Israel Hamas War the Widening Middle East Conflict

[elgordo38]

22 minutes ago, boomerangutang said:

 

The Koch bros. are against Trump/Ryan care.  Kochs think it doesn't go far enough in feathering rich peoples' nests while shafting the little people.  Koch's have declared they'll fund Republicans (in upcoming elections) who oppose the bill, and ignore those who favor the Republican bill.  

 

 

Thanks for the update I now know how to spell B*****ds K.O.C.H. B.R.O.T.H.E.R.S.

[farcanell]

8 hours ago, maewang99 said:

Medicaid is flat out not sustainable... and not just funding wise.  we don't even have enough physical resources for it... even if we conjure up more printed money... and his travel bans and language don't help at all either.

 

I'm waiting for Ian Bremmer to make it ****official****

Trump has morphed into a lame duck while still in his first 100 Days.

 

it's supposed to be the last couple of months, in 2020 or something?

just a little ahead of schedule. 
 

Medicare versions work well in other countries.... it can in the USA, as well

[Jingthing]

I wouldn't make predictions either way at this point. We'll see how the vote goes. 

[attrayant]

The CBO has released a revised score of the new & improved Ryan-TrumpCare after legislators retooled it trying to get more votes. The new CBO score is worse than the previous one!

CBO released a revised estimate for Republicans’ health care plan. It somehow got worse.

[Dumbastheycome]

The  whole  situation  is  like  a  re formatted  "Your'e  fired  " piece  of   sh.t !

[Jingthing]

Reports are some votes have changed towards yes based on trump's "hard ball" tactic. He may still "win" but the American people "lose" regardless.

 

Quote

 

Even if Trump ‘wins,’ this health-care mess has been a horrendous disaster

...
He is more interested in a win, or avoiding a loss, than any of the arcane policy specifics of the complicated measure, according to a dozen aides and allies interviewed over the past week who described his mood as impatient and jittery.

 

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/plum-line/wp/2017/03/24/even-if-trump-wins-this-health-care-mess-has-been-a-horrendous-disaster/

 

trump may not be the worse American president in American history (it's early yet) but he certainly is the worse president I've ever seen. He makes Dick Nixon look good. 

Edited March 24, 2017 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

I'm watching the debate right now live here:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/

 

Breaking news. Majority speaker Ryan is visiting the white house to tell trump he doesn't have the votes to pass for the scheduled vote at 330 PM eastern US time. 

trump before said, vote now, regardless.

They could still delay that based on the news from Ryan. 

Edited March 24, 2017 by Jingthing

[Andaman Al]

3 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

I'm watching the debate right now live here:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/

 

Breaking news. Majority speaker Ryan is visiting the white house to tell trump he doesn't have the votes to pass for the scheduled vote at 330 PM eastern US time. 

trump before said, vote now, regardless.

They could still delay that based on the news from Ryan. 

 

 

Trump just wants a vote and to have this all finished, he does not care about the outcome. If it's a yes he will take all the credit, if it is a no he will blame and shame the Republicans who did not support it. All Trump cares about is that nothing interferes with his weekend trip to Mara Lago. God help if he had to stay in the White House and work over the weekend to push the bill through - no chance.

[Jingthing]

White house  signalling lack of confidence now in a winning vote but still going forward with today's vote. 

[Andaman Al]

6 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

White house  signalling lack of confidence now in a winning vote but still going forward with today's vote. 

As I said, Trump now believes he wins either way, and a vote today means no working weekend. He will be on his Golf course in Florida this time tomorrow.   Trump - Truly Ridiculous Uninspiring Meglomaniac President !

[Andaman Al]

8 hours ago, boomerangutang said:

The Koch bros. are against Trump/Ryan care.  Kochs think it doesn't go far enough in feathering rich peoples' nests while shafting the little people.  Koch's have declared they'll fund Republicans (in upcoming elections) who oppose the bill, and ignore those who favor the Republican bill.

This is exactly what I had read and heard. Some members are under the impression that the Koch brothers have offered 'protection money' to those that vote for the bill, that is wrong, they are offering campaign funds in 2018 to those that vote against the bill.

[Jingthing]

Wow.

trumpcare vote pulled at trump's request.

Apparently didn't have nearly enough votes.

His "art of the deal" strongman ultimatum
 "do it now or else" failed BIGLY.

No idea where this goes next.

It seems to me the only way to get the votes for something productive is a move towards rebranding ACA in a way that fixes it (rather than repealing) with a coalition of democrats and moderate republicans.

 

 

Is trump up for that? Extremely doubtful.  A truly great and unifying president might be but trump is clearly not that. 

 

The other alternative, more likely perhaps, is aggressively sabotage ACA so that people will indeed be begging even for something even as horrific as trumpcare. trump has already mentioned such a tactic several times. 

Edited March 24, 2017 by Jingthing

[Andaman Al]

Wow.

trumpcare vote pulled at trump's request.

Apparently didn't have nearly enough votes.

His "art of the deal" strongman ultimatum

 "do it now or else" failed BIGLY.

No idea where this goes next.

It seems to me the only way to get the votes for something productive is a move towards rebranding ACA in a way that fixes it (rather than repealing) with a coalition of democrats and moderate republicans.

 

 

Is trump up for that? Extremely doubtful.  A truly great and unifying president might be but trump is clearly not that. 

 

The other alternative, more likely perhaps, is aggressively sabotage ACA so that people will indeed be begging even for something even as horrific as trumpcare. trump has already mentioned such a tactic several times. 

What Trump will now do is to refuse to fix the bits of the Affordable Care Act that need fixing. He will make Americans really suffer. The ACA is not perfect but it has evolved into a damn good start, there are many things that can be done to improve it but Trump will never do that. He does not want one shred of an Obama legacy to remain, whatever the cost. Trump will watch America suffer now as he will refuse to make necessary improvements and improvements are what any normal Government would do. The Meglomaniac is now fully on the loose, impeach him quick or pay the price. I think healthcare just became what ipads were to Yingluck -a disaster!

[jerojero]

Mr. Big Deal Maker, couldn't work his fake magic. What happened? He learned being a corporate bully doesn't work in governing a country. Of course he takes no responsibility and blames everyone else for his failure. Big mouthed bully, full of b's.

 

 

[Jingthing]

26 minutes ago, jerojero said:

Mr. Big Deal Maker, couldn't work his fake magic. What happened? He learned being a corporate bully doesn't work in governing a country. Of course he takes no responsibility and blames everyone else for his failure. Big mouthed bully, full of b's.

 

 

Yep.

Exactly. 

It's a pleasure to see him fail so bigly.

But he's a very dangerous and extremely incompetent man and he's still president.

The damage continues.

Quote

 

Trump played a game of chicken with House Republicans. Then he blinked. Bigly.

Donald Trump was elected in part on one promise: that he knows how to make deals normal politicians don’t. Part of that mystique is the willingness to call his rivals’ bluff, to put his cards on the table and ask everyone else to do the same. That's what Trump did Thursday night. But when the time came to push all his chips into the middle of the table, Trump folded.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/03/24/donald-trump-played-a-game-of-chicken-with-house-republicans-then-he-blinked/

Edited March 24, 2017 by Jingthing

[iReason]

The Art of the Shlameal. 

 

The Centerpiece of the buffoon in chief's promises goes down in flames. 

And the puny cowards wouldn't even conduct an actual vote.

Because then it would be on record: Trump is a Loser.

 

In Major Defeat for Trump, Push to Repeal Health Law Fails

 

"House Speaker Paul D. Ryan conceded, “We’re going to be living with Obamacare for the foreseeable future.”

 

"In the end, Republican leaders doomed the bill by agreeing to eliminate federal standards for the minimum benefits that must be provided by certain health insurance policies."

 

"Mr. Trump and his top strategist, Stephen K. Bannon, wanted to see a confidential list of compiled to exact revenge on the bill’s Republican opponents, according to two people with direct knowledge of the situation."

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/24/us/politics/health-care-affordable-care-act.html?_r=0

[FritsSikkink]

22 hours ago, craigt3365 said:

It's really sad that Trump and the republicans are trying to ram this through no matter the consequences.  It's been proven it won't help.  Actually, it will hurt many.  What's needed is a long term analysis of the health care problem and a bipartisan agreement on what needs to get done.  Sadly, it doesn't look like that will happen.  Trump just wants to kill a legacy of Obama.  No matter the consequences.  Glad he didn't make it.

 

So much for him being a deal maker.  Strike one.

Strike 2, Mexico isn't paying for the wall. 

[selftaopath]

13 hours ago, Thaidream said:

If Trump had any real guts and wanted a universal healthcare system that would cover all Americans - he would go to a single payer system and expand the Medicare system to everyone. The cost would be handled by increasing the already paid medicare tax on one's salary slightly and make it free for the unemployed or those over 65. Instead of spending upwards of $25 Billion on a useless border wall and increase the American military budget -already the largest in the World- by another $54 Billion- he could use those Billions and put it toward real healthcare for Americans.  That is how you make a country great- not by robbing the poor to take care of the rich.

There is not a day that goes by when Donald Trump does not irritate millions of Americans and citizens of other countries with his complete lack of decorum; insensitivity; and utter incompetence.

The dumpster is a poor excuse of a human being. I hope his karma is real and rapid. 

[craigt3365]

Where is that member that said Trump is the best deal maker there is?  I believe this is strike two.  The first being the travel ban.  What's next?

 

Here's Trump's reaction.  What a weak and miserable person.  Blaming others for his failures.

 

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/03/24/politics/donald-trump-health-care-blame/index.html

 

Quote

 

Trump's art of no deal: Find someone to blame

Speaking soon after accepting defeat, Trump didn't shoulder the responsibility himself, nor did he pin the blame on House GOP leadership or any of the warring Republican factions' whose competing demands ultimately sunk any chance of a consensus bill.

Instead, he blamed Democrats and vowed to let Obamacare "explode."

 

 

It's no been proven he's not presidential material.  Case closed.

 

[selftaopath]

5 hours ago, Andaman Al said:

 

 

Trump just wants a vote and to have this all finished, he does not care about the outcome. If it's a yes he will take all the credit, if it is a no he will blame and shame the Republicans who did not support it. All Trump cares about is that nothing interferes with his weekend trip to Mara Lago. God help if he had to stay in the White House and work over the weekend to push the bill through - no chance.

Yea the dumpster is yet another republican hypocrite. How he/they BITCHED a/b Obama... A "must read" article depicts why Republicans hate poor people. 

[selftaopath]

5 hours ago, Andaman Al said:

This is exactly what I had read and heard. Some members are under the impression that the Koch brothers have offered 'protection money' to those that vote for the bill, that is wrong, they are offering campaign funds in 2018 to those that vote against the bill.

Sorry TV members. Apparently I misunderstood. I stand corrected and thank for clarifying this. "My bad." 

[maewang99]

don't need Ian Bremmer on this....Trump....

the first lame duck while still in his First 100 Days....

next?

the 20 trillion US dollar debt limit.... last agreed to in 2015.  

20,000,000,000,000 US dollahs already spent.

 

each of those last zeroes are impossible to get wrap our arms fully around... even for Sapiens... with our chimpanzee arms.
 

time's up.  it's time to deal with a real problem.  not fake ones.

in Baht this one is

720,000,000,000,000.   almost a quadrillion.

get used to saying it.  a quad. 

and 80,000,000 WW2 Baby Boomers counting on Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security.... like I said.... get ready to talk in "quads". THIS generation, mine, is both sexes.

it MUST be financed somehow.... by someone.....

Bank of Thailand... get ready to buy more US Treasuries... lots.

lots and lots and lots.  you ain't got no choice forward..... you made your choice in the past... now at the best you can do is stay the course.

Cheap baht? exports. TOURISM. TOURISM TOURISM...... this has George Soros 'written all over it'.... but on a slightly different side of the trade this time maybe. yes? 

don't believe it? 

same ol same ol. then you really won't like George Soros. blah blah blah.... talk talk talk.  but George doesn't just talk.




 

Edited March 25, 2017 by maewang99

[pegman]

14 hours ago, Jingthing said:

The promises he made in the campaign were impossible in any non universal single payer system. All rational people got that. Now this bill he is pushing is a pile of garbage and he can't sell it anymore saying it is terrific. Last I heard only 17 percent of Americans support the trumpcare plan. He wants a quick win on something so complex and consequential. It would be tragic if he gets it but on the other hand realistic fixes to the current ACA can't happen either with total Republican power. A very sad situation. Dysfunctional government with a clown leader.

It may be a missed opportunity. Would the Republicans not have been in for a beat down in the mid-terms had this passed? 17% support could have been worn down further with some creative advertising about the huge tax cuts for the wealthy and issuance being taken from millions. Then build a case for Medicare for all. Bernie was doing a nice job of that just now on TV.

[pegman]

1 hour ago, selftaopath said:

Sorry TV members. Apparently I misunderstood. I stand corrected and thank for clarifying this. "My bad." 

Something you would never hear that Orange thing say.

[utalkin2me]

It's funny because one of the big things we was always touting was how he has the best people who will be negotiating for him, the best people for every job. Let's see how making the wall on the Mexican border goes now. I actually hate Obamacare but I think Trump is more of a train wreck than Obamacare could ever be. 

Edited March 25, 2017 by utalkin2me

[craigt3365]

Interesting analysis from a guy on TV.  Trump didn't go after this aggressively until it was determined he would not win.  He let Ryan handle it.  They are saying he should have been going after this back in November.  I guess golf was more important.

 

Also, he said those opposed to the bill weren't afraid of Trump.  He threatened them, personally, but they didn't cave in.  Which means Trump is toast in the future.  He can't bring people together.  Just push them apart.

 

Love this comment from John King.  If this is the best he can do, it's pretty bad.  If he can't get even his own party to go along with him, he's in trouble.  He said the democrats did a much better job getting the ACA passed than the current administration.  Saying it's a bad deal and lets kill it doesn't work. LOL

[craigt3365]

2 minutes ago, utalkin2me said:

It's funny because one of the big things we was always touting was how he has the best people who will be negotiating for him, the best people for every job. Let's see how making the wall on the Mexican border goes now. I actually hate Obamacare but I think Trump is more of a train wreck than Obamacare could ever be. 

Mexico will never pay for the wall, and it will probably never be built.  Especially after this loss.  He doesn't have the support to get it through.

[pegman]

4 hours ago, Andaman Al said:

What Trump will now do is to refuse to fix the bits of the Affordable Care Act that need fixing. He will make Americans really suffer. The ACA is not perfect but it has evolved into a damn good start, there are many things that can be done to improve it but Trump will never do that. He does not want one shred of an Obama legacy to remain, whatever the cost. Trump will watch America suffer now as he will refuse to make necessary improvements and improvements are what any normal Government would do. The Meglomaniac is now fully on the loose, impeach him quick or pay the price. I think healthcare just became what ipads were to Yingluck -a disaster!

iPads? Explain yourself because it sure seems to me that iPads are to Yingluck as ACA is to Obama as 30฿ doctor visits were to Taksin.

[Andaman Al]

1 hour ago, craigt3365 said:

Here's Trump's reaction.  What a weak and miserable person.  Blaming others for his failures.

 

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/03/24/politics/donald-trump-health-care-blame/index.html

 

Quote

 

Trump's art of no deal: Find someone to blame

Speaking soon after accepting defeat, Trump didn't shoulder the responsibility himself, nor did he pin the blame on House GOP leadership or any of the warring Republican factions' whose competing demands ultimately sunk any chance of a consensus bill.

Instead, he blamed Democrats and vowed to let Obamacare "explode."

 

 

It's no been proven he's not presidential material.  Case closed.

Trump was saying in interviews that the reason it failed was because they could 'not get one Democrat vote!' He seems to have forgotten the Republicans are in the majority and the reason the bill failed was because he could not get around 36 of his OWN side to vote for him.

[Andaman Al]

10 minutes ago, pegman said:

iPads? Explain yourself because it sure seems to me that iPads are to Yingluck as ACA is to Obama as 30฿ doctor visits were to Taksin.

Sorry it's you that needs to explain yourself isn't it. I am comparing Trumps attempt at introducing health care to Yingluck holding up an iPad during her campaign and saying 'every child will get one of these'. i.e. - a disaster. Or maybe a better comparison would just be that Trump would have been more at home on Yinglucks Government knowing he was in the mix to rob over 800 Billion baht from the country.