Caution Urged On Visas

[bizman]

I would like to add a word of caution about visa requirements. A couple of weeks ago I attempted to post information I had received from attorney visa specialists about the new Thai regulations. My posting was deleted by Lop and I was told it was full of misinformation, including "there is no such thing as a multiple entry visa". That's very interesting since I have one!! Several people agreed that I was incorrect in what I stated. Reading today's blurb, Time up for some 30 day visa runners...

Farangs living in Thailand with a 30 day stamp on arrival, and renewing it by continuous monthly visa runs to the Cambodian border, face big problems from next month. New regulations introduced on October 1 2006 mean that these farangs will currently be on their third 30 days visa run (October, November and December) with the limit of 90 days in a 6 months’ block about to bite.

Since October, immigration officers at Thai airports and border posts have been underlining 30 days stamps in visitors’ passports with a yellow marker pen.

Once three such stamps have been issued in a 6 months’ period, entrants are likely to be refused another in the short term. They are likely to be given a temporary 7 days’ stamp and told to quit Thailand for at least three months. These changes had been introduced by the immigration bureau nationally as it was felt the discretion of the 30 days stamp on arrival was being abused by foreigners trying to turn it into an unofficial residency permit.

Bureau chief police lieutenant general Suwat Tumrongsrikul had indicated that he had evidence that some such “residents” were running bars illegally or abusing Thai hospitality in other ways. If the perpetual 30 days on arrival farangs wish to continue to live in Thailand they have to break the cycle by leaving the country and requesting a prior visa (60 or 90 days) at a Thai consulate or embassy abroad. The most popular destinations in Asia are Penang and Vientiane, but most applicants are currently being restricted there to a single entry tourist visa (60 days plus an extension of 30 days).

The British embassy Pattaya based officer, Barry Kenyon, said all of the options needed financial resources. “Foreigners over 50 can apply for a one year retirement option,” he said, “but they need to have at least 800,000 baht made up of a Thai bank book deposit and probably proof of income or pension in their first country.” He added that men under 50 wanting a one year visa were mostly restricted to the “married man’s extension” or a valid work permit issued by the Labour office. Another option for foreigners with funds is to return to their own countries to obtain a multiple entry tourist or non-immigrant visa.

It is increasingly the pattern that multiple entries are being given only in the applicant’s home country. The Thai government recently introduced a new three year business visa, again awarded only in the first country, but this requires the support of the Thai commerce ministry or board of investment as well as proof of liaison with business partners in Thailand. A Pattaya based visa and travel agent said that he thought that some impecunious farangs might go into overstay as they could not afford to leave the country, thus risking jail and deportation procedures. But he wondered whether the new rules might be softened later in the year. “The whole thing was introduced without much notice, “he said, “and it might not be long term as it stands. Nobody knows.” The immigration bureau stresses that the new rules about 30 days do not apply to holiday tourists or holders of prior visas issued in countries outside Thailand.

A spokesman said tourists were very welcome and there were procedures in place to permit long stays. “We are concerned only with the abuse of the 30 days stamp by foreigners who are renewing it month after month after month at border posts. It is not a residency permit,” he explained.

it appears I was not as wrong as Lop said. I surely don't claim to be an expert on the subject but, it is apparent the person heading this forum is not either. Therefore, my advice is spend the money and hire someone that is instead of trying to sort out this hodgepodge of mumbo jumbo!

[scott1999]

nice post very clear

[tropo]

Once three such stamps have been issued in a 6 months’ period, entrants are likely to be refused another in the short term. They are likely to be given a temporary 7 days’ stamp and told to quit Thailand for at least three months. These changes had been introduced by the immigration bureau nationally as it was felt the discretion of the 30 days stamp on arrival was being abused by foreigners trying to turn it into an unofficial residency permit.

This information is incorrect. The allowable time in Thailand on 30 day entry stamps is limited to 90 days in a 6 month period. The number of stamps is irrelevant.

[Sophon]

My posting was deleted by Lop and I was told it was full of misinformation, including "there is no such thing as a multiple entry visa". That's very interesting since I have one!!

I sincerely doubt that Lopburi ever claimed that there was no such thing as a multiple visa, as it is well known by everyone reading this forum for more than a few days that indeed there is.

I'm guessing that what he said was, that there is no such thing as a multiple tourist visa. You can get a double, triple and maybe even quadrouple tourist visas, but that is not the same as a multiple (unlimited entries) visa.

Lopburi is very knowledgable when it comes to visa issues and also very willing to listen to new information, and I'm sure if he said the information you posted was incorrect then that was indeed the case.

Also, the article you quoted has been posted before and there really isn't anything new in it. Except for that mention that you will probably get seven extra days, all the information in the article has been posted here numerous times before.

Sophon

Edited December 16, 2006 by Sophon

[taxexile]

when it comes to knowledge on visa matters and procedures ......

......... lopburi is god.

[Maestro]

A couple of weeks ago I attempted to post information I had received from attorney visa specialists about the new Thai regulations. My posting was deleted...and I was told it was full of misinformation...it appears I was not as wrong...

Perhaps the time has come, Bizman, to expose you for what you are. The politically correct way to put it, I believe, is to say that you are being economical with the truth.

The new law is "90 days within a 6 month period". A period of 30 days consecutively is the maximum. Each time you enter Thailand it is considered 30 days even if you are only here for one day!

The above was gross misinformation. Long before this post of yours, this forum reported repeatedly that it is the number of days on visa-exempt stay that count, not the number of entries.

Since you were here within the past 6 months, the only way you can stay for another 3 month period is to get one-year multiple visa. Can be done, but you will need bkk attorneys and around 20k baht.

This, too, was gross misinformation.

1. To stay an additional 3 months after 90 days of visa-exempt stays, you do not need a “one-year multiple visa”, which would be a non-immigrant visa valid for one year, granting 90-day stays per entry. Most visa-exempt border runners would probably not qualify for a non-O visa, anyway. All you need is a single-entry tourist visa, which gives permission to stay 60 days when you enter and you can apply for a 30-day extension at any immigration office within Thailand.

2. Nobody needs to hire a Bangkok attorney and pay him 20,000 Baht to get a tourist visa.

Pardon for being brutal in calling you a liar, but I feel it is necessary for others to see the true story.

--

Maestro

[Maestro]

when it comes to knowledge on visa matters and procedures ......

......... lopburi is god.

...and what’s more, after that bizman post with the absurd misinformation Lopburi patiently explained to bizman the true situation in a PM (personal message), yet yesterday bizman came back to insist that he, bizman, was right after all. If bizman lacks the intellectual capacity to understand what he reads here and what an expert explains to him in a PM, why does he not simply keep quiet?

Bizman, I don’t want to hear anything more from you in this forum about your views on moderation. From the forum rules:

5) Discussion of moderation issues, actions or moderation policies concerning individual cases are not allowed in the forums. Such comments should be directed to a moderator or administrator, and not discussed on the forum.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

You are correct Maestro. A multi Non-Immigrant runs to around 5000 baht.

[lopburi3]

Your post was removed because it was false information as I said in my PM. I also said you could not obtain a multi entry visa inside Thailand. Below is a copy of that PM.

This post was removed due to misinformation.

The new law is "90 days within a 6 month period". A period of 30 days consecutively is the maximum. Each time you enter Thailand it is considered 30 days even if you are only here for one day! Since you were here within the past 6 months, the only way you can stay for another 3 month period is to get one-year multiple visa. Can be done, but you will need bkk attorneys and around 20k baht.

The rule applies only to entry without visa. Each day is counted to a total of 90. There is no limit on the number of entries. You can not obtain a multi entry visa in Thailand. Please be careful about posting information as it can confuse an already confused situation even more. Thanks.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Ole Bizman is a legend in his own lunchtime

[Gary A]

As a moderator and our resident expert concerning visas, it is Lopburi's responsibility to remove or correct erroneous posts. Since the whole visa situation is up in the air and conditions vary depending which immigration office you use, it is impossible to have ALL the answers. Lopburi does an admirable job explaining rules that are unclear even to Thai immigration.

I know I certainly wouldn't have the patience to answer the same questions time after time. Kudos to Lop. I for one appreciate his efforts. It's not like he is getting rich from his efforts.

Edited December 18, 2006 by Gary A

[Krub]

As a moderator and our resident expert concerning visas, it is Lopburi's responsibility to remove or correct erroneous posts. Since the whole visa situation is up in the air and conditions vary depending what immigration office you use, it is impossible to have ALL the answers. Lopburi does an admirable job explaining rules that are unclear even to Thai immigration.

Seconded

[dr_Pat_Pong]

As a moderator and our resident expert concerning visas, it is Lopburi's responsibility to remove or correct erroneous posts. Since the whole visa situation is up in the air and conditions vary depending what immigration office you use, it is impossible to have ALL the answers. Lopburi does an admirable job explaining rules that are unclear even to Thai immigration.

Seconded

Thirded.

[bangkokgas]

As a moderator and our resident expert concerning visas, it is Lopburi's responsibility to remove or correct erroneous posts. Since the whole visa situation is up in the air and conditions vary depending what immigration office you use, it is impossible to have ALL the answers. Lopburi does an admirable job explaining rules that are unclear even to Thai immigration.

Seconded

Thirded.

Fourthed.

[rocky]

I would like to add a word of caution about visa requirements. A couple of weeks ago I attempted to post information I had received from attorney visa specialists about the new Thai regulations. My posting was deleted by Lop and I was told it was full of misinformation, including "there is no such thing as a multiple entry visa". That's very interesting since I have one!! Several people agreed that I was incorrect in what I stated. Reading today's blurb, Time up for some 30 day visa runners...

Farangs living in Thailand with a 30 day stamp on arrival, and renewing it by continuous monthly visa runs to the Cambodian border, face big problems from next month. New regulations introduced on October 1 2006 mean that these farangs will currently be on their third 30 days visa run (October, November and December) with the limit of 90 days in a 6 months’ block about to bite.

Since October, immigration officers at Thai airports and border posts have been underlining 30 days stamps in visitors’ passports with a yellow marker pen.

Once three such stamps have been issued in a 6 months’ period, entrants are likely to be refused another in the short term. They are likely to be given a temporary 7 days’ stamp and told to quit Thailand for at least three months. These changes had been introduced by the immigration bureau nationally as it was felt the discretion of the 30 days stamp on arrival was being abused by foreigners trying to turn it into an unofficial residency permit.

Bureau chief police lieutenant general Suwat Tumrongsrikul had indicated that he had evidence that some such “residents” were running bars illegally or abusing Thai hospitality in other ways. If the perpetual 30 days on arrival farangs wish to continue to live in Thailand they have to break the cycle by leaving the country and requesting a prior visa (60 or 90 days) at a Thai consulate or embassy abroad. The most popular destinations in Asia are Penang and Vientiane, but most applicants are currently being restricted there to a single entry tourist visa (60 days plus an extension of 30 days).

The British embassy Pattaya based officer, Barry Kenyon, said all of the options needed financial resources. “Foreigners over 50 can apply for a one year retirement option,” he said, “but they need to have at least 800,000 baht made up of a Thai bank book deposit and probably proof of income or pension in their first country.” He added that men under 50 wanting a one year visa were mostly restricted to the “married man’s extension” or a valid work permit issued by the Labour office. Another option for foreigners with funds is to return to their own countries to obtain a multiple entry tourist or non-immigrant visa.

It is increasingly the pattern that multiple entries are being given only in the applicant’s home country. The Thai government recently introduced a new three year business visa, again awarded only in the first country, but this requires the support of the Thai commerce ministry or board of investment as well as proof of liaison with business partners in Thailand. A Pattaya based visa and travel agent said that he thought that some impecunious farangs might go into overstay as they could not afford to leave the country, thus risking jail and deportation procedures. But he wondered whether the new rules might be softened later in the year. “The whole thing was introduced without much notice, “he said, “and it might not be long term as it stands. Nobody knows.” The immigration bureau stresses that the new rules about 30 days do not apply to holiday tourists or holders of prior visas issued in countries outside Thailand.

A spokesman said tourists were very welcome and there were procedures in place to permit long stays. “We are concerned only with the abuse of the 30 days stamp by foreigners who are renewing it month after month after month at border posts. It is not a residency permit,” he explained.

it appears I was not as wrong as Lop said. I surely don't claim to be an expert on the subject but, it is apparent the person heading this forum is not either. Therefore, my advice is spend the money and hire someone that is instead of trying to sort out this hodgepodge of mumbo jumbo!

I was on the other end of the advice from an expert on this site, Not wishing to name the person giving the information,

It was stated that no more Investment visas would be issued and if you applied from the date said, it would be too late and the application would be denied.

I had been getting all the requirements for the investments visa together prior to reading the information. I thought it was too late and nearly didn’t bother applying after reading the advice on this from a professional who has much experience dealing with the immigration department and gives a lot of advice on this site

I did apply and I DID REVIEVE MY INVESTMENT VISA. The visa was finally stamped into my passport early November this year.

I am aware that other people using this site had read the same information as I had regarding the investment visa and thought it was too late, so didn’t bother applying as they thought it would be a waste of time.

I believe the lesson here is don’t believe anything you read, take it on board and do further investigations for your self. Though the problem with this is some companies in Thailand charging for advice and services are not as professional as needed in this area. Therefore go to immigration and ask there. Go directly to the horse

Other advice I would give, immigration is not that difficult to deal with, apply for your own visas (investment, retirement. Etc) though I do believe the investment visa has now been closed to new applicants.

My friend here in Pattaya was brainwashed into believing that the only way to get a retirement visa was by paying a legal company big money and they would grease the palms of the immigration department. Even though my friend is 60, married to a thai, has the 800,000bht etc.

I have another friend who is trying to get his one month Thai (bar) girl friend back to the UK for a holiday.

A Pattaya company has told him they can guarantee a visa for her. First he has to pay 10,000bht and the application is put in, if denied, he pays a futher 40,000bht and a second application is put in, if denied he pays a final 60,000bht where some ones hand is greased in the British embassy and the application is guaranteed.

[Asia4ever]

rocky wrote:

I was on the other end of the advice from an expert on this site, Not wishing to name the person giving the information,

It was stated that no more Investment visas would be issued and if you applied from the date said, it would be too late and the application would be denied.

I think this says way more about the inconsistency of Thai immigration officials trying to cope with a system that is in a state of flux, than it does about the invaluable contributions of an extremely knowledgeble "expert on this site".

[dr_Pat_Pong]

As a moderator and our resident expert concerning visas, it is Lopburi's responsibility to remove or correct erroneous posts. Since the whole visa situation is up in the air and conditions vary depending what immigration office you use, it is impossible to have ALL the answers. Lopburi does an admirable job explaining rules that are unclear even to Thai immigration.

Seconded

Thirded.

Fourthed.

Pour Forth We Beseech Thee O Lord Thy Grace Into Our Hearts

[Gary A]

Amen brother.