Trump to roll back use of climate change in policy reviews - source

[Grubster]

17 hours ago, boomerangutang said:

Who is surprised that Trump and his anti-science dummies are against what 97% of climate scientists claim?  Plus, with millionaires and billionaires around him, some of whom making big bucks from fossil fuels, it makes sense (lots of cents) for ignorant elder white men to keep denying what's going on.

 

Note:  there are groups of young Americans and Canadians who are backing up on hard drives; with as much scientific CC data as possible, because Trump is determined to wipe the data from existence.  In Trump's view:  if the data no longer exists, then the problem is gone.

 

 

Yeah its nice that the western working class has to live under these " end climate change " rules while the east is breaking them all and beating us out of our jobs isn't it? Time to wake up.

[baboon]

14 hours ago, jerojero said:

Yes, let Republican dominated Congress decide if CO2 is harmful to the planet. Forget the vast majority of scientists and scientific evidence proven the harm. Carry on, idiot Republicans, go on, kill our planet thank you very much.

'We must destroy the planet before it destroys us...'

[joecoolfrog]

18 hours ago, SOTIRIOS said:

...right on....!!!

 

...read the facts and stop the rhetoric....

 

...global warming is a farce.....and competing with the space program and the military budgets for funds...

 

...while over 1/3 of the American population uses food stamps....and has little or no medical coverage....

And the earth is 6,000 years old , its obvious , the sooner Trump bans Science , the better !

[iReason]

Whatta surprise... 

 

“I will give you everything” promises Trump in announcing his energy plan

 

"Yesterday in a press conference and speech in North Dakota, Republican presidential candidate Donald Trump announced

what some are terming his energy policy."

 

"His announcement was extremely short on specifics, included factual inaccuracies,

and in some cases contained obvious internal contradictions."

 

"At one point, Trump estimated that "75 percent of our rules and regulations are bad for us."

https://arstechnica.com/science/2016/05/donald-trumps-energy-plan-everything-but-the-pet-unicorn/

 

 

Oil, Coal Seen as Winners With Donald Trump Victory

Election win buoyed investors in fossil fuels while sending shares of wind and solar firms tumbling

https://www.wsj.com/articles/oil-coal-seen-as-winners-with-trump-victory-1478693338

[joecoolfrog]

16 hours ago, ilostmypassword said:

Over the next 10 years Trumpcare is going to give back to the richest Americans over 270 billion dollars in taxes over  that subsidize Obamcare.  If you put a stop to that, it will more than pay for any expenses incurred by any climate change influenced policy decisions.

But surely you are assuming that the long time welfare of us all is more important than making rich folk richer.

What on earth makes you think that Trump would care about anybody outside his immediate circle ?

[boomerangutang]

12 hours ago, yardrunner said:

No doubt climate change occurs, the question should be more about the causes and how much mankind is to blame, three or four ice ages was that because man was not affecting the planet. NO because their were inter-glacial events when the ice sheets receded and those were after the human population had been decimated by the advancing glaciers.

Then there was the carboniferous era when the coal measures were laid down and temperatures were far warmer than today but man had not appeared on the scene

We're not talking about ice ages or climate swings in prior times.   We're talking about what's going on now and in the near future (upcoming decades).   It's like if a kid sticks a knife in a schoolmate, and the principle lessens its significance by saying, "people have been knifed for thousands of years.  What's the big deal?"   

 

6 hours ago, Grubster said:

Yeah its nice that the western working class has to live under these " end climate change " rules while the east is breaking them all and beating us out of our jobs isn't it? Time to wake up.

Citing someone else or some other country doing harmful things, doesn't justify oneself or one's own country doing harmful things.   That's the immature logic of Trumpism.   

[stevenl]

6 hours ago, Grubster said:

Yeah its nice that the western working class has to live under these " end climate change " rules while the east is breaking them all and beating us out of our jobs isn't it? Time to wake up.

The East has a long way to go but is making big improvements. The US on the other side is going backwards. Bad for the environment, and in the medium and long term bad for the US as well.

[maewang99]

the only thing more dead than Trump's 2nd Travel Ban.....

is the Great Barrier Reef.... 30 years ahead of schedule.....
 

the headlines in this morning's New York Times...

brought to us from the city that just had 2 feet of snow in mid March....

and where ****700**** miles of choo choo track and steampipe passageways sit just above the salt water line.

 

yeehhhhhaaaaaaaaaaaaa! 
    

Edited March 16, 2017 by maewang99

[Ahab]

21 hours ago, ricklev said:

Interesting!  What's the relationship between climate change, food stamps and people with medical coverage?

It is interesting, but there is no relationship other than they are all things that money is spent on. Spend money on food stamps people can eat, spend money on medical coverage and people get medical care, but if you spend massive amounts of money on global warming we get computer predictions showing nearly no change for this massive cost. That is the relationship and it is interesting.

[simple1]

7 hours ago, Grubster said:

Yeah its nice that the western working class has to live under these " end climate change " rules while the east is breaking them all and beating us out of our jobs isn't it? Time to wake up.

China is shaping up to be a world leader on climate change

 

https://www.ft.com/content/3f1ba5ba-ddac-11e6-86ac-f253db7791c6

 

[Grubster]

3 hours ago, boomerangutang said:

We're not talking about ice ages or climate swings in prior times.   We're talking about what's going on now and in the near future (upcoming decades).   It's like if a kid sticks a knife in a schoolmate, and the principle lessens its significance by saying, "people have been knifed for thousands of years.  What's the big deal?"   

 

Citing someone else or some other country doing harmful things, doesn't justify oneself or one's own country doing harmful things.   That's the immature logic of Trumpism.   

Well I hate to be the bringer of bad news but every time you buy something made in these high polluting countries, then you are part of the polluting problem.  Oh but tariffs on these goods would be evil. It is a bit immature of the Trump haters to just bury their heads in the sand while buying all these pollution producing goods from other countries while screaming like a crushed cat if a puff of smoke should escape from one of the few factories left in the US providing jobs for us.

[Grubster]

3 hours ago, stevenl said:

The East has a long way to go but is making big improvements. The US on the other side is going backwards. Bad for the environment, and in the medium and long term bad for the US as well.

We have been expecting our manufacturers and workers to compete on a very unequal playing field. Should we just send ALL of our jobs and companies to countries that don't comply with the standards we have to live by?   Have you not seen the levels of pollution in China?  If you buy their goods you are part of the problem not the solution.

[yardrunner]

4 hours ago, boomerangutang said:

We're not talking about ice ages or climate swings in prior times.   We're talking about what's going on now and in the near future (upcoming decades).   It's like if a kid sticks a knife in a schoolmate, and the principle lessens its significance by saying, "people have been knifed for thousands of years.  What's the big deal?"   

no you are not talking about climate swings in previous times but you should think about cause and effect, what happened then can give pointers to what is happening now and man is not always to blame, think about the St Helen's and Reykjavik volcanic eruptions in our own time both of which had an effect on global climates. or go back in time to when Santorini  erupted in the Mediterranean in the 1600s BC which affected the climate in the western hemisphere and China  leading to crop failures and famine. yes we should do what we can to mitigate the effects of climate change but it will not always be enough to stop the effects completely when mother nature decides to put a spanner in the works

[boomerangutang]

6 hours ago, Ahab said:

It is interesting, but there is no relationship other than they are all things that money is spent on. Spend money on food stamps people can eat, spend money on medical coverage and people get medical care, but if you spend massive amounts of money on global warming we get computer predictions showing nearly no change for this massive cost. That is the relationship and it is interesting.

 

2 hours ago, Grubster said:

Well I hate to be the bringer of bad news but every time you buy something made in these high polluting countries, then you are part of the polluting problem.  Oh but tariffs on these goods would be evil. It is a bit immature of the Trump haters to just bury their heads in the sand while buying all these pollution producing goods from other countries while screaming like a crushed cat if a puff of smoke should escape from one of the few factories left in the US providing jobs for us.

                 Well, that's partly true, but is missing the bigger point.  It's the same derision put toward delegates to CC synopses who fly there and back by jet.  Part of the CC overview, put forth by people who give credence to science, is to instill a sense of husbandry in people of the world, particularly children.  If I tell a classroom of kids to not litter, and one pipes up, "but my dad litters, so what you're saying is BS."  where to go from there?  

 

                  You may not know this, but there are tens of millions of good folks in the US and WW who are doing what they can to make a better, cleaner world.  Many of those people don't eat red (or other types of) meat.  Everyone should know that farming animals for food is highly wasteful and polluting compared to getting the same calories from other means.  Many also are careful with how they use energy - for example at night:  "One light per person."  Or not using Air-con, or using internal combustion engines as seldom as possible.  There are 10,000 ways to make one's footprint on the planet less invasive/polluting.  

 

             And yes, even the most consciencious folks ride in cars or use Air-con once in awhile.  We're not seeking clean-as-falling-snow perfection, but we (most of us) are aiming for a planet which is decent for future generations.  The alternative is ugly, dirty and barely habitable.   Already, even in the best scenario, tens of thousands of animal and plant species go extinct in coming decades.  Let's lessen those stats.

[boomerangutang]

2 hours ago, yardrunner said:

no you are not talking about climate swings in previous times but you should think about cause and effect, what happened then can give pointers to what is happening now and man is not always to blame, think about the St Helen's and Reykjavik volcanic eruptions in our own time both of which had an effect on global climates. or go back in time to when Santorini  erupted in the Mediterranean in the 1600s BC which affected the climate in the western hemisphere and China  leading to crop failures and famine. yes we should do what we can to mitigate the effects of climate change but it will not always be enough to stop the effects completely when mother nature decides to put a spanner in the works

Of course there are natural events which effect climate.  Always have been, always will be.  Your closing sentence is off base.  excerpt: ".....but it will not always be enough to stop the effects completely...."

 

      If your spouse is sweeping rooms in the house, do you say to her/him, "what the use of cleaning the house, it will never be completely clean?"    Things happen by degrees (pun intended).  Moderate effort/adjustments by a lot of people can yield substantial results.  Only deniers/cynics are talking in absolute adjectives, like the word "completely".    Trump is the biggest buttplug of all because of the following reasons:

A.  He's in a powerful political position

B.  He lies incessantly, when he's not grossly exaggerating. 

C.  He gets his news/info from shout-radio conspiracy theorists/racists who are zanier than the acid-head nutcases I knew in California in years ago.  Even zanier than the drunk rednecks who hang out at bars at closing time, hoping to get into fistfights.

D.  He gets a kick out of pissing off liberals and tree-huggers.

E.  He worships money.  Power is 2nd,   all else is a distant 3rd for him.  

F.  He's a good manager, like Haystacks Calhoun is a good ballerina. (look him up)

[Berkshire]

4 hours ago, Grubster said:

We have been expecting our manufacturers and workers to compete on a very unequal playing field. Should we just send ALL of our jobs and companies to countries that don't comply with the standards we have to live by?   Have you not seen the levels of pollution in China?  If you buy their goods you are part of the problem not the solution.

If you listen to what you're saying, you're really not making any sense.  So America should lower its standards because other countries have low standards?  Pollute more because others do?  As for buying stuff from China, so we should prohibit Americans from shopping at Wal Mart?  Can't buy iPhones because they're made in China?  American manufacturing didn't leave the US because of bad trade deals  It was a natural progression of our economy...as well as automation and other technological advancement. 

 

As for "leveling the playing field," Obama tried to do that with the TPP...but Trump shut that down.   

[Grubster]

5 hours ago, boomerangutang said:

 

                 Well, that's partly true, but is missing the bigger point.  It's the same derision put toward delegates to CC synopses who fly there and back by jet.  Part of the CC overview, put forth by people who give credence to science, is to instill a sense of husbandry in people of the world, particularly children.  If I tell a classroom of kids to not litter, and one pipes up, "but my dad litters, so what you're saying is BS."  where to go from there?  

 

                  You may not know this, but there are tens of millions of good folks in the US and WW who are doing what they can to make a better, cleaner world.  Many of those people don't eat red (or other types of) meat.  Everyone should know that farming animals for food is highly wasteful and polluting compared to getting the same calories from other means.  Many also are careful with how they use energy - for example at night:  "One light per person."  Or not using Air-con, or using internal combustion engines as seldom as possible.  There are 10,000 ways to make one's footprint on the planet less invasive/polluting.  

 

             And yes, even the most consciencious folks ride in cars or use Air-con once in awhile.  We're not seeking clean-as-falling-snow perfection, but we (most of us) are aiming for a planet which is decent for future generations.  The alternative is ugly, dirty and barely habitable.   Already, even in the best scenario, tens of thousands of animal and plant species go extinct in coming decades.  Let's lessen those stats.

China is not my dad, it is the country that we have sent most of our jobs to so that these products could be produced with five times the carbon footprint as if made here, not to mention the shipping of the raw resources there and the finished products back. So BS to your father son scenario.

  We could greatly help the environment by refusing to buy these products, putting heavy tariffs on all products made with less desirable effects to the environment then ours, not to mention slave wages and child labor, lack of safety, the list goes on.  A guy who lost his job to China and is now working for less than half what he did is not going to be very interested in saving the world for the privileged is he. He may never be able to afford to go look at any parts of his own country. Population still blooms in most poor countries too, and yes I am aware that eating animals contributes greatly to the destruction of our natural surroundings, and has a huge effect on the atmosphere.

   I'd love to save the world, but I don't know what to do.

    

[Dumbastheycome]

On 3/15/2017 at 9:27 AM, ricklev said:

Interesting!  What's the relationship between climate change, food stamps and people with medical coverage?

The  money  in certain hands.