Tourism made up 17 percent of GDP last year

[chiang mai]

4 minutes ago, Yme said:

I originally suspected that this is domestic and international. In that case there would not be much change to the past. About 10/11 per cent for international and 6/7 per cent for domestic would sound about correct.

 

Then again, it does say "130,000 people visiting the nation daily" which would be 47.450 million people. Far above the total of foreign tourists claimed. Placed against the claimed income this equates to an average of Bt52,898 ( US$1,511) per person. So...

 

 

The average length of tourist stay in Thailand is 9 days, the average tourist spend per day is 5,400 baht.  That's 48,600 per average tourist, not that far away from your 52,898 baht so I wouldn't be too hasty in raising that flag!

[elgordo38]

23 hours ago, webfact said:

It is expected 10 million Chinese tourists will visit in 2017.

Please do not leave us hanging in suspense how much will they spend especially on Kit Kat chocolate bars. 

[chiang mai]

44 minutes ago, Yme said:

I originally suspected that this is domestic and international. In that case there would not be much change to the past. About 10/11 per cent for international and 6/7 per cent for domestic would sound about correct.

 

Then again, it does say "130,000 people visiting the nation daily" which would be 47.450 million people. Far above the total of foreign tourists claimed. Placed against the claimed income this equates to an average of Bt52,898 ( US$1,511) per person.

 

 

 

So which is it, BS or not BS, you seem uncertain!

[zorro1]

Do the airports run 24/7 in Thailand ? I know they don't in the UK.

Yes I have a 2.20 am departure coming up

Sent from my Redmi Note 3 using Tapatalk

[oxo1947]

One does get a little weary of the constant--no it cant be true that Thailand is doing so well re Tourism.

 

Below are 2 reports both just financial--one from  MasterCard whom Every year, puts together its Global Destination Cities Index, data to figure out which cities are the most popular with tourists.

 

2/ is the World Tourism Organization 

I have just taken the financial reports that is done for 2015 and gets reported in full in mid 2016--this is the latest financial date--if you want to argue that it is out of date no one is here in 2016---then maybe you are right ,  but I have been reading how TAT has been telling a lie  to us from posters way back in 2009.  When looking at the WTO finance chart note the 8% drop in Thailand's revenue for the year 2013-14 (Army take over street fighting etc)

 

Also of interest is that according to their latest figures there are only 3 countries that increased their tourism revenue   USA--China-Thailand.. it may well be that Thailand revenue has dropped in 2016....we will know for sure latter in the year

 

 

1/ http://www.cntraveler.com/galleries/2015-06-03/the-10-most-visited-cities-of-2015-london-bangkok-new-york/1

 

2/ International tourism receipts grew to US$1,260 billion in 2015, corresponding to an increase in real terms of 4.4% from 2014.^[1] The World Tourism Organization reports the following destinations as the top twelve tourism earners for the year 2015, with the United States by far the top earner.

Rank	Destination	UNWTO Region[3]	International tourism receipts (2015)[1]	International tourism receipts (2014)[4]	Change (2014 to 2015) (%)	Change (2013 to 2014) (%)
1	United States	North America	$204.5 billion	$191.3 billion	6.9%	7.8%
2	China	Asia	$114.1 billion	$105.4 billion	8.3%	—
3	Spain	Europe	$56.5 billion	$65.1 billion	13.2%	3.9%
4	France	Europe	$45.9 billion	$58.1 billion	21.0%	2.8%
5	United Kingdom	Europe	$45.5 billion	$46.5 billion	2.3%	11.8%
6	Thailand	Asia	$44.6 billion	$38.4 billion	16.0%	8.0%
7	Italy	Europe	$39.4 billion	$45.5 billion	13.3%	3.6%
8	Germany	Europe	$36.9 billion	$43.3 billion	14.9%	4.9%
9	Hong Kong(China)	Asia	$36.2 billion	$38.4 billion	5.8%	1.4%
10	Macau(China)	Asia	$31.3 billion	$42.6 billion	26.4%	1.1%
11	Australia	Oceania	$29.4 billion	$31.9 billion	9.3%	0.4%
12	Turkey	Europe	$26.6 billion	$29.5 billion	7.1%	5.7%

 

[oxo1947]

1 hour ago, spidermike007 said:

No. Incorrect. The entire country is suffering from a declining tourism industry.

That's a well written post Spider--thank you....could you just pop a few figures in there to show us the rate of decline..remember Google is your friend, they do have lots of charts...(as long as they are not also in on this dastardly plot) ..........................

[elgordo38]

1 hour ago, spidermike007 said:

No. Incorrect. The entire country is suffering from a declining tourism industry. And that will not change. It is a permanent declining trend. For a hundred valid reasons. As I stated previously:

 

I have a friend who recently stayed on Samui. He stayed at a resort that has 54 rooms. Normally, they are 100% booked, from about Dec. 20th, to about January 5th. This year, they only had 22 rooms filled. They are down 60% for the peak season. Many resorts are experiencing similarly alarming numbers. These hotels counted on the government to support them, when they spend millions on their properties, and the government has let them down, once again. They continue to drop the ball, at every opportunity. 

 

They trot out these projections, every time they get scared, and see the numbers dropping. Who was it that said, if you tell the people something often enough, eventually they will believe it? Well, not us. We are not buying your simpleton lies. Tourism is declining by the day. Perhaps 50 years from now, in a hospitality industry class at a university here, they will discuss how Thailand lost the golden egg of Western tourism. Those tourists, unlike most Chinese tourists, spent anywhere from $100 a day, to over $1,000 a day. They brought real money into the country, and in exchange, were treated with utter and complete disregard, scammed, disrespected, and abused. Eventually, most said no more. Thailand thought the country was something very special, and that nobody would ever say no, or find alternative places to visit. The fact is that there are countless other spots, that offer better service, more expertise in food and beverage (especially wine), reasonable import duties to sustain a luxury goods market, better training, and far better english skills. Thailand simply lost sight of the big picture, and had very little vision, with regard to big spending tourists, who need to be catered to, instead of scorned.  

 

The real solution is about encouraging tourists, and ex-pats, from countries that spend real money, to come here and visit. That message seems to have gotten lost, in the fervor to court the Chinese tourists, many of whom do not spend much money at all here. So, what happened? The Western tourists started to decline in number, and the genius minds at the TAT decided it was time to "lure" the Chinese. They came. But, they did not spend much money. Hotels, restaurants, gift shops, jewelers, galleries, spas, massage shops, bars, and countless other businesses suffered, and will continue to suffer from this extreme myopia, on the part of the officials in charge of tourism. Oh well. Can't say they were not warned. 

 

The neighbors are trying too hard, and making too much effort, and investing money. Thailand is not. Though this topic relates mostly to tourism, in a way it pertains to ex-pats living here too. And I too am considering other spots. Currently the top spot under consideration seems to be Spain. So much culture, great wine, alot of fascinating places to visit nearby, reasonable real estate, a language I speak, and a reasonable standard of living. The other spots in this region offer too much similar nonsense, and bad infrastructure. Too many "so called leaders" in this region too, who lack creative juice, nor do they care one iota for their people. And the really hot weather, which seems to be getting hotter, and drier, is not all that appealing, as I get older. Thailand is making no steps whatsoever, to improve upon itself. On alot of levels, it feels like it is either standing still, or more than likely going backwards. Frankly, the biggest draw at the moment is being close to my wife's family, the food, the relatively pleasant people, and the weakening of the baht. But, I dislike the government, and the level of ignorance being perpetrated by the fabulously inferior educational system here does not appear to bode well for the future of the place. I also despise the practice of face, and the staggering level of cowardice that accompanies that weak, pathetic quality. 

 

It is a real shame, as I find most Thai people to be quite lovely, friendly, warm, helpful and fun to be around. There are many aspects of life here, that I truly enjoy. I am sure many feel the same way. Just wish the country was not moving backwards, (and was instead moving forward under the leadership of progressive minds) due to a system of meritocracy, and a complete lack of forward looking vision. A nice dream indeed.

 

Moving the country forward? I think not. More like "Moving Thailand backwards at an alarming pace".

Well done spidermike. You could again revive the art of writing. 

Edited February 17, 2017 by elgordo38

[DerekMarshall]

1 hour ago, spidermike007 said:

No. Incorrect. The entire country is suffering from a declining tourism industry. And that will not change. It is a permanent declining trend. For a hundred valid reasons. As I stated previously:

 

I have a friend who recently stayed on Samui. He stayed at a resort that has 54 rooms. Normally, they are 100% booked, from about Dec. 20th, to about January 5th. This year, they only had 22 rooms filled. They are down 60% for the peak season. Many resorts are experiencing similarly alarming numbers. These hotels counted on the government to support them, when they spend millions on their properties, and the government has let them down, once again. They continue to drop the ball, at every opportunity. 

 

They trot out these projections, every time they get scared, and see the numbers dropping. Who was it that said, if you tell the people something often enough, eventually they will believe it? Well, not us. We are not buying your simpleton lies. Tourism is declining by the day. Perhaps 50 years from now, in a hospitality industry class at a university here, they will discuss how Thailand lost the golden egg of Western tourism. Those tourists, unlike most Chinese tourists, spent anywhere from $100 a day, to over $1,000 a day. They brought real money into the country, and in exchange, were treated with utter and complete disregard, scammed, disrespected, and abused. Eventually, most said no more. Thailand thought the country was something very special, and that nobody would ever say no, or find alternative places to visit. The fact is that there are countless other spots, that offer better service, more expertise in food and beverage (especially wine), reasonable import duties to sustain a luxury goods market, better training, and far better english skills. Thailand simply lost sight of the big picture, and had very little vision, with regard to big spending tourists, who need to be catered to, instead of scorned.  

 

The real solution is about encouraging tourists, and ex-pats, from countries that spend real money, to come here and visit. That message seems to have gotten lost, in the fervor to court the Chinese tourists, many of whom do not spend much money at all here. So, what happened? The Western tourists started to decline in number, and the genius minds at the TAT decided it was time to "lure" the Chinese. They came. But, they did not spend much money. Hotels, restaurants, gift shops, jewelers, galleries, spas, massage shops, bars, and countless other businesses suffered, and will continue to suffer from this extreme myopia, on the part of the officials in charge of tourism. Oh well. Can't say they were not warned. 

 

The neighbors are trying too hard, and making too much effort, and investing money. Thailand is not. Though this topic relates mostly to tourism, in a way it pertains to ex-pats living here too. And I too am considering other spots. Currently the top spot under consideration seems to be Spain. So much culture, great wine, alot of fascinating places to visit nearby, reasonable real estate, a language I speak, and a reasonable standard of living. The other spots in this region offer too much similar nonsense, and bad infrastructure. Too many "so called leaders" in this region too, who lack creative juice, nor do they care one iota for their people. And the really hot weather, which seems to be getting hotter, and drier, is not all that appealing, as I get older. Thailand is making no steps whatsoever, to improve upon itself. On alot of levels, it feels like it is either standing still, or more than likely going backwards. Frankly, the biggest draw at the moment is being close to my wife's family, the food, the relatively pleasant people, and the weakening of the baht. But, I dislike the government, and the level of ignorance being perpetrated by the fabulously inferior educational system here does not appear to bode well for the future of the place. I also despise the practice of face, and the staggering level of cowardice that accompanies that weak, pathetic quality. 

 

It is a real shame, as I find most Thai people to be quite lovely, friendly, warm, helpful and fun to be around. There are many aspects of life here, that I truly enjoy. I am sure many feel the same way. Just wish the country was not moving backwards, (and was instead moving forward under the leadership of progressive minds) due to a system of meritocracy, and a complete lack of forward looking vision. A nice dream indeed.

 

Moving the country forward? I think not. More like "Moving Thailand backwards at an alarming pace".

12

 +1

 

Espanya va bien :-) 

[elgordo38]

4 minutes ago, elgordo38 said:

Too many "so called leaders" in this region too, who lack creative juice, nor do they care one iota for their people.

Right on the money here. 

[baneko]

so 52,808,013 divided by 365 days = 144, 679 per day or 6028 per hour on average.
 
Of course they all show up at once when its your turn to go through immigration. :)
 
 
 

80% chinese but spent 2% of the satang....

[chiang mai]

18 minutes ago, elgordo38 said:

Well done spidermike. You could again revive the art of writing. 

But that's about all, shame it's not a  revival of fact!

[elgordo38]

28 minutes ago, chiang mai said:

But that's about all, shame it's not a  revival of fact!

Looks like we have an Outlander in our midst. Not to worry you cannot win everybody's heart. Short on comment and "revival of fact??"

Edited February 17, 2017 by elgordo38

[chiang mai]

10 minutes ago, elgordo38 said:

Looks like we have an Outlander in our midst. Not to worry you cannot win everybody's heart. Short on comment and "revival of fact??"

Consider the evidence, the poster says:

 

"The entire country is suffering from a declining tourism industry. And that will not change. It is a permanent declining trend".

 

The evidence is to the contrary, TAT's numbers support the anecdotal evidence that tourism is indeed increasing, at least in the North it is.

 

"Those tourists, unlike most Chinese tourists, spent anywhere from $100 a day, to over $1,000 a day".

 

TAT's own figures show that the average (of all)  tourist spends 5,400 baht per day, that's USD154. So $1k a day would be the top 0.5% or similar.

 

"They came. But, they did not spend much money".

 

We can guess at how much money Chinese tourists spend here per day but I'm pretty certain we'd be very wrong. I have seen first hand the wealthy Chinese who stay at the Chedi(s) and who drop 300k baht at a time in the Boutique Shop. Chinese friends who visit here tell us Thailand is so cheap by comparison to China and when they visit they do spend.

 

"Frankly, the biggest draw at the moment is being close to my wife's family, the food, the relatively pleasant people, and the weakening of the baht".

 

The Baht has been strengthening for quite some time.

[elgordo38]

1 hour ago, chiang mai said:

Consider the evidence, the poster says:

 

"The entire country is suffering from a declining tourism industry. And that will not change. It is a permanent declining trend".

 

The evidence is to the contrary, TAT's numbers support the anecdotal evidence that tourism is indeed increasing, at least in the North it is.

 

"Those tourists, unlike most Chinese tourists, spent anywhere from $100 a day, to over $1,000 a day".

 

TAT's own figures show that the average (of all)  tourist spends 5,400 baht per day, that's USD154. So $1k a day would be the top 0.5% or similar.

 

"They came. But, they did not spend much money".

 

We can guess at how much money Chinese tourists spend here per day but I'm pretty certain we'd be very wrong. I have seen first hand the wealthy Chinese who stay at the Chedi(s) and who drop 300k baht at a time in the Boutique Shop. Chinese friends who visit here tell us Thailand is so cheap by comparison to China and when they visit they do spend.

 

"Frankly, the biggest draw at the moment is being close to my wife's family, the food, the relatively pleasant people, and the weakening of the baht".

 

The Baht has been strengthening for quite some time.

That's my boy!!!! God bless him he believes the TAT lady to. So much in common. 

Edited February 17, 2017 by elgordo38

[Oziex1]

So it's standing room only now.

[chiang mai]

18 minutes ago, elgordo38 said:

That's my boy!!!! God bless him he believes the TAT lady to. So much in common. 

Which part don't "we" believe, the volume of tourists, the average spend per day or the strengthening Baht?

 

EDIT TO ADD:

 

Here's an interesting link from April 2016 that talks about the increase in tourism to Thailand and also the increase in tourism to almost every other country in the region, some of the increases are huge:

 

https://www.thailand-business-news.com/tourism/53251-international-tourist-arrivals-rise-15-j.html

Edited February 17, 2017 by chiang mai

[spidermike007]

4 hours ago, chiang mai said:

 

I encourage you to take a drive from Mae Rim along the Samoeng Road, it's the road that leads into the mountains and has shed loads of tourist attractions on both sides of the road, along with a national park etc. If you were to do that you'd see the elephant camp parking lot is choka all day long, choka with grey minibuses and tourist coaches, typically over 100 separate means of transport parked up and waiting for their guests to finish their tour. You'd see the same thing at other tourist attractions, all day long, every day long, to be honest I've not seen things as busy as this before. So I don't know where you're looking, if you're using an anecdotal single hotel in Samui as your measure, best look somewhere else as well.

 

I have a hald dozen friends who work for five star hotels, in Bangkok, Hua Hin, Phuket, and Samui. I know a few dozen people who own restaurants, bars, massage shops, gift shops, etc. All say the same thing. All say their business is down dramatically. It is busy right now, during peak season. But year on end, it is way, way down. All say the same thing. They cannot all be wrong. Plus, anecdotally, when I am in Hua Hin during the off season it is far, far slower than it has ever been before. The local people say the same thing there.

 

The TAT is making everything up, as they go along. No doubt they have been instructed from the top, to do so.

 

Lastly, many of the tourists we are now seeing are zero baht Chinese tourists. Though they fill up the buses, they bring minimal income to the tourism sector. 

[fish monger]

So, were taxes paid on 253 million baht...? How do they REALLY KNOW how much money was spent...? HAH...! THEY DON'T...!

[nakhonandy]

If this is true, which I seriously doubt, based on Pattaya the last year, it must indicate that the overall economy has taken a huge dive! 

 

Back in the good old days, tourism was around 10% of GDP, that was when there were loads of tourists and the economy was good. 

 

 

[chiang mai]

1 minute ago, spidermike007 said:

 

I have a hald dozen friends who work for five star hotels, in Bangkok, Hua Hin, Phuket, and Samui. I know a few dozen people who own restaurants, bars, massage shops, gift shops, etc. All say the same thing. All say their business is down dramatically. It is busy right now, during peak season. But year on end, it is way, way down. All say the same thing. They cannot all be wrong. Plus, anecdotally, when I am in Hua Hin during the off season it is far, far slower than it has ever been before. The local people say the same thing there.

 

The TAT is making everything up, as they go along. No doubt they have been instructed from the top, to do so.

 

Lastly, many of the tourists we are now seeing are zero baht Chinese tourists. Though they fill up the buses, they bring minimal income to the tourism sector. 

Perhaps the profile of tourism in the North is different, closer to the border etc, I know we get convoys of SUV's with Chinese plates all heading through Mae Rim several times a week, dunno?

 

FWIW I believe the tourist numbers over all, so what is they are miscounting they are miscounting consistently, year in year out. One of the reasons I believe them is because of what I see, another is that tourist revenue forms part of the budget, it's one thing to tell porkies about how many tourists visited Thailand, it's yet another to put the revenue from those visits into the income column of the country's budget.

 

Lastly, I recall in not too many years past how stories emerged from Pattaya about the downturn in western tourist numbers and how everyone scoffed at it being possible to replace them from other countries. Truth is the profile of tourism here keeps changing, older businesses who don't adapt don't benefit.

[Stargeezr]

If tourism is 17 percent of the GDP then Thailand really is in the sink.

Good Luck TAT , keep your inflated numbers going and hope that the good General PM

believes your B* S..

Geezer

[bangon04]

11 hours ago, chopin2 said:

Didn't they recently state that the thai economy isn't dependent on tourism anymore, due to strong performans from other sectors? With 17% of GDP, a downturn of arrivals will hurt.

What percentage of GDP would be calculated for aging farang sponsors supporting the Isaan population?

[mok199]

Thailand..LAND OF DENIAL.and the famous..''THAI GRIN''...just get rid of those filthy disgusting tour buses..and finish the F%^ing beach already....

Edited February 17, 2017 by mok199

[oxo1947]

2 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

I have a hald dozen friends who work for five star hotels, in Bangkok, Hua Hin, Phuket, and Samui. I know a few dozen people who own restaurants, bars, massage shops

Lots of people --lots of friends with empty rooms--but not one link to a credible financial institution that points to a downturn. --or agrees with your lots of friends.

 

Come on Spider----you know your way around the net--go pull up some "Credible" figures that agree with your dozens of friends making beds and working Massage...its easy to show Thailand's tourism  is on the skids...........or is it............

 

 

 

[Brer Fox]

3 hours ago, elgordo38 said:

That's my boy!!!! God bless him he believes the TAT lady to. So much in common. 

You need to excuse chiang mai. He is unashamedly a junta lover. He purrs like a neutered pussy cat when the TAT statistics are published.

[elgordo38]

40 minutes ago, Brer Fox said:

You need to excuse chiang mai. He is unashamedly a junta lover. He purrs like a neutered pussy cat when the TAT statistics are published.

Don't blame him I was like that till about a decade ago and then "I don seen de light" I was never placed in this world to thrive and survive I was put here like a cog in a big wheel that keeps churning out material goods for big business and in my case a simple servant (which was my lucky break in life). I led a good life should not complain my children and grandchildren and great grandchildren will have it tough. Thinking back that neutering idea might have been a good one around 20 years of age. 

Edited February 17, 2017 by elgordo38

[thaiman]

Are tourists counted twice if they enter multiple times into the Kingdom within a year?  For example a border runner who does 5 border runs in a year, is he considered one tourist or five?

[JayBird]

10 hours ago, thaiman said:

Are tourists counted twice if they enter multiple times into the Kingdom within a year?  For example a border runner who does 5 border runs in a year, is he considered one tourist or five?

I'm not sure how, exactly, they calculate the GDP contribution due to tourism.

 

It would be very hard (impossible?) to get an accurate number.  They could be doing something in the extreme:

-- Any revenue generated at any shop in a 'touristy' area (Therefore, all sales at Paragon count as Tourism Income?)

 

Or the other extreme:

- Any revenue generated at locations only foreigners can spend money (international airport fees, hotels booked with foreign passport, etc.)

 

Cash revenue can not be traced (yet is a major contributor into an economy like Thailand).  And differentiator between Expat and Tourist can be difficult (both use foreign passport but one actually lives here and does not count as tourist).

 

As for in/out, I suspect they simply count anyone with a non-Thai passport coming in as a tourist.  Each time they come in.

[spidermike007]

16 hours ago, chiang mai said:

Perhaps the profile of tourism in the North is different, closer to the border etc, I know we get convoys of SUV's with Chinese plates all heading through Mae Rim several times a week, dunno?

 

FWIW I believe the tourist numbers over all, so what is they are miscounting they are miscounting consistently, year in year out. One of the reasons I believe them is because of what I see, another is that tourist revenue forms part of the budget, it's one thing to tell porkies about how many tourists visited Thailand, it's yet another to put the revenue from those visits into the income column of the country's budget.

 

Lastly, I recall in not too many years past how stories emerged from Pattaya about the downturn in western tourist numbers and how everyone scoffed at it being possible to replace them from other countries. Truth is the profile of tourism here keeps changing, older businesses who don't adapt don't benefit.

 

From what I understand, the TAT in it's desperation to keep the numbers up, uses all business visas, and some transit passengers in their counts. And alot of the new numbers are Chinese tourists, who spend very very little here. And most of the money for their tours is repatriated to China. Only the hotels and restaurants they use benefit, and the rooms and meals are steeply discounted. Again, all I talk to say the same thing. I am sure there are areas that are doing better than others. You have alot more Chinese up north. They fill up the buses, but do not provide much income, as the quality Chinese tourists have little interest in Thailand, as the country cannot provide the quality of service they are accustomed to, and the luxury shopping is too expensive due to misguided policy, with regard to excessive import duty. Also, the F & B is not what it should be, due to excessive duty on imported wine. The highest in the world, at over 400%. Totally misguided on nearly every level. Extremely poor leadership. Something this country has suffered from for decades. 

 

Little P. Moving Thailand backwards at an alarming pace.

[Shawn0000]

25 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

 

From what I understand, the TAT in it's desperation to keep the numbers up, uses all business visas, and some transit passengers in their counts. And alot of the new numbers are Chinese tourists, who spend very very little here. And most of the money for their tours is repatriated to China. Only the hotels and restaurants they use benefit, and the rooms and meals are steeply discounted. Again, all I talk to say the same thing. I am sure there are areas that are doing better than others. You have alot more Chinese up north. They fill up the buses, but do not provide much income, as the quality Chinese tourists have little interest in Thailand, as the country cannot provide the quality of service they are accustomed to, and the luxury shopping is too expensive due to misguided policy, with regard to excessive import duty. Also, the F & B is not what it should be, due to excessive duty on imported wine. The highest in the world, at over 400%. Totally misguided on nearly every level. Extremely poor leadership. Something this country has suffered from for decades. 

 

Little P. Moving Thailand backwards at an alarming pace.

 

http://www.thaiwebsites.com/tourism-income-Thailand.asp

According to this, you are wrong, the Chinese being the highest spenders per day, Europeans being the lowest with Americans being the second lowest.