Aboriginal woman's slaying exposes Australia's racial divide

[ilostmypassword]

On 12/17/2016 at 4:25 PM, F4UCorsair said:

Batty's husband was mentally Ill, something she has conveniently forgotten as the agenda has been hijacked by the leftist women's miovement.

 

Check this link.  Sorry can't padste the link, nut google 'bettina arndt domestic violence In Australia'.

 

She's reviewed 1700 papers on the subject, and a few mistruths are exposed 

 

I saw her recently on TV, very I Impressive.  She's a psychologist and one of the original women's rights campaigners, but has seen the hypocrisy of the women's movement, e.g., It Is silent on the abuse of muslim women, not a whimper about the oppressive burqa, but advocate things like a man saying his wife Is fat, or criticizing the housework, as being domestic violence.

 

Unable to edit typos and capital 'I' (eye).

 

 

Looked up Bettina Arndt. Here's a link to an article she wrote claiming 1 out of 3 victims of domestic violence is the husband. Lots of other dubious assertions with no hard evidence provided.

http://www.bettinaarndt.com.au/news/2479/

On the other hand it seems she is a plagiarist:

In 2007, the Australian television programme Media Watch aired allegations of plagiarism[4] by Arndt, allegations that were not disputed.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bettina_Arndt

[Tawan Dok Krating Daeng]

2 hours ago, F4UCorsair said:

 

Mansplaining??

 

I don't have a wife, but when I did she wasn't beaten you offensive leftist jerk.

 

Now we see the underbelly of the selfish, sanctimonious and self satisfied Right Wing. Every day thinking who can we exploit today. Talk down to those who believe in social justice as a matter of course.

 

Right back at ya Bud.

[Tawan Dok Krating Daeng]

1 hour ago, moose7117 said:

 

what rubbish !

what happened to New Zealand's original inhabitants then ?

the race that pre date the Maori, where did they end up ? or are you too ashamed to say ?

 

The english invaders of New Zealand only signed a treaty after they realised they could not beat the Maori into submission.

You Pakeha's like to twist the truth.

 

Australia is a mess as far as the aboriginals are concerned, with both sides being to blame !

it is too bloody late to fix the divide now as neither party will try and the government is not interested in resolving the problem..

 

Moose

 

 

 

Who are these indigenous beings who predated the Maori? Hobbits and Elves perhaps? Seekers of the Dark Lord of Mordor?

 

You may want to check your history before attempting to slam another poster.

 

The Polynesians settled New Zealand s the first inhabitants of this and many other Pacific Islands.

 

As neolithic navigators the Polynesians had no compeers. They traversed and explored a vast oceanic region; they wandered half a world away from their original homeland, and here, at the edge of the world, they abide, conservative and disdainful as of yore, to await the end.

http://nzetc.victoria.ac.nz/tm/scholarly/tei-BesMaor-c2-2.html

 

The British colonials in New Zealand negotiated a Treaty. The British colonials in Australia invented a legal fiction known as Terra Nulius, from the Ancient Roman legal tradition of 'Nobody's Land' that denied the existence of the Aboriginal people to allow them to disenfranchise them of land and human existence.

http://www.racismnoway.com.au/teaching-resources/factsheets/10.html

 

There are quite obvious consequences for modern Australian society as a result.

Edited January 3, 2017 by Tawan Dok Krating Daeng

[A1Str8]

Now no offense but I have always wondered why don't the useless insects who do such things to other people just do it to themselves? I mean the world needs women but doesn't really need the aforementioned b!tc@es. 

Not to mention that dead girl, may she rest in peace is worth more than the prosecutors who refused to do something. 

[Alan Deer]

1 hour ago, moose7117 said:

 

what rubbish !

what happened to New Zealand's original inhabitants then ?

the race that pre date the Maori, where did they end up ? or are you too ashamed to say ?

 

The english invaders of New Zealand only signed a treaty after they realised they could not beat the Maori into submission.

You Pakeha's like to twist the truth.

 

Australia is a mess as far as the aboriginals are concerned, with both sides being to blame !

it is too bloody late to fix the divide now as neither party will try and the government is not interested in resolving the problem..

 

Moose

 

 

 

 

What an extraordinary comment! Probably some of the most facile statements I’ve ever seen about indigenous peoples and displaying a huge lack of historical knowledge.

 

You have introduced a bit of Nazi-style pseudo-history which says more about yourself than anything to do with this discussion.

 

All occupants of countries are “migrants” including the Australian aboriginals - but that to any normal person what obviously not be the point - the point is that once they had discovered Australia the Europeans set about destroying the pre-existing inhabitants - whether or not other peoples did that is pre-history elsewhere is quite simply ia red-herring - it is no mitigation or justification for the Europeans campaign of genocide in Australia .....it’s not even relevant - but apparently you fail to comprehend that

 

(BTW - as you well know there has been strong questioning as to the motivation of “pre-Maori” settlement theorists, as it appears to have a large helping of white supremacist content and very little evidence - so we know where you are coming from! - and furthermore, not one of those theories has ever passed any remote academic)

 

As for Australia - there was a totally different approach to that used with the New Zealand inhabitants - Within a short time of arriving in Australia,  the British did something they had not done anywhere else - they invoked the European International law of “Terra Nullius” over the entire landmass of Australia completely denying the existence of several thousand people - (one thing we can be pretty sure of is that  the Maoris did not do that to any alleged previous inhabitants of NZ).

 

And then you seem to think there is a “divide” - that is a personal feeling and an erroneous observation - divide is a simplistic attempt to dichotomize the issues to make them more palatable and easier to “understand” for racists.

 

The truth is that Australia as a nation is taking steps to engage the many different indigenous cultures and right the wrongs of the past and although slow there is some steady success - Mabo, national apology, Aboriginal voting /civil rights etc. etc. and they are working within the law - it is only retrogressive reactionaries like yourself who still try to paint a picture of hopelessly irreconcilable positions to perpetuate a position that leaves you and your ilk out in the cold and out of step with your own society.... Your position is bolstered by your ignorance and fear of something that it is fairly obvious you don’t understand.

 

This fear has driven European settlers to commit some of the most heinous atrocities against the Australian indigenous population and this carries on today. There are people living in Cairns and North QLD who were involved in the hunting and killing of aboriginals for sport - the idea that they and their families could/will be exposed has driven some people to adopt desperate attitudes against the indigenous populations - they never considered that they would one day be held accountable for their actions - so the tactics are obfuscation, denial and promulgation of false histories..... but they are less and less convincing - only those with something to hide, the ignorant and the gullible swallow their lies these days.

 

[moose7117]

google "moriori" !

 

and then comment on what the Maori's did !

 

and have any of you guys ever been to Australia ?

 

or seen a full blood Australian aboriginal ?

 

i might not be able to use big words like you brainy guys but i know bullcrap when i read it !

[Tawan Dok Krating Daeng]

2 hours ago, moose7117 said:

google "moriori" !

 

and then comment on what the Maori's did !

 

and have any of you guys ever been to Australia ?

 

or seen a full blood Australian aboriginal ?

 

i might not be able to use big words like you brainy guys but i know bullcrap when i read it !

 

The hypothesis that the Moriori predate the Maori has been discredited. They are indigenously Maori and not indigenous to their islands. The Maori Invasion in the 19th Century was part of tribal warfare and does not correlate with the colonization of Australia or New Zealand.

[Kiwiken]

3 hours ago, moose7117 said:

google "moriori" !

 

and then comment on what the Maori's did !

 

and have any of you guys ever been to Australia ?

 

or seen a full blood Australian aboriginal ?

 

i might not be able to use big words like you brainy guys but i know bullcrap when i read it !

The Moriori were hunted, butchered ,killed and eaten by the Maori. The last of them escaped to the Chatham islands only to be killed in a last great massacre. Those I know who still claim Moriori descent have little time for Maori either. And talk of Maori much the same way you talk about non Maori. I gather from your twisted view you are a north islander. i am a Southener and for your info do not label Me or My Kin a pakeha. I may not be as Brown as you but some of my relatives have possible more moku than you

[Flanno]

On ‎12‎/‎17‎/‎2016 at 2:42 PM, Kiwiken said:

I guess since I come from a Multicultural integrated Society yes I can look across the ditch and review your mistakes and Ours. But as a Kiwi I know all too much about racism in Australia . Not 50 years ago not 10 but now!

So Ken could you kindly give some details of racism you have experienced in Australia. For those who may not know New Zealanders can enter Australia without visas and stay for as long as they wish. The only restriction I believe those with serious criminal convictions. Many stay for the rest of their lives and raise their children there. They do not need work visas and can work in whatever fields they are suited to. They buy homes, their kids go to school, they pay taxes and all have the opportunity to become naturalized Australians if they so desire..

So Ken can you please enlighten us as to what sort of racism you have experienced while in Australia? Thanks.

[SaintLouisBlues]

4 minutes ago, Flanno said:

For those who may not know New Zealanders can enter Australia without visas and stay for as long as they wish.

All non-Australian citizens require a visa. New Zealanders have a Special Category Visa which gives them indefinite right to remain: https://www.border.gov.au/about/corporate/information/fact-sheets/17nz

I believe it's called that as they are acknowledged as having Special Needs

[halloween]

7 hours ago, Tawan Dok Krating Daeng said:

 

The hypothesis that the Moriori predate the Maori has been discredited. They are indigenously Maori and not indigenous to their islands. The Maori Invasion in the 19th Century was part of tribal warfare and does not correlate with the colonization of Australia or New Zealand.

So mass murder is OK if they are the same race? Interesting concept..

 

BTW your statement that

'"Arguing the moral equivalency of the British invasion of the Australian continent to other acts of colonization does not provide any justification. Almost all of those acts of colonization have been unwound except in a few places like the Malvinas Islands and Tahiti. "

 

Just how were the colonisations of Canada and the USA 'unwound'?

[SaintLouisBlues]

I've always thought the NZ solution was a white racist's wet dream. What's the least productive part of the modern economy? Small-scale, labor-intensive farming. What do the Maori want? Their "metaphysical connection" to the land ( as I once saw it described in an official publication). Give it to 'em, keep 'em marginalised but happy (they've got what they wanted) while everyone else gets on with making lots of money out of services. What could possibly go wrong? Works in NZ, why wouldn't it work in Australia?

Edited January 4, 2017 by SaintLouisBlues

[SaintLouisBlues]

2 minutes ago, halloween said:

So mass murder is OK if they are the same race? Interesting concept..

I've always assumed Maori vs Moriori was a form of ethnic cleansing. And the extinction of the moa points to the Maori's excellent conservation credentials too

[Scott]

A racist rant has been removed.

[moose7117]

I am actually an Australian, of mixed descent. Irish and indigenous.

After working for a few years as a musterer around Halls creek and working for over 20 years in remote Australia, Kimberly, Pilbara,FNQ etc.and having worked with a "few" Aboriginals, i really have no idea what i am talking about then?  i just ate and shared campsites and worked with them full bloods on a daily basis.

 

It amazes me the crap you read that sprouts from the educated academics that live in their ivory towers and have never lived with or seen first hand the people that they are experts on.

 

come to the Halls Creek rodeo one day, drink in the middle bar , spruik your beliefs and see how long you last.

 

maybe that fellah in the feather boot come looking for you !

 

And i must be a Racist as i am a mixed breed but my wife is full blood Thai, so what are our kids ? 1/4 Paddy, 1/4 Boong and half gook ?

Edited January 4, 2017 by moose7117

[Tawan Dok Krating Daeng]

4 hours ago, halloween said:

So mass murder is OK if they are the same race? Interesting concept..

 

BTW your statement that

'"Arguing the moral equivalency of the British invasion of the Australian continent to other acts of colonization does not provide any justification. Almost all of those acts of colonization have been unwound except in a few places like the Malvinas Islands and Tahiti. "

 

Just how were the colonisations of Canada and the USA 'unwound'?

 

I guess you will have to just tell us whether mass murder is ok within the same race or provide more examples of colonies that have evolved into liberal democracies because I certainly said no such thing. If you make up things and attribute them to others, then I suppose it is easier to try to debunk such things.

 

I do not believe that the 19thC wars by the Maori against the Moriori correlate to the Colonialisation Model as expressed in the first wave of mercantilism by England from the 16th C nor the second wave of imperialistic consquest from the 19thC. There is absolutely nothing in this statement that explicitly or implicitly endorses mass murder.

 

You wish a more extensive analysis of colonialism with references to North and South America? No problem but it would be probably ruled off topic and I do not believe you raise the issue in good faith, merely a weak attempt at attacking my original statement through diversion.

[Tawan Dok Krating Daeng]

22 minutes ago, moose7117 said:

I am actually an Australian, of mixed descent. Irish and indigenous.

After working for a few years as a musterer around Halls creek and working for over 20 years in remote Australia, Kimberly, Pilbara,FNQ etc.and having worked with a "few" Aboriginals, i really have no idea what i am talking about then?  i just ate and shared campsites and worked with them full bloods on a daily basis.

 

It amazes me the crap you read that sprouts from the educated academics that live in their ivory towers and have never lived with or seen first hand the people that they are experts on.

 

come to the Halls Creek rodeo one day, drink in the middle bar , spruik your beliefs and see how long you last.

 

maybe that fellah in the feather boot come looking for you !

 

And i must be a Racist as i am a mixed breed but my wife is full blood Thai, so what are our kids ? 1/4 Paddy, 1/4 Boong and half gook ?

 

Why not share your perspective on the topic instead of just assuming posters who have a tertiary education are not equipped to comment?

 

I do not really remember Halls Creek. It has been 40 years since I was in the Pilbara and Kimberlys but I still remember Turkey Creek and my mother's reaction to the cost of a dozen eggs there. My experience has been mainly in the Anangu Lands with the Pitjantiatiara and homelands in Arnhem Land. I have also worked with various State and Federal Bureaucrats dealing with Aboriginal Affairs, many of them members of the Stolen Generation. I do not claim that such experiences give a better comprehension of the issues but they do provide a perspective which I share. Furthermore, I do not claim this perspective is an answer to the 'problem'. I certainly do believe that there is an answer but it involves an acceptance by many Australians of the consequences of the British invasion and colonization in the 18th Century and the way in which Aboriginal people have been treated from that time to the present.

 

I think pretty much all non indigenous Australians are mixed breeds. Ironic, since racism was such a part of Australian culture. I hope that multiculturalism and a liberal arts based education system is slowing fixing that.

[moose7117]

Turkey creek was renamed Warmun over 20 years ago, and why would you buy there ?

it aint even worth stopping at.

[Alan Deer]

So much of the above is just way off topic - it seems to be a personal "my daddy's a policeman" type school boy contest rather than an educated discussion.

 

I fail to see that the genocide of the Moriori in the 19th C has any true relevance to any argument concerning the Australian woman in the OP...or in anyway mitigates justifies Australian racism........

 

as for posters claims of "indigenous ancestry" - it really is irrelevant to - it is not the messenger that is important it is the message and that is one of rcism - stupidity and ignorance is not the preserve of any one particular population - it is open to all.

Edited January 4, 2017 by Alan Deer

[Alan Deer]

On 1/3/2017 at 10:57 PM, moose7117 said:

google "moriori" !

 

and then comment on what the Maori's did !

 

and have any of you guys ever been to Australia ?

 

or seen a full blood Australian aboriginal ?

 

i might not be able to use big words like you brainy guys but i know bullcrap when i read it !

please - at least point out how you think this mitigates the woman's death - it is certainly not obvious to me.

[Reigntax]

On Saturday, December 17, 2016 at 2:42 PM, Kiwiken said:

I guess since I come from a Multicultural integrated Society yes I can look across the ditch and review your mistakes and Ours. But as a Kiwi I know all too much about racism in Australia . Not 50 years ago not 10 but now!

 

Why, did Australian customs refuse you a visa unlike all the bro's

[soc]

On 17/12/2016 at 4:05 AM, RachaRob said:

Some of the aborigines I have met are racists themselves but some are quite decent people.

Most Aborigines are very decent people until they drink alcohol.

Prior to white settlement/invasion(call it what you like)the Aboriginal people had NO alcohol whatsoever. Their metabolism cannot handle too much of it.

Our ancestors have been drinking alcohol since the Sumerians invented beer.

For their own protection, Aborigines were not allowed to drink alcohol until about 1964 when the UN got into the act & said that the Australian Govt was "racist"(don't the PC do-gooders love labeling anyone who disagrees with them with that word"!)& brought pressure on the Govt to repeal that law.

Now we see what happens.

l know that there are plenty of white idiots who cannot handle alcohol either, but l have never seen/found an Aborigine who can get completely drunk & not become belligerent & violent.

l too, have worked with & along side Aborigines & when sober, are a likable people.

When drunk, l would just make myself scarce.

[soc]

On 17/12/2016 at 6:17 PM, Tawan Dok Krating Daeng said:

 

It has become axiomatic that while the Right is not per se racist, those with racist views find welcome in its embrace.

 

What is the context for such culturally imperialist rubbish? You have money and can buy anything that represents 'advanced' culture like remote controlled helicopters, expensive tread mills and trophy wives? Have you personally contributed to the advancement of the culture that you have appropriated? The culture of Aristotle, Michelangelo, Isaac Newton and others? Or have you just taken from it? I like Western culture. I have tried to contribute to it through my education, my work and my social interactions. I appreciate and support the fundamental liberalism of western culture and seek to promote its advancement.

 

But how does an appreciation of one's own culture grant entitlement to demean and diminish the culture of others?

 

"Nothing they did was sustainable" Nothing except their culture that was sustained for 40,000 or 50,000 years. "No agriculture" Aboriginal culture at the time of the invasion was hunter-gatherer. Perhaps we would have had to wait another 50,000 years for them to develop agriculture (as you define it). We will never know. What we do know is that their culture and way of life was successful for them and their environment. "Rudimentary Structures" Do you have any concept of Aboriginal spirituality? It is an ancient and complex mysticism that has existed for centuries. Well beyond any physical structures built by non Aboriginal societies. "Raped and burnt [sic]" Aboriginal people were so in tune with their environment that they knew much of native Australian flora required fire to reproduce.

 

What else you got?

You are cherrypicking now about "in tune with their environment"

The Aborigines routinely set fire to the bush(to clear the undergrowth & drive out game).

l'm not saying that that practice was wrong for the results, but its hardly conservationist.

When the Aborigines arrived in Australia(yes, Daeng, they are immigrants too!), there were large marsupial animals that no longer exist.

Scientists now believe that these animals were hunted to extinction by, guess who? the incoming "invaders"

lt is thought that the original inhabitants of the mainland were the same people as the Tasmanian Aboriginal, while the successive wave of "invasions" of the mainland Aboriginal people today came from lndia.

A completely different race/type of people altogether.

They killed off or assimilated the locals.

White Europeans are not even the last invasion.

There is more to come.

Like it?

[soc]

23 hours ago, moose7117 said:

I am actually an Australian, of mixed descent. Irish and indigenous.

After working for a few years as a musterer around Halls creek and working for over 20 years in remote Australia, Kimberly, Pilbara,FNQ etc.and having worked with a "few" Aboriginals, i really have no idea what i am talking about then?  i just ate and shared campsites and worked with them full bloods on a daily basis.

 

It amazes me the crap you read that sprouts from the educated academics that live in their ivory towers and have never lived with or seen first hand the people that they are experts on.

 

come to the Halls Creek rodeo one day, drink in the middle bar , spruik your beliefs and see how long you last.

 

maybe that fellah in the feather boot come looking for you !

 

And i must be a Racist as i am a mixed breed but my wife is full blood Thai, so what are our kids ? 1/4 Paddy, 1/4 Boong and half gook ?

l'll bet your children are good looking.

l'm British & Russian & my (ex)wife is Spanish, Chinese,Filipino & American & our 4 children are quite handsome(even if l do say so, myself! lol!)

One of my daughters is a model.

[moose7117]

27 minutes ago, soc said:

l'll bet your children are good looking.

l'm British & Russian & my (ex)wife is Spanish, Chinese,Filipino & American & our 4 children are quite handsome(even if l do say so, myself! lol!)

One of my daughters is a model.

 

Teres no way i am gunna post photos , thats for sure.

 

and the boy is described as "lore" by the ladies and a complete waste of time by me !

[Tawan Dok Krating Daeng]

5 hours ago, soc said:

You are cherrypicking now about "in tune with their environment"

The Aborigines routinely set fire to the bush(to clear the undergrowth & drive out game).

l'm not saying that that practice was wrong for the results, but its hardly conservationist.

When the Aborigines arrived in Australia(yes, Daeng, they are immigrants too!), there were large marsupial animals that no longer exist.

Scientists now believe that these animals were hunted to extinction by, guess who? the incoming "invaders"

lt is thought that the original inhabitants of the mainland were the same people as the Tasmanian Aboriginal, while the successive wave of "invasions" of the mainland Aboriginal people today came from lndia.

A completely different race/type of people altogether.

They killed off or assimilated the locals.

White Europeans are not even the last invasion.

There is more to come.

Like it?

 

This is an ideologically tainted representation of some aspects of Aboriginal culture and the pre-history of Australia. It would appear that some issues are raised merely to attempt to diminish the Aboriginal culture. While somewhat more precise than the general anti-Aboriginal slurs to which I was responding, the politicization of aspects of Aboriginal culture and history has the same effect. It would seem that that is the intention of this post reinforced by using statements as fact with no citations or acknowledgement of the ideologically based dissension about many of these issues.

 

Representing Aboriginal people as immigrants has but one purpose, to attempt to de-legitimize their culture and ties to their land. Accusations that they were responsible for the extinction of mega-fauna are likewise controversial. The invasion from India theory is an entirely ideological interpretation of recent genetic studies.

 

All this seems to reinforce my earlier assumptions that those of the Right need to feel that Aboriginal people are somehow lesser or less culturally advanced. Your moral relativism is entirely one sided.

[Alan Deer]

6 hours ago, soc said:

Most Aborigines are very decent people until they drink alcohol.

Prior to white settlement/invasion(call it what you like)the Aboriginal people had NO alcohol whatsoever. Their metabolism cannot handle too much of it.

Our ancestors have been drinking alcohol since the Sumerians invented beer.

For their own protection, Aborigines were not allowed to drink alcohol until about 1964 when the UN got into the act & said that the Australian Govt was "racist"(don't the PC do-gooders love labeling anyone who disagrees with them with that word"!)& brought pressure on the Govt to repeal that law.

Now we see what happens.

l know that there are plenty of white idiots who cannot handle alcohol either, but l have never seen/found an Aborigine who can get completely drunk & not become belligerent & violent.

l too, have worked with & along side Aborigines & when sober, are a likable people.

When drunk, l would just make myself scarce.

 

This theory about alcohol is total bunkum......

The comment personifies the “white” attitude to the first Australians - a string of "convenient" pseudo scientific pronouncements have been made about them that are used in some way to shift blame from the European invaders.

 

Social conditions create a predisposition for alcoholism, not genetics............ this baseless idea dates back to colonial times when it was thought native people all over the world were particularly vulnerable to addiction, but there is no evidence of this whatsoever. Yet again a false theory is used to support a notion hopelessness and fatalism in indigenous peoples thus perpetuating the erroneous concept of a “dying race”

 

what white Australia is failing to do or trying to avoid are the causes of problem drinking which are the same throughout the world - and that is as a a release from a desperate situation - then accompanied by other substance abuse, it is followed by alcoholism.....the kind of anti-social behaviour on alcohol is by no means just an aboriginal problem, it is seen all over Australia and the rest of the world especially amongst disadvantaged sectors of populations, amongst all people regardless of skin colour or heritage - it is seen all over the world..

 

the media doesn’t help (v. this thread - they get their facts wrong and reinforce stereotypes.......The real message to be learned is to  objectively approach the problem and not try to cling to fallacious theories in the hope that they remove some of the responsibility from the non-indigenous population.

 

BTW - various Aboriginal nations in Australia DID have alcohol before the Europeans arrived ...in some places in quite a weak form - from plants and fruit. In the North they got alcohol from the traders from Indonesia...and there is also evidence that they fermented their own alcohol too.

A greater percentage of indigenous people abstain from alcohol that non-indigenous...1.6 times less.

Reliance on processed food has dome a lot of physical harm to indigenous people too as they previously lived a very low salt diet - many suffer from salt/sugar related diseases....these are a far more insidious threat.

 

 

I wish people would get their facts right before posting  on this topic - mind you there are about 200 years of lies and b/s to sort through first

 

 

 

[soc]

6 hours ago, Tawan Dok Krating Daeng said:

 

This is an ideologically tainted representation of some aspects of Aboriginal culture and the pre-history of Australia. It would appear that some issues are raised merely to attempt to diminish the Aboriginal culture. While somewhat more precise than the general anti-Aboriginal slurs to which I was responding, the politicization of aspects of Aboriginal culture and history has the same effect. It would seem that that is the intention of this post reinforced by using statements as fact with no citations or acknowledgement of the ideologically based dissension about many of these issues.

 

Representing Aboriginal people as immigrants has but one purpose, to attempt to de-legitimize their culture and ties to their land. Accusations that they were responsible for the extinction of mega-fauna are likewise controversial. The invasion from India theory is an entirely ideological interpretation of recent genetic studies.

 

All this seems to reinforce my earlier assumptions that those of the Right need to feel that Aboriginal people are somehow lesser or less culturally advanced. Your moral relativism is entirely one sided.

And you would be wrong.

l am an admirer of Aboriginal culture & of their accomplishments.  But l am also sadly aware of their failures.   l also have Aboriginal friends & although l do not raise the subject with them, so are they.  Of course they are immigrants.

Do you think that they evolved within Australia?

They came from South-East Asia in waves of different races & cultures. They also introduced the Dingo, which killed off the Tasmanian Tiger, which used to live on the mainland. That was only about 4000 years ago.

 

You are actually talking rubbish when you say that they lived in "perfect harmony" with the land.

You need to take off your rose-coloured glasses.

Ever hear of the "Bunyip"?  Thats a race-memory for all the Mega Fauna that used to live in Australia but was hunted to extinction before the white man arrived.  Similar to how the Maoris exterminated the Moa from New Zealand, before the whiteman.

Maybe you should stop feeling sorry for yourself & just face facts. 

 

The Aboriginal people have to make the effort to help themselves.  The opportunities are there, they just need to take them.  And l wish them luck.

[soc]

6 hours ago, Alan Deer said:

 

 

This theory about alcohol is total bunkum......

 

The comment personifies the “white” attitude to the first Australians - a string of "convenient" pseudo scientific pronouncements have been made about them that are used in some way to shift blame from the European invaders.

 

 

Social conditions create a predisposition for alcoholism, not genetics............ this baseless idea dates back to colonial times when it was thought native people all over the world were particularly vulnerable to addiction, but there is no evidence of this whatsoever. Yet again a false theory is used to support a notion hopelessness and fatalism in indigenous peoples thus perpetuating the erroneous concept of a “dying race”

 

 

what white Australia is failing to do or trying to avoid are the causes of problem drinking which are the same throughout the world - and that is as a a release from a desperate situation - then accompanied by other substance abuse, it is followed by alcoholism.....the kind of anti-social behaviour on alcohol is by no means just an aboriginal problem, it is seen all over Australia and the rest of the world especially amongst disadvantaged sectors of populations, amongst all people regardless of skin colour or heritage - it is seen all over the world..

 

 

the media doesn’t help (v. this thread - they get their facts wrong and reinforce stereotypes.......The real message to be learned is to  objectively approach the problem and not try to cling to fallacious theories in the hope that they remove some of the responsibility from the non-indigenous population.

 

 

BTW - various Aboriginal nations in Australia DID have alcohol before the Europeans arrived ...in some places in quite a weak form - from plants and fruit. In the North they got alcohol from the traders from Indonesia...and there is also evidence that they fermented their own alcohol too.

 

A greater percentage of indigenous people abstain from alcohol that non-indigenous...1.6 times less.

 

Reliance on processed food has dome a lot of physical harm to indigenous people too as they previously lived a very low salt diet - many suffer from salt/sugar related diseases....these are a far more insidious threat.

 

 

 

I wish people would get their facts right before posting  on this topic - mind you there are about 200 years of lies and b/s to sort through first

 

 

 

 

 

l think you are the one talking bunkum.  l've never found an Aboriginal person yet who could drink alcohol & not get into trouble.  l've worked with Aboriginals and they themselves acknowledged that fact.  Many of them didn't drink because they knew what it did to them.  Don't worry there are plenty of white people who can't handle their drink either.  And don't get your knickers in a knot, this is not about bashing anyone.

 

Nobody is "shifting blame"why? do you feel guilty?

You are the first person l have ever heard that says that the Aboriginal people had alcohol.  Excuse me if l am skeptical……Links please.

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6 hours ago, moose7117 said:

 

Teres no way i am gunna post photos , thats for sure.

 

and the boy is described as "lore" by the ladies and a complete waste of time by me !

No, l wouldn't expect you to post pictures.

Hope you didn't take that the wrong way.