French leader says all new subs will be built in Australia

[webfact]

French leader says all new subs will be built in Australia

CANBERRA, Australia (AP) — French Prime Minister Manuel Valls says a planned fleet of French-designed Australian submarines will all be built in Australia on time and within budget.

Valls met his Australian counterpart Malcolm Turnbull on Monday, a week after Australia announced that DCNS, a French state majority-owned company, had been chosen to design 12 diesel-electric submarines.

Australia expects the fleet will cost at least 56 billion Australian dollars ($43 billion), although the contracts have yet to be signed.

Valls dismissed speculation that at least the first 97-meter (318-foot) long Shortfin Barracuda would be built in a DCNS shipyard in France before construction shifts to the Australian manufacturing hub of Adelaide.

Turnbull agreed that the "entire submarine fleet" would be built in Adelaide by Australian workers with Australian steel.


-- (c) Associated Press 2016-05-02

[tolsti]

Do French subs come complete with a white flag and reverse gear?

[Credo]

Do French subs come complete with a white flag and reverse gear?

Yes. That's why they are building them in Australia.

[KimSamui]

Do French subs come complete with a white flag and reverse gear?

Yes. That's why they are building them in Australia.

What is that about?

[TPI]

Do French subs come complete with a white flag and reverse gear?

Yes. That's why they are building them in Australia.

What is that about?

You would have to be from Oz to understand......ironic!

[Ulic]

While I do think building the subs in Australia is the way to go, I just wonder what the

increased cost is. What were the Japanese bid numbers and what were the French

bid numbers to build the subs in France.

[Grouse]

Cost seems to be about double that for the Astute class (hunter killer - Trafalgar class replacement) which is nuclear powered and has cruise missiles and the best underwater physics in the world! The French must be good salesmen!

[weegee]

The French Prime Minister says....built on time and within budget.... Wait until he meets the 'Unions" doing the building....it will drag on for years and cost double by the time they are built....if they ever get finished at all.

[Gillyflower]

Well I'm from Oz and I would like to understand. Please explain.

This news is a week old already. A lot of the building is to be done in France and the shipyards are getting ready. The French are known to be tops in this field.

Edited May 2, 2016 by Gillyflower

[Tywais]

Cost seems to be about double that for the Astute class (hunter killer - Trafalgar class replacement) which is nuclear powered and has cruise missiles and the best underwater physics in the world! The French must be good salesmen!

You mean this one? Slow, leaky, rusty: Britain's £10bn submarine beset by design flaws

[Grouse]

Cost seems to be about double that for the Astute class (hunter killer - Trafalgar class replacement) which is nuclear powered and has cruise missiles and the best underwater physics in the world! The French must be good salesmen!

You mean this one? Slow, leaky, rusty: Britain's £10bn submarine beset by design flaws

Yes, that was after the launch of the first one

Do you always read the Guardian for defence matters? I suggest you try Janes.

The Americans are hugely impressed ( compared to Virginia class)

No, to get something to sea with this degree of complexity is just astonishing.

Incidentally, underwater physics is one of the few areas where the British are still world leaders. Most other stuff was handed over to the yanks. TSR2 anyone? Thought not.....

Edited May 2, 2016 by Grouse

[attento]

While I do think building the subs in Australia is the way to go, I just wonder what the

increased cost is. What were the Japanese bid numbers and what were the French

bid numbers to build the subs in France.

Just hope the Australians get their money. Keep checking your bank account Mr Turnbull, to see the payments arrive.

France has no money ! The country is practically bankrupt.

Edited May 2, 2016 by attento

[Grouse]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astute-class_submarine

This is worth reading if just for the comments by our American cousins

I believe the Corbyn/Guardian front plan to put our ballistic missile subs to sea with no missiles as a cost saving measure!

[Grouse]

I think it should be known that in the bar game "spoof" as played in The British Club, the call for number 5 is Belgrano (cinq). Germans are allowed to call Hood!

[sanukjim]

Do French subs come complete with a white flag and reverse gear?

The French will be building the subs in Australia as Australia doesn't have the tech knowledge to do it them self.The Australia on the same note will be having The United States do the arming of the subs for the same reason.

[sanukjim]

While I do think building the subs in Australia is the way to go, I just wonder what the

increased cost is. What were the Japanese bid numbers and what were the French

bid numbers to build the subs in France.

Just hope the Australians get their money. Keep checking your bank account Mr Turnbull, to see the payments arrive.

France has no money ! The country is practically bankrupt.

Australia will be paying the French to build the subs for them as the Australian government does not have the knowledge or expertise.For the same reason America will arm the subs.

[Celer et Audax]

I think it should be known that in the bar game "spoof" as played in The British Club, the call for number 5 is Belgrano (cinq). Germans are allowed to call Hood!

Strange call given that the Hood was sunk by the Bismark not a submarine!!

[up2u2]

There were a number of key conservative seats looking to fall in South Australia in the upcoming election. The decision to go with the French who agreed 'in principle' as the contract has not actually been formalised or even signed to have the Subs built in South Australia. This announcement shores up conservative seats that were looking to be lost to the opposition. I wouldn't get too exuberant that this is of great benefit to the Australian taxpayer. For a Right Wing government that preaches austerity and spending cuts on health, education, unemployment assistance, social assistance all deemed to be unaffordable but the skies the limit on a $50B (probably $120B after budget blow outs) military pork barrelling to ensure re-election. That of course is absolutely affordable.

[IAMHERE]

Will the propellers go counter clockwise ?

[ilostmypassword]

While I do think building the subs in Australia is the way to go, I just wonder what the

increased cost is. What were the Japanese bid numbers and what were the French

bid numbers to build the subs in France.

Just hope the Australians get their money. Keep checking your bank account Mr Turnbull, to see the payments arrive.

France has no money ! The country is practically bankrupt.

Attento is not so attentive.

Edited May 2, 2016 by ilostmypassword

[Gillyflower]

The contract was between France, Germany and Japan.

Japan. There was doubt as to the capacity to realise the subs out of their own country. Secondly - it would have upset China which is the first economic partner of Australia.

Germany. They proposed to construct in Australia. The handicap was that they have never constructed ships of class 4000 tons demanded by Oz.

It will mean some 2-3000 employments in Australia and some 4000 in France.

To the poster who says that France is.bankrupt........I'm shivering in my boots.......my pension is due in a few days. You're a fool.

Edited May 2, 2016 by Gillyflower

[simple1]

Building the French submarines in Adelaide will delay the start of the build of the first sub by two years, that then impacts the retirement timeline of the existing Collins class submarines which are now estimated to cost an additional 4 billion dollars to upgrade whilst waiting for the French subs to be operational. Current estimated total budget for the French subs is around 150 billion dollars for build, ongoing maintenance etc.

[Grouse]

I think it should be known that in the bar game "spoof" as played in The British Club, the call for number 5 is Belgrano (cinq). Germans are allowed to call Hood!

Strange call given that the Hood was sunk by the Bismark not a submarine!!

It still cinq!

[Rancid]

Well lets just hope the French don't do to Oz like they did to the Russians, namely decide not to deliver. Politics aside, they haven't demonstrated trustworthy business principles as a supplier.

[up2u2]

It doesn't matter if the entire deal falls through after the election or if it costs the Australian taxpayer $500B it is simply a political strategy to hold key seats from opposition Labor Party and the new Independent Nick Xenophon Party. Particularly 'The Fixer' Christopher Pine's seat. It may have been a deal put in place with current Prime Minister Turnbull when he wanted to execute previous Prime Minister Abbott. To be honest getting rid of that evil prick is probably worth $50B.

[Gillyflower]

To Rancid

Don't worry old chap. The French have agreed to fully reimburse Russia as well as footing the bill for training the sailors and building port infrastructure in Vladisvostok. They have now sold the Mistral Class Aircraft Carriers to Egypt.

Also I don't see exactly how the French could do a midnight flt with a sub out of Adelaide.

[craigt3365]

Well lets just hope the French don't do to Oz like they did to the Russians, namely decide not to deliver. Politics aside, they haven't demonstrated trustworthy business principles as a supplier.

Doubt that will happen as it's unlikey Oz will invade and occupy another nation's sovereign territory. As Russia did. Thus prompting France's decision not to deliver.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-29052599

[billd766]

I think it should be known that in the bar game "spoof" as played in The British Club, the call for number 5 is Belgrano (cinq). Germans are allowed to call Hood!

Strange call given that the Hood was sunk by the Bismark not a submarine!!

Oddly enough only 2 British battleships were sunk by German U boats. The Royal Oak at Scapa Flow in October 1939 and the Barham off Sollum, Egypt in November 1941. The only other British battleship sunk by torpedoes was the Prince of Wales off the East coast of Malaya in December 1941 by the Japanese air force.

An interesting link for those who may be interested.

http://www.naval-history.net/WW2BritishLosses1Major.htm

Edited May 6, 2016 by billd766

[Koosdedooes]

While I do think building the subs in Australia is the way to go, I just wonder what the

increased cost is. What were the Japanese bid numbers and what were the French

bid numbers to build the subs in France.

Just hope the Australians get their money. Keep checking your bank account Mr Turnbull, to see the payments arrive.

France has no money ! The country is practically bankrupt.

Australia will be paying the French to build the subs for them as the Australian government does not have the knowledge or expertise.For the same reason America will arm the subs.

If they build them in Aussie, they will never get finished as i would wager the unions will be on strike most the time

[Gillyflower]

Some people don't seem to know much about business. Australia doesn't have to worry about BEING paid, it has to worry about PAYING.

First of all when the Contract Offer was launched, well over a year ago, part of the conditions was that the subs were to be built in OZ. There was never any question of them being built in the countries of the tenders. The negociations took about a year to finalise.

Some posters don't read other posts. The contract was between 3 countries, Germany who had never constructed 4000 tonners, Japan whom it was thought were not capable of building out of their country, plus the China question and France.