British grandad locked up in Thailand claims he was beaten, robbed and sexually abused in jail

[chiang mai]

My thoughts also, the picture is incomplete.

On the jail issue: I don't know if the rules are different elsewhere in Thailand but here in Chiang Mai, about seven years ago, a Brit we know was given 5 years in jail and he was housed strictly with foreigners and not with locals and all foreigners were treated similarly.

From what I have heard and been told foreigners are kept separate from the locals in jail. I have, thankfully, no personal experience so I cant speak authoritatively but that is my understanding. The BBC Panorama had a program on it a few years back and that was stated in that program as well

All Thai jails now put foreigners together with Thais. When only foreigners were together in one cell they had a bad habit of fighting with each other, so to stop that problem foreigners are in with the Thais these days. It also makes sure that all foreigners obey the cell rules, up and out at around 7.30 am, and absolute no talking, walking etc after 9 pm. Thai prisoners are made to encourage foreigners to obey the rules, so disobey a room leader and the offending foreigner will receive a beating from his fellow Thai cellmates.

I'm sure you may believe that but the evidence thus far is that foreigners and Thai's are segregated, do you have any proof of what you say?

[bazza40]

This is a farang vs. farang story. The accused is alleged to have run into a motorbike driven by a Frenchman. The collision injured a french woman who was on the bike and she allegedly died from his injuries some time after the collision.

She died from his injuries? Really?

[Hawk]

You have to PAY the guards for an easy ride.

Nonsense! You need an easy ride, help etc, then you need to pay a prisoner who works in the prison shop, or a prisoner who can get access to a phone, or a prisoner who works in the prison hospital, or a prisoner who has access to hot water(for your 3 in 1 coffee), or the prisoner in charge of the visit room for a longer visit, or a prisoner who works in the office who can speak to an officer on your behalf, etc.

[Hawk]

My thoughts also, the picture is incomplete.

On the jail issue: I don't know if the rules are different elsewhere in Thailand but here in Chiang Mai, about seven years ago, a Brit we know was given 5 years in jail and he was housed strictly with foreigners and not with locals and all foreigners were treated similarly.

From what I have heard and been told foreigners are kept separate from the locals in jail. I have, thankfully, no personal experience so I cant speak authoritatively but that is my understanding. The BBC Panorama had a program on it a few years back and that was stated in that program as well

All Thai jails now put foreigners together with Thais. When only foreigners were together in one cell they had a bad habit of fighting with each other, so to stop that problem foreigners are in with the Thais these days. It also makes sure that all foreigners obey the cell rules, up and out at around 7.30 am, and absolute no talking, walking etc after 9 pm. Thai prisoners are made to encourage foreigners to obey the rules, so disobey a room leader and the offending foreigner will receive a beating from his fellow Thai cellmates.

I'm sure you may believe that but the evidence thus far is that foreigners and Thai's are segregated, do you have any proof of what you say?

I know for absolute certain prisoners are not segregated, only ladyboys are segregated. As for evidence, you pay a visit to Klong Prem, Lat Yao, Chiangmai, Chiangrai, or your local jail and ask. Can you speak Thai? Then ask the staff.

[chiang mai]

I'm sure you may believe that but the evidence thus far is that foreigners and Thai's are segregated, do you have any proof of what you say?

I know for absolute certain prisoners are not segregated, only ladyboys are segregated. As for evidence, you pay a visit to Klong Prem, Lat Yao, Chiangmai, Chiangrai, or your local jail and ask. Can you speak Thai? Then ask the staff.

I have no wish to argue with you but I have to ask, have you visited all of those prisons you mention and have you seen those things for yourself, it seems very odd you would know first hand details of such things, at so many Thai prisons.?

For my part I have only ever visited the prison in CM once, in order visit someone and he said he was incarcerated with only foreigners.

EDIT: forgot, I am fluent in Thai.

Edited May 2, 2016 by chiang mai

[Hawk]

I'm sure you may believe that but the evidence thus far is that foreigners and Thai's are segregated, do you have any proof of what you say?

I know for absolute certain prisoners are not segregated, only ladyboys are segregated. As for evidence, you pay a visit to Klong Prem, Lat Yao, Chiangmai, Chiangrai, or your local jail and ask. Can you speak Thai? Then ask the staff.

I have no wish to argue with you but I have to ask, have you visited all of those prisons you mention and have you seen those things for yourself, it seems very odd you would know first hand details of such things, at so many Thai prisons.?

For my part I have only ever visited the prison in CM once, in order visit someone and he said he was incarcerated with only foreigners.

EDIT: forgot, I am fluent in Thai.

Yes a long time ago foreigners were segregated at night in the Chiangmai Remand Prison but for many years now prisoners in Chiangmai sleep in cells with the Thais.

Yes I have visited quite a few of the jails that I mentioned and have known others who visited the remaining mentioned jails. Also I have visited the Chiangmai prison, both inside and out, on a few occasions. First the foreigners(Chiangmai) were placed in cell 502 on the top floor, then they were moved down to small cells on the fourth floor but due to continued fighting they were put in a large cell with Thais on the third floor. Now they have been moved to the new jail 70 kilometres from Chiangmai.

As for Klong Prem, no segregation, I have personally seen the sleeping arrangements.

[balo]

It seems that foreign media , especially British tabloids are targeting Thailand now , a new story every week . Don't get me wrong, there's plenty of cases to write about involving foreigners here, but after KT it has been more focus on Thailand .

[Bluespunk]

It seems that foreign media , especially British tabloids are targeting Thailand now , a new story every week . Don't get me wrong, there's plenty of cases to write about involving foreigners here, but after KT it has been more focus on Thailand .

Not surprising really.

[thesetat2013]

I think this account holds some truth to it. In prison, inmates run what happens inside and guards only watch and, as in this case, the guards perhaps are as evil as the inmates.. What bother me so about this is that this guy is probably in jail just because he is a foreigner. I have read so many instances where death has occurred due to negligent driving yet, the Thai never seems to go to prison for it. A good example is this recent case where the guy drove 200 kph and crashed into the back of a car killing to students. I don't see him even looking at a charge for their deaths, only his bad driving. Pathetic to see double standards across the board with foreigners and Thai.

Foreigners who live here should integrate more then they would know the way to avoid jail.

Complain about double standards. Do you speak fluent Thai? Do you know the way the system works? I do but to be fair, I've been here most my life.

Coming to live in a country, associating only with other foreigners, not giving a **** about learning the language etc and you deserve to be treated like 2nd class citizens as that is what you are.

Wow! You must have some serious issues with other expats to twist my comment into a bitch session about other foreigners that live here. Surely you said absolutely nothing except your complaints directed towards them and just as surely you said nothing about the topic.

[maanoi]

Sooooo...... any stories about foreigners fleeing Thailand while on bail and making it home?

Cause thats how much faith i have in the Thai justice system. I'd be gone so fast

[MartinBangkok]

I keep a lawyer on speedial. Just in case. As far as I know, you can still get legal representation before signing any police documents in Thai. I could be wrong. Lawyers...weigh in with comments.

Why don't you speedial your lawyer?

[IAMHERE]

I think this account holds some truth to it. In prison, inmates run what happens inside and guards only watch and, as in this case, the guards perhaps are as evil as the inmates.. What bother me so about this is that this guy is probably in jail just because he is a foreigner. I have read so many instances where death has occurred due to negligent driving yet, the Thai never seems to go to prison for it. A good example is this recent case where the guy drove 200 kph and crashed into the back of a car killing to students. I don't see him even looking at a charge for their deaths, only his bad driving. Pathetic to see double standards across the board with foreigners and Thai.

The difference between the two cases is that the Merc. driver had money and paid his way out (or at least his insurance company did), the Brit doesn't seem to be able to raise 100k Baht and apparently didn't have insurance otherwise he would have been able to post a bail bond.

Have you ever heard the saying 'two wrongs don't make a right' This guy killed someone, are you saying he doesn't deserve to be punished because a Thai person would have gotten away with it ?

Also are we expected to believe most inmates in Thai jails an non Thai.

I thought he was saying this is Thailand and you get punished according to Thai law and custom.

[falang khinok]

Never ever expect justice from a worldy court.....this advice is for all countrys of the world...if u send to prison in any country of the world expect the worstest to happen to u...if u find justice at the courts and beeing trated well in a jail u are like a triple lottery winner

[D3030]

I'm sure you may believe that but the evidence thus far is that foreigners and Thai's are segregated, do you have any proof of what you say?

I know for absolute certain prisoners are not segregated, only ladyboys are segregated. As for evidence, you pay a visit to Klong Prem, Lat Yao, Chiangmai, Chiangrai, or your local jail and ask. Can you speak Thai? Then ask the staff.

I have no wish to argue with you but I have to ask, have you visited all of those prisons you mention and have you seen those things for yourself, it seems very odd you would know first hand details of such things, at so many Thai prisons.?

For my part I have only ever visited the prison in CM once, in order visit someone and he said he was incarcerated with only foreigners.

EDIT: forgot, I am fluent in Thai.

Yes a long time ago foreigners were segregated at night in the Chiangmai Remand Prison but for many years now prisoners in Chiangmai sleep in cells with the Thais.

Yes I have visited quite a few of the jails that I mentioned and have known others who visited the remaining mentioned jails. Also I have visited the Chiangmai prison, both inside and out, on a few occasions. First the foreigners(Chiangmai) were placed in cell 502 on the top floor, then they were moved down to small cells on the fourth floor but due to continued fighting they were put in a large cell with Thais on the third floor. Now they have been moved to the new jail 70 kilometres from Chiangmai.

As for Klong Prem, no segregation, I have personally seen the sleeping arrangements.

Provide some video documentation with your mug in it...

Anyway...

I do recall seeing the Merchant of Death' - Russian Viktor Bout locked up with a bunch of Thai's..

It may have been a holding cell? I don't know...

But do know, Victor Bout didn't claim he got his butt plugged by Thai prison guards.

Nor have I heard any farangs of late, saying they were sexually abused by prison guards..

Makes no sense..

May make more sense, he signed his own death sentence by his accusations..

[ozyjon]

Isn't this the reason people don't want to go to jail.

[BlindMagician]

I do not believe 1 word of this.

I have been in a Thai prison, and i was treated with the greatest of respect.

Staff and prisoners went out of their way to help me.

He did wrong and is trying to disguise what he did with lies.

What was your crime? Care to share, with no lies?

Maybe you search Colins posts and you will find his story...its been told before all straight up with a brutually honest account

So maybe less of your demands "with no lies" etc or are you making remarks like this because his story doesnt fit the paraniod farangs version of "they are all out to get us" ?

Well, lets break that down shall we...

"Maybe you search Colins posts and you will find his story" - I dont have time to trawl through an individuals (how many?) posts to pick out any relevant bits.

"...its been told before all straight up with a brutually honest account" - that's wonderful...glad you are bale to verify.

"So maybe less of your demands "with no lies" etc" - a bit loaded that, calm down. Not a demand, but just a polite request, or do you think the opposite should be asked for. Your pal Colin himself refers to "lies", and I make a link to that. Whats fair for the goose....?

"or are you making remarks like this because his story doesn't fit the paraniod farangs version of "they are all out to get us" ?.." wow ... hit a nerve then. Remarks like what old chap? Like you? The remarks are what they are, just simple questions. Read it it what you will, but that starts to be a reflection on your paranoia. I don't have a farang, or any other label you choose to throw at me, paranoia of anything in this topic.

So now I wonder what compells you to his defense, and what nerve or nerves are being twanged. Care to share. with no lies?

Edited May 2, 2016 by BlindMagician

[D3030]

Well... For sure, Dave has a horrible lawyer..

Dave has been living in Thailand for 2 years.

He states... 14 months of his stay has felt like being in prison..

So, 8 months into his move to Thailand he kills a women, then blames the driver/ passengers for no lights and not wearing helmets??

As he admits, reporting the accident to the police 3 weeks after the accident..

For reason that only makes sense, that he left the scene of the accident..

He recalls the accident, recalls seeing the motorbike lights off, and the riders with no helmets.

But as soon as he is released by the hospital, he reports the accident to the police?

Why didn't he go to the police station to get a copy of the accident report or the status of the victims he hit, vice reporting the accident?

When the police told him there was no report on file..

Amazingly, he took that info as if the accident never happened!!

Because, now he's dumbfounded he was arrested and now may face manslaughter charges..

Maybe in the UK there are no charges, if a Brit says it was an accident, and blames the victim for not wearing a helmet, that may have caused her death..

But not in Thailand!!

This guy Dave sounds like complete moron..

[rodcourt49]

I do not believe 1 word of this.

I have been in a Thai prison, and i was treated with the greatest of respect.

Staff and prisoners went out of their way to help me.

He did wrong and is trying to disguise what he did with lies.

...we all have our stories and our own ways of telling them...if it makes him feel better..let him go!

Edited May 2, 2016 by rodcourt49

[Scouse Twoccer]

Am I right in saying that the prisoners have to do there own cooking, maybe he was robed for his food

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

No, you're not, how could 2/3000 prisoners be organised to do their own cooking? The nearest they would get to cooking their meals would be to add hot water provided by the prison in the mornings to their Pot Noodles.

[Scouse Twoccer]

Money IS used in many Thai jails.

No, it is not. There would be no point.

All money, together with any other personal possessions, is taken from prisoners on their registration at the prison. It is held by the prison in an account in the prisoner's name to which additional money can be added by outsiders and any purchasing within the prison is debited from that prisoner's account. On release any funds in that account are returned to the prisoner down to the last baht.

There are no facilities at all in Thai jails that use cash.

You appear to know an awful lot about Thai jails hmmm

Your observation skills are beyond reproach. Hmmm? What's that supposed to mean?

[Scouse Twoccer]

My thoughts also, the picture is incomplete.

On the jail issue: I don't know if the rules are different elsewhere in Thailand but here in Chiang Mai, about seven years ago, a Brit we know was given 5 years in jail and he was housed strictly with foreigners and not with locals and all foreigners were treated similarly.

From what I have heard and been told foreigners are kept separate from the locals in jail. I have, thankfully, no personal experience so I cant speak authoritatively but that is my understanding. The BBC Panorama had a program on it a few years back and that was stated in that program as well

All prisoners in Bangkok prisons are mixed together, Thai, farangs, blacks, whatever.

[Scouse Twoccer]

You have to PAY the guards for an easy ride.

Oh and don't imagine the British Embassy will help you because they won't.

No one has to pay ANYTHING. And the British Embassy WILL help as much as they are allowed to.

[colinneil]

I do not believe 1 word of this.

I have been in a Thai prison, and i was treated with the greatest of respect.

Staff and prisoners went out of their way to help me.

He did wrong and is trying to disguise what he did with lies.

Be careful you don't get sued for libel for calling the man a liar In writing. You could end back in prison for not paying a judgment/lien after a civil action. Damaging a person's reputation on the Internet is pretty disgusting.

Be careful i dont get sued. Are you living in la la land?

I said i do not believe 1 word, so nobody can sue me ok.

I never called anyone a liar, just i do not believe 1 word.

[Scouse Twoccer]

All Thai jails now put foreigners together with Thais. When only foreigners were together in one cell they had a bad habit of fighting with each other, so to stop that problem foreigners are in with the Thais these days. It also makes sure that all foreigners obey the cell rules, up and out at around 7.30 am, and absolute no talking, walking etc after 9 pm. Thai prisoners are made to encourage foreigners to obey the rules, so disobey a room leader and the offending foreigner will receive a beating from his fellow Thai cellmates.

I'm sure you may believe that but the evidence thus far is that foreigners and Thai's are segregated, do you have any proof of what you say?

He doesn't need to prove anything, he's right, you're wrong, regardless of "the evidence thus far".

[HooHaa]

Horrific account, but another situation where you feel you don't have the whole story.

Indeed, sexual assault is so very vague.

[Scouse Twoccer]

I'm sure you may believe that but the evidence thus far is that foreigners and Thai's are segregated, do you have any proof of what you say?

I know for absolute certain prisoners are not segregated, only ladyboys are segregated. As for evidence, you pay a visit to Klong Prem, Lat Yao, Chiangmai, Chiangrai, or your local jail and ask. Can you speak Thai? Then ask the staff.

Not even LBs are segregated, although they are all kept together after lock up they're in there with the rest of the men.

[Koosdedooes]

Horrific account, but another situation where you feel you don't have the whole story.

Indeed, sexual assault is so very vague.

Indeed given in another post in this very thread someone claimed the gentleman concerned has a 7th Dan in some Bruce Lee martial art, if true can see him becoming anyones bitch in the lock up can you ?

[MyFriend You]

Wonder why him being a "British Grand Dad" has anything to do with this?? Maybe grand kids making a play for sympathy to get him out of jail??

[HooHaa]

Horrific account, but another situation where you feel you don't have the whole story.

Indeed, sexual assault is so very vague.

[justaphase]

....manslaughter.....???

...wow.....apply 'the law' to a perverse degree .....to foreigners only.....and then everything is 'okay'.....

...in some psycho peoples minds.....

....anybody else got charged with manslaughter over the 'Songkran Slaughter'......???

I was in jail with a Thai guy doing 11 months for killing a mc rider who was drunk.