Israel cuts water supplies to West Bank during Ramadan

[Morch]

I think I found it!!! The palestinians pay 8.8 Shakels household tariff and the settlers just pay 2.2 Shakels as GROWERS for Agriculture!!!! So it's 400% different!!!

Or did I read it wrong???

http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/business/.premium-1.622913

http://www.water.gov.il/Hebrew/ProfessionalInfoAndData/2012/10-Israel-Water-Sector-Economics-Policy-and-Tarrifs.pdf

It seems you did get it wrong.

There is nothing in either link which refers to the Palestinians. The 8.8 NIS quote refers to Israeli household consumption. No idea where the idea that all Illegal Israeli settlers are defined as "growers" comes from (doesn't appear in either link).

In Israel, water meant for agricultural or industrial purposes is often recycled/treated, not household tap water. The Palestinians, for various reasons not to do with Israel, are not that keen on adopting such measures.

[snowgard]

Just read the links what I posted before!!! There is every proof inside!!! And yes you right. Israel not cut the water to individual palestinians but to the complete communities!!!

And the Israelian settlers got their water because to grow up bananas and oranges with a extrem high water consum in a dessert is more important as a palistinian!!!

Edited June 17, 2016 by snowgard

[snowgard]

I still wait that you show us that the israelians pay the same prices!!!

I not believe that all newspapers made a wrong report about the higher prices!!!

[Morch]

Just read the links what I posted before!!! There is every proof inside!!! And yes you right. Israel not cut the water to individual palestinians but to the complete communities!!!

And the Israelian settlers got their water because to grow up bananas and oranges with a extrem high water consum in a dessert is more important as a palistinian!!!

I have read and commented on your latest two links in a post above. They do no refer to neither the Palestinians or the illegal Israeli settlers in the West Bank.

Please do not twist my words - Mekorot (Israel's national water company) does not supply water to any individual consumer, but deals with municipalities and similar organizations. These, in turn, are responsible for billing and payments. If a municipality is lax in collecting revenues, that is not Mekorot's responsibility. Similarly, maintenance of local infrastructure usually falls on the municipality. Mekorot deals with such things on a national level.

As far as I am aware, neither oranges nor bananas are a major product of the illegal Israeli settlements. Also, water used for growing both is not tap water, but recycled/treated water. If anything, growing these with decreased usage of water is somewhat of an Israeli specialty.

[Morch]

I still wait that you show us that the israelians pay the same prices!!!

I not believe that all newspapers made a wrong report about the higher prices!!!

Lets try again.

You are the one saying that Palestinians pay 300%-1000% more than Israelis. You do not even know how much Israelis pay, but still insist on this.

As you cannot support what you say, you try to turn the tables and insist others will find the facts for you.

You claim something without being able to back it up, don't throw a tantrum.

The newspaper articles you linked did not show anything about 300%-1000% higher prices.

[snowgard]

No Comment!!! And this run now for years!!!

https://vimeo.com/15063908

[Morch]

@snowgard

Non of these clips support your pricing claims.

A clip from EWASH - referenced earlier in the topic as the NGO that objected to the construction of desalinization project in Gaza due to political considerations.

A clip from Press TV - Iran's mouth piece.

A clip from al Jazeera - Qatar based, also responsible for the shoddy OP.

A clip from Lifesource, a Palestinian NGO.

All very objective, I'm sure.

[snowgard]

And here is a news article from Newzealand http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/WO0402/S00164.htm

but this one was from 2004.

http://www1.american.edu/ted/ice/GAZA.HTM (Gaza Palestinians pay up to $1.20/cubic meter while Israeli settlers only pay $0.10/cubic meter for water. Elmusa (1994) states that "relative to per capita income, Palestinians pay as much as twenty times what Israeli settlers pay for water.")

But I still wait for your PROOF!!! Sorry but I found it unrespectful to stink against something and don't show YOUR TRUE!!! Or did you have something to hide???

[Morch]

@snowgard

Those are the third and fourth clips mentioned in my previous post, I believe.

The New Zealand article originated from IWPS, a pro-Palestinian NGO. Excuse me for not taking it as very accurate when it refers to Mekorot as a private water company. While it does raise the claim that Palestinians pay 300% more than the Palestinians, it offers neither proof nor mentions how much "Israelis and settlers" pay. This is pretty much on the same level as your statement. Reading the article, doesn't seem like a very objective or even balanced account. As you point out it's somewhat dated - 2004.

The ICE review link refers to the Gaza Strip, not to the West Bank, and dates back to 1997. Additionally, the agreement between Israel and the Palestinians specify different conditions with regard to the Gaza Strip's water supply.

And you still don't get it. YOU made the claim, YOU need to provide support. I do not need to prove YOUR claims for YOU.

[Scott]

An inflammatory post has been removed.

[DaddyWarbucks]

@snowgard

Non of these clips support your pricing claims.

A clip from EWASH - referenced earlier in the topic as the NGO that objected to the construction of desalinization project in Gaza due to political considerations.

A clip from Press TV - Iran's mouth piece.

A clip from al Jazeera - Qatar based, also responsible for the shoddy OP.

A clip from Lifesource, a Palestinian NGO.

All very objective, I'm sure.

Summarily disregarding news sources just because they may have some relation to the Palestinian people is just as bigoted as dismissing all Israeli sources because they are pro-Zionist.

Typical propaganda tactics.

There is no real interest in learning the facts... it is all about promoting an agenda.

[HikeFromLA]

My guess is that this just tells a little piece of the story. Are they comparing residential usage or usage by all sources - residential, commercial, industrial and agricultural? Typical Al Jazeera propaganda. Probably true at some level, but meaningless without the context. Without knowing for sure, I'll bet the Palestinians in the West Bank territories have very little capacity to consume water.

It's hard for me to understand why anyone would provide water to people you're essentially at war with and equally hard to understand why the Palestinians would accept it. Just another little mystery about the whole mess in the middle east that is beyond understanding.

Israelis won the war and conquered the land.

As occupiers, you do not get to continue waging war against a conquered population.

You have to stop.

[snowgard]

@snowgard

Those are the third and fourth clips mentioned in my previous post, I believe.

The New Zealand article originated from IWPS, a pro-Palestinian NGO. Excuse me for not taking it as very accurate when it refers to Mekorot as a private water company. While it does raise the claim that Palestinians pay 300% more than the Palestinians, it offers neither proof nor mentions how much "Israelis and settlers" pay. This is pretty much on the same level as your statement. Reading the article, doesn't seem like a very objective or even balanced account. As you point out it's somewhat dated - 2004.

The ICE review link refers to the Gaza Strip, not to the West Bank, and dates back to 1997. Additionally, the agreement between Israel and the Palestinians specify different conditions with regard to the Gaza Strip's water supply.

And you still don't get it. YOU made the claim, YOU need to provide support. I do not need to prove YOUR claims for YOU.

But this shows your ignorant view of humanity!!! Are you a Israelian??? This would let me understand your point!!!

Search on Google for "palestine higher water price" and Google give you an answer.

But I know you can't do it. I made the claim and you not need to google it!!! ;-)

I really hope the western countries stop to support Israel in the near future and not sale all fruits and vegetable from Israel anymore.

Have a nice weekend!!!

[i claudius]

'Israelis, including settlers, consume five times more water than Palestinians in the West Bank, 350 litres per person per day in Israel compared with 60 litres per Palestinian per day in the West Bank'

If you oppress people this way by cutting their water, you cannot expect them to sit and wait and turn their other cheek.

Consumption isn't necessarily related to availability. Do you have any figures on deodorant sales?

?? You cant read english?

It is easy to understand. Israelis use 5 times more water than palestinians.

Classic oppression tactics from Israel. First get their land by force, use an embargo to push them and then cut their water.

Then why israel and its citizens get surprised when those opressed people with even not enough water to drink and use go and attack innocent victims?

So why doesn't Palestein get off their buts and sort out water supplies for themselves?

[Morch]

@snowgard

Non of these clips support your pricing claims.

A clip from EWASH - referenced earlier in the topic as the NGO that objected to the construction of desalinization project in Gaza due to political considerations.

A clip from Press TV - Iran's mouth piece.

A clip from al Jazeera - Qatar based, also responsible for the shoddy OP.

A clip from Lifesource, a Palestinian NGO.

All very objective, I'm sure.

Summarily disregarding news sources just because they may have some relation to the Palestinian people is just as bigoted as dismissing all Israeli sources because they are pro-Zionist.

Typical propaganda tactics.

There is no real interest in learning the facts... it is all about promoting an agenda.

Honestly, if this comment was made by someone else, it might have held some merit. Don't recall you ever having issues with posters dismissing sources supporting Israel. If memory serves, not a stranger to these practices as well.

As I'm sure you have noticed, I did point out that non of them actually supported the statement in question.

[Morch]

@snowgard

Those are the third and fourth clips mentioned in my previous post, I believe.

The New Zealand article originated from IWPS, a pro-Palestinian NGO. Excuse me for not taking it as very accurate when it refers to Mekorot as a private water company. While it does raise the claim that Palestinians pay 300% more than the Palestinians, it offers neither proof nor mentions how much "Israelis and settlers" pay. This is pretty much on the same level as your statement. Reading the article, doesn't seem like a very objective or even balanced account. As you point out it's somewhat dated - 2004.

The ICE review link refers to the Gaza Strip, not to the West Bank, and dates back to 1997. Additionally, the agreement between Israel and the Palestinians specify different conditions with regard to the Gaza Strip's water supply.

And you still don't get it. YOU made the claim, YOU need to provide support. I do not need to prove YOUR claims for YOU.

But this shows your ignorant view of humanity!!! Are you a Israelian??? This would let me understand your point!!!

Search on Google for "palestine higher water price" and Google give you an answer.

But I know you can't do it. I made the claim and you not need to google it!!! ;-)

I really hope the western countries stop to support Israel in the near future and not sale all fruits and vegetable from Israel anymore.

Have a nice weekend!!!

You can badmouth, bold your words, and put more exclamation marks, to your little heart's content. It would still not make your case.

Sending other poster to search Google is rude, and simply means you cannot provide proper support.

To try and make this clearer - the price a Palestinian may or may not pay to another Palestinian delivering water in a tanker, is not the price Israel charges from the Palestinians for the same water. It is not even the price set by the Palestinian Water Authority. Basically, these are private operators, many of them unregulated (by Palestinian authorities), who thrive at the expense of their fellow Palestinians. The Palestinian Authority does very little to counter water theft (by Palestinians) from its own infrastructure, does very little to regulate or subsidize such private operators, and fails miserably when it comes to collecting revenues from Palestinian consumers.

[Morch]

So why doesn't Palestein get off their buts and sort out water supplies for themselves?

The Palestinian Authority cannot "sort out water supplies for themselves" on a scale that would make all their issues go away. The access to water reserves, production and distribution was determined by agreement long ago. Said agreement was supposed to be temporary, but remained in place to this day, and overall it is not favorable for the Palestinians, nor is it fair. As to why the Palestinians signed such an agreement - either file it in the Palestinian leadership failures folder, or blame Israel.

That said, there is a lot the Palestinians could have done and can do to improve the current situation. A more efficient and less corrupted system of revenue collection, stricter measures toward unauthorized water production, water theft and profiteering, better maintenance of existing infrastructure, and introduction of water saving, treatment and recycling process. These will not change the basics of the situation, but will alleviate some of the hardship, without having to do much with Israel. As to why these steps are not taken, another trip to that Palestinian leadership failures folder.

On an international level, the Palestinians mostly use this as a propaganda tool, rather than raising a concrete offer to amend the agreement. It is very effective for PR, but does not actually improve much for the populace. In my opinion, this is possible one of the few diplomatic fronts where they could have had significant success and achieve better terms as well.

[Ulysses G.]

I think you are mainly speechless because you are not all that informed regarding the topic you post on. This might also explain the frustration evident in your foul language and repeated Nazi references.

Indeed and this also applies to the other regular, anti-Israel posters. Not ONE of them seems to have any accurate knowledge of the conflict and yet they comment on it compulsively.

[Steely Dan]

I think you are mainly speechless because you are not all that informed regarding the topic you post on. This might also explain the frustration evident in your foul language and repeated Nazi references.

Indeed and this also applies to the other regular, anti-Israel posters. Not ONE of them seems to have any accurate knowledge of the conflict and yet they comment on it compulsively.

Peter Yeung in the Independent published the same fallacious report as the o.p article, which was retweeted by 15000 obsessive hate filled frothers. He even refused to amend the article when the facts were demonstrated to him, instead hiding behind the excuse that he reported on an allegation. So the journalists who spread slander about Israel care about the facts as little as their followers do as is tediously demonstrated here every day of the year.

[JingerBen]

Israel has long rationed water to Palestinians. This is water pumped from wells and rivers inside Palestine. But Israel has seized control of all the water and doles it out one drop at a time.

From the very first, the policy of the Israeli government has been to make conditions of life intolerable for Palestinians so they will leave and make way for Israeli settlers.

It is all part of realizing the Zionist dream of ​Eretz Israel.

[snowgard]

You can badmouth, bold your words, and put more exclamation marks, to your little heart's content. It would still not make your case.

Sending other poster to search Google is rude, and simply means you cannot provide proper support.

To try and make this clearer - the price a Palestinian may or may not pay to another Palestinian delivering water in a tanker, is not the price Israel charges from the Palestinians for the same water. It is not even the price set by the Palestinian Water Authority. Basically, these are private operators, many of them unregulated (by Palestinian authorities), who thrive at the expense of their fellow Palestinians. The Palestinian Authority does very little to counter water theft (by Palestinians) from its own infrastructure, does very little to regulate or subsidize such private operators, and fails miserably when it comes to collecting revenues from Palestinian consumers.

You can talk what you want but the fact is: "Israel cut almost every year the water for the at most very poor palestinians but give very cheap water (2.6 Shakel) to the Israelian settlers for grow up !!!" Source: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:YTh3O2CquvsJ:www.haaretz.com/israel-news/business/.premium-1.622913+&cd=1&hl=en

THIS show me that palestinians are only low class humans for Israelis. Otherwise they would be treated the same.

The palestinians must pay 7.676 Shakels for the m³. And don't tell me the settlers too. They got the aggriculture tariff for growers for just 2.6 Shakels and use it 100% for their households too. http://www.water.gov.il/Hebrew/Rates/Pages/Rates.aspx

But that you ride so extrem on my claim and not on the bad behavior from Israel to cut other humans from the access of water show me too what human are you be!!!

Your statement that the palestinians who provide the water tanks charge the higher prices is even misleading, given te fact that these trucks are only needed because Israel blocks the waterpipes.

But I still believe not all Israelis are bad.

Edited June 18, 2016 by snowgard

[dexterm]

Still nobody care to comment on the fact that water shortages were due to a burst water main?

The burst pipe you refer to disrupted supplies to a mere 5 villages: Marda, Biddya, Jammain, Salfit and Tapuach.

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/06/israel-cuts-water-supplies-west-bank-ramadan-160614205022059.html

If it has been repaired, will it all be hunk dory again with occupied Palestinians now able to refill ther swimming pools just like their nearby neighbors in the illegal Zionist colony?

The OP article has certainly opened up a hornet's nest of the further insidious nastiness and greed of Israel's illegal occupation.

Under the Geneva Convention to which Israel is a signatory, it has a duty of care towards the people it occupies, including public health and non destruction of property [incl wells and irrigation systems]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourth_Geneva_Convention#Section_III._Occupied_territories

If Israel does not wish to cop so much flak for its occupation...easy...stop building further illegal colonies on stolen land and end the occupation.

[snowgard]

Israel has long rationed water to Palestinians. This is water pumped from wells and rivers inside Palestine. But Israel has seized control of all the water and doles it out one drop at a time.

From the very first, the policy of the Israeli government has been to make conditions of life intolerable for Palestinians so they will leave and make way for Israeli settlers.

It is all part of realizing the Zionist dream of ​Eretz Israel.

This is exact the point. Every year they stole more and more land from the palestinians!!!

And this never change if the western countries not stopp to support Israel.

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/israel-confirms-it-plans-west-bank-farming-land-grab-jordan-valley-near-jericho-1539485

https://www.rt.com/news/335739-israel-palestine-land-seizure/

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-israel-palestinians-idUSKCN0WH1IF

[JingerBen]

Still nobody care to comment on the fact that water shortages were due to a burst water main?

The burst pipe you refer to disrupted supplies to a mere 5 villages: Marda, Biddya, Jammain, Salfit and Tapuach.

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/06/israel-cuts-water-supplies-west-bank-ramadan-160614205022059.html

If it has been repaired, will it all be hunk dory again with occupied Palestinians now able to refill ther swimming pools just like their nearby neighbors in the illegal Zionist colony?

The OP article has certainly opened up a hornet's nest of the further insidious nastiness and greed of Israel's illegal occupation.

Under the Geneva Convention to which Israel is a signatory, it has a duty of care towards the people it occupies, including public health and non destruction of property [incl wells and irrigation systems]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourth_Geneva_Convention#Section_III._Occupied_territories

If Israel does not wish to cop so much flak for its occupation...easy...stop building further illegal colonies on stolen land and end the occupation.

There you go again...

Demolishing propaganda talking points.

[Steely Dan]

Still nobody care to comment on the fact that water shortages were due to a burst water main?

The burst pipe you refer to disrupted supplies to a mere 5 villages: Marda, Biddya, Jammain, Salfit and Tapuach.

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/06/israel-cuts-water-supplies-west-bank-ramadan-160614205022059.html

If it has been repaired, will it all be hunk dory again with occupied Palestinians now able to refill ther swimming pools just like their nearby neighbors in the illegal Zionist colony?

The OP article has certainly opened up a hornet's nest of the further insidious nastiness and greed of Israel's illegal occupation.

Under the Geneva Convention to which Israel is a signatory, it has a duty of care towards the people it occupies, including public health and non destruction of property [incl wells and irrigation systems]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourth_Geneva_Convention#Section_III._Occupied_territories

If Israel does not wish to cop so much flak for its occupation...easy...stop building further illegal colonies on stolen land and end the occupation.

Hornets nest? Hardly! Indeed aside from Al-Jazeera and a small smattering of leftist newspapers in the west nobody is getting worked up, aside from some of our esteemed members that is. The world is moving on rapidly. There's Brexit, the migrant crisis, US presidential race, hostile relations with Russia and China. Not to mention ISIS. This is but a small side show within a side show.

Israel is now allied with many Arab states, the world has moved on, so too will the Palestinians one day leaving their 'supporters' left in search of a new victim to demonize Israel with.

[Morch]

Israel has long rationed water to Palestinians. This is water pumped from wells and rivers inside Palestine. But Israel has seized control of all the water and doles it out one drop at a time.

From the very first, the policy of the Israeli government has been to make conditions of life intolerable for Palestinians so they will leave and make way for Israeli settlers.

It is all part of realizing the Zionist dream of ​Eretz Israel.

Some posters are having a hard times coming to terms with the fact that the water is divided according to a bilateral agreement signed by the Palestinians. The water is not pumped from "wells and rivers" (what rivers?) inside Palestine but from a variety of sources - some in the mountain aquifer (which will not be solely Palestinian anyway) and some originating from within Israel (as a measure to reduce over production and salinization of the mountain aquifer).

And there goes the nonsense trade mark line you bring up on every other post.

[Morch]

Still nobody care to comment on the fact that water shortages were due to a burst water main?

The burst pipe you refer to disrupted supplies to a mere 5 villages: Marda, Biddya, Jammain, Salfit and Tapuach.

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/06/israel-cuts-water-supplies-west-bank-ramadan-160614205022059.html

If it has been repaired, will it all be hunk dory again with occupied Palestinians now able to refill ther swimming pools just like their nearby neighbors in the illegal Zionist colony?

The OP article has certainly opened up a hornet's nest of the further insidious nastiness and greed of Israel's illegal occupation.

Under the Geneva Convention to which Israel is a signatory, it has a duty of care towards the people it occupies, including public health and non destruction of property [incl wells and irrigation systems]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourth_Geneva_Convention#Section_III._Occupied_territories

If Israel does not wish to cop so much flak for its occupation...easy...stop building further illegal colonies on stolen land and end the occupation.

The 5 "mere villages" translate to a "mere" few tens of thousands residents, all in the Salfit Governate. Oh, and Tapuach (more correctly Kfar Tapuach) is an illegal Israeli settlement in the area.

The bit of the Geneva Convention quoted does not directly mention irrigation systems, wells or even water. It is a general provision. It also specifies conditions under which these provisions may be breached. Further, and to some posters chagrin, the bilateral agreements signed between the Palestinians and Israel usually take precedence over multilateral treaties.

[Morch]

This is exact the point. Every year they stole more and more land from the palestinians!!!

And this never change if the western countries not stopp to support Israel.

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/israel-confirms-it-plans-west-bank-farming-land-grab-jordan-valley-near-jericho-1539485

https://www.rt.com/news/335739-israel-palestine-land-seizure/

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-israel-palestinians-idUSKCN0WH1IF

As general criticism and objection to the Israeli occupation, this is correct.

With regard to the OP, not so much.

[JingerBen]

Israel has long rationed water to Palestinians. This is water pumped from wells and rivers inside Palestine. But Israel has seized control of all the water and doles it out one drop at a time.

From the very first, the policy of the Israeli government has been to make conditions of life intolerable for Palestinians so they will leave and make way for Israeli settlers.

It is all part of realizing the Zionist dream of ​Eretz Israel.

Some posters are having a hard times coming to terms with the fact that the water is divided according to a bilateral agreement signed by the Palestinians. The water is not pumped from "wells and rivers" (what rivers?) inside Palestine but from a variety of sources - some in the mountain aquifer (which will not be solely Palestinian anyway) and some originating from within Israel (as a measure to reduce over production and salinization of the mountain aquifer).

And there goes the nonsense trade mark line you bring up on every other post.

Your post is an attempt to whitewash an obvious fact... Israel is controlling water sources on Palestinian land and rationing them to Palestinians living on Israeli occupied territory.

​Eretz Israel ​is a "...nonsense trade mark..." ?

Tell that to a Zionist.

[willyumiii]

Israel sucks.

They go out of their way to cause trouble ,

and then when they get a little payback, they scream that they are being persecuted.

They are cocky and act tough as long as they know the U.S will finance and support them.

Israel has been an "independent" country for about 60 years now.

It is time they were truly independent and learned how to conduct themselves in a manor that does not put their existence in jeopardy with out a big brother to stick up for them.

Their attitude is a huge reason there can be no peace in the middle east, and that puts the safety of the entire world at risk.

They are the spoiled brats and bullies of the world and they need to grow up.

It's past time the USA let Israel either sink or swim on their own