new passport do all previous entries into thailand get omitted?

[kurtcap]

Hey all

I have seen recently seen many posts regarding refusals even at Suwarnabumi due to previous amounts of tourist and visa exempt entries, would just like to know what happens with a new passport whilst out of the country? Does it start new on entries also?

[BritTim]

As a general rule, your old and new passports will be linked in immigration's computer. Immigration will be able to see the full record of your entries. The consulates cannot see this, so you usually have a clean slate as far as getting visas is concerned. However, if you had many visa exempt entries in the past, trying for more because of a new passport is unwise.

[Get Real]

Simple answer. No, it does not. As the post before me state the passports are linked, and it doesn´t matter if the consulate or an emassy give you a visa. That says nothing about if you are allowed to enter or not.
Read the new rules about tourist visas, and after that decide what is the right visa to choose for no problem entering and exiting the country during your stay.

[Essecola]

If arriving at a land border, people are supposed to be allowed 2 entries per calendar year which can later be extended 30 more days. Even with exempt stamps from previous years or passports, this regulation would make it look like it is possible to enter twice that way unless getting a bad immigration officer or if there is some element of untruth to the regulation itself.

[IMA_FARANG]

You fail to understand that the Thai consulates and even the Thai immigration officers you see when you enter Thailand is just the lowest level of immigration.

This level you see when you enter Thailand is just the lowest level which does not have access all the information that is stored at higher levels about you and your previous rips to Thailand.

 

 

[BritTim]

24 minutes ago, Essecola said:

If arriving at a land border, people are supposed to be allowed 2 entries per calendar year which can later be extended 30 more days. Even with exempt stamps from previous years or passports, this regulation would make it look like it is possible to enter twice that way unless getting a bad immigration officer or if there is some element of untruth to the regulation itself.

My own interpretation is that this two per year maximum is one criteria for denying entry, not a reset of all previous entry history. I think you can still be denied entry for other reasons (such as many visa exempt entries in the past). However, immigration officials may well be inclined to be lenient with regard to your full history in practice.

[Essecola]

11 minutes ago, BritTim said:

My own interpretation is that this two per year maximum is one criteria for denying entry, not a reset of all previous entry history. I think you can still be denied entry for other reasons (such as many visa exempt entries in the past). However, immigration officials may well be inclined to be lenient with regard to your full history in practice.

I guess I just meant that if he was worried about his previous entries becoming a factor, the 2 entries by land in a calendar year regulation might cancel out that concern to some degree if he were to enter by land and hadn't since Dec31.

Edited March 5, 2017 by Essecola

[FritsSikkink]

41 minutes ago, IMA_FARANG said:

You fail to understand that the Thai consulates and even the Thai immigration officers you see when you enter Thailand is just the lowest level of immigration.

This level you see when you enter Thailand is just the lowest level which does not have access all the information that is stored at higher levels about you and your previous rips to Thailand.

 

 

The consulate isn't immigration.

[USPatriot]

Nope   welcome to the 21st century

[chainarong]

45 minutes ago, BritTim said:

My own interpretation is that this two per year maximum is one criteria for denying entry, not a reset of all previous entry history. I think you can still be denied entry for other reasons (such as many visa exempt entries in the past). However, immigration officials may well be inclined to be lenient with regard to your full history in practice.

That means to find out if the immigration is going to be kind you'll need to fly to Thailand, rather an expensive way to find out you can't enter. 

[chainarong]

5 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

The consulate isn't immigration.

Embassy's and  Consulates are not even remotely involved with the immigration department , immigration in any country is a separate identity.

[Essecola]

37 minutes ago, chainarong said:

That means to find out if the immigration is going to be kind you'll need to fly to Thailand, rather an expensive way to find out you can't enter. 

Fly          ....or come by land

[Asiantravel]

47 minutes ago, chainarong said:

Embassy's and  Consulates are not even remotely involved with the immigration department , immigration in any country is a separate identity.

on the one hand they go to extraordinary lengths to monitor the whereabouts of foreigners at all times and yet they can't create a common database that would centralise information on everyone for the benefit of all departments involved in the process?

[al007]

I understand Thailand immigration computer system based on the USA model, and will compare date of birth, facial recognition, and probably more than we know

 

So gone are the days when a quick name change, or a new passport will eradicate ability to link to previous one

 

All it now does; is when found out make the consequences far more severe

 

Keep life simple and play by the rules, but then no doubt the Bangkok Hilton may be appealing to some; but not me

[jspill]

No one really knows but keyboard warriors will act like they do. 

 

Sure the new passport is linked to the previous one, but it's possible that seeing a relatively empty passport stops the IO from looking into things any deeper on the computer. I'd say it's worth a try. 

 

1 minute ago, al007 said:

I understand Thailand immigration computer system based on the USA model, and will compare date of birth, facial recognition, and probably more than we know

 

So gone are the days when a quick name change, or a new passport will eradicate ability to link to previous one

 

All it now does; is when found out make the consequences far more severe

 

Keep life simple and play by the rules, but then no doubt the Bangkok Hilton may be appealing to some; but not me

Err it's not illegal to change your passport if you're worried about the number of visa stickers and stamps in it. He isn't asking about getting round a blacklist.

 

Not that he'd end up in the Bangkok Hilton even if he was.

[Suradit69]

2 hours ago, IMA_FARANG said:

You fail to understand that the Thai consulates and even the Thai immigration officers you see when you enter Thailand is just the lowest level of immigration.

Embassies and consulates are not any level of immigration, lowest or highest. They are under a separate ministry and have no access to immigrations data.

 

The immigrations officers at the airport can see your previous entries. That's the reason they check on their computer and the reason they may refuse entry. Saying they're the lowest level isn't really saying anything.

[Lovethailandelite]

Considering those that continue to live and work here (Nomads) keep trying to convince everybody that it's all legal and acceptable, that anybody has a need to change there passport in there attempt to hide there previous visa history? I wonder why consulates and Embassy's refuse anymore visas saying you have had too many forcing a passport change if there is no problem. Very strange.

[jgold]

They can see at the immigration at airport BUT when you give them a passport with no thai visas you have much less chances of coming under scrutiny. Best to take a break in the neighboring countries like Cambo or Vietnam. Very easy to stay in Vietnam right now. 

[juice777]

No one really knows but keyboard warriors will act like they do. 
 
Sure the new passport is linked to the previous one, but it's possible that seeing a relatively empty passport stops the IO from looking into things any deeper on the computer. I'd say it's worth a try. 
 
Err it's not illegal to change your passport if you're worried about the number of visa stickers and stamps in it. He isn't asking about getting round a blacklist.
 
Not that he'd end up in the Bangkok Hilton even if he was.

You are right there but the way things are going at the moment i think soon a new passport won't help anyone.

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[hawker9000]

5 hours ago, IMA_FARANG said:

You fail to understand that the Thai consulates and even the Thai immigration officers you see when you enter Thailand is just the lowest level of immigration.

This level you see when you enter Thailand is just the lowest level which does not have access all the information that is stored at higher levels about you and your previous rips to Thailand.

 

 

'Don't think this is actually true.  The IO at the desk where you present your passport sees your entire history, and not just what's in your current passport.  There may be additional information about your past stays that higher-ups can see if you escalate your case, but I'm pretty sure the guy at the desk easily sees ALL your comings & goings the moment your pii (name, pp no., birthdate, nationality) is entered, and in many cases even that's scanned in nowadays.

 

 

[Formaleins]

Depends upon the type of visa or extension you are on.

the exempt 30 days entries do not seem to get recorded, however, I am on my 3rd passport here and every passport I held from the day I first came here is cross referenced and stamped into my new passport, along with a few stamps I am a bit unsure of - They seem to refer to previous extensions but it gets complicated trying to understand all of the cross reference stamps - (It does to the Immigration too when you enter or leave)

[paulsingle]

I'm relatively new to to process of getting visas to come to Thailand. I may take a beating from some of the digital bruisers that lurk around these forums but I'm going to ask this question anyway.

What does a visa confer upon the bearer? If I am given a visa by the Thai consulate in Hull, UK to enter Thailand is it true that I could be taking a gamble by flying from London to Bangkok, hoping to be allowed to enter? 

[juice777]

Regardless of how many "back to back" visas I've had in the past year? 

You just said you are new to getting visas but now you are saying back to back in the past year

I am out of this Thread

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[BritTim]

19 minutes ago, paulsingle said:

I'm relatively new to to process of getting visas to come to Thailand. I may take a beating from some of the digital bruisers that lurk around these forums but I'm going to ask this question anyway.

What does a visa confer upon the bearer? If I am given a visa by the Thai consulate in Hull, UK to enter Thailand is it true that I could be taking a gamble by flying from London to Bangkok, hoping to be allowed to enter? 

When flying from home country, you will almost certainly not have a problem flying into Bangkok (Phuket could be a different story). However, if you have been living continuously in Thailand for years on tourist visas, and have only been back in the UK for a few days, it will depend a bit on the individual immigration official. Obviously, the visa would make no difference if you were blacklisted.

[paulsingle]

Just now, juice777 said:

You just said you are new to getting visas but now you are saying back to back in the past year

I am out of this Thread

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I said I'm relatively new to getting visas to come to Thailand because I've been coming for holidays at least once a year for the past 15 years but in September last year I got my first visa and I've been here since then. I've made 2 trips to Phnom Penh so I'm on my 3rd visa. Going back to UK next month but planning more visa visits. 3 visas makes me a complete newbie compared to most on this forum and I don't understand what rights are conferred on the bearer of a visa.

[jspill]

2 minutes ago, paulsingle said:

I said I'm relatively new to getting visas to come to Thailand because I've been coming for holidays at least once a year for the past 15 years but in September last year I got my first visa and I've been here since then. I've made 2 trips to Phnom Penh so I'm on my 3rd visa. Going back to UK next month but planning more visa visits. 3 visas makes me a complete newbie compared to most on this forum and I don't understand what rights are conferred on the bearer of a visa.

It's a bit better than a visa exempt but still no 100% right conferred to enter Thailand. People can still get pulled aside and questioned with a visa, and possibly denied entry if they're unlucky. 

 

For you it should be fine, only 3 visas then a trip to home country. People tend to have problems on their 5th visa in a row with no trips to home country, only 1-2 days outside Thailand each time they do a visa run, stuff like that. As well as not carrying 20k baht cash as 'proof of funds'. 

[BritTim]

2 minutes ago, paulsingle said:

I said I'm relatively new to getting visas to come to Thailand because I've been coming for holidays at least once a year for the past 15 years but in September last year I got my first visa and I've been here since then. I've made 2 trips to Phnom Penh so I'm on my 3rd visa. Going back to UK next month but planning more visa visits. 3 visas makes me a complete newbie compared to most on this forum and I don't understand what rights are conferred on the bearer of a visa.

You will be fine.

The visa does not guarantee that you will be admitted by immigration, but the officials will only prevent you from entering according to Section 12 of the Immigration Act 1979. As a practical matter, officials at Suvarnabhumi are not going to decide you fall into one of the categories to refuse entry based on your travel history to date. To be doubly sure, carry at least 20,000 Thai baht in cash (any currency) and have an onward flight out of Thailand.

[paulsingle]

1 minute ago, BritTim said:

When flying from home country, you will almost certainly not have a problem flying into Bangkok (Phuket could be a different story). However, if you have been living continuously in Thailand for years on tourist visas, and have only been back in the UK for a few days, it will depend a bit on the individual immigration official. Obviously, the visa would make no difference if you were blacklisted.

Thanks BritTim. On that basis, as things currently stand, I should be able to come out from UK, spend 3 months and then visit Phnom Penh for another visa then back to UK for 6 months and repeat indefinitely. May to September in UK every year and the rest of each year in Thailand  (with one regional trip for a new visa).

[BritTim]

1 minute ago, paulsingle said:

Thanks BritTim. On that basis, as things currently stand, I should be able to come out from UK, spend 3 months and then visit Phnom Penh for another visa then back to UK for 6 months and repeat indefinitely. May to September in UK every year and the rest of each year in Thailand  (with one regional trip for a new visa).

Yes. I know more than one Westerner doing something similar.

[juice777]

Thanks BritTim. On that basis, as things currently stand, I should be able to come out from UK, spend 3 months and then visit Phnom Penh for another visa then back to UK for 6 months and repeat indefinitely. May to September in UK every year and the rest of each year in Thailand  (with one regional trip for a new visa).

Can't you just get a METV in the UK? Then you won't have to go to PP

Or 1 visa in the UK then 2 border crossing which you extended for 30 days each which will give you 7 months in total

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