Huge markup on imported foods. Why?

[farcanell]

1 hour ago, dexterm said:

1) I would suggest you learn to read a map.

  "with their neighbors(tan)"

...the Philistine territory on your map is colored tan.

 

2) I have just demonstrated how silly and irrelevant this ancient history old chestnut is. I am sure Israel does not feel obliged to hand over its coastal strip and its main airport to Palestinians on the strength of a  ancient map. And similarly your map is just as immaterial to Palestinians in the OP being colonized in the West Bank and Jerusalem.

 

The people whose lives generated your map, are long since dead. Lets join the 21st Century please and deal with the living.

You haven't demonstrated anything.... nothing... nada... you could have, I suppose,  but you have not... the ancient philistine state would be swallowed by Israel... geopolitics in action... also territories conquerored by Israel.... why suggest it should be Palestinian.

 

maps are ever changing.... as I have demonstrated... don't get too twisted about that... my post of a map was in response to suggestions that the 1967 borders should be enforced... why?

 

why not enforce the borders of 2000 years ago? 

 

One of histories nine great worthies was judas M... fighting a resistance movement against Rome, for the good of Jews in Israel... I know... blah blah blah

 

But.... the simple fact is that you are supporting a non entity ( Palestinian government), which is a threat to an allied government (of a recognized state.) to my country

 

And.... my country has, on every single occasion, over the last 100 plus years, sallied forth to support its allies... it's called honor... and we will again, if called upon... that's what we do... we support our allies.

 

sit back... have a beer.... rail and rant as much as you want, but at days end, isreals problems are also the problems of its allies.... making it my problem... and it will be until my ELECTED government decides otherwise

 

my government is there to serve its people, at the will of its people... and generally does so quite well... when it does not, it will be ejected by the people

 

these seem to be principles that are beyond your comprehension ( for the people, by the people)

 

if you wish to support an entity branded as a terrorist organization, from time to time... go ahead.... even if treasonous ( if you belong to a country allied to Israel, as you are then against your country)

 

your choice... not mine... my choices are made by rational logical reasoning, and an unwavering support of my democratically elected government ( even when I don't like that elected government, because the majority decided, not me )

[Morch]

12 hours ago, pumpuy said:

It would be good to stop digging up the graves of the past , and start growing the seeds of a peaceful , secure future ... it can be done , even if the Israelis do not seem to know how ...

 

Another post which fails to recognize that there are two sides to this conflict. Not as if either is peaceful and receptive to offers.

[Morch]

11 hours ago, DaddyWarbucks said:

All good points.

The Zionists will never stop at their internationally recognized 1967 borders.

What they want is Eretz Israel , but they will soon be facing their worst nightmare - 6 million native Palestinians demanding equal rights in their homeland with the rest of the world looking on and full scale international BDS beckoning if they choose the South African apartheid option.

 

And yet another rehash of the same clueless post.

 

There are Israeli Zionists and Israeli Zionist political parties which do not support the illegal settlement effort. These are also generally in favor of reaching a peace agreement with the Palestinians. On the other hand, the current government includes a party which is not Zionist. So, overall, a bit more complex than the simplistic view presented.

 

Of the Palestinian mentioned, about a third are already Israeli citizens. As for the rest, they are currently still unable to reconcile their own internal conflicts, never mind field a unified effort of any kind.

 

Some posters reoccurring wet dream of "full scale international BDS beckoning" will remain a fantasy for the time being. Not even a realistic proposition anytime soon.

[Morch]

11 hours ago, johna said:

Israel building homes 

Its the Israeli's who have been killing Palestinians, burning their homes, stealing their land since 1948.  To continually claim that the Palestinian's have no right to this land is preposterous.  

 

The Palestinians were not and are not the peaceful people you try to portray them as. There was and there is violence on offer from both sides. Also, Palestinians were also killed by some of their supposed Arab allies, and their lands taken. That does not, of course,  detract from their right for self determination.

[Morch]

8 hours ago, gamini said:

It's not the Israelis house. They have stolen it from the Palestinians as well as the land . They have every right to expelL them.  If the Israelis were not there in the first place and had not siezed Palestinian land and built houses on it there would be no problems at all.

There were "problems", including Palestinian violence prior to the Israeli occupation which began in 1967. So to say there would have been "no problems at all" is far fetched. Granted, the Israeli illegal settlements are a major cause for much of the tensions between the sides, but they are not the only issue involved nor the first.

[Morch]

6 hours ago, Asiantravel said:

 

 

I am more concerned about a blatant and unethical conflict of interest than lack of experience.

Whether he is Trump’s son-in-law or not I don’t see how as senior adviser to the President he should be allowed to give advice which will obviously be severely tainted by personal financial gain.

 

Not that I see Trump's appointment of his son-in-law as a constructive move, or even an ethical one - but  fail to see which "personal financial gain" is involved. Could be wrong, but I don't think that Kushner is currently directly invested in anything related to the OP (at least not in a manner breaching accepted norms). If I remember correctly, Kerry had shares in Noble Energy (involved with Israeli maritime natural gas production). Of course, if we'd hear about Jerusalem Trump Tower, that would certainly put another spin on things. 

[Morch]

6 hours ago, Thorgal said:

 

Palestine existed far longer than any Jewish kingdom or Jewish state...

That's a historical fact.


Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect

 

 

And it had nothing to do with the Palestinian of the present. Next nonsense "historical fact"?

 

 

[Asiantravel]

5 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

Not that I see Trump's appointment of his son-in-law as a constructive move, or even an ethical one - but  fail to see which "personal financial gain" is involved. Could be wrong, but I don't think that Kushner is currently directly invested in anything related to the OP (at least not in a manner breaching accepted norms). If I remember correctly, Kerry had shares in Noble Energy (involved with Israeli maritime natural gas production). Of course, if we'd hear about Jerusalem Trump Tower, that would certainly put another spin on things. 

 

" Earlier this month the Israeli newspaper Haaretz reported that Donald Trump’s son-in-law has funded one of the settlements that is to receive new homes."

 

 

[Jingthing]

1 minute ago, Asiantravel said:

 

" Earlier this month the Israeli newspaper Haaretz reported that Donald Trump’s son-in-law has funded one of the settlements that is to receive new homes."

 

 

He makes money from donating? Tax deduction? 

[Morch]

3 hours ago, Asiantravel said:

will be interesting to see what happens at the United Nations now. Can they do anything ? will they do anything?

 

If by "do" you meant actual steps - probably not. These would have to pass through the UNSC, where a majority is tricky and the veto power easily exercised. Note that the recent UNSC resolution condemning Israel came about after certain text adjustments were included, and only under a UNSC article which does not mandate action. Had it been otherwise, doubt there would have been a majority, never mind a US abstention.

 

[Morch]

8 minutes ago, Asiantravel said:

 

" Earlier this month the Israeli newspaper Haaretz reported that Donald Trump’s son-in-law has funded one of the settlements that is to receive new homes."

 

 

Yeah, that's shoddy reporting. He (or rather his family) donated to an organization which supported the settlement (or more correctly, if not mistaken, the construction of a religious foundation there). It wasn't, I believe, something of a grand scale nor intended for profit. Think I linked to the actual details on a previous topic.

 

Doesn't make his appointment any more kosher.

Edited January 25, 2017 by Morch

[farcanell]

16 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

He makes money from donating? Tax deduction? 

And... investing in the infrastructure and security of an allied nation

[Jingthing]

1 minute ago, farcanell said:

And... investing in the infrastructure and security of an allied nation

Investing or a donation. I recall hearing donations. They are not the same thing. 

Edited January 25, 2017 by Jingthing

[Morch]

7 hours ago, dexterm said:

Your ancient map is all a bit silly and irrelevant as far as two peoples co-existing in peace in the 21st Century.

 

According to your map, Palestinians ought to own Ben Gurion airport. Should Israel give that back to its rightful owners then?

 

Lets be realistic and look to the future, and not ancient history.
 

 

3 hours ago, dexterm said:

1) I would suggest you learn to read a map.

  "with their neighbors(tan)"

...the Philistine territory on your map is colored tan.

 

2) I have just demonstrated how silly and irrelevant this ancient history old chestnut is. I am sure Israel does not feel obliged to hand over its coastal strip and its main airport to Palestinians on the strength of a  ancient map. And similarly your map is just as immaterial to Palestinians in the OP being colonized in the West Bank and Jerusalem.

 

The people whose lives generated your map, are long since dead. Lets join the 21st Century please and deal with the living.

 

Phonetics and Etymology aside, there is nothing connecting the Palestinian of the present to the biblical Philistines. They do not figure in the Palestinian culture, historical accounts or religious heritage. Not so with regard to Israelis and Jews. That there is no such equivalence does not negate the Palestinian claim, so trying to revise ancient history is simply redundant.

 

You are welcome to join the 21st century at any time you choose - this would include recognizing such facts as the Palestinians own contributions to their predicament, achieved by bad choices, intransigence, embracing violence and infighting. These do not erase Israel's role or responsibility - but they need to be accounted for whether you like it or not.

 

[Morch]

As posted on the parallel topic (which is really the same one) - the current Israeli move is a product of right wing coalition parties (or more correctly, party - Jewish Home) routinely challenging Netanyahu's leadership by bringing up extreme legislation proposals or  issuing extreme statements. Netanyahu can not (or will not) dismiss them, for political and electoral reasons, so he is often cornered into situations in which he either gets on the bus or pays them off with political coin.

 

In this case, the Jewish Home party wished to raise a legislation proposal which would see several major illegal settlements in the vicinity of Jerusalem annexed to Israel. Netanyahu is neither a religious zealot, nor unaware of the international implications such a move would cause. He was also worried about putting the Trump administration in a tough spot days after the inauguration and  ahead of his meeting with Trump. Hence, a political deal was struck - the motion was delayed, and the building permits issued.

 

West Bank settler organizations weren't that jubilant, expressing doubt full scale construction will actually materialize and noting that these aren't "new" permits, but withheld permits delayed over and over again. Guess they too know who they are dealing with, and what his words are worth.

[farcanell]

28 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

 

Phonetics and Etymology aside, there is nothing connecting the Palestinian of the present to the biblical Philistines. They do not figure in the Palestinian culture, historical accounts or religious heritage. Not so with regard to Israelis and Jews. That there is no such equivalence does not negate the Palestinian claim, so trying to revise ancient history is simply redundant.

 

You are welcome to join the 21st century at any time you choose - this would include recognizing such facts as the Palestinians own contributions to their predicament, achieved by bad choices, intransigence, embracing violence and infighting. These do not erase Israel's role or responsibility - but they need to be accounted for whether you like it or not.

 

???? very balanced... kudo's.

[farcanell]

36 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Investing or a donation. I recall hearing donations. They are not the same thing. 

But still business orientated... tax deductions are a dodge.

 

either way.... I'm not sure if it should be applauded or critised... nor am I sure about how it should be perceived by the voting population, with regards to a presidential advisor ( even if the donation ... or whatever... was made pre election)

 

but... Micheal Moore has vowed to uncover any wrong doings on the road to impeachment.... so I'm sure it will be something that's is being critically looked at.

[Trouble]

My prediction is that at some point Israel will go a little to far on this settlement issue and one by one European countries fed up with the land grab will start recognizing Palestine. As the middle east evolves after ISIL and the other disturbing wars come to a close (it may be 50 years from now), Europe will see more value in having good relations with the larger populace in the Middle East and abandon for all practical purposes Israel as it will really have little to offer in the way of resources or trade.  I don't mean to say that they will not recognize Israel, they will just tire of the whole issue and by pass it for good relations with trading partners who will offer a better economic opportunity.  (OR on the other hand the Muslims maybe by then be the majority in Europe and then just abandon Israel completely. )  I think most of the world is tired of the Israel and Palestinian fight/debate and could care less.  It is only the Jews and the evangelical bunch in the USA which ties the fate of Israel to their own destiny  that gives a rats ass about Israel. Many Americans are tired of 50 years of the issue being some kind of important part of America's foreign policy.  In essence they don't really carry some kind of torch on the issue, they are just tired of it, tired of the billions in foreign aid that we waste on Israel and wish it would all go away one way or another.  We in America need to move on from this issue and take a more neutral stance, something Obama tried to do at the end and failed. Obama should have had more balls earlier on but was much too timid on the issue at the end. Cutting off foreign aid for building settlements would have been a good start. Those settlements are like waving a red flag at a bull.

Edited January 25, 2017 by Trouble

[farcanell]

44 minutes ago, Trouble said:

My prediction is that at some point Israel will go a little to far on this settlement issue and one by one European countries fed up with the land grab will start recognizing Palestine. As the middle east evolves after ISIL and the other disturbing wars come to a close (it may be 50 years from now), Europe will see more value in having good relations with the larger populace in the Middle East and abandon for all practical purposes Israel as it will really have little to offer in the way of resources or trade.  I don't mean to say that they will not recognize Israel, they will just tire of the whole issue and by pass it for good relations with trading partners who will offer a better economic opportunity.  (OR on the other hand the Muslims maybe by then be the majority in Europe and then just abandon Israel completely. )  I think most of the world is tired of the Israel and Palestinian fight/debate and could care less.  It is only the Jews and the evangelical bunch in the USA which ties the fate of Israel to their own destiny  that gives a rats ass about Israel. Many Americans are tired of 50 years of the issue being some kind of important part of America's foreign policy.  In essence they don't really carry some kind of torch on the issue, they are just tired of it, tired of the billions in foreign aid that we waste on Israel and wish it would all go away one way or another.  We in America need to move on from this issue and take a more neutral stance, something Obama tried to do at the end and failed. Obama should have had more balls earlier on but was much too timid on the issue at the end. Cutting off foreign aid for building settlements would have been a good start. Those settlements are like waving a red flag at a bull.

 

Your probably right.

 

the "civilized world" has used the Jews as scape goats for the last couple of thousand years... England, France, Germany... any king requiring money.

 

taking  their money... then evicting them from their countries, or otherwise persecuting them, rather than pay their debts... etc etc.

 

shameful really.... no honor... no wonder they want their own country so dearly, and are prepared to defend it so desperately.

 

 

[Jingthing]

The budding trump -- Netanyahu relationship. In Bibi's case, this might turn out to be a careful what you wish for thing.

 

Reference to settlements in the link. 

 

 

Quote

 

How Erratic Trump Unnerves Even Netanyahu

But there is a fundamental difference between the two. Netanyahu is a seasoned, highly skilled. diplomatic and political operative with a deep understanding of the history and workings of the international system. Trump, by contrast, is a hypersensitive narcissist with a short attention span, a tenuous grasp of the truth and a dangerous obliviousness to how much he doesn’t know. All those combine to make him unpredictable and unsteady, among the most dangerous qualities a world leader can have. For all Netanyahu’s relief that Republicans now hold the White House, he has good reason — indeed, many good reasons — to be wary.

 

 

[hawker9000]

19 hours ago, pumpuy said:

No comment ...

Our neighbour here in Thailand has a lot of land he does not use , ( just some farming ...) , I think we will just occupy it , built a house and tell him to f..ck off ...

If he dares to throw some stones at us , we will pay a killer to finish with that story ... right ?

So a few years back that neighbor, along with his buddies, tried to run you off YOUR land, and exterminate you & your family in the process, did he?

 

(Don't worry.  I understand Jew-haters don't really like to tell that part of the story...)

 

Edited January 25, 2017 by hawker9000

[bandito]

8 hours ago, farcanell said:

 

Your probably right.

 

the "civilized world" has used the Jews as scape goats for the last couple of thousand years... England, France, Germany... any king requiring money.

 

taking  their money... then evicting them from their countries, or otherwise persecuting them, rather than pay their debts... etc etc.

 

shameful really.... no honor... no wonder they want their own country so dearly, and are prepared to defend it so desperately.

 

 

 

So true, so true, could'nt have said it any better.

[Grubster]

On 1/25/2017 at 10:18 AM, TheFishman1 said:

Great should build another 2500 what other country can't build where they want 

I guess you wouldn't mind if your neighbor built on your land and then claimed it was his.