Eyewitness: Truck slams into crowd in Nice

[canuckamuck]

This guy had nothing to do with Islam. He didn't even follow its teachings. No more a Muslim than the Pope.

The Right Wing War Mongers thought they had a poster boy to promote their military agenda.

His mental illness was depression which can develop into a serious illness if left untreated.

What these tragedies seem to be highlighting is France's inability to integrate different social / religious immigrants into its society. Large areas of slums with generational high unemployment and limited access to education. Generational exclusion and isolation is not going to turn out to good. Home grown terrorists.

Nothing to do with Islam? Well let's think about that. His name was Mohamed he was born into a Muslim family, the press said he was a Muslim, Oh and he shouted Allah Akbar after killing 84 people watching fireworks. Does that make him Catholic now?

So if a son is named Mohamed and has a Muslim family he is an Islamic Terrorist? Fits with your very simplistic world view unfortunately the facts of this guy don't match it. He didn't practice his Islamic religion, he was under psychiatric care, he had just recently been divorced, he drank alcohol and was involved in petty crime, isolated and unhappy not much to look forward to in life and suffering from depression. Loony war mongers would like to distill this persons life down to Mohamed + Muslim family = terrorist but it is not that simple. Sorry you lucked out on this one. Humans are not that simplistic. France has the most Muslims getting involved fighting with ISIS. You have to ask why that is the case.

Your logic and comprehension skills have failed you again. You said he had nothing to do with Islam, as in completely separated from Islam in every way. I merely pointed out your fallacy. Now you introduce a new fallacy, that I said being born in Muslim family makes you a terrorist. I never said that at all. But shouting Allah is great after killing dozens of innocent men women and children, makes you an Islamic terrorist.

[Jingthing]

The Nice terrorist (that sounds odd) certainly does not represent Islam. But he does represent Islamic Jihadist terrorism. Such scum are often not good practicing Muslims. Perhaps that's too much contradiction for some to grasp but welcome to the real world. Within the Islamic texts you can find teachings of peace and also teachings of horrific violence. The Jihadists like the violent parts. It's not Islamophobic to be open about this truthiness.

Edited July 16, 2016 by Jingthing

[Jdiddy]

Ban trucks, especially high capacity ones with auto gear boxes

[dexterm]

Nothing to do with Islam? Well let's think about that. His name was Mohamed he was born into a Muslim family, the press said he was a Muslim, Oh and he shouted Allah Akbar after killing 84 people watching fireworks. Does that make him Catholic now?

No. It makes him a nutjob.

But you would clearly like to make this deranged man who never visited a mosque, never observed Ramadan, who ate pork, drank alcohol, took drugs, wore immodest beach shorts, trashed and defecated throughout his wife's home when she asked for a divorce, tore up up his child's teddy bear, had convictions for road rage and assault..as 100% representative of a religion followed by a quarter of the world's population, because it happens to suit your hate filled Islamophobic agenda.

His last words are all you need to know.

And yes I do have a hate filled agenda. I hate people making excuses for mass murderers and a belief system which over and over has resulted in massive death tolls comprised of the weakest and most vulnerable members of society. Maybe your kids will be next.

Fake: Allahu akbar was heard

Messages were circulated that the truck driver shouted Allahu akbar, which is Arabic for God is great.

This tweeter suggests he can hear Allahu Akbar in the seventh second of this video of the Nice attack.

As yet, no official source has said this happened.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36807333

There were reports from witnesses said the driver shouted “Allahu Akbar” (”God is greatest in Arabic”), though other witnesses disputed this.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/world/dozens-dead-as-truck-ploughs-into-nice-bastille-day-parade/news-story/c85335cc0942d425928dcb58061c31fa

But I kinda know whose version you will prefer.

[dexterm]

The Nice terrorist (that sounds odd) certainly does not represent Islam. But he does represent Islamic Jihadist terrorism. Such scum are often not good practicing Muslims. Perhaps that's too much contradiction for some to grasp but welcome to the real world. Within the Islamic texts you can find teachings of peace and also teachings of horrific violence. The Jihadists like the violent parts. It's not Islamophobic to be open about this truthiness.

How do you know that he is a Jihadist terrorist? When all the evidence points to him being far from religious and simply a bitter and deranged man. Your jumping to conclusions betrays your your agenda and undermines your credibility.

I agree with you the man is ...was scum and a terrorist. Anyone who indifferently kills innocents especially children is a terrorist.

Edited July 16, 2016 by dexterm

[canuckamuck]

His last words are all you need to know.

And yes I do have a hate filled agenda. I hate people making excuses for mass murderers and a belief system which over and over has resulted in massive death tolls comprised of the weakest and most vulnerable members of society. Maybe your kids will be next.

Fake: Allahu akbar was heard

Messages were circulated that the truck driver shouted Allahu akbar, which is Arabic for God is great.

This tweeter suggests he can hear Allahu Akbar in the seventh second of this video of the Nice attack.

As yet, no official source has said this happened.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36807333

There were reports from witnesses said the driver shouted “Allahu Akbar” (”God is greatest in Arabic”), though other witnesses disputed this.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/world/dozens-dead-as-truck-ploughs-into-nice-bastille-day-parade/news-story/c85335cc0942d425928dcb58061c31fa

But I kinda know whose version you will prefer.

I prefer the truth

[dexterm]

His last words are all you need to know.

And yes I do have a hate filled agenda. I hate people making excuses for mass murderers and a belief system which over and over has resulted in massive death tolls comprised of the weakest and most vulnerable members of society. Maybe your kids will be next.

Fake: Allahu akbar was heard

Messages were circulated that the truck driver shouted Allahu akbar, which is Arabic for God is great.

This tweeter suggests he can hear Allahu Akbar in the seventh second of this video of the Nice attack.

As yet, no official source has said this happened.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36807333

There were reports from witnesses said the driver shouted “Allahu Akbar” (”God is greatest in Arabic”), though other witnesses disputed this.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/world/dozens-dead-as-truck-ploughs-into-nice-bastille-day-parade/news-story/c85335cc0942d425928dcb58061c31fa

But I kinda know whose version you will prefer.

I prefer the truth

Good. That makes two of us. Much better to remain objective and open minded. We will no doubt eventually hear the truth from an official investigation without jumping to conclusions.

[Credo]

It's getting harder and harder to trust anyone who is from the ME or looks Middle Eastern. This is especially true if they are on the young side.

[up2u2]

Your logic and comprehension skills have failed you again. You said he had nothing to do with Islam, as in completely separated from Islam in every way. I merely pointed out your fallacy. Now you introduce a new fallacy, that I said being born in Muslim family makes you a terrorist. I never said that at all. But shouting Allah is great after killing dozens of innocent men women and children, makes you an Islamic terrorist.

Correct in his personal life he had little if anything to do with Islam. Just as his crime had nothing to do with Islamic extremism. As usual you form an opinion on his name and his religion because it suits your agenda but it is becoming clear his name or his religion isn't a factor in his crime. As more information comes to light it would seem he struck out at the society that he felt rejected and abused by. He may as well have screamed Pineapple as he killed people a god being great had nothing to do with his actions they came from a different place altogether.

[Credo]

Correct in his personal life he had little if anything to do with Islam. Just as his crime had nothing to do with Islamic extremism. As usual you form an opinion on his name and his religion because it suits your agenda but it is becoming clear his name or his religion isn't a factor in his crime. As more information comes to light it would seem he struck out at the society that he felt rejected and abused by. He may as well have screamed Pineapple as he killed people a god being great had nothing to do with his actions they came from a different place altogether.

But he didn't scream Pineapple, did he?

[canuckamuck]

Your logic and comprehension skills have failed you again. You said he had nothing to do with Islam, as in completely separated from Islam in every way. I merely pointed out your fallacy. Now you introduce a new fallacy, that I said being born in Muslim family makes you a terrorist. I never said that at all. But shouting Allah is great after killing dozens of innocent men women and children, makes you an Islamic terrorist.

Correct in his personal life he had little if anything to do with Islam. Just as his crime had nothing to do with Islamic extremism. As usual you form an opinion on his name and his religion because it suits your agenda but it is becoming clear his name or his religion isn't a factor in his crime. As more information comes to light it would seem he struck out at the society that he felt rejected and abused by. He may as well have screamed Pineapple as he killed people a god being great had nothing to do with his actions they came from a different place altogether.

Hey social justice warrior, you can't make this guy into a victim.

Your post is disgusting.

[up2u2]

Correct in his personal life he had little if anything to do with Islam. Just as his crime had nothing to do with Islamic extremism. As usual you form an opinion on his name and his religion because it suits your agenda but it is becoming clear his name or his religion isn't a factor in his crime. As more information comes to light it would seem he struck out at the society that he felt rejected and abused by. He may as well have screamed Pineapple as he killed people a god being great had nothing to do with his actions they came from a different place altogether.

But he didn't scream Pineapple, did he?

As for a god being great he may as well have. It was irrelevant to what he was doing. It isn't what motivated him. In his personal life he certainly didn't believe his god was great. He pretty much rejected the ideology of Islam. So yes he may as well have screamed Pineapple. I understand it is difficult to see past your obvious prejudices.

[Jingthing]

Muslim background. Mass terrorist murder. Shouts Allah Akbar. Barks like a dog. Ipso facto. Jihadist. Also this method has been suggested on Jihadist inspirational website.

Also it's well known Jihadists actively work to recruit and inspire mentally unstable alienated people. There doesn't need to be any direct contact at all. They don't give a fig if the people they inspire are good practicing Muslims. Face reality.

Don't make excuses for the this Jihadist scum. Even trying does disservice to moderate Muslims.

Edited July 16, 2016 by Jingthing

[ddavidovsky]

This really is total nonsense.

The cause is not displaced people. Sure - many attacks in the West are from people living in Mulsim enclaves.

But who 'displaced' them? In the main they came of their own volition and these communities made a decision not to assimilate. Mostly because many sects of Islam think Westerners are dirt.

Sure - young men growing up in these non-assimilated communities find it hard to find jobs. This is what happens when you set yourself apart from the world around you. They also get to listen to psychopathic Mullahs brainwashing them.

The reason your displacement theory is nonsense is not this, though.

The reason is that Islam is clearly the cause.

Just last month, Islamic terrorists in Iraq killed 250 people. Most of them families out breaking their fast. A nice family meal out. Their sin? Being the WRONG KIND of Mulsim.

So seriously - cut the amateur psycho-babble. It's leftist tripe.

Muslims are killing far more Muslims than Westerners. They do so in the Middle East, they do so in non-Middle Eastern Africa - these are not displaced people. They are displeased people. They simply despise people that have a different world view. They were not born that way, they were brainwashed.

The answer is simple. Zero tolerance for hate speaking Mullahs, countries that sponsor Islamic terrorism and places of worship that preach hatred.

I was hoping for a better quality discussion from someone.

The reasons for the displacement is irrelevant. True, it is often self-imposed - economic migrants turn up in the west with idealistic expectations and many find the reality is quite different - their sense of inferiority is made worse, and disillusionment only makes them more bitter than ever.

I'll say again, Islam is only the surface cause, not the ultimate cause. And again: people seek division. Groups need to make themselves different and will create divisions for the sake of competition - it's built into human evolution. Similar things have happened in the history of Christianity (wars and attempted genocides against other religions, brutal suppressions of one sect by another) only we've had centuries to grow out of it. Yes, you could say Islam is centuries behind, but simply to blame religion is to blame human nature and doesn't help.

As I said, this is partly for the imams to deal with, and somehow the imams need to be controlled by the state (we agree on that), so that is a political issue. The real solution though - and the only solution - is to reduce the bitterness, to restore stability and self-esteem in the Islamic world. Entire states need to be rebuilt, borders redrawn in some cases. I would give a particular example - the primary example - that would help a great deal, but apparently it is taboo to mention it in this thread.

Nope - your displaced persons theory is a sham.

There are far more Islamic driven attacks in the middle east.

It simply blows your victim theory out of the water.

If you want better discussion, make valid points.

I'm talking about ISIS and Al Qaeda type terrorism - the sort that takes its struggle to the west. That's the theme of this thread.

I'm not talking about internal strife within Islam (Sunni/Shia) which I presume you are referring to in the middle east - that has been there for millennia, with wars on and off - they have never taken that out on the west. Let's clearly differentiate that.

My theory (and I haven't seen a better one on this thread, or anywhere the world's media) is that ISIS is driven by bitterness due to a sense of inferiority and the quest for an identity they can take pride in. The psychology behind this is commonly (not exclusively) a sense of displacement - many ISIS mercenarys were immigrants in western countries, and many immigrants in the world are posing a terrorist threat to their hosts. What is eating them that sparked this sense of bittnerness? In a single word: Globalisation. This has brought restrictive Islamic traditions clashing against the freedoms of the modern world. It's a struggle between tradition and modernity, and that's bound to be bad-tempered. All the more reason for them to have their own secure homelands where they can rule themselves as they like without oppressing others.

So far so logical.

The solution therefore is to restore pride to the Islamic world by restoring (or establishing) stable nationhood for all. And that doesn't mean immigration to Europe - just the opposite. They need their own nations - nations that former immigrants will want to go back to, just as Jews have been happy to go to Israel.

What single act would restore pride to Islam and help de-escalate the tension more than anything? The answer to that, in all objective rationality, is independence for Palestine, the positive effect of which would spread a warm glow of pride through the Islamic world. That's the start. Then partition of the 'artificial' states of Iraq, Syria and Libya is the next step, just as it was inevitable to partition Yugoslavia and the Soviet Union.

Long way to go then, but without that start I mentioned, there may be no solution at all.

[dexterm]

Correct in his personal life he had little if anything to do with Islam. Just as his crime had nothing to do with Islamic extremism. As usual you form an opinion on his name and his religion because it suits your agenda but it is becoming clear his name or his religion isn't a factor in his crime. As more information comes to light it would seem he struck out at the society that he felt rejected and abused by. He may as well have screamed Pineapple as he killed people a god being great had nothing to do with his actions they came from a different place altogether.

But he didn't scream Pineapple, did he?

We don't know what he screamed do we according to any official report. All the rest is hearsay.

The revealing point is that some posters are certain they know 100% what he screamed because it fits their hate filled agenda. That's the telling part that speaks volumes about their character and reflects on their not so hidden prejudices.

Edited July 16, 2016 by dexterm

[dexterm]

Muslim background. Mass terrorist murder. Shouts Allah Akbar. Barks like a dog. Ipso facto. Jihadist. Also this method has been suggested on Jihadist inspirational website.

Also it's well known Jihadists actively work to recruit and inspire mentally unstable alienated people. There doesn't need to be any direct contact at all. They don't give a fig if the people they inspire are good practicing Muslims. Face reality.

Don't make excuses for the this Jihadist scum. Even trying does disservice to moderate Muslims.

I am appalled by your illogic.

First a litany of admitted unproven assertions.

"Barks like a dog. Ipso facto. Jihadist."

Then you contradict yourself.

He does not need to be a good practising Muslim...yet simultaneously he believes in Jihad????

Edited July 16, 2016 by dexterm

[Jingthing]

Quacks like a duck.

French official: Attacker was ‘radicalized . . . very swiftly’

“We are now facing individuals who are responding positively to the messages issued by the Islamic State without having had any special training," the French interior minister said on the same day ISIS claimed responsibility for the Bastille Day rampage that left 84 dead and 202 injured.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/islamic-state-claims-responsibility-for-france-attack-in-nice/2016/07/16/4327456e-4ab9-11e6-8dac-0c6e4accc5b1_story.html?hpid=hp_hp-top-table-low_nice-515am%3Ahomepage%2Fstory

[Credo]

Correct in his personal life he had little if anything to do with Islam. Just as his crime had nothing to do with Islamic extremism. As usual you form an opinion on his name and his religion because it suits your agenda but it is becoming clear his name or his religion isn't a factor in his crime. As more information comes to light it would seem he struck out at the society that he felt rejected and abused by. He may as well have screamed Pineapple as he killed people a god being great had nothing to do with his actions they came from a different place altogether.

But he didn't scream Pineapple, did he?

We don't know what he screamed do we according to any official report. All the rest is hearsay.

The revealing point is that some posters are certain they know 100% what he screamed because it fits their hate filled agenda. That's the telling part that speaks volumes about their character and reflects on their not so hidden prejudices.

Well, I am pretty sure that Mohammad didn't scream Pineapple.

[Jingthing]

Concern about Islamophobia in the wake of Jihadist terror attacks is understandable. That must be fought. There shouldn't be and doesn't need to be a war against all Muslims.

But fighting Islamophobia with gross distortions and denials about the reality of these Jihadist threats is just massively STUPID. It won't help. It will BACKFIRE.

[thai3]

It's the Islamisation of Europe that needs fighting, not the fear of it.

[FinChin67]

It's the Islamisation of Europe that needs fighting, not the fear of it.

Like the muslims in Southern Thailand. So peaceful...

[FinChin67]

So more people arrested in France.

It seems that what ever this muslim was carrying (like dementia and other things suggested in this thread) must be airborne.

How to protect yourself from it?

[Jingthing]

It's the Islamisation of Europe that needs fighting, not the fear of it.

If you want to focus on that, fine, but I'm sure you'll agree the vast majority of Muslims living in Europe or seeking to migrate to Europe aren't active Jihadist terrorists. Most Muslims just want to get on with their lives in peace like everyone else. They have as much or more to lose from Jihadists than anyone else. It's just not helpful to gin up a war against Muslims. We need to do better than that.

Edited July 16, 2016 by Jingthing

[FinChin67]

Muslim background. Mass terrorist murder. Shouts Allah Akbar. Barks like a dog. Ipso facto. Jihadist. Also this method has been suggested on Jihadist inspirational website.

Also it's well known Jihadists actively work to recruit and inspire mentally unstable alienated people. There doesn't need to be any direct contact at all. They don't give a fig if the people they inspire are good practicing Muslims. Face reality.

Don't make excuses for the this Jihadist scum. Even trying does disservice to moderate Muslims.

I am appalled by your illogic.

First a litany of admitted unproven assertions.

"Barks like a dog. Ipso facto. Jihadist."

Then you contradict yourself.

He does not need to be a good practising Muslim...yet simultaneously he believes in Jihad????

He was born muslim. Always a muslim. It was a call to arms. He obliged.

[Jingthing]

He had obviously given up on his own worldly life. Most people who have reached that point just commit suicide and leave it at that.But if you're inspired by Islamic Jihad, you can jazz up a suicide with the "glory" of a mass murder terrorist attack.

This was another level.

No real targets except just people including children.

Not specifically cartoonists, or Jews, or decadent heavy metal music adult fans ... just people in the west.

I was walking down a soi tonight and saw a huge WHITE truck.

I wouldn't have thought of it as a terrorist weapon before ...

Edited July 16, 2016 by Jingthing

[Dagnabbit]

Looks like the Right Wing war mongers are out of luck on this one.

Seems the culprit was just a guy whose world has had the wheels fall off it.

Broken marriage, no future, isolated from society and family, untreated mental illness.

<snip>

This guy had nothing to do with Islam. He didn't even follow its teachings. No more a Muslim than the Pope.

The Right Wing War Mongers thought they had a poster boy to promote their military agenda.

His mental illness was depression which can develop into a serious illness if left untreated.

What these tragedies seem to be highlighting is France's inability to integrate different social / religious immigrants into its society. Large areas of slums with generational high unemployment and limited access to education. Generational exclusion and isolation is not going to turn out to good. Home grown terrorists.

You miss the point totally.

He had been in telephone contact with a known Jihadi.

Yes - he had mental issues.

Yes - that makes him an easy target for radicals looking to convert people into active Jihadi's willing to lay down their life in the name of Islam.

Nobody is born hating anybody. All Jihadi's are brainwashed by somebody. The fact that this guy was easy to brainwash is rather irrelevant. The CAUSE is the brainwashing. The radical Imams that preach hatred and are allowed to do so because to stop them would be politically incorrect.

[Dagnabbit]

The Nice terrorist (that sounds odd) certainly does not represent Islam. But he does represent Islamic Jihadist terrorism. Such scum are often not good practicing Muslims. Perhaps that's too much contradiction for some to grasp but welcome to the real world. Within the Islamic texts you can find teachings of peace and also teachings of horrific violence. The Jihadists like the violent parts. It's not Islamophobic to be open about this truthiness.

How foolish.

The lunatic liberal line appears to be as follows:

Good practicing Muslims are peaceful.

This man in Nice committed an atrocity, therefore he cannot be a Muslim.

Therefore it follows that ISIS are non-Muslim, Osama Bin Laden was a non-Muslim, the 9-11 attackers were non-Muslims, Mullah Omar was a non-Muslim.

In fact - it is hereby declared by Jingthing that committing an atrocity automatically makes you a non-Muslim. Even if you were somehow convinced that you were a Muslim and acting on the name of your faith. It still makes you a non-Muslim.

This also means that all sectarian violence in the Middle East is committed by atheists. When primarily Sunni ISIS recently bombed a shopping district full of Shiiite Muslims that were shopping, breaking their fast, watching soccer, training at the gym - the bombers weren't Sunni's at all. They were atheists because liberals decided that they were atheists the moment they committed the atrocity.

Looking back in Ireland, it now seems that all sectarian violence there must have been committed by warring atheists because good, practicing religious people wouldn't do that.

Somehow liberals have forgotten that hundreds of millions of people have been killed by violent minorities throughout history.

Nobody says all Muslims are bad but this claim that no Muslims can be bad is silly. It's like saying no Catholics can be bad.

[Dagnabbit]

This really is total nonsense.

The cause is not displaced people. Sure - many attacks in the West are from people living in Mulsim enclaves.

But who 'displaced' them? In the main they came of their own volition and these communities made a decision not to assimilate. Mostly because many sects of Islam think Westerners are dirt.

Sure - young men growing up in these non-assimilated communities find it hard to find jobs. This is what happens when you set yourself apart from the world around you. They also get to listen to psychopathic Mullahs brainwashing them.

The reason your displacement theory is nonsense is not this, though.

The reason is that Islam is clearly the cause.

Just last month, Islamic terrorists in Iraq killed 250 people. Most of them families out breaking their fast. A nice family meal out. Their sin? Being the WRONG KIND of Mulsim.

So seriously - cut the amateur psycho-babble. It's leftist tripe.

Muslims are killing far more Muslims than Westerners. They do so in the Middle East, they do so in non-Middle Eastern Africa - these are not displaced people. They are displeased people. They simply despise people that have a different world view. They were not born that way, they were brainwashed.

The answer is simple. Zero tolerance for hate speaking Mullahs, countries that sponsor Islamic terrorism and places of worship that preach hatred.

I was hoping for a better quality discussion from someone.

The reasons for the displacement is irrelevant. True, it is often self-imposed - economic migrants turn up in the west with idealistic expectations and many find the reality is quite different - their sense of inferiority is made worse, and disillusionment only makes them more bitter than ever.

I'll say again, Islam is only the surface cause, not the ultimate cause. And again: people seek division. Groups need to make themselves different and will create divisions for the sake of competition - it's built into human evolution. Similar things have happened in the history of Christianity (wars and attempted genocides against other religions, brutal suppressions of one sect by another) only we've had centuries to grow out of it. Yes, you could say Islam is centuries behind, but simply to blame religion is to blame human nature and doesn't help.

As I said, this is partly for the imams to deal with, and somehow the imams need to be controlled by the state (we agree on that), so that is a political issue. The real solution though - and the only solution - is to reduce the bitterness, to restore stability and self-esteem in the Islamic world. Entire states need to be rebuilt, borders redrawn in some cases. I would give a particular example - the primary example - that would help a great deal, but apparently it is taboo to mention it in this thread.

Nope - your displaced persons theory is a sham.

There are far more Islamic driven attacks in the middle east.

It simply blows your victim theory out of the water.

If you want better discussion, make valid points.

I'm talking about ISIS and Al Qaeda type terrorism - the sort that takes its struggle to the west. That's the theme of this thread.

I'm not talking about internal strife within Islam (Sunni/Shia) which I presume you are referring to in the middle east - that has been there for millennia, with wars on and off - they have never taken that out on the west. Let's clearly differentiate that.

My theory (and I haven't seen a better one on this thread, or anywhere the world's media) is that ISIS is driven by bitterness due to a sense of inferiority and the quest for an identity they can take pride in. The psychology behind this is commonly (not exclusively) a sense of displacement - many ISIS mercenarys were immigrants in western countries, and many immigrants in the world are posing a terrorist threat to their hosts. What is eating them that sparked this sense of bittnerness? In a single word: Globalisation. This has brought restrictive Islamic traditions clashing against the freedoms of the modern world. It's a struggle between tradition and modernity, and that's bound to be bad-tempered. All the more reason for them to have their own secure homelands where they can rule themselves as they like without oppressing others.

So far so logical.

The solution therefore is to restore pride to the Islamic world by restoring (or establishing) stable nationhood for all. And that doesn't mean immigration to Europe - just the opposite. They need their own nations - nations that former immigrants will want to go back to, just as Jews have been happy to go to Israel.

What single act would restore pride to Islam and help de-escalate the tension more than anything? The answer to that, in all objective rationality, is independence for Palestine, the positive effect of which would spread a warm glow of pride through the Islamic world. That's the start. Then partition of the 'artificial' states of Iraq, Syria and Libya is the next step, just as it was inevitable to partition Yugoslavia and the Soviet Union.

Long way to go then, but without that start I mentioned, there may be no solution at all.

Yes - I know what you are talking about. You are trying to claim European based attackers are victims of a kind. It's nonsense because when you look at EXACTLY the same sort of behavior elsewhere, your "Cause" is not there. The effect is the same.

You should stop with this victimhood theory.

What would restore pride to Islam? Well - quite simple, reform. Stop imprisoning women for being raped. Stop hanging homosexuals. Stop making women walk around in bin-liners. You know - basic freedoms, that sort of thing.

You wouldn't need secret polices in Islamic states if the general populace were happy living in one, would you?

[Ulysses G.]

14 pages so far of the usual redneck Muslim bashing that now seems to be the norm on this forum despite rule #11.

You will not post slurs, degrading or overly negative comments directed towards ...any other group on the basis of race, nationality, religion, gender or sexual orientation.

and despite the fact that the OP perp was not a practising Muslim; he ate pork, drank alcohol, took drugs, never went to a mosque or observed Ramadan.

Rubbish. No one cares if he was zealous about every aspect of his religion. The 9/11 murderers weren't either. He was a radical Muslim terrorist who died in the act of committing violent Jihad against infidels.

Hadith 19:4294 " Fight against those who do not believe in Allah. Make a holy war."

[Ulysses G.]

This guy had nothing to do with Islam. He didn't even follow its teachings.

Nonsense. He followed Islam's teachings concerning violence and Jihad. He was Muslim all right.