So what did the Brexit supporters gain?

[Eclipse]

U.K will not get freedom from E.U as they were never trapped in the first place.

U.K were at the head of the table making the rules.

 

Now . The pound continues on it's downward slide.

All because a few bigots did not like a few Polls living nearby.

 

It beggars belief.

There is little doubt now that the Government should tell EU that article 50 will never be sanctioned.

[AlexRich]

16 minutes ago, Eclipse said:

U.K will not get freedom from E.U as they were never trapped in the first place.

U.K were at the head of the table making the rules.

 

Now . The pound continues on it's downward slide.

All because a few bigots did not like a few Polls living nearby.

 

It beggars belief.

There is little doubt now that the Government should tell EU that article 50 will never be sanctioned.

 

The problem now is that they are talking about delaying the Article 50 decision until the end of 2017 because not only do they not have a team in place to begin negotiations, they also do not appear to know what questions to ask and what priorities to make. That's how well this decision was thought through!

 

Theresa May has very cleverly put three 'Brexit' stooges in charge of the fiasco ... Johnson, Fox and Davis. Davis previously stated that the exit would be fairly straightforward ... he's now coming to realise it's not, and now the other two clowns Fox and Johnson are arguing over departmental resources. If this goes badly wrong, and I suspect it will, these three will be totally discredited. If May had put anyone else in charge they are the very same people that would have heavily criticised whatever agreement was put in place. Now they own it.

 

Between 1950 and 1973 the UK was the slowest growing major economy in Europe, after 1973 until present day it is the fastest, even faster than Germany. But Brexit supporters will tell you about how great things will be outside the stifling EU ... so far, so bad.

[Eclipse]

Yes the racist bigots have done a great service to the country.

 

We can only hope that the government have the guts to ignore the opinion poll that took place in June.

[AlexRich]

1 minute ago, Eclipse said:

Yes the racist bigots have done a great service to the country.

 

We can only hope that the government have the guts to ignore the opinion poll that took place in June.

 

The problem is that May is in hock to the Daily Mail, who supported her in the leadership election, and I suspect engineered the exit of Boris Johnson from proceedings (as no doubt he has a great deal more skeletons in his cupboard than have been aired so far), but that support comes with a cost, and that cost is to see Brexit through to the end. So she will not go back on the vote ... unless of course the UK public backtrack and support a party that wants to stay in the EU. For that to happen the economy would need to tank ... or the Europeans would have to move on free movement (which could happen over the next couple of years). So I think we'll be leaving ... a dumb decision in my personal view. 

[NanLaew]

10 hours ago, AlexRich said:

 

.... For that to happen the economy would need to tank ... or the Europeans would have to move on free movement...

 

Whichever happens first...

[sandyf]

11 hours ago, AlexRich said:

 

The problem now is that they are talking about delaying the Article 50 decision until the end of 2017 because not only do they not have a team in place to begin negotiations, they also do not appear to know what questions to ask and what priorities to make. That's how well this decision was thought through!

 

Theresa May has very cleverly put three 'Brexit' stooges in charge of the fiasco ... Johnson, Fox and Davis. Davis previously stated that the exit would be fairly straightforward ... he's now coming to realise it's not, and now the other two clowns Fox and Johnson are arguing over departmental resources. If this goes badly wrong, and I suspect it will, these three will be totally discredited. If May had put anyone else in charge they are the very same people that would have heavily criticised whatever agreement was put in place. Now they own it.

 

Between 1950 and 1973 the UK was the slowest growing major economy in Europe, after 1973 until present day it is the fastest, even faster than Germany. But Brexit supporters will tell you about how great things will be outside the stifling EU ... so far, so bad.

At the press briefing yesterday, the Downing Street spokesman refused to answer the question "Will Article 50 be invoked during 2017?"

The only response he was prepared to give was that Article 50 would not be invoked during 2016. Apparently the PM is in Switzerland and unavailable for comment. Boris Johnson is the most senior politician in the UK at the moment but could not be located.

[Berty100]

8 minutes ago, sandyf said:

At the press briefing yesterday, the Downing Street spokesman refused to answer the question "Will Article 50 be invoked during 2017?"

The only response he was prepared to give was that Article 50 would not be invoked during 2016. Apparently the PM is in Switzerland and unavailable for comment. Boris Johnson is the most senior politician in the UK at the moment but could not be located.

 

But isn't it so that even if they never invoke article 50, the EU will kick them out on the 24th of June 2018.

[AlexRich]

1 hour ago, Berty100 said:

 

But isn't it so that even if they never invoke article 50, the EU will kick them out on the 24th of June 2018.

 

I think technically and legally the answer to your question is no. The Article can only be triggered by the member country, and as long as they are complying with EU rules no other country or the EU itself can make them invoke Article 50.

 

It will be interesting to watch all this play out over the next few years ... interesting, but painful for anyone who converts £ sterling into Thai Baht.

[sandyf]

4 hours ago, AlexRich said:

 

I think technically and legally the answer to your question is no. The Article can only be triggered by the member country, and as long as they are complying with EU rules no other country or the EU itself can make them invoke Article 50.

 

It will be interesting to watch all this play out over the next few years ... interesting, but painful for anyone who converts £ sterling into Thai Baht.

Exactly, Article 50 must be invoked according to the constitution of the member state, still waiting for the courts to rule on that one.

 The UK will no longer be subject to the EU treaty 2 years after invoking Article 50, this period can be extended through agreement with the EU. Until Article 50 is invoked the UK is still a full member of the EU but once Article 50 is invoked the UK cannot partake in any discussion or vote that may relate to the future of the UK. This part of Article 50 is so vague that it could mean that the UK will cease to be an active member of the EU during the exit period but still subject to all EU rulings.

Something else that some seem to be unaware of is that the exit agreement is subject to approval by the EU parliament, so at the end of the day if the EU parliament does not like what the UK has asked for and the EU is not prepared to extend, the EU treaty could be terminated with the UK out in the cold.

 

Your last comment is spot on and at my time of life it is pain I could do without. 

[AlexRich]

2 minutes ago, sandyf said:

Exactly, Article 50 must be invoked according to the constitution of the member state, still waiting for the courts to rule on that one.

 The UK will no longer be subject to the EU treaty 2 years after invoking Article 50, this period can be extended through agreement with the EU. Until Article 50 is invoked the UK is still a full member of the EU but once Article 50 is invoked the UK cannot partake in any discussion or vote that may relate to the future of the UK. This part of Article 50 is so vague that it could mean that the UK will cease to be an active member of the EU during the exit period but still subject to all EU rulings.

Something else that some seem to be unaware of is that the exit agreement is subject to approval by the EU parliament, so at the end of the day if the EU parliament does not like what the UK has asked for and the EU is not prepared to extend, the EU treaty could be terminated with the UK out in the cold.

 

Your last comment is spot on and at my time of life it is pain I could do without. 

 

You might benefit or at least not suffer as much if some economic or political calamity puts investors off the far east or Thailand. Ones that come to mind:

 

1) China has been racking up debt to boost it's growth rate (the official rate is an overstatement), any cracks in that scenario may send Far East currencies into a tailspin; 

2) Political issues with Thailand impacting on investors view of the economic prospects of the country, will weaken the Baht.

3) If the US Fed raise interest rates you will see a flight of money from emerging markets, again might well weaken the Baht. This seems unlikely today, but things can change very quickly.

4) The economic impact of Brexit does not push the UK into a recession, if things are better than forecast then GBP will bounce back a little.

 

So you may get lucky ... currency is notoriously difficult to forecast ... you might end up in a better situation than many think.

 

 

 

[ThaiPauly]

Well the baht has tanked against the pound and for us that live here and rely on funds coming from the UK, THAT is the main concern

 

Not much else about Brexit bothers me, in fact I could not care less, Immigration does not bother me personally, nor does what we contribute to the E U in funding.

 

Sorry to say what everyone else thinks, it's every man for himself I'm afraid

 

I would love for the government to come out and say they were not going to trigger article 50...ever, then maybe life could get back to normal...whatever normal is

Edited August 16, 2016 by ThaiPauly

[cumgranosalum]

The Pound is possibly headed for parity with the Euro? I wonder if Brexiteers appreciate the irony in that?

[happy Joe]

On 14/08/2016 at 1:55 AM, autanic said:

 

 

The majority of the British People who chose to leave the EU, did not rely on advice from UKIP or Brexit Campaigners. We only had to look at the state of our Country, to know which way to vote.  The only shock to people who wanted to stay is how many of us, actually wanted to leave.

 

If it cost the UK economy 1 Trillion Pounds to leave the EU, then it would be a an investment, as we are free again to decide our own destiny. Good or bad.

 

Autanic or Titanic ?

 

 

[GuestHouse]

PM May has taken some decisive action.

 

She's written a letter to the Chinese regarding the relationship the UK is to have with the Chinese.

 

The "decisive action" was to inform neither parliament or the British people of the contents of the letter and the deal she is offering the Chinese. 

 

It seems the UK's relationship with its new master is to be a secrete negotiation not fit for the ears of the British citizens. 

 

[dick dasterdly]

20 hours ago, ThaiPauly said:

Well the baht has tanked against the pound and for us that live here and rely on funds coming from the UK, THAT is the main concern

 

Not much else about Brexit bothers me, in fact I could not care less, Immigration does not bother me personally, nor does what we contribute to the E U in funding.

 

Sorry to say what everyone else thinks, it's every man for himself I'm afraid

 

I would love for the government to come out and say they were not going to trigger article 50...ever, then maybe life could get back to normal...whatever normal is

Sterling/bht has gone down by 10%.  About the same as the last drop in sterling during my time here.

 

I'd stopped following Brit. politics after retiring to Thailand, but now I'm fascinated to see what happens next.

?  How will they do this and will it result in a backlash?

[AlexRich]

7 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

Sterling/bht has gone down by 10%.  About the same as the last drop in sterling during my time here.

 

I'd stopped following Brit. politics after retiring to Thailand, but now I'm fascinated to see what happens next.

?  How will they do this and will it result in a backlash?

 

I'm also watching this one very carefully ... the truth is that no one really knows what the eventual outcome will be. My personal view is that a lot will depend on what the UK's eventual deal will be with the EU. As long as we have unfettered access to the EU market we may not suffer too much, and the £ will recover well against other countries, including the Baht. Thailand under the military has not been a great success historically ... so a lot could happen here that soothes the pain of the 10-12% fall in the £ relative to the Baht. 

 

I read that there is a court case going through that will challenge May's legal right to trigger Article 50 without going through parliament ... a parliament where the majority of MPs would vote to remain. It will probably go to the UK's Supreme Court and if appealed will be decided ironically in the European Court. So that's one to keep your eye on. 

[dick dasterdly]

1 hour ago, AlexRich said:

 

I'm also watching this one very carefully ... the truth is that no one really knows what the eventual outcome will be. My personal view is that a lot will depend on what the UK's eventual deal will be with the EU. As long as we have unfettered access to the EU market we may not suffer too much, and the £ will recover well against other countries, including the Baht. Thailand under the military has not been a great success historically ... so a lot could happen here that soothes the pain of the 10-12% fall in the £ relative to the Baht. 

 

I read that there is a court case going through that will challenge May's legal right to trigger Article 50 without going through parliament ... a parliament where the majority of MPs would vote to remain. It will probably go to the UK's Supreme Court and if appealed will be decided ironically in the European Court. So that's one to keep your eye on. 

Not really, IMO its all down to politics and whether Brit. politicians feel brave enough to find a way around the 'leave' referendum vote.

[dick dasterdly]

Will May pretend that she's enforcing the vote, whilst doing nothing until the next general election?

 

Its a whole bunch of 'ifs' and how the electorate respond to this - if they're given a 'leave' option at the nest general election.

[sandyf]

2 hours ago, dick dasterdly said:

Will May pretend that she's enforcing the vote, whilst doing nothing until the next general election?

 

Its a whole bunch of 'ifs' and how the electorate respond to this - if they're given a 'leave' option at the nest general election.

That's the way I see it panning out, she cannot keep everyone happy so she needs to get the general election behind her before facing the backlash. In the meantime she can always pray for an escape route.

 

Another issue that may come up is Turkey. That was a major weapon in the vote leave arsenal, but recent events have effectively ruled them out of ever joining the EU. If parliament has to vote on Article 50, MP's may see the Turkish situation as significant grounds to reject the referendum result.

 

" Kasra Nouroozi, from Mishcon de Reya, says: "Everyone in Britain needs the government to apply the correct constitutional process and allow Parliament to fulfil its democratic duty, which is to take into account the results of the referendum along with other factors and make the ultimate decision." "

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-uk-leaves-the-eu-36703799

[autanic]

I have read a lot about brexiteers like myself being racist biggots.

 

I can assure you nothing could be further from the truth and if you ever met me in real life, you would appreciate the irony of that statement,

 

The fact remains is this, I was given a  legal and democratic vote and the question on the ballot paper was this.

 

 

Do you wish the United Kingdom to remain a part of the European Union or to leave the European Union.

 

I voted to leave.

 

 

Now you can bitch and moan about racism,  and how badly it will affect you and will it or won't it ever happen. 

 

The only thing that has any certaintity, is that I had a vote a d for my own non racist reason, I voted to leave. Alongwith 17 million others.

 

Now Teresa  May has stated in the clearest terms that brexit means brexit, the hows and when, well quite frankly I couldnt give a shit. Am I  am not in rush really.

 

What people do not understand outside of the  UK, is  yes our pound is worth less than before, yes we might be heading into recession, yes the sky might fall in, but we stuck two fingers up at the authorities and won the day.  Now that is freedom and it is sweet.

Edited August 17, 2016 by autanic

[Berty100]

5 hours ago, autanic said:

we stuck two fingers up at the authorities and won the day.

 

You won the referendum, if you won the day is a completely different matter and will only be known in a decade or so, but I personally think you lost the day.

[sandyf]

1 hour ago, Berty100 said:

 

You won the referendum, if you won the day is a completely different matter and will only be known in a decade or so, but I personally think you lost the day.

Exactly, but in reality it was everyone that lost the day and will end up paying dearly for that misguided gesture. The ball has started rolling.

 

Bureaux de change offering €0.99 for £1

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-37107945

[AlexRich]

8 hours ago, autanic said:

What people do not understand outside of the  UK, is  yes our pound is worth less than before, yes we might be heading into recession, yes the sky might fall in, but we stuck two fingers up at the authorities and won the day.  Now that is freedom and it is sweet.

Edited 8 hours ago by autanic

 

I think people outside of the UK understand what we did. The Chinese (in one of their main daily newspapers) described us as displaying a "losing mentality", most of the EU couldn't understand it and the US thought we were mad. 

 

Sticking two fingers up to the authorities makes no sense to me ... along with Eton's own boy Boris, the owner of the Daily Mail, Murdoch's Sun, Nigel Farage, Bill Cash, Nigel Lawson and a fellow group of Little Englander fantasists ... they're hardly the Bolsheviks, are they? 

 

What is this freedom that is sweet? We're still in the EU, Article 50 now delayed, immigrants from Europe still coming into the country, investment plans stalled, currency tumbling, growth stalling, Central Bank cutting interest rates, savers stuffed, London's economy most affected (a big tax earner) ... I could go on.

 

The question is how have we benefited? And your answer is that the air smells a bit sweeter? Where we not free before? You talk as if we lived in North Korea. Sorry, but you bought the bullsh*t ... and that's the only thing that this whole episode in our history smells of?

 

 

 

[cumgranosalum]

The general philosophy of Brexiteers - it you can call it that - brings to mind the owner of a car who finds it needs repairing and rather than fixing it decides the best solution is to smash it up and buy a bicycle

Edited August 18, 2016 by cumgranosalum

[cumgranosalum]

1 hour ago, AlexRich said:

 

I think people outside of the UK understand what we did. The Chinese (in one of their main daily newspapers) described us as displaying a "losing mentality", most of the EU couldn't understand it and the US thought we were mad. 

 

Sticking two fingers up to the authorities makes no sense to me ... along with Eton's own boy Boris, the owner of the Daily Mail, Murdoch's Sun, Nigel Farage, Bill Cash, Nigel Lawson and a fellow group of Little Englander fantasists ... they're hardly the Bolsheviks, are they? 

 

What is this freedom that is sweet? We're still in the EU, Article 50 now delayed, immigrants from Europe still coming into the country, investment plans stalled, currency tumbling, growth stalling, Central Bank cutting interest rates, savers stuffed, London's economy most affected (a big tax earner) ... I could go on.

 

The question is how have we benefited? And your answer is that the air smells a bit sweeter? Where we not free before? You talk as if we lived in North Korea. Sorry, but you bought the bullsh*t ... and that's the only thing that this whole episode in our history smells of?

 

 

 

 

there'as a classic definition of "wrong end of the stick"?

[sandyf]

3 hours ago, AlexRich said:

 

I think people outside of the UK understand what we did. The Chinese (in one of their main daily newspapers) described us as displaying a "losing mentality", most of the EU couldn't understand it and the US thought we were mad. 

 

I would agree on your first 2 points but not the 3rd, I believe that it was in the US interest for the UK to leave the UK. Mr Obama knew exactly what he was doing when he said the UK would go to the back of the queue, that it would get right up the nose of the UK population.

The US have a vested interest in manipulating the EU and the task becomes a lot easier if the UK is no longer involved. Post Brexit the UK will be so desperate for a trade deal with the US you never know what they will agree to.

Once Turkey's role in the leave campaign was over, they were also removed from the equation, or are we to believe that was pure coincidence. The US were never going to be happy with a Muslim country in the EU.

 

The one thing that I fail to understand is that why with a referendum of such significance, David Cameron allowed it to be held without a minimum margin. This borderline result will haunt the UK for years to come.

[AlexRich]

14 minutes ago, sandyf said:

I would agree on your first 2 points but not the 3rd, I believe that it was in the US interest for the UK to leave the UK. Mr Obama knew exactly what he was doing when he said the UK would go to the back of the queue, that it would get right up the nose of the UK population.

The US have a vested interest in manipulating the EU and the task becomes a lot easier if the UK is no longer involved. Post Brexit the UK will be so desperate for a trade deal with the US you never know what they will agree to.

Once Turkey's role in the leave campaign was over, they were also removed from the equation, or are we to believe that was pure coincidence. The US were never going to be happy with a Muslim country in the EU.

 

The one thing that I fail to understand is that why with a referendum of such significance, David Cameron allowed it to be held without a minimum margin. This borderline result will haunt the UK for years to come.

 

I disagree. I don't think it is in the US interests to have a close partner outside the EU, with no influence on EU policy going forward, especially with regard to things like Russian sanctions ... many of the Europeans would like to water them down for domestic business reasons ... Italy come to mind, and France had some naval sales that got kiboshed. Obama's involvement did not help, but it wasn't some clever manoeuvre to influence the vote towards Brexit. Bear in mind also many US european headquarters are based in the UK, particularly the London Banks ... it really makes no sense. I'm not naive enough to think that there are never any dirty tricks played, but I don't think this was one of them.

 

 

[sandyf]

3 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

 

I disagree. I don't think it is in the US interests to have a close partner outside the EU, with no influence on EU policy going forward, especially with regard to things like Russian sanctions ... many of the Europeans would like to water them down for domestic business reasons ... Italy come to mind, and France had some naval sales that got kiboshed. Obama's involvement did not help, but it wasn't some clever manoeuvre to influence the vote towards Brexit. Bear in mind also many US european headquarters are based in the UK, particularly the London Banks ... it really makes no sense. I'm not naive enough to think that there are never any dirty tricks played, but I don't think this was one of them.

 

 

Each to his own on that one, looks to me like 'divide and conquer'. They are going to end up with a bigger grip on each camp.

[HappyDazed]

On 08/17/2016 at 1:30 PM, dick dasterdly said:

Sterling/bht has gone down by 10%.  About the same as the last drop in sterling during my time here.

 

Its more like 15% based on todays rate and comparisons with previous rate drops are invalid as the reason for this rate drop is a longterm thing which is difficult if not impossible to recover from.  For illustration, I take it you're referring to the simarily low rate back in 2013, but that recovered almost immediately which is just not happening this time.

[Khun Han]

6 hours ago, HappyDazed said:

 

Its more like 15% based on todays rate and comparisons with previous rate drops are invalid as the reason for this rate drop is a longterm thing which is difficult if not impossible to recover from.  For illustration, I take it you're referring to the simarily low rate back in 2013, but that recovered almost immediately which is just not happening this time.

 

No, it's 10% at today's rate if you compare to the steady rate in the weeks before the brexit vote.

 

How long have you been on the block? Sterling spent a while down at about 44Bt a few years ago.

 

And where in Pantip did you buy your currency exchange crystal ball? I want one.

 

Keep up the scaremongering guys. You're hilarious .