Boonsong suffers the fate of the ‘hired gun’

[Siripon]

8 minutes ago, tomta said:

Are you quite sure that the possibility of this event did not enter into their planning? And even so, how does this event give the military the right to deny elections? The Thai people are quite capable of having democracy even when events happen as they always do . "British prime minister, Harold Macmillan, was once asked what was the most difficult thing about his job. ‘Events, dear boy, events’ was his now famous reply." (The Guardian). He still managed to hold elections.

Please do not compare UK and Thai politics. It is like comparing guavas to mangoes.

[tomta]

8 minutes ago, Siripon said:

Please do not compare UK and Thai politics. It is like comparing guavas to mangoes.

I was not comparing British politics and Thai politics. I was talking about the underlying forces, as I believe MacMillan was, that shape all human activity including politics. Stuff happens.

[halloween]

1 hour ago, pornprong said:

Looks like somebody has no idea how Thai democracy works.

Who would have though that pro-junta posters base their anti democracy views on biased assumptions without bothering to look for easily available proof?

 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_MPs_elected_in_the_Thai_general_election,_2011

 

Thank you, I stand corrected.

BTW he won't be re-elected in this lifetime.

[scorecard]

1 minute ago, halloween said:

Thank you, I stand corrected.

BTW he won't be re-elected in this lifetime.

 

And hopefully his puppet master will eventually also be in jail (and shamed) for cheewit duration.

[pornprong]

14 minutes ago, scorecard said:

 

And hopefully his puppet master will eventually also be in jail (and shamed) for cheewit duration.

And what would you like to see happen to Prayuth?

[halloween]

1 hour ago, tomta said:

How much time must expire before we can call  a temporary situation a permanent one? I guess that's why you use the screaming capitals of CURRENT. Don't forget the 20 years during which whatever government emerges must adhere to the policies of some nameless, unelected "reform" bureaucrats. Even Stalin only had five  year plans. I suppose we must be thankful they didn't go for the 1000 year plan

If it was a choice between permanent and going back to the way things were, I would be ambivalent. the best we can hope for is an eventual return to democracy of a vastly superior form than the Shin era, which shouldn't be hard to achieve.

[halloween]

1 minute ago, pornprong said:

And what would you like to see happen to Prayuth?

The topic is Boonsong. Do you think the voters of 7th district Chiang Mai will vote PTP again after their last candidate turned out to be a criminal who helped rob the nation of billions of baht?

[pornprong]

Just now, halloween said:

If it was a choice between permanent and going back to the way things were, I would be ambivalent. the best we can hope for is an eventual return to democracy of a vastly superior form than the Shin era, which shouldn't be hard to achieve.

In what fashion would it be vastly superior?

During the "Shin era" at least the governments were of the peoples choosing and they could be replaced by the people choosing to vote them out.

How exactly in the "vastly superior form" do you get rid of unelected Senators?

 

As for your ambivalence, it's irrelevant.

What matters is what the Thai people want and if 1976, 1992 and 2010 are any indication, it is democracy they want.

[pornprong]

1 minute ago, halloween said:

The topic is Boonsong. Do you think the voters of 7th district Chiang Mai will vote PTP again after their last candidate turned out to be a criminal who helped rob the nation of billions of baht?

I think the voters of the 7th district of Chiang Mai would overwhelming vote for both PTP and Boonsong again.

 

Unlike timid supporters of fascism, the voters of Chiang  Mai see things for what they are and know an elected government has been illegally overthrown and a political witch hunt aimed at tarnishing democracy has been in full swing since May 22 2014.

[halloween]

Just now, pornprong said:

I think the voters of the 7th district of Chiang Mai would overwhelming vote for both PTP and Boonsong again.

 

Unlike timid supporters of fascism, the voters of Chiang  Mai see things for what they are and know an elected government has been illegally overthrown and a political witch hunt aimed at tarnishing democracy has been in full swing since May 22 2014.

So you and the voters of CM think Boonsong is innocent despite the evidence presented? Oh, that's right you don't know and you don't want to know. And you think Thai voters are like you?

[pornprong]

23 minutes ago, halloween said:

So you and the voters of CM think Boonsong is innocent despite the evidence presented? Oh, that's right you don't know and you don't want to know. And you think Thai voters are like you?

I don't trust the Thai courts.

The damage the Yellows have done to the already shaky reputation of the Thai judicial system will take decades to repair.

What makes it even worse is that the have destroyed what semblance of justice there was in order to deny democracy.

That's right, not to fight corruption, but to destroy democracy.

 

Boonsong won't serve 42 years.

Long before then democracy will win out over ultra-nationalist fascist crap and there will be a mass release of those wrongfully convicted and amnesty for those whose sentences are politically motivated.

[greenchair]

13 minutes ago, pornprong said:

I don't trust the Thai courts.

The damage the Yellows have done to the already shaky reputation of the Thai judicial system will take decades to repair.

What makes it even worse is that the have destroyed what semblance of justice there was in order to deny democracy.

That's right, not to fight corruption, but to destroy democracy.

 

Boonsong won't serve 42 years.

Long before then democracy will win out over ultra-nationalist fascist crap and there will be a mass release of those wrongfully convicted and amnesty for those whose sentences are politically motivated.

We all live in hope. 

But before that will happen, it will have to get really bad for the poor. 

It's not bad enough for them to risk their lives right now. 

[Siripon]

52 minutes ago, pornprong said:

I think the voters of the 7th district of Chiang Mai would overwhelming vote for both PTP and Boonsong again.

 

Unlike timid supporters of fascism, the voters of Chiang  Mai see things for what they are and know an elected government has been illegally overthrown and a political witch hunt aimed at tarnishing democracy has been in full swing since May 22 2014.

Do you know who Boonsong was the hired gun for, the title of this thread?  That person is from Chiang Mai and Boonsong is now serving a long term in prison because of that person.

The cousin of Apisit, Suranand , a long term supporter of Pheua Thai,  could not take it any longer that his friend Boonsong had gone to jail for his boss, a very rich person from Chiang  Mai.

Although Suranand  had served Pheua Thai loyally for several years in various positions, finally he could not stand seeing the minions of the Shinawats going to jail for their crimes of their bosses.

 

 

[pornprong]

7 minutes ago, Siripon said:

Do you know who Boonsong was the hired gun for, the title of this thread?  That person is from Chiang Mai and Boonsong is now serving a long term in prison because of that person.

The cousin of Apisit, Suranand , a long term supporter of Pheua Thai,  could not take it any longer that his friend Boonsong had gone to jail for his boss, a very rich person from Chiang  Mai.

Although Suranand  had served Pheua Thai loyally for several years in various positions, finally he could not stand seeing the minions of the Shinawats going to jail for their crimes of their bosses.

 

 

Your post says exactly why Boonsong is in jail.

[Siripon]

10 minutes ago, pornprong said:

Your post says exactly why Boonsong is in jail.

You are right- Boonsong is in jail because he committed several corrupt acts under the orders of an important person in Chiang Mai, causing  large losses to the country.

[pornprong]

11 hours ago, Siripon said:

You are right- Boonsong is in jail because he committed several corrupt acts under the orders of an important person in Chiang Mai, causing  large losses to the country.

He implemented a (somewhat flawed) public policy that had won a mandate from the people of Thailand in the 2011 election.

His crime is tho be a member of a party that is by far the most popular inThailand thereby rendering the elites null and void when it comes to democracy.

 

As for causing losses to the country - how much do you think coups cost the economy (a damn site more than the rice scheme that's for sure) and how much to you think protecting industries owned by billionaires from competition costs the country (a damn site more than the rice scheme that's for sure).

 

The big difference I see in posters here is that some want what is best for Thailand and its people while others just want to punish Thaksin for crimes both real and imagined.

This brings me to ask myself - why the obsession with Thaksin?

The only answer there is, is that those particular posters are using opposition to Thaksin as a means to hide their real political views from which I guess they must be too embarrassed to admit straight up.

All other sad really, don't you think?

[robblok]

20 minutes ago, pornprong said:

He implemented a (somewhat flawed) public policy that had won a mandate from the people of Thailand in the 2011 election.

His crime is tho be a member of a party that is by far the most popular inThailand thereby rendering the elites null and void when it comes to democracy.

 

As for causing losses to the country - how much do you think coups cost the economy (a damn site more than the rice scheme that's for sure) and how much to you think protecting industries owned by billionaires from competition costs the country (a damn site more than the rice scheme that's for sure).

 

The big difference I see in posters here is that some want what is best for Thailand and its people while others just want to punish Thaksin for crimes both real and imagined.

This brings me to ask myself - why the obsession with Thaksin?

The only answer there is, is that those particular posters are using opposition to Thaksin as a means to hide their real political views from which I guess they must be too embarrassed to admit straight up.

All other sad really, don't you think?

Why are you lying os much, he is in jail for corruption, fake G2G deals costing the goverment around 30 billion. Why can't you just admit the facts. People like you love to rewrite history. This has nothing to do with the rice scheme as such but corruption in it where he was a key figure. 

[pornprong]

1 hour ago, robblok said:

Why are you lying os much, he is in jail for corruption, fake G2G deals costing the goverment around 30 billion. Why can't you just admit the facts. People like you love to rewrite history. This has nothing to do with the rice scheme as such but corruption in it where he was a key figure. 

You think he's in jail for corruption. 

 

 

Boonsong may or may not be guilty - anyone with an ounce of sense would have absolutely zero faith in the Thai courts when they are dealing with political cases.

 

Why is Boonsong in jail and yet so many others guilty of corruption roam free (for example Suthep and his corruption involved in the building of 396 police stations under Abhisits government or the Generals involved in the corruption during the construction of Rajabhakti park or Suthep again for the Sor Por Kor 4-01 land scandal???)

 

Do you believe only PTP affiliated Thais are guilty of corruption?

If not, then can you explain why all the court decisions handed down are so one sided?

 

If you support the coup and don't want democracy, freedom and equality in Thailand that's fine - but you look silly when you try to defend the indefensible.

 

Here are three undeniable points of fact:

 

The Thais courts are not impartial, they are in fact heavily politicised.

The Junta does not want democracy - ever.

Corruption is endemic in Thailand and it has gone up under the Junta.

 

Any thing you or anyone else posts contradicting these three points is inane, silly, farcical nonsense.

 

 

[robblok]

30 minutes ago, pornprong said:

You think he's in jail for corruption. 

 

 

Boonsong may or may not be guilty - anyone with an ounce of sense would have absolutely zero faith in the Thai courts when they are dealing with political cases.

 

Why is Boonsong in jail and yet so many others guilty of corruption roam free (for example Suthep and his corruption involved in the building of 396 police stations under Abhisits government or the Generals involved in the corruption during the construction of Rajabhakti park or Suthep again for the Sor Por Kor 4-01 land scandal???)

 

Do you believe only PTP affiliated Thais are guilty of corruption?

If not, then can you explain why all the court decisions handed down are so one sided?

 

If you support the coup and don't want democracy, freedom and equality in Thailand that's fine - but you look silly when you try to defend the indefensible.

 

Here are three undeniable points of fact:

 

The Thais courts are not impartial, they are in fact heavily politicised.

The Junta does not want democracy - ever.

Corruption is endemic in Thailand and it has gone up under the Junta.

 

Any thing you or anyone else posts contradicting these three points is inane, silly, farcical nonsense.

 

 

Again deflections because you don't want to retract your lies, Boonsong IS guilty and convicted by a court of law. Everyone knew these rice deals were fake this has been public knowledge before so they now proved it in court too. Your just one of those other Shin apologists who does not want to face reality. The guy is guilty. 

 

There are plenty of corrupt PTP people NOT in jail and unfortunately also plenty of Yellow and generals NOT in jail for corruption that has zero bearing on the fact of Boonsong is guilty or not. There have been democrats convicted for corruption. You are missing out on a very important detail, the PTP was in power most of the time so had most of the chance to be corrupt not the Democrats that explains a lot.

 

I am not defending the junta here, I am defending a court case that shows a corrupt criminal and shows the corruption in the rice program. Its sad you can't see the difference but then again your so red sighted its not suprising.

 

What the junta want or not want is no care of mine, i want them gone and I want a democracy, but a real one this time.. not one where once people are voted in they break the law and think they can get away without punishment.. thank fully Boonsong did not escape justice. If Democrats or army guys are convicted you will hear me cheer too. 

[pornprong]

21 minutes ago, robblok said:

Again deflections because you don't want to retract your lies, Boonsong IS guilty and convicted by a court of law. Everyone knew these rice deals were fake this has been public knowledge before so they now proved it in court too. Your just one of those other Shin apologists who does not want to face reality. The guy is guilty. 

Not deflections but accurate statements of affairs as they stand.

 

Boonsong has been found guilty by the same judicial system that convicted the obviously innocent Burmese lads and released the obviously guilty popcorn gunman.

He maybe guilty and he may not be guilty - any sane person has zero confidence in the Thai judiciary.

 

21 minutes ago, robblok said:

There are plenty of corrupt PTP people NOT in jail and unfortunately also plenty of Yellow and generals NOT in jail for corruption that has zero bearing on the fact of Boonsong is guilty or not. There have been democrats convicted for corruption. You are missing out on a very important detail, the PTP was in power most of the time so had most of the chance to be corrupt not the Democrats that explains a lot.

It does have a bearing - one side of politics has been targeted and the laws bent and twisted to convict them whilst the other side has been let off scot free.

 

The unrest started in late 2005, since then:

Coup government from 2006 until late 2007

Abhisit government from 2008 until 2011

Coup government from 2014 until 2017

 

Not really much time left in between for PTP to govern (even less if you also deduct the street mob enforced caretaker government periods).

 

Why must you continue to repeat outright untruths?

 

21 minutes ago, robblok said:

I am not defending the junta here, I am defending a court case that shows a corrupt criminal and shows the corruption in the rice program. Its sad you can't see the difference but then again your so red sighted its not suprising.

The courts are part of the Junta - you are defending the junta!

 

Why have the courts let all of the yellows walk free and locked up the reds?

Doesn't take a genius to work it out,.

 

21 minutes ago, robblok said:

What the junta want or not want is no care of mine, i want them gone and I want a democracy, but a real one this time.. not one where once people are voted in they break the law and think they can get away without punishment.. thank fully Boonsong did not escape justice. If Democrats or army guys are convicted you will hear me cheer too. 

You don't want a real democracy.

The junta constitution is not a democratic constitution and here you are supporting it.

The most democratic constitution Thailand has had is the 1997 one and the military has twice now moved to make Thailand less democratic with their own dud constitutions yet you somehow think that a real democracy is somehow going to arise out of undemocratic constitutions.....that is what is sad.

 

 

[robblok]

20 minutes ago, pornprong said:

Not deflections but accurate statements of affairs as they stand.

 

Boonsong has been found guilty by the same judicial system that convicted the obviously innocent Burmese lads and released the obviously guilty popcorn gunman.

He maybe guilty and he may not be guilty - any sane person has zero confidence in the Thai judiciary.

 

It does have a bearing - one side of politics has been targeted and the laws bent and twisted to convict them whilst the other side has been let off scot free.

 

The unrest started in late 2005, since then:

Coup government from 2006 until late 2007

Abhisit government from 2008 until 2011

Coup government from 2014 until 2017

 

Not really much time left in between for PTP to govern (even less if you also deduct the street mob enforced caretaker government periods).

 

Why must you continue to repeat outright untruths?

 

The courts are part of the Junta - you are defending the junta!

 

Why have the courts let all of the yellows walk free and locked up the reds?

Doesn't take a genius to work it out,.

 

You don't want a real democracy.

The junta constitution is not a democratic constitution and here you are supporting it.

The most democratic constitution Thailand has had is the 1997 one and the military has twice now moved to make Thailand less democratic with their own dud constitutions yet you somehow think that a real democracy is somehow going to arise out of undemocratic constitutions.....that is what is sad.

 

 

What you are saying is that your defending corruption that is so obvious a blind man can see. You don't want to admit it because it also cast doubts on YL her case. I understand that its hard to see your hero's  turning out not to be hero's but corrupt.. or negligent.

 

Im leaving it here as you can't even accept proof and convictions, just that one case might not be air tight does not mean this one is not. You have not even tried to defend the guy based on evidence. That shows enough. Most on your side accept the guy is corrupt but your a rare breed, I will no longer debate with you as its impossible to debate with people who wont accept basic facts.

[pornprong]

10 minutes ago, robblok said:

What you are saying is that your defending corruption that is so obvious a blind man can see. You don't want to admit it because it also cast doubts on YL her case. I understand that its hard to see your hero's  turning out not to be hero's but corrupt.. or negligent.

What I am saying is that the Thai courts have zero credibility and less than zero credibility when it comes to political cases.

None of the Shinawatra's are my heroes.

I would be just as comfortable with an elected Prayuth as an elected Yingluck or an elected Abhisit.

I prefer democracy to dictatorship, tyranny, fascism and plutocracy, that is all.

 

10 minutes ago, robblok said:

Im leaving it here as you can't even accept proof and convictions, just that one case might not be air tight does not mean this one is not. You have not even tried to defend the guy based on evidence. That shows enough. Most on your side accept the guy is corrupt but your a rare breed, I will no longer debate with you as its impossible to debate with people who wont accept basic facts.

Many cases are not air tight, the majority of political cases aren't air tight and worse still, there are many air tight cases that don't even make it to the courts.

He may be corrupt, he may not, unfortunately the Thai courts have zero credibility so we may never really know then truth.

I for one, would be willing to bet a large sum of money that this guy does not serve the full 42 years.

Once democracy returns, the injustice served up to Boonsong and many, many others will be rectified and they will be released.

 

[Siripon]

Just now, pornprong said:

What I am saying is that the Thai courts have zero credibility and less than zero credibility when it comes to political cases.

None of the Shinawatra's are my heroes.

I would be just as comfortable with an elected Prayuth as an elected Yingluck or an elected Abhisit.

I prefer democracy to dictatorship, tyranny, fascism and plutocracy, that is all.

 

Many cases are not air tight, the majority of political cases aren't air tight and worse still, there are many air tight cases that don't even make it to the courts.

He may be corrupt, he may not, unfortunately the Thai courts have zero credibility so we may never really know then truth.

I for one, would be willing to bet a large sum of money that this guy does not serve the full 42 years.

Once democracy returns, the injustice served up to Boonsong and many, many others will be rectified and they will be released.

 

Why don't you read the court's verdict and its reasons for his guilt.

The fake G to g contracts, the assistance of certain rice mills

Of course he won't serve 42 years if he behaves himself. Possibly a third or less of his sentence as Rakkiart did. Maybe less if he reveals his paymaster.

[halloween]

2 minutes ago, Siripon said:

Why don't you read the court's verdict and its reasons for his guilt.

The fake G to g contracts, the assistance of certain rice mills

Of course he won't serve 42 years if he behaves himself. Possibly a third or less of his sentence as Rakkiart did. Maybe less if he reveals his paymaster.

The court's verdict doesn't matter because he doesn't trust the courts.

The evidence presented in parliament by the Democrats doesn't matter because he knows they are just BKK elite.

The evidence reported in the press doesn't matter because he knows the press is restricted by the junta.

The only evidence acceptable is that of PTP elected MPs (as opposed to stinking Democrats who bought their seats) and Chalerm said there was no corruption.

So as he wasn't there at the time, or involved in the scam, or possibly that he was, he just doesn't know but innocent until proven guilty, but not by the biased Thai courts.

[pornprong]

1 hour ago, halloween said:

The court's verdict doesn't matter because he doesn't trust the courts.

The evidence presented in parliament by the Democrats doesn't matter because he knows they are just BKK elite.

The evidence reported in the press doesn't matter because he knows the press is restricted by the junta.

The only evidence acceptable is that of PTP elected MPs (as opposed to stinking Democrats who bought their seats) and Chalerm said there was no corruption.

So as he wasn't there at the time, or involved in the scam, or possibly that he was, he just doesn't know but innocent until proven guilty, but not by the biased Thai courts.

Look at you all excited about evidence.

Too bad you didn't take minute to look for a bit of it before posting that Boonsong was never elected.

Keep it up son, you're headed in the right direction.

[halloween]

1 hour ago, pornprong said:

Look at you all excited about evidence.

Too bad you didn't take minute to look for a bit of it before posting that Boonsong was never elected.

Keep it up son, you're headed in the right direction.

Actually I did google his name plus MP, no hits, just hundreds of sites discussing the evidence against him and his sentence.

I guess you missed them, or do you avoid sites that don't follow the red message?

Edited September 7, 2017 by halloween

[Eric Loh]

7 minutes ago, halloween said:

Actually I did google his name plus MP, no hits, just hundreds of sites discussing the evidence against him and his sentence.

I guess you missed them, or do you avoid sites that don't follow the red message?

You seem to know a lot on this case. Like to ask your opinion whether the 42 years sentencing for 847 M Baht G to G rice fraud was appropriate compare to 20 years for Sondi's 1.08 B bank fraud.

[halloween]

Just now, Eric Loh said:

You seem to know a lot on this case. Like to ask your opinion whether the 42 years sentencing for 847 M Baht G to G rice fraud was appropriate compare to 20 years for Sondi's 1.08 B bank fraud.

What " 847 M Baht G to G rice fraud "?

[Eric Loh]

3 minutes ago, halloween said:

What " 847 M Baht G to G rice fraud "?

englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/ex-minister-boonsong-20-others-faulted-corru...

 

[halloween]

2 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/ex-minister-boonsong-20-others-faulted-corru...

 

try again