Hate speech trial of far-right politician Wilders will go ahead

[Saradoc1972]

Quote

 

Accused of discrimination and inciting racism for the remarks, televised live in 2014, he will now face trial at the end of the month.

[...]

The far-right politician’s next trial comes as his Freedom Party is neck and neck with Prime Minister Mark Rutte’s ruling conservative VVD Party in opinion polls. The next general election in the Netherlands is due in March.

 

 

Has anyone noted how long it takes for proceedings to get going for divisive politicians and their alleged speech crimes? Always as long as possible, with the climax in due time for the next elections, or so it seems.

 

Or can anyone tell me what's two-years hold-up when a speech was televised? Need to ask witnesses to make sure he said what he said?

 

Same in Germany. Lutz Bachmann, the controversial Dresden Pegida front-man, got indicted for hate-speech having called migrants en-route to Europe scum and whatnot during a public protest in 09/14. Took them until 04/16 to have a trial before an Amtsgericht, the lowest local court, where things normally get resolved within 4 months. 19 months over which the press commenting on Pegida could always bring to mind he was being prosecuted. Press is now full with how he is due for "a new trial" in November. It's called an appeal, but I suppose you can make it sound like new

 

Björn Höcke, MP in Thuringia and chief whip of the AFD faction, got indicted for alleged fraud in 05/15. Indictment got thrown out for being based on purely fictitious allegations, parliament removed his immunity nonetheless one months later, right before the AFD's national party convention. Two more AFD MPs in Thuringia had their immunity removed at the time, one for alleged insult. Big coincidence. BTW they are publicly debating how to keep him from ever taking back his job as a teacher, and if maybe he could be disciplined as a civil servant for the perfectly legal political  views he stated for the AFD.

 

Dr. Frauke Petry, AFD chairwoman, has been indicted for alleged perjury supposedly committed 11/2015 as late as 05/16, haven't heard nothing of it as yet. Difficult case, but I would have supposed a whole squad of state's attorneys could.... ?

 

Dubravko Mandic, atty and chair of the AFD's ombuds... whatever, had his practice and flat raided *one year* after he posted a picture of the 1946 Nuremberg trial on Facebook that had been retouched with the face of Merkel, Gauck and several Green Party figureheads. A full raid for libel, yes? Go and try reporting s.o. for insult to German police, like as a normal citizen. Takes two weeks for them to write back they're not interested, prosecute privately, if you can. "Evaluation" of this case will definitely take until the next general elections September 2017. I am betting the farm on it.

 

So the PC crowd is using the legal system as a weapon against newcomers, Germany and Netherlands alike. I hope it backfires and am looking forward to seeing these mainstream parties' figureheads' faces when these new parties take power and civil servants, police and judges loyal to the country roll up their sleeves.

 

[F4UCorsair]

1 hour ago, elgordo38 said:

This is a typical way of trying to silence tine opposition. As stated in t he article they have an election coming up in March and this guy is runnning neck and neck with the ruling party. Great way to discredit him or eliminate him. I think this will backfire. If he wins its goodbye EU

 

I think these latest charges have just abour guaranteed his party a win In March.  I hope so, and the diminoes may start to fall.

 

Unable to edit typos.

Edited October 15, 2016 by F4UCorsair

[JulesMad]

5 hours ago, BrainLife said:

It is the same nonsense that Trump is getting from the left in the USA. Freedom to speak your mind seems to always hurt muslims.

 

Yes, indeed :-)  Trump and Wilders are the same kind of complete idiots!!!  They also make me very wary of people with the same hair-do..... Extremely suspicious :-)

MY freedom of speech: Shave their hair off and have a contest who looks the most like an ass :-)

[F4UCorsair]

4 minutes ago, JulesMad said:

 

Wislde, underts only promotes intolerance and injustice! It woinld be awesome if he could be silenced forever!!! He is the travesty, not the justice system (which is definitely not perfect ;-) )

 

And muslims, the very people he Is accused of creating Intolerance against don't do likewise, particularly against Jews, but also against all In their adopted/host countries??

They hate us all, and our cultures , and aren't backward In telling us, but our PC lefties cop It under threat of being branded 'racist'.

 

You must be joking.

[Grouse]

2 hours ago, vogie said:

 

Because the Moroccans make up the majority (spelt right?) of immigrants in Holland I suppose.

 

https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/4271/moroccans-netherlands

 

Seems that Moroccans are the 6th largest racial group in The Netherlands. Less than 3% overall but 9% in Amsterdam. Criminality is the issue with two thirds of young Maroccans having been arrested at least once. Seems they are controlling drugs and trafficking (and Schipol taxis).

 

Majority is spelt correctly IMHO ?

Edited October 15, 2016 by Grouse

[Grouse]

53 minutes ago, arend said:

I'm American, father Dutch, mother Spanish-Indian. Lived in Netherlands with my cousin outside Amsterdam. Neighbor was one of these haters who harrassed us by tossing dog shit in our yard, giving us the finger when we went out etc. I grew up in the deep South in the waning days of segregation outside New Orleans. Neighbor was the Grand (whatever) of the KKK in the Parish I lived in. I pushed burning KKK crosses over as high school mischief. The hate was intense like a Trump rally which has brought back memories of those days. Some teachers tried to conduct class discussions of the issues but soon the class would erupt into total chaos. But, I was not personally targeted like in Netherlands probably because of father's blond looks and our Dutch last name. Even my father, a basic NeoColonialist who fought  as a Marine in Indonesia succumbed to the endemic racism. All that hate and rage I knew could not be legislated away or reasoned with. It would just go underground to surface again when it had a chance. Trump's White supremacy movement is just that chance as the corollary is the anti immigration movement in Europe. It is a fever and fall into insanity utterly beyond reason that is sweeping the planet. It's most nefarious forms can even be found right here on TV where commentors rail against stereotyped groups and calmly and rationally justify Duterte's genocidal murder of drug users without due process where just the accusation can get you killed. It reminds me of those Nazis who calmly explained the need for a "Final solution" that the gas chambers provided in a perfectly reasoned argument. I guess my point is simply that we are facing a great danger if we allow this fevered hatred to gain ground. Make no mistake, this is about white supremacy. Nipping it in the bud by taking to task the inciters is a start. Because Europeans know where this slippery slope leads, they are more invested in stopping it....

 

Thanks for the interesting post.

 

Personally, I don't think it's white supremacism. More that we have way too many Muslims who just won't integrate properly.

[Grouse]

Just to underline the point....

 

I am anti Muslim and all their mores. Way too many in Europe already

 

BUT, I fully support the moral obligation to provide TEMPORARY refuge to GENUINE REFUGEES.

 

I think Wilders is to the right of me but is tolerable. AfD is slightly too far right for me. Bit of a neo-NAZI aroma you see.

[brianinbangkok]

11 hours ago, JulesMad said:

 

Wilders only promotes intolerance and injustice! It would be awesome if he could be silenced forever!!! He is the travesty, not the justice system (which is definitely not perfect ;-) )

 

"Silenced forever" you mean murdered like Dutch Politician Pim Fortuyn???

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pim_Fortuyn

After Left wing PC politicians branded him as "far right" because he did not agree with them.  Or what about PvdA PC politicians saying pretty much the same as Wilders and not being put on trial for it ?

http://www.rtlnieuws.nl/nieuws/politiek/pvdaers-samsom-en-spekman-niet-vervolgd-om-marokkanen-uitspraken

Free speech is lost in Europe thanks to PC politicians refusing to stand up for this basic right.

Wilders will never form a government due fact PVV is a one man party.  Often its not what he says but how he says things that upset people.  He is not suitable to lead a government.  Still he has the right to free speech agree with him or not.

[stevenl]

4 hours ago, RickBradford said:

What the PC brigade don't get, and luckily never will, is that using these heavy-handed methods to try to force people to follow Right Thought simply causes a backlash.

 

The powers-that-were in the UK launched a ferocious assault against Brexit prior to the referendum (including a £9 million leaflet campaign, scare stories from Obama etc) and they got shafted.

 

The next Dutch election is in Wilders' pocket; he could win it from behind bars, if he had to, for saying something that anyone outside the kumbaya PC bubble regards as common sense.

 

The people have had enough of being sold out by the political establishment.

"What the PC brigade don't get, and luckily never will, is that using these heavy-handed methods to try to force people to follow Right Thought simply causes a backlash."

What you and many others don't get is that following the law is required. Whether he did that I don't know, that is up to the judge.

[stevenl]

9 minutes ago, Grouse said:

Just to underline the point....

 

I am anti Muslim and all their mores. Way too many in Europe already

 

BUT, I fully support the moral obligation to provide TEMPORARY refuge to GENUINE REFUGEES.

 

I think Wilders is to the right of me but is tolerable. AfD is slightly too far right for me. Bit of a neo-NAZI aroma you see.

Wilders is not to the right, only his stance on immigrants is. His other viewpoint regarding social and economical issues are mostly quite to the left.

[elgordo38]

58 minutes ago, Grouse said:

 

Thanks for the interesting post.

 

Personally, I don't think it's white supremacism. More that we have way too many Muslims who just won't integrate properly.

Sorry you got that wrong they want you to integrate into their religion and ways. They seem to have governments on their side running interference. 

[notmyself]

One thing he brought up long ago is why (in NL) religious books that promote hate are given an exemption from the law. Hitler's Mein Kampf is banned because it promotes hate by whatever rules they use and the same rules also ban the Qur'an but it is given an exemption because (only because) it is a religious book. Why?

[Grubster]

I hope they vote their government out over this and publicly shame them into hiding.

[Grubster]

If we had a civil war in my country I would do one of three things, I would fight on one side, I would fight on the other side or I would get in the middle and try to stop it. I would not run like a coward to your country asking you to take care of me.  Close the borders, ship em back or adapt to their way of life, its your choice, or is it.

[RuamRudy]

11 hours ago, Grubster said:

If we had a civil war in my country I would do one of three things, I would fight on one side, I would fight on the other side or I would get in the middle and try to stop it. I would not run like a coward to your country asking you to take care of me.  Close the borders, ship em back or adapt to their way of life, its your choice, or is it.

 

If two superpowers are fighting a proxy war in your country, do you think that your choosing any 1 side would make a difference?

[Grouse]

16 hours ago, Grubster said:

If we had a civil war in my country I would do one of three things, I would fight on one side, I would fight on the other side or I would get in the middle and try to stop it. I would not run like a coward to your country asking you to take care of me.  Close the borders, ship em back or adapt to their way of life, its your choice, or is it.

 

Nah, I'd go to the pub somewhere else. Ever been in Sheffield when there's a local derby?

[F4UCorsair]

You're a simple one grouse, and that's often not a bad thing!!

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, F4UCorsair said:

You're a simple one grouse, and that's often not a bad thing!!

 

That's the nicest thing anyone's ever said about me X

[Grubster]

8 hours ago, RuamRudy said:

 

If two superpowers are fighting a proxy war in your country, do you think that your choosing any 1 side would make a difference?

Sure did in Korea and Vietnam. The only cowards there were the Rich ones in the south of Vietnam. Maybe the Philippines also. 

[RuamRudy]

2 hours ago, Grubster said:

Sure did in Korea and Vietnam. The only cowards there were the Rich ones in the south of Vietnam. Maybe the Philippines also. 

 

There is no doubting the bravery of the Vietcong but the real winners were in Washington and Moscow. Personally, I wouldn't give either of them tuppence ha'penny, let alone risk the lives of my loved ones and myself for another country's ideology.

[Grubster]

18 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

 

There is no doubting the bravery of the Vietcong but the real winners were in Washington and Moscow. Personally, I wouldn't give either of them tuppence ha'penny, let alone risk the lives of my loved ones and myself for another country's ideology.

I wouldn't say that Russia, the US, or China won any prize there. I think the people of Vietnam won. Vietnam doesn't cow down to Russia or China as far as I can tell. Most of the muslim men running from their conflicts leave their families behind. Cowards.

[KKr]

On 10/15/2016 at 10:46 AM, oslooskar said:

 

Pat Condell does a pretty good job of explaining. I hope posting this link is not a violation of this website's rule.

Sounds to me like someone who likes to continue living in his little mind in his little house in a narrow street, and missed that with technology advancing the huge people movements we see now are inevitable. some people consolidating their power and wealth while fighting over fossil fuels, other people displaced by such warring, and many people seeking to advance their well-being. 
The Netherlands has been very tolerant and over the last 70 years is used to live with people from other continents, and with different religions. 
People like LePen and Wilders imho will only make the situation worse by inciting hatred.
His crime is not that he has a different opinion, his crime (if proven) is that he seems to prepare a state where large groups of citizens are set up against each other, and potentially will create a basis for a civil unrest.
No-one did something when in the 1930's certain demagogic powers stood up, let the Dutch do their thing, and stop the ongoing efforts to divide the society, but rather strive for an integration.

[soalbundy]

1 hour ago, KKr said:

Sounds to me like someone who likes to continue living in his little mind in his little house in a narrow street, and missed that with technology advancing the huge people movements we see now are inevitable. some people consolidating their power and wealth while fighting over fossil fuels, other people displaced by such warring, and many people seeking to advance their well-being. 
The Netherlands has been very tolerant and over the last 70 years is used to live with people from other continents, and with different religions. 
People like LePen and Wilders imho will only make the situation worse by inciting hatred.
His crime is not that he has a different opinion, his crime (if proven) is that he seems to prepare a state where large groups of citizens are set up against each other, and potentially will create a basis for a civil unrest.
No-one did something when in the 1930's certain demagogic powers stood up, let the Dutch do their thing, and stop the ongoing efforts to divide the society, but rather strive for an integration.

Muslims don't integrate,they want the society to change to suite them

[brianinbangkok]

The Dutch have been very tolerant in accepting a very intolerant religion into The Netherlands that has not integrated at all over the last 40 years.
They fail to stand up for basic rights of protecting womans rights, gay rights and free speech all in favour of not insulting the muslim immigrants.
The Dutch people are being ignored by the PC politicians and I think thats part of why Wilders gets so many votes.

[stevenl]

1 hour ago, brianinbangkok said:

The Dutch have been very tolerant in accepting a very intolerant religion into The Netherlands that has not integrated at all over the last 40 years.
They fail to stand up for basic rights of protecting womans rights, gay rights and free speech all in favour of not insulting the muslim immigrants.
The Dutch people are being ignored by the PC politicians and I think thats part of why Wilders gets so many votes.

 

Nonsense, a vast, vast majority has integrated.

[Morch]

3 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Nonsense, a vast, vast majority has integrated.

 

How is integration measured?

[brianinbangkok]

Nonsense, a vast, vast majority has integrated.

Integration means accepting Dutch values on gay rights , freedom of speech, womans rights. And so on.

The vast majority of muslims in Netherlands do not do this.

Islam is not compatible with western values.

Its not about race , the Indonesians that arrived in the 50s are 100% integrated.

[stevenl]

2 hours ago, brianinbangkok said:

Integration means accepting Dutch values on gay rights , freedom of speech, womans rights. And so on.

The vast majority of muslims in Netherlands do not do this.

Islam is not compatible with western values.

Its not about race , the Indonesians that arrived in the 50s are 100% integrated.

"Integration means accepting Dutch values on gay rights , freedom of speech, womans rights. And so on.

The vast majority of muslims in Netherlands do not do this."

 

And you base this on what information?

[Morch]

12 minutes ago, stevenl said:

"Integration means accepting Dutch values on gay rights , freedom of speech, womans rights. And so on.

The vast majority of muslims in Netherlands do not do this."

 

And you base this on what information?

 

Perhaps on the same strength of asserting that "... a vast, vast majority has integrated."

At least one of the statements includes an attempt to define integration.

Edited October 23, 2016 by Morch

[Saradoc1972]

12 minutes ago, stevenl said:

"Integration means accepting Dutch values on gay rights , freedom of speech, womans rights. And so on.

The vast majority of muslims in Netherlands do not do this."

 

And you base this on what information?

 

The mayor of Amsterdam has called on Dutch Muslims to emigrate to some country were they could be themselves, if Islam was so important to them, he further claimed street criminality in the Netherlands was firmly in the hands of Moroccans. The town of Emden had to establish curfews specifically for Moroccans (yes, apparently that is possible in enlightened societies), because the little charmers kept on marauding through the streets mugging, assaulting, and torching cars by the dozens. In Amsterdam there are Sharia patrols and Sharia4Holland activists. They fill up the prison system like they do everywhere else, the percentage on welfare is disproportionate.

 

I suppose the bad Dutch didn't give their muzzie-immigrants enough love.

And no, they are not integrated, I start hating that word. They don't integrate, they don't want to. Any concentration of Muslims turns the place into the very hellhole those came from.