Trump unleashes military strikes against Assad airbase in Syria

[Morch]

47 minutes ago, CGW said:

I wonder if the USA regrets creating ISIS and helping establish so many "governments" around the world?

 

Only the US did not "create" ISIS, and Assad did cooperate with ISIS when it suited him.

[Silurian]

Well, the "waste-of-space" POTUS needed a win and he was handed one. Nothing like military action to boost those all too low approval numbers. This airstrike was a nicely choreographed display. Interesting that the Syrian military knew to leave the area ahead of time. I am sure that was just a coincidence.

 

Eyewitness says Syrian military anticipated U.S. raid

http://abcnews.go.com/International/eyewitness-syrian-military-anticipated-us-raid/story?id=46641107

 

[craigt3365]

1 minute ago, Silurian said:

Well, the "waste-of-space" POTUS needed a win and he was handed one. Nothing like military action to boost those all too low approval numbers. This airstrike was a nicely choreographed display. Interesting that the Syrian military knew to leave the area ahead of time. I am sure that was just a coincidence.

 

Eyewitness says Syrian military anticipated U.S. raid

http://abcnews.go.com/International/eyewitness-syrian-military-anticipated-us-raid/story?id=46641107

 

Agreed.  But everything may have just lined up for Trump.  If this attack is true, congrats to Donald.

 

It's well documented the US communicated to the Russians about the attack well before.  Warning them about it.  Good move.  Helps avoid problems.  The attack was also done in the early morning to avoid casualties.  Just damage infrastructure.

[williamgeorgeallen]

8 hours ago, boomerangutang said:

                    Another angle:   Syrian rebels, and others who hate Assad (there are many factions, not least the Israelis and Saudis) ......could clandestinely poison Syrians.   They all know how seriously poisoning is viewed, particularly by westerners.  So, a mass poisoning in a non-Assad-held territory would trigger serious US/western military response - against Assad's troops.

i would say that is more likely than assad doing it.

[Morch]

34 minutes ago, sujoop said:

 

 

 

1) Putin's troops knew to stand down and get out of the way in advance

2) Of course Russia knew and knows  where every aircraft goes from 'their' controlled Syrian airfields and also what they're carrying.

End result, Trump gets a badly needed ratings boost and the heats off both Trump/Putin as Russia-gate is suddenly out of the headlines. Now they can pretend to be opponents for the first time and carry on with less heat. A win-win. Next distraction N Korea and more to follow.

 

 

 

It was reported that the Russian were forewarned by the US, so the standing down part is no mystery. Russia obviously got a handle on relevant air traffic and communications intercepts, and the same goes for the US and the UK. The level of the supposed "control" they exercise over Syrian air bases and operations is a matter of speculation (at least with regard to the limitations of this forum).

 

I don't think that the Russians are particularly troubled by Syrian forces using chemical weapons (or more precisely, chlorine) - as long as they can deny culpability and that exact details remain vague.

 

It's possible that the whole thing is a finally orchestrated diversion, but that requires giving the Trump administration quite some credit. From what we've seen so far, not exactly the most competent administration, and with so many willing to spill the beans and following their tracks - would be a hard one to pull.

[williamgeorgeallen]

18 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

The whole scenario is strange- Assad was basically out of the woods as Trump and Company indicated they were not interested in regime change and Assad had to know this. I find it hard to believe that he then ordered a chemical attack. He had to know Trump would respond. Now all of a sudden the onus is on potential war rather than looking into Trump's connection to Russia.

I do not trust Trump and his minions . Syria needs to negotiate an end to this carnage and Russia and America need to establish safe zones. As an American, i would prefer the US stay out of Syria except for air support and some well placed Special Forces.

Russia can have the place. Let them drai their foreign money reseerves and place their soldiers in harms way. America has done enough- too many waurs and interventions. The only problem is that with Trump in power- even his domestic agenda is like a war on some people in America.

The best regime change would be if Trump was ousted as President.

think donald dropped the ball on this one. i agree assad had no motivation to use chemical weapons.

Edited April 7, 2017 by williamgeorgeallen

[craigt3365]

1 minute ago, williamgeorgeallen said:

i would say that is more likely than assad doing it.

More likely that a rag tag group of rebels could pull this off?  Make it look like an air attack?  They've got no war aircraft.  As opposed to Assad who's already used chemical weapons, which they admit?  And has been bombing civilians for years.  Really? LOL

 

Don't forget the US tracked the aircraft from the base to the bombing location and back.  With great shots of the bombing site.  Conspiracy theories are interesting, but perhaps not applicable here.

[friendofthai]

Lets look at the final result of the actions of the USA. The territory bombed will be under control of ISIS very soon. Yes, Obama is not the father of ISIS - it is just a joke.

[Rob13]

1 minute ago, craigt3365 said:

More likely that a rag tag group of rebels could pull this off? Make it look like an air attack? 

 

Not enough info for anybody  here to speculate. I wouldn't put it past trump to have pulled a gulf of tonkin to divert attention away from his putin connections. What better way than start something against Assad. The timing is very convenient for him.

[craigt3365]

2 minutes ago, Rob13 said:

 

Not enough info for anybody  here to speculate. I wouldn't put it past trump to have pulled a gulf of tonkin to divert attention away from his putin connections. What better way than start something against Assad. The timing is very convenient for him.

Luckily, it's not up to just Donald to do this.  He has to get the agreement from his national security team.  Too many players for this not to be real. 

[Andaman Al]

3 hours ago, LannaGuy said:

some Syria facts:

so what 'mess' did Assad start?

• Syria – only Arab country with a secular constitution – does not tolerate Islamic extremist movements.
• Roughly 10% of the Syrian population belongs to one of the many Christian denominations, all fully integrated in     Syrian political and social life.
• Syria clearly and unequivocally opposes Zionism and the Israel government.
• Following a massive oil find in Syria’s Golan Heights, occupied by Israel since 1967, Netanyahu recently asked Obama to recognize its annexation of the territory. To consolidate its hold, plans are afoot to quadruple Israeli settler numbers to 100,000.
• Syria is one of the only countries in the Middle East without debts to the International Monetary Fund (Pre-invasion Libya & Iran the only others.)
• Syria is the only Mediterranean country which remains the owner of its oil company, with an oil reserve of 2,500 million barrels, the operation of which has avoided privatization and is reserved exclusively for state-owned enterprises.

This 'shortened' list highlights why the pack turned on Assad as opposed to any other world Dictator.

 

 

 

1 hour ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Why did it all start? How did the US and some Western allies get involved in the first place?

See above.

 

 

26 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

I've love to see  evidence also.  But I'm not going to follow conspiracy theories either.  So far, it's being said by world leaders that Assad did this.  That's all we have to go with for now.  Conspiracy theories aside.

Craig , you of all people amaze me with that post. So now you define a 'conspiracy theory' as any alternative explanation that is outside that endorsed by certain 'world leaders'. - That is NOT all we have to go on is it. I would list the 'conspiracy theories' as you define them that have already been shown to have been true including many many black flag ops but we would go off topic. Lets start with Bush and Blairs WMD's and you can google the dozens of others throughout recent history where 'world leaders' tried everything to pull the wool over the eyes of their citizens in order to start a hugely profitable war, either in monetary or political terms - or often both. So at a time like this with the lessons of Iraq you are saying we just accept what is said because a World leader has told us so. Look at the motivations of all sides and see where the scales balance out. Mind numbing!

[Andaman Al]

13 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

Luckily, it's not up to just Donald to do this.  He has to get the agreement from his national security team.  Too many players for this not to be real. 

Exactly what was said about Iraq.

[Morch]

1 minute ago, Andaman Al said:

This 'shortened' list highlights why the pack turned on Assad as opposed to any other world Dictator.

 

 

 

See above.

 

 

Craig , you of all people amaze me with that post. So now you define a 'conspiracy theory' as any alternative explanation that is outside that endorsed by certain 'world leaders'. - That is NOT all we have to go on is it. I would list the 'conspiracy theories' as you define them that have already been shown to have been true including many many black flag ops but we would go off topic. Lets start with Bush and Blairs WMD's and you can google the dozens of others throughout recent history where 'world leaders' tried everything to pull the wool over the eyes of their citizens in order to start a hugely profitable war, either in monetary or political terms - or often both. So at a time like this with the lessons of Iraq you are saying we just accept what is said because a World leader has told us so. Look at the motivations of all sides and see where the scales balance out. Mind numbing!

 

So deception applies only to Western governments then?

[williamgeorgeallen]

29 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

More likely that a rag tag group of rebels could pull this off?  Make it look like an air attack?  They've got no war aircraft.  As opposed to Assad who's already used chemical weapons, which they admit?  And has been bombing civilians for years.  Really? LOL

 

Don't forget the US tracked the aircraft from the base to the bombing location and back.  With great shots of the bombing site.  Conspiracy theories are interesting, but perhaps not applicable here.

why did assad do this?  he would know the consequences. seems things were going well for him and he was finally making progress.

is not difficult to pop a canister of gas from an upwind location on the ground. could even do it when there is a syrian aircraft overhead.  their airforce has around 500 aircraft in a country one quarter the size of texas i would imagine most populated areas are flown over continuously. having the flight plan of the aircraft that dropped the gas sounds about as likely as them finding the passport on the sidewalk of the hijacker on the 9/11 flight. now that is something that really made me LOL.

Edited April 7, 2017 by williamgeorgeallen

[Rob13]

21 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

Luckily, it's not up to just Donald to do this.  He has to get the agreement from his national security team.  Too many players for this not to be real. 

Plenty of precedent against what you're saying  he 'has to do' here. What decisions are made  are on  him. The security chiefs are just advisers.

Edited April 7, 2017 by Rob13

[Thaidream]

The problem that one has when there is a President like Trump- who has lied in the past and constantly distorted facts is that no one really knows if he is telling the truth now or continues his lies. I can't quite remember another President that has so blatantly distorted facts and espoused pure fiction.

However,  I doubt that the US Secretary of Defense  General Mattis could be convinced to lie about what actually happened.  Let's see what the Russians come up with. If they have proof that the Assad regime did not release gas let's see it unless they are part of the 'conspiracy'.

I do firmly believe that Donald Trump must be removed as President either by impeachment or invoking the 25th Amendment. He is dangerous to America and the World.

Edited April 7, 2017 by Thaidream

[KhaoNiaw]

7 minutes ago, williamgeorgeallen said:

why did assad do this?  he would know the consequences. seems things were going well for him and he was finally making progress.

Why would he believe there would be consequences? Total red herring. Everything that has gone on previously would tell him to go ahead as there would be no consequences. Trump seemed to have no interest. So not why keep making your domestic opponents pay the worst possible price?

 

 

[Silurian]

Russian footage of the airstrike seems to show minimal damage to the runways.

 

1st footage of destruction at US-hit Shayrat airbase in Syria (VIDEO)

https://www.rt.com/news/383857-video-syria-missile-attack-us/

[Andaman Al]

9 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

So deception applies only to Western governments then?

Absolutely not. So get the scales out. Why would Assad be involved in 'deception' and why would 'other Governments'?  See which side weighs heaviest. Be objective, not emotional. Non of us like to see pictures of children and babies dying and suffering (it is how certain charities secured billions of aid from people all over the world for Africa - aid which never got to the dying, suffering emaciated babies!). The balance of logic - not emotion shows a very different picture to the one we are currently being fed. As Ron Paul says, why on earth would Assad do this when Russia, the US and Syria were on the verge of peace talks and a joint strategy for fighting ISIS, an agreement that will now never ever happen? Who/which parties and Governments would not want Russia, the US and Syria to find a way of working together to bring stability to the region. Who wants instability and who really hates the Assad regime?

 

This attack could be the catalyst for Iran to become involved - a move that a few countries in the region would relish, and if Iran does become involved then Russia will have no option but to jump in the ring also. It is for these reasons that this move should have gone to Congress. The very reason Obama wanted to go to Congress before attacking Syria - but the Republican Congress would not support him.

 

There is far too much s**t being thrown at the fan for anyone to have a clear assessment of what is really going on here.

 

If Assad wanted to kill his people he would have just carpet bombed the area. he would NOT have used chemical weapons.

[Silurian]

Interesting article about Syria and possible conspiracy theories. With all the worries about "fake news" can anyone really state for sure what is happening? Crazy times indeed when everyone is so jumpy about "fake news" and "dishonest" media.

 

Trump loves a conspiracy theory. Now his allies in the fringe media say he’s falling for one in Syria.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2017/04/06/trump-loves-a-conspiracy-theory-now-his-allies-in-the-media-say-hes-falling-for-one-in-syria/?hpid=hp_hp-top-table-main_fix-media-620a%3Ahomepage%2Fstory&utm_term=.8ac7f0fd3873

Edited April 7, 2017 by Silurian

[sawadeeken]

Just getting 'primed-up' for Kim Jong-un and North Korea............

Practice makes perfect --- my mom taught me years ago..............

[Andaman Al]

I actually give up here, it is futile.

 

The only thing we can all do that will be beneficial to us ALL as TV members is to discuss the stock we should all be purchasing and any other investment opportunities we should consider whilst a potential full regional conflict erupts including two super powers.

 

Anyone got any starters? I guess it is still not too late for Raytheon shares.

Edited April 7, 2017 by Andaman Al

[mesquite]

Finally we've got a president with some balls.

[CGW]

22 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

The problem that one has when there is a President like Trump- who has lied in the past and constantly distorted facts is that no one really knows if he is telling the truth now or continues his lies. I can't quite remember another President that has so blatantly distorted facts and espoused pure fiction.

You must be really young, you should have been around for the " blatantly distorted facts and espoused pure fiction." that Bush, Clinton, Bush & Obama came out with! or are you choosing your own criteria?

As others have stated here, Assad is not stupid, he well knew what reaction gassing civilians would provoke, he had nothing to gain by carrying out this act!

^^ Gold has done well today!

[craigt3365]

39 minutes ago, Andaman Al said:

This 'shortened' list highlights why the pack turned on Assad as opposed to any other world Dictator.

 

 

 

See above.

 

 

Craig , you of all people amaze me with that post. So now you define a 'conspiracy theory' as any alternative explanation that is outside that endorsed by certain 'world leaders'. - That is NOT all we have to go on is it. I would list the 'conspiracy theories' as you define them that have already been shown to have been true including many many black flag ops but we would go off topic. Lets start with Bush and Blairs WMD's and you can google the dozens of others throughout recent history where 'world leaders' tried everything to pull the wool over the eyes of their citizens in order to start a hugely profitable war, either in monetary or political terms - or often both. So at a time like this with the lessons of Iraq you are saying we just accept what is said because a World leader has told us so. Look at the motivations of all sides and see where the scales balance out. Mind numbing!

Bush and Blair aren't in charge.  This isn't 15 years ago in a different country.  Apples and oranges.  Pretty much every world leader from the Western world is supporting this.  And guaranteed, they have better info available to them than we do.  With respect. 

 

Syria has used chemical weapons before on their own people.  Syria bombs their own civilians on an almost daily basis.  The rebels have no air war craft.  Sorry, but it makes sense.  I'll side with the world leaders on this one.

[Morch]

22 minutes ago, Andaman Al said:

Absolutely not. So get the scales out. Why would Assad be involved in 'deception' and why would 'other Governments'?  See which side weighs heaviest. Be objective, not emotional. Non of us like to see pictures of children and babies dying and suffering (it is how certain charities secured billions of aid from people all over the world for Africa - aid which never got to the dying, suffering emaciated babies!). The balance of logic - not emotion shows a very different picture to the one we are currently being fed. As Ron Paul says, why on earth would Assad do this when Russia, the US and Syria were on the verge of peace talks and a joint strategy for fighting ISIS, an agreement that will now never ever happen? Who/which parties and Governments would not want Russia, the US and Syria to find a way of working together to bring stability to the region. Who wants instability and who really hates the Assad regime?

 

This attack could be the catalyst for Iran to become involved - a move that a few countries in the region would relish, and if Iran does become involved then Russia will have no option but to jump in the ring also. It is for these reasons that this move should have gone to Congress. The very reason Obama wanted to go to Congress before attacking Syria - but the Republican Congress would not support him.

 

There is far too much s**t being thrown at the fan for anyone to have a clear assessment of what is really going on here.

 

If Assad wanted to kill his people he would have just carpet bombed the area. he would NOT have used chemical weapons.

 

I'm not the one calling the deception card.

 

My take, as posted earlier, is that things aren't always neatly related. There aren't always good explanations for why things happen. Trump being Trump does not preclude Assad being Assad. Neither is a great leader and both have miscalculated in the past. There is no reason to see either as a master chess player.

 

Assad does not necessarily operate in line with the same reasoning applied. Not that he's irrational, just different takes, goals and perspective. Maybe he didn't take Trump seriously, or maybe capturing Idlib and consolidating control before talks are commenced seemed a worthy goal.

 

It wouldn't be the first attack using chemical weapons carried out by Assad's forces. These happened during the Russian military involvement as well. Russia pretty much shielded Assad on previous occasions, as it does now. If not for the US payback, this too would have been swept in due time by the rapid flow of events.

Edited April 7, 2017 by Morch

[craigt3365]

38 minutes ago, williamgeorgeallen said:

why did assad do this?  he would know the consequences. seems things were going well for him and he was finally making progress.

is not difficult to pop a canister of gas from an upwind location on the ground. could even do it when there is a syrian aircraft overhead.  their airforce has around 500 aircraft in a country one quarter the size of texas i would imagine most populated areas are flown over continuously. having the flight plan of the aircraft that dropped the gas sounds about as likely as them finding the passport on the sidewalk of the hijacker on the 9/11 flight. now that is something that really made me LOL.

Really good question.  Why would Assad do this?  Another good question, why has Assad killed over 200,000 of his own people?  That is mind boggling to me.

[metisdead]

A number of posts containing links to Twitter blogs have been removed as they are non credible sources of information:

 

2) You will not use ThaiVisa.com to post any material which is knowingly or can be reasonably construed as false, inaccurate, invasive of a person's privacy, or otherwise in violation of any law.
 
Troll posts have been removed as well. 

[Orac]

I actually give up here, it is futile.
 
The only thing we can all do that will be beneficial to us ALL as TV members is to discuss the stock we should all be purchasing and any other investment opportunities we should consider whilst a potential full regional conflict erupts including two super powers.
 
Anyone got any starters? I guess it is still not too late for Raytheon shares.

Social media will benefit bigly and could provide a comeback for twitter stock and the prospect of it being know in the future as the Facebook Live War.

[Andaman Al]

Fasten your seat belts!

 

Quote

Russia to reinforce Syrian air defences as Moscow warns of 'considerable damage' to ties with US after missile strike

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/04/07/russia-halts-air-safety-deal-us-syria-warns-considerable-damage/