervention of "big countries" referenced in the quote has now begun.

US Navy freedom of navigation exercises are underway as are joint FON exercises of the US and the Philippines. More joint exercises involving more Asean and neighboring countries will come, to include Australia and India. The coming soon ruling of the International Court of Arbitration will provide the legal basis of it.

US Pacific Fleet and US Pacific Air Forces with allies will then be able to take a decisive action to block CCP sustaining their isolated SCS islands, both the natural ones and the artificial ones that are in violation of the ILOS. Consequently, CCP has to consider the course it is taking in the SCS.

US and Japan's determination in the East Sea over the Senkaku Islands (2011-13) has simmered CCP Boyz down there, requiring them to turn their covetous attention to the SCS. CCP will soon find out they will fare no better in the SCS than they did in the East Sea where they flopped and had to fall silent and inactive. In respect of CCP and the SCS, it will take a while yet and a few incidents too, but CCP will realise the same fate there as well.

The Phils are not Japan by any means or stretch, but CCP is enabling opposition to it to succeed by creating serious objection to it throughout the entire India-South China Sea-Western Pacific region. This is occurring in the waters and seas from Shanghai to Shenzhen and Hainan Island. The grand lesson for CCP new dynasty of Chinese emperors in business suits is that no country is an island no matter its bully size or its absolutist mindset, no matter its authoritarian traditions and imperious history, or of its arbitrary culture.

Okay, I've just noticed this post from Publicus !!

Okay, lets get something sorted out here. China took part in some small confrontations with Vietnam after America had fought the Vietnam War with Vietnam. To suggest that America's conflict with Vietnam was huge, it was about one hundred times GREATER than Vietnam's lttle conflict with China, would be putting it lightly !!!!!!

Today, in Vietnam, there is a historical figure called Ho Chi Minh, who is regarded by the Vietnamese people as being a national hero and Founding Father of modern-day Vietnam. Ho Chi Minh, he fought a war AGAINST the USA. We all know that there was a massive war that America fought against Vietnam. Hollywood made a whole load of war films based on the Vietnam War. All those movies do actually show America fighting against the Vietnamese.

One of those movies was Rambo, First Blood, Part 2.

rambo2.jpg

Above is a picture of the film/movie.

Yes, Sylvester Stallone goes to Vietnam, to fight against Vietnamese soldiers. Vietnam was about America against Vietnam. It was NOT about America and Vietnam fighting against China. Americans make themselves look silly if or when they talk about Chinese aggression against Vietnam, bearing in mind that America killed about one hundred times more Vietnamese than China did. And it's also silly trying to imply that America is 'friends' with Vietnam in a struggle against China.

The Vietnamese in typical Confucius state of minds has already forgiven and moved on which is commendable for them.

There are some small factions who have not forgiven but it's a small group like everyone else , there are interest groups.

Vietnam and like many ASEAN countries have history with China , both negative and positive and the realistic nature of Asians separate trade from political concerns which is rather unlike the west who see it as co-related and one of the tools that can be used

So this idea of a blockade is ridiculous and counter productive as is any preemptive strike that will only impact civilians

The real life after that short Vietnamese war 40 years ago is sad. In having the American partners who care from the private sector , it has gone a positive and slow way in promoting the peace healing process for these families

These hospices are real and all around the Danang area which was close to the DMZ zone.

I first got to know them when I expanded hotel projects there and some of the Vietnamese executives told me if we do donate all the half used hotel soap bars to these places

I went on a trip with them and my heart wept at the sight of the effects of agent orange. It was heart breaking to see it and you can google the images if you have the stomach and I hope it will go in a positive way not to shame but reach out and assist these groups

They really need help and these days most hotel chains there have banded and donated a lot of useful items to these hospices and I applaud the foreign and Chinese hotel owners who have participated