Removal of stall-holders on Loi Kroh @ Night bazaar

[sanemax]

14 minutes ago, Chiengmaijoe said:

Me-me?  Talk about the pot calling the kettle black! This topic is about the stall-holders, people you have clearly never got to know, yet you insult them (Mafia!) and then offer to apologise about your ignorance if they accept that they are inconveniencing you. They could lose their livelihood but we should all feel sorry for you!  And yes, they are trying to pay for their kids to go to school.

 

The Night bazaar is the one place that I tell tourists to avoid .

Although it is free enterprise and the stall holders can charge what they like, the stall holders ask extortionate prices , even after haggling , you may get them down to double the amount you will pay in other places .

   A tourist rip off area .

Best off going to Saturday and Sunday markets , where they sell things for a reasonable price

 

[stephenterry]

2 minutes ago, Dipterocarp said:

Good riddance. These markets sell junk at high prices, and no the bargaining isn't fun anymore. I used to like the tourist t-shirts, make great gifts. It was OK when you could get one for 120 baht now they want crazy money and the don't budge on prices, it is a cartel.

I needed a shirt suddenly recently so I had to buy one at Night Bazzaar. Sukhothai FC jersey. Vey low quality copy twice as much as the real thing at SportsWorld. I guess tourists just get off on buying something outdoors. They stall holders are also very happy to exploit people and also get aggressive sometimes if you look at stuff and don't buy.

I've bought shirts and shorts from the shops along Chanklan road, and they're reasonable quality and priced accordingly. They're small businesses too, but face daily competition for the stall holders who are parked on the pavements fronting their shops.

[sanemax]

43 minutes ago, Chiengmaijoe said:

There is more malice in your few comments than I've seen in the many years I' ve known these lovely people. Given the choice, I know who I'd rather spend my time with - salt of the earth, warm people or judgemental unsympathtic lost souls - no competition. 

Although you are on a forum spending time with  "judgemental unsympathtic lost souls " , rather than with your "salt of the earth , warm people"

   You do have the choice, but, you are here with us, rather than being there with them .

    BTW , do you go around the stall holders houses for a visit ? Have a meal or a few beers with them ? Do they stop by your house for a visit ?

Edited July 22, 2017 by sanemax

[stephenterry]

2 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Although you are on a forum spending time with  "judgemental unsympathtic lost souls " , rather than with your "salt of the earth , warm people"

   You do have the choice, but, you are here with us, rather than being there with them

[CharlieH]

Flame post and response removed.

 

Any more personal attacks will see those concerned on a posting holiday.

 

7) You will respect fellow members and post in a civil manner. No personal attacks, hateful or insulting towards other members, (flaming) Stalking of members on either the forum or via PM will not be allowed.
 

[stephenterry]

Yes, I've also known a few traders who are 'salt of the earth' genuine warm people, and I've known more who pretend to like you because they see you as having money, and several more that couldn't give a toss whether you lived or died, and even more who try and rip you off, and won't budge. Up to you is their only mantra.

 

So from my personal experience, to put all stall holders of the Night Bazaar area in the first category is simply not factual. 

[Chiengmaijoe]

24 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Although you are on a forum spending time with  "judgemental unsympathtic lost souls " , rather than with your "salt of the earth , warm people"

   You do have the choice, but, you are here with us, rather than being there with them .

    BTW , do you go around the stall holders houses for a visit ? Have a meal or a few beers with them ? Do they stop by your house for a visit ?

I'm on a forum informing people of the plight of some people I know, under threat of losing their livelihood. I can do that and spend time with people I know and like. Yes,  I know some of them personally and they have visited my house. This topic was about them, not you.

[stephenterry]

From what I've read, none of those traders are under threat of losing their livelihoods, as the CM authorities have backed off. I wouldn't want to see any stall holders being forced out, but I'm still going to air my complaint about the ongoing lunchtime racket that would drown out a Thai karaoke bar at full blast. Bear in mind there are several small business restaurants down that stretch whose customers have to endure the daily lunchtime racket. 

 

There must be an alternative solution, like setting up the stalls early morning when no-one is around for example. That's what I call consideration for others.

Edited July 22, 2017 by stephenterry
addition to text.

[Gonzo the Face]

There is a solution for those so bothered....... make your lunch a take-a-way or find another area more suitable to you , for your lunch..  I cannot understand that someone would constantly return to an area for lunch where they are so annoyed.  Its balance..... if its too annoying go somewhere else.....if you like that restaurant so much, it just come with the noise.  We each decide for ourselves,  only Mr.Trump rules the universe. ..... or are you Mr Trump??

[sanemax]

20 minutes ago, Chiengmaijoe said:

I'm on a forum informing people of the plight of some people I know, under threat of losing their livelihood. I can do that and spend time with people I know and like. Yes,  I know some of them personally and they have visited my house.

Those genuine salt of the earth warm hearted stall holders may just have move location and begin to charge reasonable prices and they may have to stop ripping tourists off and to stop causing annoyance to shop keepers and car drivers in that area

[Chiengmaijoe]

21 minutes ago, stephenterry said:

From what I've read, none of those traders are under threat of losing their livelihoods, as the CM authorities have backed off. I wouldn't want to see any stall holders being forced out, but I'm still going to air my complaint about the ongoing lunchtime racket that would drown out a Thai karaoke bar at full blast. Bear in mind there are several small business restaurants down that stretch whose customers have to endure the daily lunchtime racket. 

 

There must be an alternative solution, like setting up the stalls early morning when no-one is around for example. That's what I call consideration for others.

 

There is another meeting next week. Hopefully they win, not Big Business.

Edited July 22, 2017 by Chiengmaijoe

[Chiengmaijoe]

Just now, sanemax said:

Those genuine salt of the earth warm hearted stall holders may just have move location and begin to charge reasonable prices and they may have to stop ripping tourists off and to stop causing annoyance to shop keepers and car drivers in that area

So long as you're happy, that's all that really matters.

[LannaGuy]

Personally I think it's madness setting up and taking down everyday. Compromise and give them a permanent home somewhere.

[sanemax]

21 minutes ago, stephenterry said:

 

There must be an alternative solution, like setting up the stalls early morning when no-one is around for example. That's what I call consideration for others.

They do not finish putting the stalls away until 7 AM and they begin putting them out a 2 PM

  10 hours everyday of putting the stalls up and down , the properties above the shops along the road are derelict , because no one can live there because of the noise of the carts .

   Surely they can invent some better , less noisy, easier to erect stalls, than the current ones .

[jobin]

Whoa Gonzo!  You've gone too far by invoking Trump into this discussion.  

 

And i'd like to add that when the flea market was on its last legs and threatened with removal there were many theories floating about, on these pages, as to the REAL reasons why.  Traffic disruption was the reason the cops gave in closing the market. 

Were there other reasons some even more powerful than traffic?  We will never know coz this in not an open and transparent society nor do the cops always tell the whole and truthful story.  

Ask yourself why is Mr Boss RedBull not in the slammer for killing a cop?  The reason given, by the police, is that the cops cannot locate him.   Do you believe that?

 

So maybe there was some traffic headaches for 1/2 days a week near Prince Royals, but in truth, maybe some bigger, unspoken, reasons also exist.

Who among us, the farang, can tell the entire story when even the Thais are denied entrance to the 'facts'?

[thaibeachlovers]

8 hours ago, jobin said:

Recall the Saturday flea market next to Prince Royal College?  Now gone completely, of course since it disturbed the city fathers, or some rich elite who did not like the view.

 

Cheap-o stalls, blankets on the road, also disturb the city bosses as it degrades THEIR image of prosperous Chiang Mai.

image of prosperous Chiang Mai.

5555555555555555555

The parts I have walked around are decrepit, broken and dirty. I don't think they have spent any money on maintenance in 20 years.

 

As for those stalls on Loi Kroh, they are a pain in the you know where and should be removed to somewhere they are not forcing me to walk in the road. The ones blocking the pavement on either side of Kampaengdin Rd are especially annoying, as the road is full of vehicles and dangerous to walk on.

It's not like the night markets aren't full of stalls selling the exact same junk.

Edited July 22, 2017 by thaibeachlovers

[sanemax]

10 minutes ago, LannaGuy said:

Personally I think it's madness setting up and taking down everyday. Compromise and give them a permanent home somewhere.

There is plenty of room in the immediate area for them to set up permanently

The building behind the McDonalds  , the building diagonally opposite Panthip Plaza . The building in the Meridian hotel , the building where Pizza hut is . All just sitting there empty

    More than enough space for them all to set up permanent stalls

[sanemax]

17 minutes ago, jobin said:

Whoa Gonzo!  You've gone too far by invoking Trump into this discussion.  

 

And i'd like to add that when the flea market was on its last legs and threatened with removal there were many theories floating about, on these pages, as to the REAL reasons why.  Traffic disruption was the reason the cops gave in closing the market. 

Were there other reasons some even more powerful than traffic?  We will never know coz this in not an open and transparent society nor do the cops always tell the whole and truthful story.  

Ask yourself why is Mr Boss RedBull not in the slammer for killing a cop?  The reason given, by the police, is that the cops cannot locate him.   Do you believe that?

 

So maybe there was some traffic headaches for 1/2 days a week near Prince Royals, but in truth, maybe some bigger, unspoken, reasons also exist.

Who among us, the farang, can tell the entire story when even the Thais are denied entrance to the 'facts'?

I do not wish to come across like your Thai GF......................but...............you really do .............think too mutt

[cyberfarang]

The night market lost it`s allure long ago as did the LK and surrounding areas.

 

Filthy, congested and ugly.  The whole lot should be cleared away,  it`s become an eyesore at the centre of the city and has well past it`s sell by date. The only time I visit there is if I am passing through on my way to somewhere else.

 

Not flaming. Facts are facts and I`m telling it how it is.

[scottiejohn]

5 hours ago, stephenterry said:

the noise and disruption to pedestrians while they're setting up their stalls in this whole area is gross.

I have been a frequent visitor to the Red Lion and a number of other smaller establishments in the area under discussion at various times of the day from 11AM-11PM. (I don’t stay in those bars all day!)

Yes there is noise from the carts being moved from the storage area to their locations but there is no way that noise can be described as 'gross' or even excessive. The noise of MC’s being revved up and the constant noise from adjacent bars/outlets and hotel parking attendant whistles is much more disturbing (if it really bothers you)!

 

Also note that most of the stalls being moved along that stretch of road are not for that bit of road under the OP’s discussion but for putting out on the main road/market area.　

　

Let the locals have their livelihood and the tourists their fun.

 

You appear to be a resident and if so you have choices. I like the area and frequent it, if you don’t like it, don’t come to it.

Edited July 22, 2017 by scottiejohn

[evenstevens]

2 hours ago, cmsally said:

I think you will find that these stalls are what encourages "foot traffic". By keeping the shopping activity spread out and diverse, it encourages foot traffic in a big way.

If it weren't for those stalls , I would imagine the small businesses on this stretch of road would lose a lot of foot traffic, hence they would lose a lot of sales/customers. Everyone in retail knows that more foot traffic leads to more sales.

 

foot traffic in E/S stable   is Passing Trade, absoulately vital to any business big or small, and anywhere  for that matter.

fully agree  with the O/P sentiments,and with  full respect disagree with Stephenterry comments

  E/S clearly remembers  despite my  advancing drinking days,the night bazaar,s birth  out of that vacant peice of dirt next to the old Pornping Hotel(now their carpark) around 1984 or so, then it  threaded   its way to Changklan Rd and onwards  for prosperity to all (,mafia included) pulling part of the old night bazaar  down,would be a sad step  for everyone concerned, ,  particular E/S who still luv,s a sticky beak and a drink  in the Night Bazaar Area , when he gallopps into town

its a Chantays nice late arvo to all

[Chiengmaijoe]

1 hour ago, cyberfarang said:

The night market lost it`s allure long ago as did the LK and surrounding areas.

 

Filthy, congested and ugly.  The whole lot should be cleared away,  it`s become an eyesore at the centre of the city and has well past it`s sell by date. The only time I visit there is if I am passing through on my way to somewhere else.

 

Not flaming. Facts are facts and I`m telling it how it is.

The tourists love it still. Been here to long, maybe? because as ES said, it was a dump 30 years ago, and relatively speaking, much more interesting now. 

[thaibeachlovers]

1 hour ago, cyberfarang said:

The night market lost it`s allure long ago as did the LK and surrounding areas.

 

Filthy, congested and ugly.  The whole lot should be cleared away,  it`s become an eyesore at the centre of the city and has well past it`s sell by date. The only time I visit there is if I am passing through on my way to somewhere else.

 

Not flaming. Facts are facts and I`m telling it how it is.

I doubt you are referring to the ACTUAL night market, but to the stalls along the road, and I agree with removing the ones from the Mcd's corner along to the traffic lights past Pantip. However, IMO, pedestrians going the other way will be mainly there for the stalls, so they could stay.

The ACTUAL night market and Anusorn night market are fine as they are, and don't obstruct anything.

[CharlieH]

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[cmsally]

6 minutes ago, Chiengmaijoe said:

The tourists love it still. Been here to long, maybe? because as ES said, it was a dump 30 years ago, and relatively speaking, much more interesting now. 

I might have to disagree in the fact "its more interesting now".

There was much more "stuff" available in the past and some amazing ideas and crafts.

Does anyone remember the "sand gecko" craze when people shipping container loads of those things. They were on everyone's shopping list.  Then not to the same extent came the wooden frogs and the list goes on !

I think that the stalls are still there on the street is an indication of consumer behaviour. People are very lazy to get off the" track" Having those stalls keeps them walking. For example , how many people would bother with Anusarn if there weren't stalls along the way to look at.

 

A lot of the ideas to fill empty spaces in buildings just wouldn't work because of the rent expected.

Then backs of buildings and higher floors don't get foot traffic so no sales.

[scottiejohn]

50 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I agree with removing the ones from the Mcd's corner along to the traffic lights past Pantip

This is not quite part of the OP's original topic but I am interested as to why you want to remove stalls only from the section from Mcd's to Pantip, why not the whole of Changklan road?

 

This is either the 'Night Bazaar' area, 'stalls and all' and connected to 'Annusan Market', (by the stalls) and local areas or is it just to be a 'normal' road in CM.

 

Do you want an area with 'character', and by definition tourists and money into the economy or just a noisy traffic thoroughfare?

 

Edited July 22, 2017 by scottiejohn

[cyberfarang]

55 minutes ago, Chiengmaijoe said:

The tourists love it still. Been here to long, maybe? because as ES said, it was a dump 30 years ago, and relatively speaking, much more interesting now. 

Agreed it was a dump 30 years ago, but during those times the area had character, with a clutter of open bars, the night market had an old world charm about it and stacks of bustling bars. But now it has lost it`s charm, it`s like nothing to see here folks, move along please. I can only describe it as nondescript.

 

Doubt if many would miss it if the whole lot disappeared over night. I wouldn`t anyway.

[evenstevens]

14 minutes ago, cyberfarang said:

Agreed it was a dump 30 years ago, but during those times the area had character, with a clutter of open bars, the night market had an old world charm about it and stacks of bustling bars.

cannot recall a clutter of  open bars, of 30 years ago( approx), flat out like a lizard  looking for a drink in the middays hot sun,back in those days

from memory only a couple open, and a wild shot was a bamboo named bar,and a aussie ran it,then there was one nearly next door, perhaps a old timer can confirm my experiences around 1985

cannot  remember a night market at all with stacks of  bustling bars(, think the Goodview open its doorsr perhaps a short time later around then,) it was indeed a  dry  city for a drink,and getting a JUMP  was practically  a mission impossible,unless you had the handsome looks as E/S

its    a Ian Poulter nice early evening to all

[Sandy Freckle]

10 hours ago, evenstevens said:

cannot recall a clutter of  open bars, of 30 years ago( approx), flat out like a lizard  looking for a drink in the middays hot sun,back in those days

from memory only a couple open, and a wild shot was a bamboo named bar,and a aussie ran it,then there was one nearly next door, perhaps a old timer can confirm my experiences around 1985

cannot  remember a night market at all with stacks of  bustling bars(, think the Goodview open its doorsr perhaps a short time later around then,) it was indeed a  dry  city for a drink,and getting a JUMP  was practically  a mission impossible,unless you had the handsome looks as E/S

its    a Ian Poulter nice early evening to all

Yep..., I also can't  remember..., but I was a hippie back then so flat out remembering anything ha ha.
....., then again..., maybe I wasn't even there.
It's a Fat Cat good morning to all. 

Edited July 22, 2017 by Sandy Freckle

[JaseTheBass]

God forbid that footpaths be clear of people selling tat here. Hopefully all the footpath markets will be a thing of the past soon as they are a pain to both pedestrians and motorists wherever they're set up.

Sent from my Cray II supercomputer