Enormous Shakeup Of Visa And Immigration Rules

[Tolley]

I think if you come thru the airport it is going to be very hard to enforce these new visa rules.

The airlines are not going to be too happy if they have to repatriate people refused entry based on these new rules.

I have over 20 Thailand entry stamps already in my passport along with many Middle East stamps. It would be quite a lengthy process to go thru my passport to check what was what.

I go along with the border crossings being able to do it but the airport is a different kettle of fish.

[dsfbrit]

I still can't see them count the days visually. If I stay in Thailnd for a 180 day period, I probably have gone in and out for 12-15 trips out of the Thai country. I may have total over 90 days or less in the 180 day period. There is just simply no visual way to count the total days from tons of stamps of all the nations unless the immigration check in staff can do remote viewing or have psychic abilities.

Also the highlighter use seem up to the immigtation staff. I did not have any highlighter on visa stamps and a my friend has 2 visa stamps after Oct 1, one has highlighter, one doesn't have.

If you have a passport with only few stamps, and have 3 obvious stamps of Thailand, then its obvious and easy to count, but for many of us who are in and out constantly, the only way to keep track the total days is by a very advanced computer program that has to be connected to every single immigration computer at every corner of Thai. The program has to set the day of the begining of each person's 180 day cycle, since each one came in diffrent time after Oct1, then add all the entry days each visit, since each person has different number of visits and different number of stay days each visit. This system is the only possible way to calculate the total days of each person, if the Thai really want to enforce the rule, the system is the only way, othwerwise, there is no simple way to do by visual unless you have only a few visa stamps.

The Pattaya Expats club gave a talk on all these changes a couple of weeks ago. It was stated there, as in other threads on TV, that the days will be automatically counted by computer.

However, they pointed out that there are only 16 points of entry at the moment that have computer systems in place to deal with this. One of those is - naturally - the new airport. They did not detail the other 15?

Neither did they say how entry points that are not yet a part of the computer network would handle this, but did point out it currently takes up to a month or so for data collected manually to be input into the computer network - I assume this is part of the same network that is used at Suvarnabumi?

If indeed this is the case - and Pattaya Expats Club have been pretty good up to now with info on these visa changes - then with a time lag of up to 1 month with manual input - it would seem difficult/impossible to me to accurately count these days???

Edited October 18, 2006 by dsfbrit

[PREM-R]

They will not need to count the days until 60 days from your first entry after 1st October [think about it logically], then the fun starts! I think they are highlighting the stamps because many passports like mine, have Thai and Malaysian entry/exit stamps squeezed into every availabel space between my Libyan stamps. So without highlighters and sequence of numbers they would be hard to find quickly.

Is this the case?, If you entered Thailand on, say, 29th September you would be due you next "visa run" on 29th October. Surely, the 29 days you have spent in Thailand since 1st October will count towards your 90 days and out, or am I wrong?

[Tolley]

I haven't read the whole thread so apologies if this is already answered but is there a policy in place for airlines officials to check passports for stamps and days spent in Thailand for passengers going to Thailand?

[djlest]

BEWARE!!!!

90 DAY TOURIST VISA FROM PHOM PENN WILL COST YOU DEARLY!!!!

HELLO ALL....

Reporting my Oct 13th 60/90 day Visa trip to Pnohm Penn (PLEASE DON'T DO IT!)

With regards to the the new shake up of VISA laws... read this and be fully aware!

Everytime you leave THAILAND don't count on getting back in,

or getting any VISA from the Embassy either,

at least not in ASIA anymore! for certain!

Its tried, tested and proved now that its entirely based on how they feel and your luck on the day!

So always take extra money, credit cards, and a phone wherever you go!

and be prepared for an expensive waste of time too...

BE fully prepared to not get what you expect!

and possibly a 3 month wait to get back into Thailand!

Sorry to say this but i believe Thailand has BIG plans for us Farang...

So before your VISA RUNS

kiss your GF and dog goodbye, prefereby not at the same time.

And make sure your rent is fully paid 3 months in advance and everything is locked away safe, and that your GF does not have any Keys or access into your beloved Hut.

MY ADVICE IF YOU HAVE BEEN HERE A WHILE ON VISA RUNS!

DO NOT under any circumstances fly to (Cambodia) PNOHM PENN for the new 90 day tourist VISA....or the 60 + 30 Tourist visa, whatever they really issue these days!

its still a blur with what is actually available...

OKAY! the story.....

I myself have been doing the 30 day poipet visa run for the last 15 months...

When we heard about the new Visa laws restricting the ammount of border runs to 3, we thought...

We would play safe and take a trip to PNOHM PEN by air.

And appy for a 60 day tourist visa, then extend it 30 days.

Then we can return back to the 3X30 day trips if the need to do so around DEC time!

giving us 6 months, right?

Thus, giving us a window of opportunity to see if this VISA shake will infact die down and return back to normal, as this is Thailand afterall.

or if not!

At least it might give us more time to work something out and get some more facts....

anyway....

My particular facts below were learnt the hard way!

and since very few are actually posting facts here, which are tried and tested and derived from reality instead of rumours, be very aware!

so, you are expecting to get your 90 day visas in DECEMBER?

after your 3x30day stamps have ran out huh?

well read on...

Arrived at PNOMM PENN EMBASSY Tuesday morning!

(applications must be before 11am) failure to do so and you need to stay another day.

So we stayed another day before applying. Wednesday morning!

Applied for the 60 day tourist VISA and paid 25 dollars fee...

Embassy took my passport with a smile and told me it would take 2 working days to process the 60 day visa.

Ofcourse i had a prebooked flight for friday morning, which was lost as a result and non refundable. ofcourse this is my mistake entirely and i don't blame the embassy whatsoever for the 11am deadline for VISA applications as stupid as it may be.

So, 3 days waiting in Pnomm penn, not too mention another flight for 79 $ for Sat morning...

but my fault i guess! and at least i was going to get a 3 month visa out of all this.

WOW! Without anymore border runs, so i was still saving money anyway, or so i thought!

So, 3 days and 30 girls later

I return to the Thai Embassy, excited to get my new 60 day VISA with a 30 day possible extension.

When i get to the desk the THAI guy laughs at me as he throws my passport back and says

"NO VISA"

i say politely, oh! why? what do you mean? i waited 3 days and i paid $25...

he says to read the attatched note inside my passport....

So i did!

and i quote!

YOUR VISA IS NOT APPROVED

YOU HAVE LONG STAY IN THAILAND

SINCE AUG 2005 UNTIL 9 OCT 2006

WITH EXCEMPT VISA 15 TIMES WHICH IS NOT THE CORRECT WAY

THE PURPOSE OF EXCEMPT VISA IS FOR TOURISM ONLY(NOT FOR LONG STAY IN THAILAND)

Ofcourse we know this already, hence why would i apply for a genuine tourist visa?

isn't that the correct way to stay in Thailand?

what the F?

Isn't this the whole purpose of me going out of the country to apply for the REAL tourist Visa?

Isn't this so that checks can be made to ensure i am not blacklisted and dont have any 9 year old boys in my suitcase?

Incidently the 25 dollars was NON REFUNDABLE and they were happy to not mention beforehand that i didn't stand a chance in hel_l to get the VISA anyway.

SO, they are happy to accept money and to make you wait 3 days, then just to add a further insult to injury!

They will give you your passport back with,

wait for it.....

My passport now has THE OFFICIAL 90 DAY TOURIST VISA paid for!

and a BIG RED X WITH 10 VOID VOID VOID stamps all over the page!

Isssued from the exact same embassy...

And Thai hand writing saying i have stayed in Thailand too long in the incorrect way! PERIOD!

Obviously this looks awful in my passport!

And it scared me sensless when flying back to BKK the following morning hoping to get a 30 day entry back...

I seriously thought any re entry would be forbidden based on my Embassy VISA declination as a tourist. And that i would be stranded in some inbetween place with my entire belongings and credit cards still in Thailand!

Anyway, as luck would have it! and only cos i look the innocent type!

They did let me through because i dont think they noticed the VOID stamp as it was 2 pages ahead of a blank page used for the re entry stamp, and i managed to go unoticed!

PHEW!

But i was seriously expecting a refusal since it looked rather obvious that the THAI EMBASSY was not my friend anymore, and they wanted to prove that with a whole page of my passport and $25 + 3 days cambodia penalty kick to my nads.

TOTAL PRICE 25 000 BAHT for absolutely nothing but hel_l!

And God help me!

On the next Visa run in 24 days.

i may well be refused entry due to the stamp.

unless i remove it ofcourse! THE WHOLE PAGE!

Which could get me into no end of trouble if found out...

so guys, if you see a scrawny twisted white farang on 14 NOV pleading 1 baht, 1 baht,

towards his flight back to the UK from cambodia. chances are its me!

so say Hi, and remind me that Thailand loves me just not my Nationality.

so....................

why did this happen? yes ive been asking that a lot....

Well if we want to try and be logical about it... not really a Thai trait, but we can try!

another theory i have is the following!

If it was indeed a 90 day TOURIST VISA they gave me

(as someone did mention above are now being offered in PENANG right now....)

and NOT a 60 day + 30 day (despite that was what i applied for) on the application form!

IF, IF, IF....

And since the Thai embassy has officially stated that it doesnt matter how many border visa runs you have had in the past. the new law will only start on oct 1st.

then it starts to count... and you have 3x

BUT DONT FOGET THIS!

BECAUSE THIS MAY BE THE REASON I WAS REJECTED!

(and not because i am a fat bloated pink pervert farang covered in tatoos!)

It actually counts by days and not VISA runs....

Make sure you understand that... it actually counts from OCT 1st

NOT the time your last entry finishes after Oct 1st

otherwise why did i get refused?

it is 90 DAYS from OCT 1st....?

bringing us nicely up to

and i applied on 13OCT for a 60 day VISA

but maybe they dont exist anymore and it was actually a 90 day visa given to me

The VISA itself says 90 days valid.... so......???? im not sure, was that including an extension? or just a real 90 day visa? or were they just bastardos?

any ideas? any comments?

Will new years be one hel_l of a day for kicking us all out!

Will there be a new Nationalistic order for Jan1st 2007!

I personally think...

We are not safe!

We are living on borrowed time!

We are merely guests regardless of what we think we own anymore

We cannot even obtain investment VISAS now

ironically since the 1st oct also, so what is this new plan?

& what does it say exactly?

FARANG GET OUT!

listen to the National anthem at 6PM and read its translation!

it says it all!

Ofcourse i am one of the bad farangs whom have stayed here on a 30 day visa for 15 months

And all of you good moral standing farangs, whom have jobs and your school is good enough to issue you a Visa. well you are all as safe as houses and will always be welcome in the land of smiles for ever and ever!

But did i mention that i work for the No 1 university of Bangkok on the weekend for 16 hours a week. and guess what?

they wont even issue us with a letter to get a NON B or any form of document to help us in anyway... despite the shake-up!

and thats the No1 university of Thailand? ahem!

Make the most of these uncertain days is all i can say!

Buy an extra packet of condoms on the way home tonight, and make that final spasm last!

Don't waste your money on Chang beer anymore, start investing in Heineken again.

save yourself the pain in the morning and dont feed the hand that spanks you!

By the way..... met a lot of guys in Cambodia who are selling up business from Thailand to move to Pnohm pen, simply because they are sick of the ups and downs in Thai laws and feel they would be better investing there.

The word is that we can own property in Cambodia, and dont have to marry anyone to stay there.

And god does it need a boost right now to its economy.

So if you want to actually feel valued again in a country that you reside, and not so dispensable.

my advice is to go and take a look. Its not so bad, rather a fun place actually!

and the doors are WIDE OPEN with oportunity!

Goodluck guys....

See you in 3 worlds from now.

[Eugen]

Sorry to hear your situation .

[CobraSnakeNecktie]

Sorry to hear your situation .

thanks for the report. I will definitely be scratching PP off my visa run list.

How come you didn't pay a little lubrication money to an agent?

Hope others post their regional visa application experiences. I am headed to KL next week and will post my attempt for a 60 day tourist visa.

[lopburi3]

A tourist visa is valid for entry during a 90 day period but the time of stay is 60 days which can probably be extended another 30 days at immigration for 1,900 baht. No change

The 30 day entry without visa day count started on Oct 1.

PP has always been the worst Embassy to obtain any visa service in the region in recent years; from many, many reports.

You are not likely to have a problem with entry to Thailand until the New Year.

[visarunner]

Don't want to add to your misery , but looks like you went to the wrong place and tried to do it yourself.

PP was never helpfull to Visaapplicants .

[Thaddeus]

A bit of a troubled past Hmmmmmmm

Emmentaler anyone?

[Maestro]

My passport now has THE OFFICIAL 90 DAY TOURIST VISA paid for!

and a BIG RED X WITH 10 VOID VOID VOID stamps all over the page!

Isssued from the exact same embassy...

And Thai hand writing saying i have stayed in Thailand too long in the incorrect way! PERIOD!

What a dreadful experience this must have been for you!

It was good of you to post it here, so that it may serve as a forceful reminder to others not even to think about going to Phnom Penh to apply for a visa.

Over the past two or three months there have been several persons posting that the Phnom Penh consulate is telling visa applicants from Thailand not to come back ever again to that consulate for a new visa. The difference is that those applicants were reluctantly given the visa that one time, whereas you were sent packing without any visa at all and worse, with a visa that was voided immediately after having been stamped in your passport.

Aside from the fact that the staff at the Thai consulate in Phnom Penh appears to be overworked with visa applications by Cambodians – as they have told some farang applicants who applied there – one of the higher-ups who would have had to sign the visa quite obviously concluded that while you applied for a tourist visa you did not really intend to return to Thailand for the purpose of tourism after having lived in that country already for 15 months for that purpose, without giving you an opportunity to prove otherwise.

Incidentally, I am a collector of unusual Thai visa and immigration stamps and if you have access to a scanner I should be grateful if you scanned and posted that voided visa. A visa with a VOID stamp is perhaps not that odd per se, but with as many as ten VOID stamps across it, it certainly is a collector’s item.

---------------

Maestro

[Mobi]

What happened to the OP doesn't surprise me in the slightest, and his advice to make sure your "affairs" are in order and to make sure you have sufficient funds etc with you when leaving to obtain a visa are well worth noting. Always be prepared for the worst case scenario - that you cannot get back in again.

What happened to me pales into insignificance compared to what happend to the OP, but very briefly I received bad advice to change from a retirement visa to a marriage visa, and not being aware of all the rules (ie the money had to stay in the designated account after I had applied for the extension) I was eventually refused (after two monthly extensions) and subsequently given 7 days to leave the country, even though I had been here on retirement extensions for 3 years, was armed with bank accounts and letter showing that I had several million Baht in the country., had a house, wife, step son, a dog, some fish and a whole load of exetended family dependant on me. And guess what they stamped in my passport as the reason for refusing my marriage extension? "INSUFFICIENT FUNDS" (In Thai).

Throughout the whole process I was polite, dressed correctly, spoke reasopnable Thai to the officials and waied at the appropriate times. The guy didn't give a shit - he just laughed at me. I found out later that a small back hander would have worked miracles.

As it turned out I reapplied for my retirement visa the next day with a million Baht in my account, and was stamped up for a year in about half an hour. But I still have that bloody "insufficient Funds" stamp in my passport

Don't trust anyone or anything or any rules in Thailand - just be prepared for the worst, and if it doesn't happen, you can have a good smile.

[Maestro]

What happened to me pales into insignificance compared to what happend to the OP...

I don’t think so. The only money you wasted was 1,900 Baht for the rejected application for extension based on support of Thai wife.

...I received bad advice to change from a retirement visa to a marriage visa, and not being aware of all the rules (ie the money had to stay in the designated account after I had applied for the extension) I was eventually refused

It looks like you have not been reading ThaiVisa regularly. It has been reported time and again that the bank account balance must remain above the required minimum – 400K for support of Thai wife – until the application is approved.

---------------

Maestro

[Cyberstar]

I've never applied for tourist visas in PP or any other consulate/embassy in Asia. My sole experience with visa-applics outside my homecountry amounts to one multiple non-O in Penang in the good old days where you didn't need anything but copies of docs, you'd have if you actually were married to a Thai.

I can only contribute with a few thoughts on how things might look from the side of the staff in PP --- in an attempt to understand why they are so tough ... Somewhere, I saw someone mentioning agents ... I believe, to get the full picture of the Cambodian situation, we'll need reports from guyes having used agents ...

Here's my reasons for thinking so:

First thing: Cambodia can't possible be a highly wanted place to be stationed... Compare to New York, Paris, Copenhagen, London ... Consequently, the staff at PP might wan't compensation...

Second thing: Staff and agents get to know each other ... both parties can easily understand the value of "you help me - I help you ... and we both have a mutual interest in not letting the bosses in Bangkok know about our arrangement" ... In comes a foreigner, wanting a stamp, dangerous to suggest tea money because he might make a fuss that'll reach the eyes of the bosses in Bangkok ...

We've got reports on how applicants, not using agents, are treated .... Anyone haved used agents to get a visa in Cambodia out there?

[tropo]

First thing: Cambodia can't possible be a highly wanted place to be stationed... Compare to New York, Paris, Copenhagen, London ... Consequently, the staff at PP might wan't compensation...

Second thing: Staff and agents get to know each other ... both parties can easily understand the value of "you help me - I help you ... and we both have a mutual interest in not letting the bosses in Bangkok know about our arrangement" ... In comes a foreigner, wanting a stamp, dangerous to suggest tea money because he might make a fuss that'll reach the eyes of the bosses in Bangkok ...

We've got reports on how applicants, not using agents, are treated .... Anyone haved used agents to get a visa in Cambodia out there?

I agree with your logic on this one. I'm a firm advocate for doing it all through an agent as the price of failure is just too high.

My visa run service has obtained tourist visas in Cambodia this month and in his words, "no problem".

however...

Cambodia is off my list.

Edited October 21, 2006 by tropo

[Mobi]

What happened to me pales into insignificance compared to what happend to the OP...

I don’t think so. The only money you wasted was 1,900 Baht for the rejected application for extension based on support of Thai wife.

...I received bad advice to change from a retirement visa to a marriage visa, and not being aware of all the rules (ie the money had to stay in the designated account after I had applied for the extension) I was eventually refused

It looks like you have not been reading ThaiVisa regularly. It has been reported time and again that the bank account balance must remain above the required minimum – 400K for support of Thai wife – until the application is approved.

---------------

Maestro

Don't you understand English?? I said Quote: "What happened to me pales into insignificance compared to what happend to the OP" That means, (just in case English is not your native language), that what happened to me was NOTHING or OF NO SIGNIFICANT CONSEQUENCE compared to what happened to the OP.

And then you say: "I don't think so"

We are not discussing my minor problem - I was using it to illustrate the fact that authorities can interpret the rules as they see fit. And some interpret in different ways to others , and often they do as they wish.

Yes I do read Thai Visa regularly, and if you were around at the time you would know that I openly admitted that I was very foolish and should have known better - and I did this at length ON THAIVISA forum - in fact I even started a thread to express my foolishness!

But all this doesn't alter the fact that others have reportedly obtained Marriage visa extensions without keeping the full funds in the bank during the period of consideration, that there was nothing in the guidlines issued by immigration to tell you this, that the immigration officer also didn't tell me this, and happily gave me another month's stamp after examining my bank book and seeing that some cash had been withdrawn. None of this is an excuse for my ignorance , but at the end of the day it's a farcical situation when you have to rely on an expat forum to know how to do things the right way.

I could also quote another, even more farcical example where a government official gave one ruling on a legal issue, and his superior subsequently agreed it was an incorrect ruling, but refused to intervene as the officer would lose face; therefor the ruling would stand even though it was in clear contravention of Thai law.

That is why I said that what happened to th OP doesn't surprise me.

Got It???

Edited October 22, 2006 by Mobi D'Ark

[dsfbrit]

What happened to me pales into insignificance compared to what happend to the OP...

I don’t think so. The only money you wasted was 1,900 Baht for the rejected application for extension based on support of Thai wife.

...I received bad advice to change from a retirement visa to a marriage visa, and not being aware of all the rules (ie the money had to stay in the designated account after I had applied for the extension) I was eventually refused

It looks like you have not been reading ThaiVisa regularly. It has been reported time and again that the bank account balance must remain above the required minimum – 400K for support of Thai wife – until the application is approved.

---------------

Maestro

Maestro / Mobi, Ialso did not read TV regularly and made the same mistake last year when I went to renew my marriage extension and after several weeks went below the 400k Baht.

Fortunately the local Immigtation Officer called my wife and told her that Bangkok had called and were very 'unhappy' about this and she said we had better top up my funds immediatley or have problems.

Like you, I had money elsewhere so no worries topping up the money- I got the visa several weeks later (phew).

I dont know why she called - we usually take a small gift (some tea or coffee - nothing big) - so she was hardly expecting any major gain from it - glad she did anyway whatever the reason.

However Maestro, as bad as the previous posters story is - and I have every sympathy for him - he can probably get a new passport and all those red stamps will at least will go away.

Mobi on the other hand, if you were considering applying for Permanent Residence have you messed up yours run of visa extensions (ie need at least 3 consecutive extensions I believe) to apply for a Permanent Residence???

Is this the case Mobi? or am I - as so often when it comes to visa issues - wrong about this.

good luck to everyone gettting your visas - whatever type they are!

[Noel]

My passport now has THE OFFICIAL 90 DAY TOURIST VISA paid for!

and a BIG RED X WITH 10 VOID VOID VOID stamps all over the page!

Isssued from the exact same embassy...

I have read at least one similar account on this forum before.

It looks to me that a junior Officer issued the visa and it was later voided by a superior Officer.

Regardless, the message is clear and has been for some time: avoid Phnom Penh...

[hunter2000]

The word is that we can own property in Cambodia, and dont have to marry anyone to stay there.

And god does it need a boost right now to its economy.

Very sorry to hear about your situation!

I've been in Phnom Penh last August, and hadn't any problems to get a "proper" visa issued by the Thai-Embassy directly.

But it seems, that times are changing, too, again!?

Unfortunately, it's not true, that you can own property in Cambodia (Land & House)...it's the same cunning + restrictive law as in TH.

The ONLY country in SEA where you can own property limited is Malaysia in the moment!

But you're true, that Cambodia offers very comfortable Visa-regulations for foreigners!

It seems to be a fact that TH doesn't want to be a pleasant and good host for foreigners anymore.

If you aren't "old enough", and aren't interested to sponsor a whole Thai-family as a foreign spouse, you aren't welcome anymore.

TH lost billions of US$ already in this year, because even big companies and wealthy private investors aren't amused about the poor "welcome" of their investment.

(i.e. Intel went to Vietnam, Seagate to Malaysia, and the Johnny-Walkers-Classics won't start in Phuket anymore in Dec, but in South Korea...)

All of us can see very clear now, that TH-officials never keep their words.

They're telling around, that they just want to know who's staying in their country, and want foreigners to apply for "proper visa" from now (acceptable, in my eyes!)....but in the same moment, they give order to their nearby embassies and consulates to be very restrictive in issuing any visa (what the f**** ?)

What's wrong to stay in TH, if you have enough money to support yourself, haven't any criminal report and aren't illegal working?

(Even every foreign bar-owner brought money into the country to pay for the key money and lease...it's his right to sit there without a work-permit and just observe, if his investment is running...every investor is doing the same around the world!)

In a country, where the average-income of the locals is not higher more than about 5,000 B/month, it's ridiculous to expect, that a foreigner pay tax for a minimum pseudo-income of 65,000 Baht/month + employ 4 Thais with minimum salary of taxable 5,000 B/ month, insurance etc. ...

(I haven't any business in TH, and also no bar etc ... but this steady trying to rip off foreigners isn't amusing anymore!)

Of course, it's TH...give us your money and piss off!

For those of us, which still have an easy chance to move with their money to a more pleasant country should do so.

All others, which believed the sweet illusion of a long-term holiday or even family-life in TH it's time to wake up, and start searching for alternatives.

It's really not worth to waste more time and money for nothing!

Edited October 22, 2006 by hunter2000

[ray23]

Yuo know I'm not in the boat any of you are in yet, I have the age and the income. There really may be 1 % bad guys out there that cause problems for Thailand, making the other 99% pay for it is really overkill and not at all neccessary.

My heart goes out to you.

But I may be putting my place up forsale and moving on as well. I really don't welcome by the Thai govenmnent any longer even if I do qaulify. No children so that is a good thing, Thai wife and go get her passport next week. So the move will be posible. I think I will end up in Bagip Philippines, the wife speak fair english, the weather is great and I qaulify for a real retirement visa.

Not a violent area of of the P.I.

So whatever happens to you guy I hope it is the best for, I already know it's not the best for Thailand but they have choosen the road to travel.

[BlackJack]

well the old saying what goes around comes around has certainly happened here recently.

After the Tyrant has gone there is a lot of cleaning up to do.

But this will become too hard and so it will be back to normal - pay and stay

gee life was so simple when backpacking here 25 years ago

[Noel]

well the old saying what goes around comes around has certainly happened here recently.

After the Tyrant has gone there is a lot of cleaning up to do.

But this will become too hard and so it will be back to normal - pay and stay

gee life was so simple when backpacking here 25 years ago

Yep, reaching mental puberty can be traumatic for some...

[Maestro]

Got It???

Got it, Mobi. And you’re right, I got your paling wrong.

---------------

Maestro

[lingyai]

It seems to be a fact that TH doesn't want to be a pleasant and good host for foreigners anymore.

If you aren't "old enough", and aren't interested to sponsor a whole Thai-family as a foreign spouse, you aren't welcome anymore.

All of us can see very clear now, that TH-officials never keep their words.

They're telling around, that they just want to know who's staying in their country, and want foreigners to apply for "proper visa" from now (acceptable, in my eyes!)....but in the same moment, they give order to their nearby embassies and consulates to be very restrictive in issuing any visa (what the f**** ?)

What's wrong to stay in TH, if you have enough money to support yourself, haven't any criminal report and aren't illegal working?

(Even every foreign bar-owner brought money into the country to pay for the key money and lease...it's his right to sit there without a work-permit and just observe, if his investment is running...every investor is doing the same around the world!)

In a country, where the average-income of the locals is not higher more than about 5,000 B/month, it's ridiculous to expect, that a foreigner pay tax for a minimum pseudo-income of 65,000 Baht/month + employ 4 Thais with minimum salary of taxable 5,000 B/ month, insurance etc. ...

I understand your fustration and agree with a lot of what you say but have to point out that the average income is more than 5,000 baht a month. This isn't Cambodia...

A majority of the people who drive and shop in the malls of this country are Thai not foreigners. Try hiring for a job that pays only 5,000 baht a month and you will find slim pickings...

I do hope that some of the more useless regulations will be done away with but I would not bet my financial future on it...

Edited October 22, 2006 by lingyai

[englishoak]

I was curious about these new changes and have read through them.

We live in "interesting times" it seems.

In light of the restrictions of type of work allowed , ability to own property, right to reside under 50 etc etc. I decided to return to the UK with my Thai family after living in Thailand for 5 years. Why? not because I could'nt afford to stay but I was getting tired of making good money under the radar. Going legit was on the restricted list.

There is not a day goes by I do not wish I was back in Thailand........ all the reasons are obvious.

That said it is probably the smartest move I have made for me & my family.

I concluded long ago that until I am 50 and can retire offically It's far too much hassle to try & carve out a living in LOS. I am not prepared to work only in designated professions. I could quite easily have kept 6 or more Thais employed in my business but only if I set up with a Thai partner ? Even then i'd not be able to "run" the business as my own ? <deleted> that ! too much hassle, i'll do it back in blighty thanks and pay my tax in exchange for security. While we are here i'll also arrange for my wife & daughter to become UK citizens also affording them some basic human rights!

If in the future when we are living in Thailand and it all goes "pear shaped" at least they will be able to return to the UK with me.

Now I don't know if the Thai gov will get it's act together or not before I "retire". (Iv'e got about 9 years to go) I will likely never trust them even if they do.

To h:ll with buying a place in a country with no rights. Or making plans long term in a country that is obviously still wayyy behind in making at least a token effort for people to spend their hard earned money by giving a simple assurance they will be able to stay with their family.

One thing is for sure...... these current ammendments are exactly that ......."current"..... more will follow and it's not going to get any cheaper.

I simply will not be investing £1 more in Thailand than I absolutely have to when I do move there for good.Nor will I burn my bridges in the UK in case of unforseen problems.

I love Thailand but it is not a place I could feel secure investing a life in. Therefore I'll retire there and laze around doing as I please, rather than contributing to the economy which is what I would rather do.

It's a shame and i'm sure LOS will hardly miss my small contribution to the economy. And thats the way the gov policy thinks "SMALL" x me by a few thousand would be investors and the figure's start to become interesting. X by 100,000 then it becomes a large sum. Most other developed countries have seen this and are embracing it.

Don't even get me started on the "baby boomer" retirees. There are billions of £'s just waiting to be spent and Thailand is pulling out of the race? Sheer madness !

[johnnyk]

The word is that we can own property in Cambodia, and dont have to marry anyone to stay there.

And god does it need a boost right now to its economy.

Very sorry to hear about your situation!

I've been in Phnom Penh last August, and hadn't any problems to get a "proper" visa issued by the Thai-Embassy directly.

But it seems, that times are changing, too, again!?

Unfortunately, it's not true, that you can own property in Cambodia (Land & House)...it's the same cunning + restrictive law as in TH.

The ONLY country in SEA where you can own property limited is Malaysia in the moment!

But you're true, that Cambodia offers very comfortable Visa-regulations for foreigners!

It seems to be a fact that TH doesn't want to be a pleasant and good host for foreigners anymore.

If you aren't "old enough", and aren't interested to sponsor a whole Thai-family as a foreign spouse, you aren't welcome anymore.

TH lost billions of US$ already in this year, because even big companies and wealthy private investors aren't amused about the poor "welcome" of their investment.

(i.e. Intel went to Vietnam, Seagate to Malaysia, and the Johnny-Walkers-Classics won't start in Phuket anymore in Dec, but in South Korea...)

All of us can see very clear now, that TH-officials never keep their words.

They're telling around, that they just want to know who's staying in their country, and want foreigners to apply for "proper visa" from now (acceptable, in my eyes!)....but in the same moment, they give order to their nearby embassies and consulates to be very restrictive in issuing any visa (what the f**** ?)

What's wrong to stay in TH, if you have enough money to support yourself, haven't any criminal report and aren't illegal working?

(Even every foreign bar-owner brought money into the country to pay for the key money and lease...it's his right to sit there without a work-permit and just observe, if his investment is running...every investor is doing the same around the world!)

In a country, where the average-income of the locals is not higher more than about 5,000 B/month, it's ridiculous to expect, that a foreigner pay tax for a minimum pseudo-income of 65,000 Baht/month + employ 4 Thais with minimum salary of taxable 5,000 B/ month, insurance etc. ...

(I haven't any business in TH, and also no bar etc ... but this steady trying to rip off foreigners isn't amusing anymore!)

Of course, it's TH...give us your money and piss off!

For those of us, which still have an easy chance to move with their money to a more pleasant country should do so.

All others, which believed the sweet illusion of a long-term holiday or even family-life in TH it's time to wake up, and start searching for alternatives.

It's really not worth to waste more time and money for nothing!

Time for you to leave then, isn't it?

Turn out the lights and close the door behind you, please.

[Maestro]

In light of the restrictions of type of work allowed , ability to own property, right to reside under 50 etc etc. I decided to return to the UK with my Thai family after living in Thailand for 5 years...That said it is probably the smartest move I have made for me & my family...

Even without the recent changes, which appear to have affected you negatively, I agree with you that you made the right move. Put your daughter through school in England and when she’s old enough to manage on her own, review your retirement options again.

One day, your daughter will thank you for it.

Best wishes to you and your family!

--------------

Maestro

[backflip]

"Don't even get me started on the 'baby boomer' retirees."

Please don't start.

"There are billions of £'s just waiting to be spent and Thailand is pulling out of the race? Sheer madness !"

Dang, you started. However this class of visitor doesn't include you, and I'm not sure why you're speculating on it. "Boomer" retirees are welcomed.

[balikbayan]

Hi to everyone!

It seems to me that regarding spouses visa the only topic discussed in this forum is all about foreign husband married to a thai wife..In my friends case (both foreigners) the one currently and legaly working is his wife and his husbands visa is a dependent visa from her..The multi million dollar question is,will this new visa regualtion have a huge impact in this kind of visa ???will he still be able to continue extending his dependent visa?any advice sunbelt? than you.....

[Nam Kao]

>>>>and aren't interested to sponsor a whole Thai-family as a foreign spouse, you aren't welcome anymore

Some cant even do that anymore, the message is pretty clear