120 Men Armed With Batons And Big Knives Demolish Stalls In Chatuchak Market

[Steph1012]

Realistically, what else can they do with squatters? Ask police to evict them?

Legally it can draw for years, while someone has invested money and the rent has to be paid.

Third world problems - third world solutions.

I would think it preferable for the police to evict the shopowners in an orderly fashion rather than having an influential person hire 100 off-duty policemen to act as thugs. And I believe the tenants were paying rent and were in the midst of legal proceedings to clarify the legal status of the leases relative to the new owners of the property who wish to redevelop the property.

One does not need to travel to the third world to find property owners who will do just about anything to break a lease in order to redevelop the property. It is a time honored tradition. Those who control the land have often been even more ruthless than those who control the means of production.

No no no. how long have you been here?

Nobody goes quietly believe me. When Thias have something inflicted on them that they don't like, they organise a riot and a mob to protect their interests. This not being the case, the landlord would not have needed 100 plus heavies to evict them.

We get it all the time here. Espescially taxi drivers, tour operators, tuk tuk drivers, beach chair operators. They blokade the police and government offices or block main roads until they cave in... and they do cave in every time here.

The Police are a big part of the problem as well. They lease the footpath outside our shop to a chicken stall! and they (Police) hacked into our power supply IN UNIFORM UP A LADDER IN BROAD DAYLIGHT WITHOUT TURNING HE SUPPLY OFF!! for the stall holder.

Got to laugh, as can't do anything about it. It's their country the chicken is good and they deliver!!

[Hermano Lobo]

It has long been rumoured that Chatujak has to make way for some development or other.

This type of thuggish action has been happening in China and Russia a lot recently.

With weapons a bit more sinister than knuckle-dusters, or though they are bad enough.

I would suppose in a so-called civilised society, legal notices of evictions would be served

with a time scale ?

The stalls have been there a long time and appear very popular. I have been there a few

times myself. I like the Bazaar feel to the place.

I would imagine that because the stalls have been there so long a challenge to the eviction

could take place in court. This may go on for a long time even if unsuccessful ?

Time = money ! The developers would not want this inconvenience and consequently

sent in the heavies. Money is power. Money is power the World over.

This does not make for a Sanook Society, the one that has been allegedly sought by

the new political leaders.

Bangkok looks First-World but in reality it is still Third World.

Sadly Thailand looks First-World in parts but at heart it is still a Third-World society.

It will take a couple of generations to change, if at all ?

[Tony Clifton]

Another fine handling of a situation by Thai policemen.

[Heng]

No no no. how long have you been here?

Nobody goes quietly believe me. When Thais have something inflicted on them that they don't like, they organise a riot and a mob to protect their interests. This not being the case, the landlord would not have needed 100 plus heavies to evict them.

I wouldn't say 'nobody goes quietly' by any means. In my experience, it's the merchant squatters that are most likely to take on the mob mentality. They have relatively substantial funds, a hardened street merchant outlook on life, and their means of making a living to lose. Plain jane squatters, who live in shacks or abandoned buildings or houses -and who aren't running a business-are usually more than willing to move if you just ask them nicely. The norm among many property owners is to actually give these folks several hundred to a few thousand Baht to help them out a bit as well, as understandably these are difficult lives that these squatters lead.

[bkkandrew]

No no no. how long have you been here?

Nobody goes quietly believe me. When Thais have something inflicted on them that they don't like, they organise a riot and a mob to protect their interests. This not being the case, the landlord would not have needed 100 plus heavies to evict them.

I wouldn't say 'nobody goes quietly' by any means. In my experience, it's the merchant squatters that are most likely to take on the mob mentality. They have relatively substantial funds, a hardened street merchant outlook on life, and their means of making a living to lose. Plain jane squatters, who live in shacks or abandoned buildings or houses -and who aren't running a business-are usually more than willing to move if you just ask them nicely. The norm among many property owners is to actually give these folks several hundred to a few thousand Baht to help them out a bit as well, as understandably these are difficult lives that these squatters lead.

Total nonsense.

[Heng]

No no no. how long have you been here?

Nobody goes quietly believe me. When Thais have something inflicted on them that they don't like, they organise a riot and a mob to protect their interests. This not being the case, the landlord would not have needed 100 plus heavies to evict them.

I wouldn't say 'nobody goes quietly' by any means. In my experience, it's the merchant squatters that are most likely to take on the mob mentality. They have relatively substantial funds, a hardened street merchant outlook on life, and their means of making a living to lose. Plain jane squatters, who live in shacks or abandoned buildings or houses -and who aren't running a business-are usually more than willing to move if you just ask them nicely. The norm among many property owners is to actually give these folks several hundred to a few thousand Baht to help them out a bit as well, as understandably these are difficult lives that these squatters lead.

Total nonsense.

Nah, totally factual in my experience.

[otherstuff1957]

The image of vendors being attacked by thugs is quite distrubing, but Heng has made a couple of good points.

Evictions in Thailand are very difficult and long drawn out. Illegal property use is not only not officially punished, but is, in some cases, more or less sanctioned by the government. Once someone has started living on or using land in Thailand (legally or not) it is very difficult to get them to move.

These laws and customs sound crazy to us, but if you study the history of property law in Thailand for the last couple of centuries, it starts to make sense.

P.S.: I'm not saying I condone the thugs actions, but there are reasons why they are acting this way.

[Dakhar]

I know of landlords that pay off the cops a few baht every month.... "just 'n case money."

That money is applied when an evection needs to be done. The cops side with the landlord and out goes the tennant, along with his flip flop.

As the son of a former land lord of 28 self standing homes in America.... I can say honestly, this system would have been a blessing back home.

[younghusband]

The image of vendors being attacked by thugs is quite distrubing, but Heng has made a couple of good points.

Evictions in Thailand are very difficult and long drawn out. Illegal property use is not only not officially punished, but is, in some cases, more or less sanctioned by the government. Once someone has started living on or using land in Thailand (legally or not) it is very difficult to get them to move.

These laws and customs sound crazy to us, but if you study the history of property law in Thailand for the last couple of centuries, it starts to make sense.

P.S.: I'm not saying I condone the thugs actions, but there are reasons why they are acting this way.

In every country and every situation thugs always have "reasons" for their thuggery.Some posters make valid points about the problem of evicting illegal squatters in Thailand.The solution would be of course a decent police force to take the necessary follow up on a court order.But a decent police force is exactly what is lacking in Thailand.

[Tony Clifton]

Touché!

[sting01]

It has long been rumoured that Chatujak has to make way for some development or other.

This type of thuggish action has been happening in China and Russia a lot recently.

With weapons a bit more sinister than knuckle-dusters, or though they are bad enough.

I would suppose in a so-called civilised society, legal notices of evictions would be served

with a time scale ?

The stalls have been there a long time and appear very popular. I have been there a few

times myself. I like the Bazaar feel to the place.

I would imagine that because the stalls have been there so long a challenge to the eviction

could take place in court. This may go on for a long time even if unsuccessful ?

Time = money ! The developers would not want this inconvenience and consequently

sent in the heavies. Money is power. Money is power the World over.

This does not make for a Sanook Society, the one that has been allegedly sought by

the new political leaders.

Bangkok looks First-World but in reality it is still Third World.

Sadly Thailand looks First-World in parts but at heart it is still a Third-World society.

It will take a couple of generations to change, if at all ?

Popalar or not, many shopps were illegal (if we believe the article). By so , popular or not, the landlord simply in the case of the illegal shops retrived by any necessary means what was him property (at it's a main point and the first of all), and secondly those so called poor shop owners who work so hard to earn a living are certainly not tax payer. If they illegaly open a shop, I hardly believe they fulfill their legal obligation and pregister to the local tax office.

I had the problem in the 0ctober 2002, we were given 3 solution : status quo ante, and by reconize they have legitimate right to occupy what we bought; or pay them to make them go away ; or cancel the deal with the previous landlord. As we did have finalized the deal with the previous landlord, we choose the third solution (less costly and on the long run safer, because we were also told one week after the actual encrochers will have leave , new one will come).

[Heng]

The solution would be of course a decent police force to take the necessary follow up on a court order.But a decent police force is exactly what is lacking in Thailand.

In my experience (vicariously only... thankfully not on any of our properties yet...) most squatter cases are dragged out in court (typically with multiple appeals + 1-2 year waiting periods in between), not on the 'frontline,' so to speak. Part of the problem is the law and the court system itself.

Squatting is trespassing. I doubt too many folks here would appreciate someone setting up shop in their front yard, refusing to move. How many would wait for a court order after years of appeals?

[chuchok]

Another great post Heng.

[OneeyedJohn]

It's just a different slant on changing the locks

[cwilliam]

Group of men forcefully demolish stalls in Chatuchak market

BANGKOK: -- Dozens of police are reinforced into Chatuchak weekend market after some 120 men armed with batons and big knives forcefully demolished hundreds of stalls in the market on Thursday morning. The men wore T-shirt with the word "police" on them.

The men briefly clashed with vendors of the stalls who rushed into the sites after learning of the demolition. The sites belong to the State Railway Authority.

Cursing and yelling at each other, both sides claimed that they had official documents to prove their actions. Some vendors were seen throwing bricks and stones at the men who shouted back and threatened to assault the vendors.

There are still unclear how many were injured during the incident.

The men reportedly started the demolition at about 4pm and continued until 7pm. They claimed that they had court order allowing them to knock down the stalls.

A woman identified herself only as Apinya claimed that she represented a developer company that has ownership over the area and is allowed to demolition works.

The vendors also showed court documents that suspend any demolition works pending trial on ownership of the areas.

After police intervention, both sides agree to go to Bang Sue police station to discuss about the incident.

--The Nation 2006-11-09

That is the Thai. way not your problem,butt out!!!

Edited November 12, 2006 by cwilliam

[backflip]

"Time = money !...Money is power. Money is power the World over."

Thanks, Hermano, I had no idea that this was the case in Thailand. Thanks for clarifying the entire situation.

[eljeque]

The image of vendors being attacked by thugs is quite distrubing, but Heng has made a couple of good points.

Evictions in Thailand are very difficult and long drawn out. Illegal property use is not only not officially punished, but is, in some cases, more or less sanctioned by the government. Once someone has started living on or using land in Thailand (legally or not) it is very difficult to get them to move.

These laws and customs sound crazy to us, but if you study the history of property law in Thailand for the last couple of centuries, it starts to make sense.

P.S.: I'm not saying I condone the thugs actions, but there are reasons why they are acting this way.

In every country and every situation thugs always have "reasons" for their thuggery.Some posters make valid points about the problem of evicting illegal squatters in Thailand.The solution would be of course a decent police force to take the necessary follow up on a court order.But a decent police force is exactly what is lacking in Thailand.

I think that it would be best if the people abide by the law, or change it.

[sriracha john]

UPDATE....they're back at it for some more!

Clash breaks out again at Sunday mart

Traders fight firm's demolition crew

Sunday Market retailers and workers from the company which won the concession to develop the market land clashed again yesterday, just five days after the first scuffle broke out last Thursday. More than 50 officers from Bang Sue police station rushed to break up the fight which erupted soon after midnight yesterday. No one was hurt in the clash. The brawl erupted after 50 men claiming to be workers of Thanasarn Sombatpattana Co erected a makeshift fence around the eight-rai Sunday Market plot near Chatuchak weekend market and began tearing down outlets.They also put up a poster announcing the company's legal right to occupy the land and vowed prosecution against trespassers, police said. Retailers who camped out overnight at the market tried to stop the men. They hurled objects at them, leading to the second scuffle in less than week, when the men stormed the site. The clash occurred despite ongoing mediation attempts to keep the land free of activities until the legal wrangle surrounding the land use has been settled through the courts.

According to Bang Sue police, a police team including an anti-riot squad has now been deployed to watch over the market at night to prevent further clashes. Wila Udom, chairman of the Sunday Cooperatives representing traders at the market, accused the company of breaking its promise to keep away from the site pending a negotiated settlement. During negotiations mediated by police last Friday, the company pledged to keep off the land and to wait for the Civil Court to rule on the dispute on Feb. 7 next year.

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/News/15Nov2006_news15.php