For Trump and GOP, 'Obamacare' repeal is complex and risky

[Jingthing]

17 minutes ago, Ulysses G. said:

Actually, I am for universal healthcare and Trump has said he is too. I do not know if he can pull it off, but I am all for it.

You're talking ancient history well before trump was a presidential candidate. He has said nothing of the kind in the campaign. He's for total B.S. right wing republican fake solutions like selling insurance across state lines. Not only can't trump pull off universal, today's trump will not even try. Do you think you're fooling anyone trying to pass him off as someone actually working for that?

[Jingthing]

10 minutes ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

It was promoted with blatant lies to the American people and it is collapsing just like the Republcan said it would. I am hardly the only one to say so.

 

http://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/obamacare-is-failing-exactly-the-way-critics-said-it-would/

Republicans worked hard to make it weaker. Especially the refusal of most republican governors to go along with expanded Medicaid. 

[Ulysses G.]

6 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

If it is collapsing why is enrolment growing? You don't see a contradiction there?

And imagine how it would be doing if Republicans had wanted to address its problems, rather than abolish it.

And I noticed you haven't continued to promote the notion that Trump favors universal healthcare.

 

I said it once. Why would I repeat myself immediately? Again, there are lots of people besides me - on both sides of the aisle - that admit Obamacare is failing.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/editorials/ct-obamacare-fail-health-care-insurance-medicine-0911-jm-20160909-story.html

 

[ilostmypassword]

6 minutes ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

I said it once. Why would I repeat myself immediately? Again, there are lots of people besides me - on both sides of the aisle - that admit Obamacare is failing.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/editorials/ct-obamacare-fail-health-care-insurance-medicine-0911-jm-20160909-story.html

 

No,  they don't "admit" Obamacare is failing. They claim it. And they don't acknowledge that any attempts to fix its problems were killed by Republicans. And they still can't seem to admit that its still growing. And apparently, neither can you.

[Ulysses G.]

10 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

You're talking ancient history well before trump was a presidential candidate. 

 

Nonsense. He has commented on this numerous times while campaigning.

 

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/donald-trump-60-minutes-scott-pelley/

 

 

https://www.statnews.com/2016/02/05/trump-cruz-universal-health-care/

 

[Jingthing]

Oh, you mean trump's "Something Fantastic" plan. Wanna buy a bridge?

He's a con man. 

[ilostmypassword]

7 minutes ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

Nonsense. He has commented on this numerous times while campaigning.

 

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/donald-trump-60-minutes-scott-pelley/

 

 

https://www.statnews.com/2016/02/05/trump-cruz-universal-health-care/

 

Here's the heart of Trump's so called universal health care plan in his own words from the CBS interview

"Donald Trump: --the government's gonna pay for it. But we're going to save so much money on the other side. But for the most it's going to be a private plan and people are going to be able to go out and negotiate great plans with lots of different competition with lots of competitors with great companies and they can have their doctors, they can have plans, they can have everything."

They even get a pony. What an utter piece of nonsense this so-called plan is. And it seems to have completely disappeared from view.  Do you think Tom Price is going to bat for it?

[Ulysses G.]

7 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Oh, you mean trump's "Something Fantastic" plan. Wanna buy a bridge?

He's a con man. 

 

We already bought one from the last president. 

 

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2013/dec/12/lie-year-if-you-like-your-health-care-plan-keep-it/

[ilostmypassword]

1 minute ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

We already bought one from the last president. 

 

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2013/dec/12/lie-year-if-you-like-your-health-care-plan-keep-it/

Except, of course, his plan actually worked.  The number of Americans without health insurance is at the lowest level ever recorded.  And the number of enrollments is still increasing.

[Ulysses G.]

2 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

Except, of course, his plan actually worked.  The number of Americans without health insurance is at the lowest level ever recorded.  And the number of enrollments is still increasing.

 

Actually, as pointed out numerous times - with plenty of evidence - it is failing.

 

http://www.cnbc.com/2016/08/16/obamacare-is-failing-but-there-is-one-way-to-fix-it-commentary.html

[ilostmypassword]

17 minutes ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

Actually, as pointed out numerous times - with plenty of evidence - it is failing.

 

http://www.cnbc.com/2016/08/16/obamacare-is-failing-but-there-is-one-way-to-fix-it-commentary.html

You just can't acknowledge that enrollments are increasing, can you?  

[ilostmypassword]

22 minutes ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

Actually, as pointed out numerous times - with plenty of evidence - it is failing.

 

http://www.cnbc.com/2016/08/16/obamacare-is-failing-but-there-is-one-way-to-fix-it-commentary.html

But if you want a commentary from someone who knows the details intimately, here it is:

http://www.latimes.com/business/hiltzik/la-fi-hiltzik-obamacare-rates-20161031-story.html

It shows that states that oppose Obamacare tend to have higher rates than states that don't.

Edited December 25, 2016 by ilostmypassword

[Ulysses G.]

30 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

You just can't acknowledge that enrollments are increasing, can you?  

 

Not enough. Spin away. It is failing.

 

 

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/439493/obamacare-failing-insurance-companies-pull-back-marketplaces-become-monopolies

 

[Langsuan Man]

8 years and all we have heard from the Republicans is, repeal, repeal, repeal, ad nauseum. Yet not one viable replacement plan has been presented by Trump or the Republicans for that matter

The only people that are against the Affordable Care Act are those that already have health insurance and are afraid that they might have to pay a few pennies more, just for it to be affordable to others

Has had such a major impact on Emergency Room visits that hospitals are now advertising their "wait" times because more people have insurance and no longer need to crowd the ER's.

Think about that when you whine; if you are in an accident you might just survive because the ER was not full of the uninsured patients


Sent from my Nexus 5X using Thaivisa Connect mobile app

[Jingthing]

Yet another trump SCAM in the works. trump voters that need Obamacare fooled by his vague campaign message. Now the reality comes.

 

This writer is more generous to those fooled by trump than I am, bless his heart.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/plum-line/wp/2016/12/27/these-coal-country-voters-backed-trump-now-theyre-worried-about-losing-obamacare/?hpid=hp_no-name_opinion-card-d%3Ahomepage%2Fstory&utm_term=.bd1c576bd32f

 

Quote

 

These coal country voters backed Trump. Now they’re worried about losing Obamacare.

And so, if many Trump voters didn’t really believe they’d lose protections under President Trump, this was not a crazy calculation to make. Now, Trump and congressional Republicans may indeed end up rolling back protections for millions who voted for him. But if that happens, and these voters do end up feeling betrayed by Trump, they will be right to feel that way — they will, in fact, have been scammed by Trump.

...

Perhaps, like other scam victims, they should have looked more closely at the fine print. But the broad conclusion they reached was a perfectly reasonable one.

 

 

[Ulysses G.]

12 hours ago, Langsuan Man said:

The only people that are against the Affordable Care Act are those that already have health insurance and are afraid that they might have to pay a few pennies more, just for it to be affordable to others

 

 

 

Only it is not a "few pennies more".

 

I am getting coverage for me and my family (I have a 4 year old son my wife works part time). The premium is similar to what I paid in the past (a little higher but not by much). but the deductibles make all the plans just unaffordable. Not with taking into account dental expenses and medical expenses.

I cant afford my health plan because of the deductible. I already gave up on looking for a doctor or treatment for my chronic conditions. trying to save money for when my son is sick. I did not take my son to his doctor for regular check ups. I know that I cant afford thees deductibles. I am afraid of what will happen to my health since I am not going to the doctor and what will happen to my sons health.

http://obamacarefacts.com/questions/high-deductible-plan-too-expensive/

[Berkshire]

1 hour ago, Jingthing said:

Yet another trump SCAM in the works. trump voters that need Obamacare fooled by his vague campaign message. Now the reality comes.

 

This writer is more generous to those fooled by trump than I am, bless his heart.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/plum-line/wp/2016/12/27/these-coal-country-voters-backed-trump-now-theyre-worried-about-losing-obamacare/?hpid=hp_no-name_opinion-card-d%3Ahomepage%2Fstory&utm_term=.bd1c576bd32f

 

 

 

I saw that article and as I was reading, I was thinking of the Thai term "som num na."  It was pretty obvious from the beginning that many Trump supporters would be voting against their own self-interest.  Well now the chickens are coming home to roost. 

[ilostmypassword]

2 hours ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

 

Only it is not a "few pennies more".

 

I am getting coverage for me and my family (I have a 4 year old son my wife works part time). The premium is similar to what I paid in the past (a little higher but not by much). but the deductibles make all the plans just unaffordable. Not with taking into account dental expenses and medical expenses.

I cant afford my health plan because of the deductible. I already gave up on looking for a doctor or treatment for my chronic conditions. trying to save money for when my son is sick. I did not take my son to his doctor for regular check ups. I know that I cant afford thees deductibles. I am afraid of what will happen to my health since I am not going to the doctor and what will happen to my sons health.

http://obamacarefacts.com/questions/high-deductible-plan-too-expensive/

Hey, great selective quoting there.  You conveniently "forgot" to include the first line where the write says

" I have job based coverage. My workplace offered three plans bronze silver and gold"

 

In other words, the writer is not getting Obamacare. He's getting insurance from where he works! Maybe you want to do some research into the increasing amount of deductibles that employers are putting into their health insurance plans? And making insurance useless for their workers?

[Jingthing]

Trashing Obamacare as the trump has promised. Not so painless!

Quote

 

Obamacare

Even if you’re not the sort to worry that if Republians succeed in repealing the Affordable Care Act, millions will lose their health insurance, you should at least recognize how the plan will impact your own budget. 

 

http://www.slate.com/articles/business/the_bills/2016/12/_5_ways_many_americans_finances_will_take_a_hit_under_trump.html

[Ulysses G.]

17 hours ago, ilostmypassword said:

Hey, great selective quoting there.  You conveniently "forgot" to include the first line where the write says

" I have job based coverage. My workplace offered three plans bronze silver and gold"

 

In other words, the writer is not getting Obamacare. He's getting insurance from where he works! Maybe you want to do some research into the increasing amount of deductibles that employers are putting into their health insurance plans? And making insurance useless for their workers?

 

There is a reason the website is called Obamacare Facts. Read the whole thing:

 

I am not a political person and I voted democratic and I am for the health plan changes. But I cant afford anything anymore. the next time I see a doctor will probably be in the emergency room. Who can I turn too?

http://obamacarefacts.com/questions/high-deductible-plan-too-expensive/

[ilostmypassword]

7 hours ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

There is a reason the website is called Obamacare Facts. Read the whole thing:

 

I am not a political person and I voted democratic and I am for the health plan changes. But I cant afford anything anymore. the next time I see a doctor will probably be in the emergency room. Who can I turn too?

http://obamacarefacts.com/questions/high-deductible-plan-too-expensive/

You still don't get it? The person who wrote this is not getting Obamacare. He's being covered by his employer.  Are you saying it's Obamacare's fault that the insurance provided by his employer is inadequate?  Or that it's Obamacare's fault because this person voted democratic?  Confused much?

[Jingthing]

So it begins.

 

Quote

 

The first bill Republicans introduced in the new Senate that began on Tuesday was budget legislation with instructions for House and Senate committees to begin repealing the Affordable Care Act. The bare-bones spending outline gives members of four committees — Ways and Means and Energy and Commerce in the House; and Finance and Health, Education, Labor and Pensions in the Senate — until Jan. 27 to produce bills that each would save $1 billion over a decade by slashing elements of the heath-care law.

 

 

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/powerpost/obama-to-huddle-with-democrats-on-protecting-his-signature-health-care-law/2017/01/04/34b655e8-d1f9-11e6-945a-76f69a399dd5_story.html

 

Expect it to be messy.

https://twitter.com/hashtag/MakeAmericaSickAgain

 

 

Edited January 4, 2017 by Jingthing

[beechguy]

On ‎12‎/‎27‎/‎2016 at 8:15 PM, ilostmypassword said:

Hey, great selective quoting there.  You conveniently "forgot" to include the first line where the write says

" I have job based coverage. My workplace offered three plans bronze silver and gold"

 

In other words, the writer is not getting Obamacare. He's getting insurance from where he works! Maybe you want to do some research into the increasing amount of deductibles that employers are putting into their health insurance plans? And making insurance useless for their workers?

 

His problems are being produced by Obamacare. I checked on other coverage, the premiums were higher, and the deductible would be $6,500 dollars annually, I don't call that affordable.

Some people want focus on Trump as a con man, but the real dishonesty was from Obama, "you can keep your coverage, doctor, etc."  and Pelosi's "affordable" statement, and incompetence that 'they would have to pass it, to know what's in it".

 

Again, the liberal left will push forward the propaganda, that this is a war on the poor. The real war on the poor, is the broken system the Democrats refused to fix. Just look at the inner city issues, Detroit, Baltimore, etc, and the violence in Chicago, 762 killed in 2016.

[Jingthing]

As flawed as Obamacare has been, which was worsened by republican antics such as not expanding Medicaid in many states, it is still MUCH BETTER than the status quo pre-Obamacare. 

[beechguy]

2 hours ago, Jingthing said:

As flawed as Obamacare has been, which was worsened by republican antics such as not expanding Medicaid in many states, it is still MUCH BETTER than the status quo pre-Obamacare. 

It was worsened by the outright lies of Obama, Reid, and Polesi, never mind the incompetence of the plan they forced down the throats of the American people. I don't disagree that something needs to be done, just put something together that works.

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, beechguy said:

It was worsened by the outright lies of Obama, Reid, and Polesi, never mind the incompetence of the plan they forced down the throats of the American people. I don't disagree that something needs to be done, just put something together that works.

All the republicans have now is their promise to trash it all, and "fix" it later. Not nearly good enough. 

[beechguy]

1 hour ago, Jingthing said:

All the republicans have now is their promise to trash it all, and "fix" it later. Not nearly good enough. 

 

And as usual, you are ignoring the reality. Press conference today, Speaker Ryan says they will take steps to phase people into the new system. Granny isn't going to get dumped off the cliff, no matter the lies Schumer and Pelosi are trying to spread.

[ilostmypassword]

12 minutes ago, beechguy said:

 

And as usual, you are ignoring the reality. Press conference today, Speaker Ryan says they will take steps to phase people into the new system. Granny isn't going to get dumped off the cliff, no matter the lies Schumer and Pelosi are trying to spread.

And as usual with the critics here, you know nothing really about the plan and why it is the way it is, and how it works. You haven't a clue about the massive amount of subsidies available to working class and middle class people. Not a notion of how it's bent down the cost of healthcare.  Or that fact that the percentage of uninsured Americans is at an all time low.  Oh, but we should be reassured that "Speaker Ryan says they will take steps to phase people into the new system"?  Really,  Are you aware that this is the same speaker Ryan who wants to privatize medicare and cut benefits to that "granny" you just cited?  I bet you don't have a clue about that, either. But not to worry. It's not like Tom Price, the incoming HUD Secretary thinks that privatizing Medicare is a good idea.  He thinks it's a great idea. This is the same Tom Price whose main concern about the healthcare system has been to protect and increase doctors' incomes.

And the Republicans have had 6 years to come up with a plan. And you seem to approve of a so called plan that can be summed up in 2 words:  Trust us. How naive can someone be? In your case, the qualifying advert would be "extremely."

Edited January 4, 2017 by ilostmypassword

[beechguy]

1 minute ago, ilostmypassword said:

And as usual with the critics here, you know nothing really about the plan and why it is the way it is, and how it works. You haven't a clue about the massive amount of subsidies available to working class and middle class people. Not a notion of how it's bent down the cost of healthcare.  Or that fact that the percentage of uninsured Americans is at an all time low.  Oh, but we should be reassured that "Speaker Ryan says they will take steps to phase people into the new system"?  Really,  Are you aware that this is the same speaker Ryan who wants to privatize medicare and cut benefits to that "granny" you just cited?  I bet you don't have a clue about that, either. But not to worry. It's not like Tom Price, the incoming HUD Secretary thinks that privatizing Medicare is a good idea.  He thinks it's a great idea. This is the same Tom Price whose main concern about the healthcare system has been to protect and increase doctors' incomes.

 

I'm in aviation, but working with an air ambulance company. We see the effects first hand, and I see it as a consumer, I'm middle class, I assure you, no subsidies are available for me. I assure you, my premiums have increased. I assure you, the cost of the care I receive has increased. Come back when you have a clue. At this point, I will just assume you are ignorant, rather than a liar.

[ilostmypassword]

1 minute ago, beechguy said:

 

I'm in aviation, but working with an air ambulance company. We see the effects first hand, and I see it as a consumer, I'm middle class, I assure you, no subsidies are available for me. I assure you, my premiums have increased. I assure you, the cost of the care I receive has increased. Come back when you have a clue. At this point, I will just assume you are ignorant, rather than a liar.

So, you're working with a company that doesn't provide you with insurance? If your rates have risen, that's probably because you make enough money to put you out of the subsidy range. And ifyou had a preexisting condition?  How would you get coverage? But your kind of argument, is, of course, nonsense. Arguing from your own individual case about a system that covers millions and millions is ridiculous and just a pretext to bloviate. Moreover, how do you know what your premiums would be if there were no Obamacare?  Do you think that would have stayed the same over the past several years?

And of course, I'd like to look up the particulars of your case but I can't. And you know why that is?  Because your're anonymous and your data is inaccessible. Arguing from the alleged facts of your case is just plain laziness.