New constitution a recipe for more problems, red shirts say

[smedly]

10 minutes ago, sjaak327 said:

no smedley, the last four elections that were valid ALL saw Thaksin's party win it. And two times with a majority of seats. There is no indication whatsoever that this is outdated nonsense, in fact, the reason why elections are postponed time and time again, and the reason the constitution has been drafted the way it is, is because the powers fear the electorate will vote for Thaksin's party in great numbers again.

 

Now before you scream outdated information, based on absolutely nothing, I would wager a bet that history will repeat itself.

everybody knows he bought the elections all the while when in power he abused his position over and over becoming a very rich man indeed, if there was a law he broke it - far to many to mention

 

you do know why he is living in a foreign country on the run and a convicted criminal - surely you must be aware of that 

Edited January 29, 2017 by smedly

[sjaak327]

9 minutes ago, smedly said:

everybody knows he bought the elections all the while when in power he abused his position over and over becoming a very rich man indeed, if there was a law he broke it - far to many to mention

 

you do know why he is living in a foreign country on the and a convicted criminal - surely you must be aware of that 

there is no evidence to suggest he won those elections via vote buying. In fact, those elections were fair, free and monitored by foreign observers.

 

In the interest of fairness, he already was a very rich man prior to his political carreer, and he was convicted on a sale of a piece of land on Ratchada, of which he personally wasn't even a beneficiary.

 

Isn't it amazing that off all his alledged transgressions, that was the only thing they could get him on ?

 

Having said that, not sure what his conviction has to do with the undisputed fact that his party did win the last four valid general elections.

 

Meanwhile your preferred goverment consists of people that forced their way into power at gunpoint, and in doing so they quite clearly broke the law. The only difference is that they cannot possibly be convicted, as they gave themselves amnesty...

Edited January 29, 2017 by sjaak327

[Get Real]

Nothing new. Anything that the red shirts don´t come up with or sign themself is automatically off the table.

[heybruce]

7 hours ago, robblok said:

They could have abstained or voted no.. they did not.. however you like to paint it they had a choice.

 

It was a damned if they did, damned if they didn't referendum.  If they had voted against the undemocratic constitution you would be posting that it was a vote for military rule and against elections.

[heybruce]

6 hours ago, smedly said:

 

He is 100% correct, he also left a lot of stuff out - like the slaughter of innocent people including children, using grenade launchers - grenades - Assault Rifles - Explosives on innocent Thai citizens, they also set up training camps in the north prepare for conflict just before the military stepped in and put a stop to the lunacy and the killings, they have the typical profile of a terrorist organisation - how they have the cheek to label themselves using the word democracy is quite beyond belief...........................all in the name of one man who lost so much face he is faceless and will never set foot in Thailand again, what is driving it ? well money - power and face, the shame of it all

Once again pretending that the violence was all on one side.  The military has killed far more Thais than the people protesting for democracy in Thailand ever have.

[heybruce]

3 hours ago, George Graham said:

The very large majority of the good Thai people want to be governed by Thaksin. This is evidenced by him and/or his surrogates winning elections time after time. Elections where, by the way, debate and discussion were allowed, elections which also were observed and were found to be free and fair.

 

2 hours ago, smedly said:

and that is total outdated nonsense

 

it is your opinion backed by nothing of substance

 

The junta's fear of elections and democratic government indicates that Prayut and company agree with George Graham's post on what the majority of Thai people want.

[JAG]

4 hours ago, smedly said:

you are wasting your time, there are now about 7 divisive id's on TVF who constantly sing the Thaksin and red tune, it is rather sinister

And in your authoritarian utopia they would be silenced, for daring to voice an opinion which you do not agree with?

 

Face it Smedly, your tolerance for other peoples views makes Ian Paisley look like a bleeding heart liberal!

[heybruce]

2 hours ago, smedly said:

everybody knows he bought the elections all the while when in power he abused his position over and over becoming a very rich man indeed, if there was a law he broke it - far to many to mention

 

you do know why he is living in a foreign country on the run and a convicted criminal - surely you must be aware of that 

Yingluck did not buy the election, it was monitored by ANFREL and declared representative of the will of the Thai voters.

 

No such organization monitored the referendum on the constitution, and it was widely condemned as blatantly unfair, yet so many anti-democrats insist it was legitimate.  What else can one expect from anti-democrats?

[rubl]

10 minutes ago, heybruce said:

Once again pretending that the violence was all on one side.  The military has killed far more Thais than the people protesting for democracy in Thailand ever have.

 

Well, that makes it right than, doesn't it?

[rubl]

6 minutes ago, heybruce said:

 

 

The junta's fear of elections and democratic government indicates that Prayut and company agree with George Graham's post on what the majority of Thai people want.

I fear the majority of Thai people would rather be left to themselves without pesky foreigners interfering. They're not really much different from the Americans I guess.

[Becker]

4 hours ago, smedly said:

what is a yellow shirt, I see only red shirt terrorists and then rest of the Thai population

 

this red yellow nonsense died a long time ago, there are no rival factions in this country something that the reds and Thaksin would like to play on but it no longer exists

 

There are only the Thaksin funded reds who operate under the control of their convicted criminal leader living abroad on the run from justice

 

The rest of the Good Thai population want nothing more to do with it and are in a very large majority

Ah, good. Then the junta leader will certainly call for nationwide elections soon, right? I mean, if the "good Thai population" is in a "very large majority" then they will henceforth elect the right people.

DO you agree smedley?

Edited January 29, 2017 by Becker

[sjaak327]

4 minutes ago, rubl said:

I fear the majority of Thai people would rather be left to themselves without pesky foreigners interfering. They're not really much different from the Americans I guess.

And they certainly would like to be left to themselves without a few pesky generals stripping them off their constitutional and human rights....

[heybruce]

8 minutes ago, rubl said:

 

Well, that makes it right than, doesn't it?

Are you acknowledging the military's suppression of democracy and killing of those calling for elections?

[George Graham]

6 hours ago, smedly said:

The vast majority of people have woken up to the violence killing and murder on the streets of this country and are fed up with it, I believe the tide had a massive turn when the kids were slaughtered at a market in Trat and the reds cheered on stage, from that time people realised that principal was worth a lot more that 500baht to buy their loyalty

 

It is over, Thaksin will never set foot in this country again, his red terrorist army are done

 

There are still a lot of things that need fixing and reformed, it is by no means an easy task and will take decades to complete

 

Thailand is moving on and it is great to see, the only people that can end the violence and complete the task are those that are in charge right now - not ideal but there is no other solution

There is another solution.

[George Graham]

3 hours ago, Becker said:

Ah, good. Then the junta leader will certainly call for nationwide elections soon, right? I mean, if the "good Thai population" is in a "very large majority" then they will henceforth elect the right people.

DO you agree smedley?

Smedley never answers, even the most simple of, questions.

[Baerboxer]

On 1/28/2017 at 0:50 PM, JAG said:

Exactly, they don't have any guns, tanks, unexplained bulging bank accounts, houses worth many multiples of their salaries, they are not related or connected to any of the good people!

 

And if / when there is an election, and if / when they win it, (like they have the last three of them) then they will expect that they should have some say in things - the barefaced cheek of it!

 

It"s like, I don't know, giving the people some say in who governs them. What a ridiculous idea eh, Smedly?

 

Er, well actually some red shirts and their black shirted friends do have guns, some are very unusually wealthy, some quiet new to their wealth since around 2010. And the red shirts leaders have never ever been elected but rather mysteriously appointed.

 

PTP aren't the red shirts. The red shirts aren't a political party. Although they may be owned by the same person. 

 

Confused?

[Baerboxer]

5 hours ago, sjaak327 said:

And they certainly would like to be left to themselves without a few pesky generals stripping them off their constitutional and human rights....

 

probably fed up with crooked politicians leeching out the state coffers, awarding themselves monopolies, changing laws to favor themselves and enrich their families, ignoring any laws they don't like and considering themselves above and beyond the law too.

 

Bugger of a choice.

[rubl]

5 hours ago, heybruce said:

Are you the military's suppression of democracy and killing of those calling for elections?

Were you acknowledging the Thai people were killing each other 

[heybruce]

1 hour ago, Baerboxer said:

 

probably fed up with crooked politicians leeching out the state coffers, awarding themselves monopolies, changing laws to favor themselves and enrich their families, ignoring any laws they don't like and considering themselves above and beyond the law too.

 

Bugger of a choice.

You just described the generals.

[heybruce]

1 hour ago, rubl said:

Were you acknowledging the Thai people were killing each other 

Of course they were, some were fighting for democracy, some fighting against democracy.  A great many westerners fall into the against democracy camp.

[sjaak327]

1 hour ago, Baerboxer said:

 

probably fed up with crooked politicians leeching out the state coffers, awarding themselves monopolies, changing laws to favor themselves and enrich their families, ignoring any laws they don't like and considering themselves above and beyond the law too.

 

Bugger of a choice.

It seems nothing has changed ! Because the generals do the exact same thing. This time, being fed up does not helpj of course,,,

[Becker]

16 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

 

And the red shirts leaders have never ever been elected but rather mysteriously appointed.

 

Maybe you can explain - drawing parallells to your own home country - why they should be elected. Are the Generals elected? Are the leaders of the Democrats elected? Did someone elect Suthep to spearhead the protests against the PTP? What exactly is your point|?

[Dale59]

Yeah I see his point! Just imagine if a non congressperson became President of the US! Oh wait .....


Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

[candide]

2 minutes ago, Dale59 said:

Yeah I see his point! Just imagine if a non congressperson became President of the US! Oh wait .....


Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

He was elected by citizens

[halloween]

On 28/01/2017 at 2:32 PM, Wilsonandson said:

What else can they do? Even if they vote in their chosen political party, that party is then given a neutral Prime Minister who may or may not agree with the majority party depending on the military picked senates approval of the majority parties idea or policies.

 

For example.

Pheu Thai wins the most seats in parliament and wants a war on drugs.

They have a house vote.

The vote passes and the PM consults the senate.

The senate disapproves.

The PM throws out the new bill.

No war on drugs.

And would that not be a better result than the last war on drugs?

[halloween]

14 hours ago, Becker said:

Maybe you can explain - drawing parallells to your own home country - why they should be elected. Are the Generals elected? Are the leaders of the Democrats elected? Did someone elect Suthep to spearhead the protests against the PTP? What exactly is your point|?

The point is that is that not being elected, but claiming to be a champion of democracy, is hypocritical at best, and more likely, simply a lie.

[sjaak327]

4 minutes ago, halloween said:

The point is that is that not being elected, but claiming to be a champion of democracy, is hypocritical at best, and more likely, simply a lie.

Pray tell, by whom should they be elected ?  It is a private organisation, there are numerous organisations the world over that advocate democracy, where leaders are not being elected.

 

It's ironic that Junta huggers even dare to bring about this subject, none of the current lot was elected.

Edited January 30, 2017 by sjaak327

[halloween]

1 minute ago, sjaak327 said:

Pray tell, by whom should they be elected ?  It is a private organisation, there are numerous organisation the world over that advocate democracy, where leaders are not being elected.

 

It's ironic that Junta huggers even dare to bring about this subject, none of the current lot was elected.

Oh, it's certainly a private organisation, owned financed and directed from abroad. The lie is that they represent the people of northern Thailand, or have any interest in democracy, other than promoting the interests of their employer.

[sjaak327]

Just now, halloween said:

Oh, it's certainly a private organisation, owned financed and directed from abroad. The lie is that they represent the people of northern Thailand, or have any interest in democracy, other than promoting the interests of their employer.

Might be true, however they are right in this case. And that is what this topic handles, shooting the messenger doesn't deflect from the fact that in this instance they are right. I personally could care less about their motives.

[halloween]

2 minutes ago, sjaak327 said:

Might be true, however they are right in this case. And that is what this topic handles, shooting the messenger doesn't deflect from the fact that in this instance they are right. I personally could care less about their motives.

Of course you think they are right, even when they are raising a completely unlikely last ditch solution as a straw argument.