Foreign governments asked to respect result of the Thai referendum

[Hawk]

"

He also urged them to express their well wishes to the Thai people for the approval of the draft constitution in the referendum even though not every Thai voted in favour of the draft but over 50 percent of the eligible voters turned out to exercise their voting rights."

 

 

But only 15 million supposedly supported the charter in a nation of nearly 70 million people. But there will still be no elections for a long time to come, no lifting of laws restricting political gatherings, freedom of speech etc. 

[robblok]

33 minutes ago, Hawk said:

"

He also urged them to express their well wishes to the Thai people for the approval of the draft constitution in the referendum even though not every Thai voted in favour of the draft but over 50 percent of the eligible voters turned out to exercise their voting rights."

 

 

But only 15 million supposedly supported the charter in a nation of nearly 70 million people. But there will still be no elections for a long time to come, no lifting of laws restricting political gatherings, freedom of speech etc. 

Everyone had a chance to vote.. everyone could vote no.. they did not. 

 

[brucec64]

I guess EU and US didn't get the memo:

 

http://eeas.europa.eu/statements-eeas/2016/160808_02_en.htm

 

"During the campaign period, however, there were serious limitations to fundamental freedoms, including restrictions on debate and campaigning."

 

http://www.state.gov/r/pa/prs/dpb/2016/08/260911.htm#THAILAND

 

"I think I’ve raised our concerns on the process leading up to the draft constitution. We raised concerns about it not being inclusive, not being open"

 

Obviously a lack of understanding of Thainess.

 

(cue all the anti EU/US vitriol...)

 

[hawker9000]

On August 9, 2016 at 5:23 PM, chainarong said:

Respect comes after you have earned it , no Democratic  government will give a Thailand  Junta the green light, and or congratulations , a carefully worded document would be the only communication they will possibly receive , for to give congratulations publicly would be endorsing a Junta lead Government , which would give the Thai Administration carte  blanche to do whatever they liked. 

 

You might be right, but my expectation is that most will pull their punches and issue some kind of a "positive statement", even if lukewarm and pro forma.  Diplomatic protocols you know. 

 

Except for the Chinese.  They'll be much more congratulatory I'm sure.

 

When Thailand retains its trading relationships and foreign lending, it pretty much gets the de facto green light you're talking about.  And I don't see any trade sanctions likely to materialize.

[heybruce]

" The foreign minister said he would invite members of the diplomatic corp and international organizations in Thailand to the Foreign Ministry either on Thursday or Friday for a briefing of the referendum result"

 

Will the briefing include an explanation as to why there was no independent monitoring of the vote and vote count?  Probably not. 

 

However they might earn a little (only a little) respect for the referendum result if they allow a competent, independent analysis of the vote count.

[heybruce]

23 hours ago, djjamie said:

I hope yingluck respects that vote. She respected the voting side of it by coming out to vote. Respecting the result is just as important.

 

So should everyone. The majority have been disrespected long enough by the previous regime and it is rather saddening if they are not respected now. 

Are you referring to the majority who's 2011 votes were disrespected by the military?  You remember the 2011 election don't you?  The legitimate one where campaigning was allowed and the vote monitored by ANFREL.

[Puccini]

On 09/08/2016 at 10:56 PM, tomacht8 said:

The turnout in the referendum was about 55 percent, which meant that only about one-third of the electorate endorsed it, given that it won with a 67 percent majority.

 

 

 

  45,00%         did not vote
   36,85%         vote yes
   18,15%         vote no
100,00%

The turnout's been very low.
The majority are the non-voters, the abstainers.

Why so many have denied or not preceeding there vote?
 

 

The 45% who chose not to vote are not the majority.

[than]

On 09/08/2016 at 10:56 PM, tomacht8 said:

The turnout in the referendum was about 55 percent, which meant that only about one-third of the electorate endorsed it, given that it won with a 67 percent majority.

 

 

 

  45,00%         did not vote
   36,85%         vote yes
   18,15%         vote no
100,00%

The turnout's been very low.
The majority are the non-voters, the abstainers.

Why so many have denied or not preceeding there vote?
 

Some are student how are very busy with Pokemon Go

[than]

On 10/08/2016 at 11:58 AM, brucec64 said:

I guess EU and US didn't get the memo:

 

http://eeas.europa.eu/statements-eeas/2016/160808_02_en.htm

 

"During the campaign period, however, there were serious limitations to fundamental freedoms, including restrictions on debate and campaigning."

 

http://www.state.gov/r/pa/prs/dpb/2016/08/260911.htm#THAILAND

 

"I think I’ve raised our concerns on the process leading up to the draft constitution. We raised concerns about it not being inclusive, not being open"

 

Obviously a lack of understanding of Thainess.

 

(cue all the anti EU/US vitriol...)

 

When some EU gouvernements don't respect the voices of their own People 

[than]

21 hours ago, heybruce said:

Are you referring to the majority who's 2011 votes were disrespected by the military?  You remember the 2011 election don't you?  The legitimate one where campaigning was allowed and the vote monitored by ANFREL.

 

 

The same ANFREL who acknowledged that vote buying were made during this same vote (2011)

[Jools]

"and to stage an election next year. "

 

Unfortunate choice of words. "Stage" is exactly what they'll do.

[joeyg]

Yeah they should be more like us Americans, where "The Rule of Law" is dead.  And the Fat Cat Fascists bail out their buddies with 20s of trillions of dollars   Much better...

[sjaak327]

Maybe if the referendum would have followed democratic principles that respect would have been forthcoming.

 

The way this referendum was conducted only deserves disrepect and distrust.

 

But I guess if democratic principles would have been followed, the yes vote would have been a no vote.

[heybruce]

1 hour ago, than said:

 

 

The same ANFREL who acknowledged that vote buying were made during this same vote (2011)

Yes, this ANFREL:

 

"Mr. Damaso Magbual, ANFREL’s Head of Mission, agreed when he said that  “The  election  period,  in  particular  Election Day  on  July  3rd,  was managed    well    and  without  any  major  incident  which  would  call  into  question  the  election’s  results. " http://anfrel.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/ThaiEOMReport_Edit_4-final_edit.pdf  

 

Page 150 of a long report full of recommendations that the referendum ignored to the point of doing the opposite.

 

[berybert]

On ‎10‎/‎08‎/‎2016 at 10:49 AM, robblok said:

Everyone had a chance to vote.. everyone could vote no.. they did not. 

 

Even if everyone had voted 'no' the 'yes' vote would have been at least 55%.

[JayBeeee]

I can't help but feel that if voters' ID card number and thumb print weren't on the actual balot paper, the result would have been quite different... or maybe not!

[digibum]

Quote

Foreign Minister Don Paramavinai today (Tuesday) called on foreign governments to respect the result of the Thai referendum on the draft constitution on Sunday in the same way that they respected their own referendums.

 

From:  President Barak Obama

To:  Thai Junta

 

Subject:  Referendum Results

 

Thailand is not the USA's father.  They cannot tell us what to do.  Thailand should stay out of USA affairs and mind to their own business.  

 

Sincerely,

 

Barak Obama

 

 

[aussieinthailand]

On ‎8‎/‎9‎/‎2016 at 1:16 PM, djjamie said:

I hope yingluck respects that vote. She respected the voting side of it by coming out to vote. Respecting the result is just as important.

 

So should everyone. The majority have been disrespected long enough by the previous regime and it is rather saddening if they are not respected now. 

Funny how you call on people to respect voting now for a referendum that was rejected by most democratic and free thinking people and international governments,  But your calling for not respecting a vote just over 2 years ago and not supporting violent thugs blocking and bashing people that wanted to vote, you familiar with the term consistency???

As for "the majority have been disrespected long enough",   well that would be the junta and their fan club disrespecting the peoples choice on a government now wouldn't it.

[halloween]

On 10/08/2016 at 11:46 AM, gk10002000 said:

I was told that people had to go the actual village or city where they live or are registered in order to vote.  That means that millions of Thais that work away from home, say the Isaan girls that work in Bangkok or Pattaya or elsewhere would have to had travel back home to vote.  That wasn't going to happen

It wasn't necessary to go home to vote. All you had to do was register as an absentee voter over a 2(?) month period. Very few bothered.

If the isaan girls wanted to vote, registration was not difficult. The fact is they couldn't give a <deleted>, they only sell them.

[metisdead]

A post containing content and a link to Bangkok Post has been removed:

 

26) The Bangkok Post and Phuketwan do not allow quotes from their news articles or other material to appear on Thaivisa.com. Neither do they allow links to their publications. Posts from members containing quotes from or links to Bangkok Post or Phuketwan publications will be deleted from the forum.
 

An off topic post has been removed as well. 

[than]

11 hours ago, heybruce said:

Yes, this ANFREL:

 

"Mr. Damaso Magbual, ANFREL’s Head of Mission, agreed when he said that  “The  election  period,  in  particular  Election Day  on  July  3rd,  was managed    well    and  without  any  major  incident  which  would  call  into  question  the  election’s  results. " http://anfrel.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/ThaiEOMReport_Edit_4-final_edit.pdf  

 

Page 150 of a long report full of recommendations that the referendum ignored to the point of doing the opposite.

 

 

Vote Buying and violence page 53, not chance I read it 

[heybruce]

1 hour ago, than said:

 

Vote Buying and violence page 53, not chance I read it 

I see, you reject the results of any election that was not perfect, even if the flaws were not of a magnitude to change the results.

 

In that case I assume you reject the results of this referendum.  The flaws--no free discussion, no independent monitors, no meaningful choice--are obvious and major. 

 

Had the election simply given the people a choice of constitutions the results would have been very different.  Unfortunately the referendum gave people a choice of continued military rule with the constitution on offer, or continued military rule with a constitution to be chosen by the military.

[than]

8 hours ago, heybruce said:

I see, you reject the results of any election that was not perfect, even if the flaws were not of a magnitude to change the results.

 

In that case I assume you reject the results of this referendum.  The flaws--no free discussion, no independent monitors, no meaningful choice--are obvious and major. 

 

Had the election simply given the people a choice of constitutions the results would have been very different.  Unfortunately the referendum gave people a choice of continued military rule with the constitution on offer, or continued military rule with a constitution to be chosen by the military.

Like in all democratic country, in Austria election for President of Austria has been invalidated because of irregularities.

In France, these last years the election of some politicians have been validated for electoral fraud (another name for vote buying)

[heybruce]

1 hour ago, than said:

Like in all democratic country, in Austria election for President of Austria has been invalidated because of irregularities.

In France, these last years the election of some politicians have been validated for electoral fraud (another name for vote buying)

Like in all democratic countries, if election irregularities don't reach a level such that they might have affected the results, the results stand.

 

Have all elections in Austria other than the one you mentioned been absolutely perfect?

 

[joeyg]

According to ancient sanskrit texts this is where we're at.  Anything sound familiar?

Prophesied events during a Kali Yuga[edit]

A discourse by Markandeya in the Mahabharata identifies some of the attributes of Kali Yuga. In relation to rulers, it lists:

• Rulers will become unreasonable: they will levy taxes unfairly.
• Rulers will no longer see it as their duty to promote spirituality, or to protect their subjects: they will become a danger to the world.
• People will start migrating, seeking countries where wheat and barley form the staple food source.
• "At the end of Kali-yuga, when there exist no topics on the subject of God, even at the residences of so-called saints and respectable gentlemen of the three higher varnas [guna or temperament] and when nothing is known of the techniques of sacrifice, even by word, at that time the Lord will appear as the supreme chastiser." (Srimad-Bhagavatam (2.7)

With regard to human relationships, Markandeya's discourse says:

• Avarice and wrath will be common. Humans will openly display animosity towards each other. Ignorance of dharma will occur.
• People will have thoughts of murder with no justification and will see nothing wrong in that.
• Lust will be viewed as socially acceptable and sexual intercourse will be seen as the central requirement of life.
• Sin will increase exponentially, while virtue will fade and cease to flourish.
• People will take vows and break them soon after.
• People will become addicted to intoxicating drinks and drugs.
• Gurus will no longer be respected and their students will attempt to injure them. Their teachings will be insulted, and followers of Kama will wrest control of the mind from all human beings.
• Brahmans will not be learned or honored, Kshatriyas will not be brave, Vaishyas will not be just in their dealings.
• https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kali_Yuga

[than]

12 hours ago, heybruce said:

Like in all democratic countries, if election irregularities don't reach a level such that they might have affected the results, the results stand.

 

Have all elections in Austria other than the one you mentioned been absolutely perfect?

 

When is not perfect all candidates wronged can attack the result in court and court can invalidated election. In some country not need constitutional court only administrative court.

[heybruce]

1 hour ago, than said:

When is not perfect all candidates wronged can attack the result in court and court can invalidated election. In some country not need constitutional court only administrative court.

Reasonable.  After the 2011 election Abhisit accepted the results and took responsibility for the Democrats embarrassing results.  He did not go to court alleging election frauds. 

 

It seems that ANFREL was correct in declaring the election results legitimate.

Edited August 13, 2016 by heybruce
grammar correction

[than]

42 minutes ago, heybruce said:

Reasonable.  After the 2011 election Abhisit accepted the results and took responsibility for the Democrats embarrassing results.  He did not go to court alleging election frauds. 

 

It seems that ANFREL was correct in declaring the election results legitimate.

 

ANFREL was correct but it reveal some irregularity in some province and violence too read page 53

 

Quote

Five red cards were expected during balloting in Sukhothai Province, Chaiyaphum Province, Maha Sarakham Province, Sisaket Province and Buriram Province in reference to campaign fraud. There have been allegations of massive electoral fraud against third-place finisher Bhumjaithai Party that could potentially lead to the party dissolution by the Constitutional Court[59]

On 21 July, the Election Commission ordered the re-elections to be held in Sukhothai province and Nong Khai Province. It also ordered a recount in Yala Province.

 

Edited August 13, 2016 by than
supplement information

[DrTuner]

[tifino]

 

they cannot expect foreign govts to respect the thai

 

if the thai do not respect the foreign govt's peoples

 

titt for TAT