Life and death on Thailand's lethal roads

[webfact]

Life and death on Thailand's lethal roads

By Jonathan HeadSouth East Asia correspondent

 

BANGKOK: -- There is a ritual that is now very familiar to Thais, before the two big holiday seasons of the year, in late December for the new year, and in April for the Songkran Festival.

 

The government will set a target for reducing fatalities on Thailand's notoriously dangerous roads, exhorting Thais not to speed, or drink and drive.

 

Sometimes good citizens will run publicity stunts, like the coffin-maker, who last year invited journalists to film the huge stockpile his workers were building up for the holiday season.

 

And every year these efforts fail.

 

Full story: http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-38660283

 

-- © Copyright BBC 2017-01-19

[maxpower]

All countries have carrying capacity. There maybe method in this Thai madness.

[NanLaew]

From the BBC article:

 

Quote

Former Deputy Transport Minister and safety campaigner Nikorn Chamnong goes further.
"We need to go back and change the DNA of the country," he says. "Education, right back in schools, is important".

 

I heard on the news that they are introducing a driving test paper in Thai high schools. It is unclear whether this is a proper, US-style 'divers ed' curriculum with a specific allocation of hours actual behind-the-wheel driving or just a fast-track to a license (and carnage) for inexperienced drivers but with the RTP's total unwillingness to enforce road traffic laws, I reckon it will be the latter.

Edited January 19, 2017 by NanLaew

[Titan1962]

The RTP need to start clamping down on all the ridiculous things that go on here.How hard can it be,the amount of revenue that could be made would be astronomical.untill they get tough,things will never change,just an increasing death toll. But it's easier to set up a few road blocks and catch a few unsuspecting tourists and fine them a few hundred baht.

[does]

If they would just ban drinking and driving. Impound cars of drunk drivers to show  you mean business.

[Gweiloman]

57 minutes ago, does said:

If they would just ban drinking and driving. Impound cars of drunk drivers to show  you mean business.

 

It's not just about drinking and driving. Most Thais don't know how to drive properly, even when sober. Of course putting alcohol into the mix just escalates the situation.

[jimstar1]

Alcohol  talking on cell phones got to be first there no driver education Yada Yada Yada 

RTP Solution lets set up road blocks catch the tourist on Motor Bike make plenty tea money

[catinthehat]

4 hours ago, Titan1962 said:

The RTP need to start clamping down on all the ridiculous things that go on here.How hard can it be,the amount of revenue that could be made would be astronomical.untill they get tough,things will never change,just an increasing death toll. But it's easier to set up a few road blocks and catch a few unsuspecting tourists and fine them a few hundred baht.

As long as there is little or no enforcement/punishment for any crimes, the carnage will continue. We are all used to the sight of many many numbers of police patrol cars everywhere on the roads (holiday or not) in the civilized world. I often  wonder what would  happen if these patrols were ALL gone. One might see the same that continues here generation after generation. I guess I would call it generational conditioning. And no I am not a wannabe psychologist.

 

It would help to infuse all of this into the early point in the education process here. Anyone ever see a child seat in a Thai vehicle? $500 fine and a trip to jail with a child abuse charge in the US for not using one.

[fruitman]

Give the police a small bonus if they write enough fines. Maybe that can make them do their job instead of going on picture all together when they arrest a small thieve.

[Revolutionary]

Unfortunately we all now the solution to the carnage on Thai roads . Unfortunately we als now that nothing will change. Sad but true!!!

[DrTuner]

Quote

Former Deputy Transport Minister and safety campaigner Nikorn Chamnong goes further.

"We need to go back and change the DNA of the country," he says. "Education, right back in schools, is important".

Finally, I agree. Let's colonize Thailand and bring in the DNA.

[Billy Bloggs]

I dont necessarily believe that helmets are the be all and end all of road safety(but I wouldnt get on a bike without one), but recently on a 2 hour wait for a train at Don Mueang station I did notice that in the traffic flow over those 2 hours the helmet wearers were at about 90% I was gob smacked, while in Issan it had been around 10% and here in Chiang Mai it might be 15 to 20% if your lucky. So anyone know why it is that BKK in that area has such a high level of helmet wearing. Whatever it is they need to get the rest of the country to follow and stop those fools sitting at tables doing stuff all.

[recom273]

Of course everyone would welcome change, let's start with the suggestion of enforcement over traffic management.

 

However, the idea that will be followed is the 'let's make motorbike lanes' .. Let's make all riders use the left hand lane, but paint "road the share" and a blue line, just like cycle paths. Let pickup trucks undertake in that lane on the highway, trucks can also cut across that lane without indicating at junctions, and if it passes 7-11 or a wet market, use that as a carpark - but at the same time they will punish riders for using other lanes by setting up a police roadblock on a suitably fast stretch of clear road.

 

In reality these government "experts" haven't got the balls to address the real issue.

[recom273]

"If we strictly follow what the law says, and issue a ticket for people driving over the speed limit, then we will end up booking everyone."

 

pure genius 

 

 

[quadperfect]

The road check points are for tourists and its obviouse its easy tea money. Tourist traps.

This place is the wild west of driving. You saddle up. Put on youre mad max and pray a mini van or a taxi driver does not kill you today.

And ok it could also come from a pick up.

I am shit scared every time i go out.

Seriously.

I do it cause i cant afford a car,and i need to get around.

So much for safety at the speed of traffic flow.

120 k seems to be the speed of choice here in phuket  in 50 k posted 

[dcnx]

They fail as drivers because Thai society has failed. Every aspect of Thai life has failed, starting with family structure, to education, to fair pay and practice at work, to transportation (all forms), to alcoholism, drug abuse on a grand scale, corruption everywhere, incompetent and corrupt police, to accepted violence against women, to glorified violence and rape on TV, human trafficking, prostitution, pollution, litter, poverty, an unstable government that gets over turned every few years, tip towing around their monarchy, and generally being held down and silenced their entire lives, and so on. And those are just off the top of my head. 

 

As a whole, Thai society is an absolute disaster. I don't blame the people, I blame their masters. It's going to take generations of not only proper education, but also rebellion and the desire to want to make their country better and safer. And that's not going to happen in our lifetime. 

 

It's called the land of smiles because smiling is the only thing they can do without hurting or taking advantage of each other. It's a tragedy.

[dcnx]

3 hours ago, DrTuner said:

Finally, I agree. Let's colonize Thailand and bring in the DNA.

 

That's probably the only realistic hope they have. 

 

To all you guys making babies here, good job! 

 

;-)

[Old Salt]

5 hours ago, does said:

If they would just ban drinking and driving. Impound cars of drunk drivers to show  you mean business.

This would be a start... however Gov RTP resources may not be adequate to go further.  How about more speed checks with cars confiscated by serious offenders.  Speed kills. 

[onemorechang]

I don't know if you can fix stupid in Thailand.

Maybe start with how the parents bring up there little boys and girls.

 

Maybe get schools , Temples, the Police, the government. to take an active roll in teaching correct behaviour in life.  this could help with the attitude Thais have on the roads as the grow up,

if they ever do.

Fines, yes,  imprisonment yes, 

but better still,  have public shaming in the towns and cities of the offenders,  they would just hate that.   with there  face   bull!t they hide behind.

Thailand needs to grow up.

Maybe in 100 years, they will get it.

Until then

Carry on with the daily BBQ of 70 + at the

Temple..

Feel sorry for the children that die on the roads,

that's the parents fault and the innocent,   the rest i don't care, let them die at there own hands

Stupid is as Stupid does.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 19, 2017 by onemorechang

[ianf]

Typical J Head article that really says nothing partly because he knows nothing and understands even less.

Thai driving: They do not have driving lessons; They do not understand road markings; The police do nothing whatsoever to police traffic. The country is too corrupt; Thais with money think they own the road, ie an attitude problem; In most cases cars are dangerous and unsafe (blacked out windows, illegal but applied to 95% of the cars on the road. They can move cars but cannot drive them. And the police do nothing at all. As for motorcyclists: They won't wear helmets; they weave in and out of traffic as if they are playing in the school playground; they have no road sense and no awareness of what's going on around them, they drink, they overload their motorbikes with whole families; they allow 10 year old kids on the road driving by themselves. In short: Nothing will change because the underlying attitude is wrong and the police are grossly incompetent. If Head had any nouse he would have explored some of these issues.

[Briggsy]

1 hour ago, dcnx said:

They fail as drivers because Thai society has failed. Every aspect of Thai life has failed, starting with family structure, to education, to fair pay and practice at work, to transportation (all forms), to alcoholism, drug abuse on a grand scale, corruption everywhere, incompetent and corrupt police, to accepted violence against women, to glorified violence and rape on TV, human trafficking, prostitution, pollution, litter, poverty, an unstable government that gets over turned every few years, tip towing around their monarchy, and generally being held down and silenced their entire lives, and so on. And those are just off the top of my head. 

 

As a whole, Thai society is an absolute disaster. I don't blame the people, I blame their masters. It's going to take generations of not only proper education, but also rebellion and the desire to want to make their country better and safer. And that's not going to happen in our lifetime. 

 

It's called the land of smiles because smiling is the only thing they can do without hurting or taking advantage of each other. It's a tragedy.

I take it you haven't visited Cambodia, Laos, The Philippines or, heaven forbid, Sub-Saharan Africa then.

[Smiley Face]

I think a big problem is the "me first", selfish attitude of Thai's, whether it's on the roads or any other place.  Their sense of entitlement translates to reckless attitudes on the roadways.  Everyone needs to get out of their way because they are the only person that matters and they should not be made to wait behind anyone.  

[brling]

1 hour ago, Briggsy said:

I take it you haven't visited Cambodia, Laos, The Philippines or, heaven forbid, Sub-Saharan Africa then.

 

Wow, an apologist for Thailand road death stats. the second worst in the world.

[fruitman]

5 hours ago, Billy Bloggs said:

I dont necessarily believe that helmets are the be all and end all of road safety(but I wouldnt get on a bike without one), but recently on a 2 hour wait for a train at Don Mueang station I did notice that in the traffic flow over those 2 hours the helmet wearers were at about 90% I was gob smacked, while in Issan it had been around 10% and here in Chiang Mai it might be 15 to 20% if your lucky. So anyone know why it is that BKK in that area has such a high level of helmet wearing. Whatever it is they need to get the rest of the country to follow and stop those fools sitting at tables doing stuff all.

 

Because the only thing the boys who sit in tents/aircon booths do is check for helmets at checkpoints.

 

But also today i saw a boy in brown coming out of the aircon booth and he jumped on a big bike to drive it without helmet.

 

There was huge trafficjam infront of their booth and that's caused by the market. 3 of the bib were sitting under a bridge and doing nothing, nope they don't go to that market to stop cars from parking on the road...they don't care at all.

[maewang99]

the "me first" selfishness  doesn't explain the Thai at all.  it looks that way if you don't know what the word "Thai" means... it means folks who have spent many years attending programs where obedience, memorization and indoctrination are the entire focus of the program. and it's a life long inculcation because, just as anywhere else, it is socially enforced even once you "graduate" from the programs they have.... how often do you ever see someone reading a book [and I don't mean text books nor comic books]??? they "teach" you for many years to copy what others write or think... without any thinking.... and allow no variation or deviation from what they are taught verbatim.... and that doing original work of any kind means nothing if it doesn't strictly conform to what is being taught... unless it is art class.... but even then you can bet there are restrictions. a wider perspective and experience is needed to get a full Theory of Mind exposure... this is where the "selfish Thai" theory comes from... they are trained not to have a wide perspective of other people... as people... but instead as being either fellow members of the whateveryouwanttocall this horror... or "foreigners".  but many farlang participate in those programs, by simply being involved in any way... a stamp of approval....  such that that, and the fact they are cheap labor generally.. is why they can pretend to be "teachers" and "do good" tutors etc to the "poor people" of Thailand.... they are poor, but not economically, as a nation, for damn sure. Thailand is the 20th richest country by PPP GDP per capita.... that ain't poor at all. 

"Thai" are not selfish... selfishness is something only someone with a full Theory of Mind can appreciate... so they are blameless. They really are.  

Our full consciousness and a Theory of Mind is not something we get just by being born as a Homo sapien. Don't expect the contrary.

Edited January 19, 2017 by maewang99

[Mook23]

5 hours ago, dcnx said:

They fail as drivers because Thai society has failed. Every aspect of Thai life has failed, starting with family structure, to education, to fair pay and practice at work, to transportation (all forms), to alcoholism, drug abuse on a grand scale, corruption everywhere, incompetent and corrupt police, to accepted violence against women, to glorified violence and rape on TV, human trafficking, prostitution, pollution, litter, poverty, an unstable government that gets over turned every few years, tip towing around their monarchy, and generally being held down and silenced their entire lives, and so on. And those are just off the top of my head. 

 

As a whole, Thai society is an absolute disaster. I don't blame the people, I blame their masters. It's going to take generations of not only proper education, but also rebellion and the desire to want to make their country better and safer. And that's not going to happen in our lifetime. 

 

It's called the land of smiles because smiling is the only thing they can do without hurting or taking advantage of each other. It's a tragedy.

Very well said. Unfortunately their only response to your valid vitriol is that they are thai and only they know what's best for.. thai. They learn it in school in a manufactured history and use laos, khmen and bpama's miserable recent past to prove they, the thai, are superior. It's a mix of hubris and ultra-ignorance AKA thainess. 

[NanLaew]

7 hours ago, ianf said:

Typical J Head article that really says nothing partly because he knows nothing and understands even less.

Thai driving: They do not have driving lessons; They do not understand road markings; The police do nothing whatsoever to police traffic. The country is too corrupt; Thais with money think they own the road, ie an attitude problem; In most cases cars are dangerous and unsafe (blacked out windows, illegal but applied to 95% of the cars on the road. They can move cars but cannot drive them. And the police do nothing at all. As for motorcyclists: They won't wear helmets; they weave in and out of traffic as if they are playing in the school playground; they have no road sense and no awareness of what's going on around them, they drink, they overload their motorbikes with whole families; they allow 10 year old kids on the road driving by themselves. In short: Nothing will change because the underlying attitude is wrong and the police are grossly incompetent. If Head had any nouse he would have explored some of these issues.

 

If you had gotten past your obvious Jonathan Head aversion, you would see that he pretty much made all the same salient points that you did while skipping on the least interesting, esoteric or irrelevant ones.

 

You don't really like it here do you.

[NanLaew]

3 hours ago, Mook23 said:

Very well said. Unfortunately their only response to your valid vitriol is that they are thai and only they know what's best for.. thai. They learn it in school in a manufactured history and use laos, khmen and bpama's miserable recent past to prove they, the thai, are superior. It's a mix of hubris and ultra-ignorance AKA thainess. 

..valid vitriol...

 

Thanks for the giggle.

 

You don't really like it here either do you.

Edited January 19, 2017 by NanLaew

[Colabamumbai]

Education should start in Kindergarden.

[Briggsy]

7 hours ago, brling said:

 

Wow, an apologist for Thailand road death stats. the second worst in the world.

Please re-read dcnx's post which states, "As a whole, Thai society is a disaster." His comment and my reply are not referring to road death stats. So, your comment is mistaken.