grandpops

About the comments of being shot from long range, the facts would appear to be different. Yesterday on the Nations Tweet , there was a statement that the Police Hospital Autopsy report states that most of the victims were shot from behind, one at very close range as there was gunpowder on the body.

How would you plan to get out of the crowd if you were one of the planted assassins? Wouldn't it be completely insane to commit this type of crime surrounded by bystanders and cameras?

That was just routes of transit from high ground or cover points to shoot from.

I would expect there was only ONE group of snipers...

This side is the only one that can truly gain by creating a conflagration.

Army not a bit, even the hawks.

Once Abhisit said move the hawks got hat the thought the wanted.

Moderate army didn't need blood at all.

Redshirts, were more rabble and riot than organized blood bath.

They were the playing card placed in the middle and cannon fodder.

And a few sacrificial lambs to the worlds perceptions too.

Who benefits with army/government disgraced for killing many?

Who benefits from putting army/government at each others throats?

Who needs martyrs and many dead to change the game and sway public opinion?

Who already has blood on their hands from the past, and so lowered thresholds of compunction to kill?

Who has no respect for, and is on the outs with the mainstream red leaders?

Who is directly connected with the amoral master funder in Dubai?

Who has access and the talent to use these weapons and motivation to change the game?

Who so far HAS benefited from this series of deaths?

A few good questions needing answers. Draw your conclusions as you will.

Who put salt in the sugar bowl? Who put fireworks in the coal?

Who put a real live toad-in-the-'ole? Khun Thaksin!

Who put jam in mother's shoe? Who made real caterpillar stew?

Who locked Grandad in the loo?... Khun Thaksin!

Khun Thaksin said it wasn't he, who put shampoo in Grandma's tea

Khun Thaksin said that it was me – my brother's rotten.

Whose pet mouse made Auntie shriek? Who ate glue and couldn't speak?

What clever dick was sick for a week? Khun Thaksin!

Terry Scott?

Appologies to Mitch Murray

Turns on the box and says, I want to know if army kill all the red shirts yet.

Well at least I know my wife is not the only one to feel that way.

A country (if it wishes to appear to be a country with a constitution and laws) simply cannot let a very small portion of the population dictate who can be in power and when you must hold elections. (Yes, I know some will point out the PAD, BUT it was the court, not the protest that brought down the regimes).

I can see nothing that is so urgent or life threatening that an election must be held before the scheduled time for it.

My wife says bring in the tanks and bull dozers, shove all the stages, bikes, taxis and trucks into the klong. Have elections next year and then what happens som nah nah, but at least it is a constitutional election.

At least your wife is consistantly showing who wears the trousers at your house. Also showing us the rabid PAD train of thought.

Nice to see all opinioins on here, even stupid ones.

As I was saying earlier, Thais (as many as possible) like to be on the winning side, and if that means changing sides late in the game... so be it.

Take today, the army are now on the same side as the reds, and the election commission appear to be also. It's Thai style and discussions about the next allocation of trough space will be much easier now they are one!

Winning side? if the Army couldn't move the reds, the police were on the reds side anyway, who, but who, is still in Abhisits corner.

BTW, I think he set a new blinking and twitching record again tonight.

If you want democracy and don't want military coups, do you really want to see the military marching down the streets? In my country (US) and most of yours, if demonstrations get out of hand the police step in and end it. Why aren't the police doing their jobs?

You suggesting the american revolution was a pack of criminal thugs? The British at the time did! These days, the US seems to celebrate this criminal band of brigands (backed by the French, who really were paid back big time in their revolution) some date in July.... was it the forth!

I wish some of you keyboard heros could actually learn something about Thai mentality and face in general.

Thais are pragmatic a will resolve this eventually and everybody will have fought on the winning side, apart from a few criminals (who will be decided by the winning team) who will be thrown under the bus.

Could someone please explain to me how it's possible that Arisman runs from one place to another causing disturbances, day in day out, even though there must be not one, but multiple arrest warrants out by now. It's not like they didn't know where he is.

I honestly don't get it. I don't understand that no arrest has been made at all, afaik.

Simple. If 2, 3 or even 100 police turned up to arrest him, the police would just get clubbed or worse.

To get a red shirt leader, a successful surrounding of his group plus a successful assault are necessary.

Yeah, just like saturday nights! Want to see thousands dead do you?

What most of you don't understand is the underlying pragmatic nature of Thais and their ability to change sides or ideas to suit.

Its all corrupt and all always has been. The CAT man is probably having a few beers and a laugh with them, after all, they are now acting more like a government than the Democrats. What with all that running away, hiding in army camps, bawling the army out to attack the protesters.

Look who is calling the shots these days. The change is happening now and the history will be written by the winners, as will the court summonses, so don't get too excited about the staged warrents issued by this regime, they will be worth as much as a falangs comments on a thai website when this is done. Sorry JD and gang, you are as inneffective as the rest of us!!!

Enjoy the change, you can't stop it.

this is a note for Lumpini police chief Pol Lt Col Sarawut Jindakham

Dear Khun Sarawut ,

Believe ,Rajprasong is under your jurisdiction!Which is Lumpini police station! Correct ?

And Arisaman Pongruangrong( the so called red leader ) is stationed in Rajprasong rally site even

after the arrest warrant is issued against him !

Whose responisbility is to arrest this man ??

Now he kidnapps CAT Ceo !!

Wonderful ,Khun Sarawut !

And when a young man drove Porche hit red motorcycles parked infront of Holiday INN you are the one to run to Jatuporn

to inform not to worry that you had arrested that driver in the Porche !!

WoW -- what a responisble policeman !!!!!!!! Trying to stop red to run havoc !!

I really do not understand why there is a police station and why there are so many police are stationed in this

particular station-wasting our tax money !

We are Thai citizens -

I cant go to Police General hospital for few days now due to the rally --right infront of the hospital !I had to visit to

keep the appointment with the doctors and get the lifesaving medicines !!!

Whose responisbility is it to evacuate these Reds ?

There are numerous criminal gangs working under the asoke BTS with beggar gang on the same side of MTR -snatched purses many times

to elderly tourists -cycles are being stolen from the cycle stands -african criminals hang around Robinson dept store -stealing money from tourists !

all right under the CCTV !!

I really wonder who is responsible and whom do you work for ??

We are scared of your police station now !

Hope God help us !

Anyone know of hotline for complaints through emails against these officers ?

Better you negotiate with the Reds. They can help you more than the puppets.

As for E-mails, you might as well post on here for all the good it does.

You seem to be saying that the police are corrupt and let these gangs roam, so why not go with the reds? Maybe they are the ones to end the police grip on the city. Just a thought.

i've just finished watching the video titled "Thai Army Opens Fire On Protesters, Protesters Hurl Grenades," and i have to say that the title is a little misleading. Nowhere in the video can you see the armying OPENING fire, you see and heard them respond, by firing into the air, which as the commentator says 'if they ae firinging into the crowd there would be alot more dead people hear'. This vidoe speaks volumes about the restraint of the army and how they tried to play by the rules. The actions of the reds - well watch the video, listen to the commentary and work out for yourself if the army really does open fire on the protesters.

http://www.france24.com/en/20100411-exclus...-thailand-crack

one example of the thai army firing into the crowd can be seen at 1.25 in this video aired on French tv

in fact there are two examples, one just before 1.25 and one just after it

Oooh you are making friends today. I am having a loko at the BBC footage as one of them showing on Saturday night and most of sunday had a clip at 18 seconds. Sorry I don't have time at the moment but its there if you look again.

It clearly shows a group of soldiers who were ahead of the lines and over the reds area on an ariel walkway. They are pointing downwards and firing! They cant even say they were firing level, they were firing downwards.

Obviously those bullets found a human target as it would have been impossible to miss from that range into a crowd that compacted.

What the Government are proposing now is another reason the Reds should not deal with them.

The eveidence will be gathered by impatrial agencies with no involvement on Saturday, ie. the Army and the Police. It will be reviewed an pontificated upon by other agences and branches of the Judiciary. Perhaps some of the same unelected people that ruled agains Thaksin, PPP, Samark etc.

Keep your reports.

there been lot of threads about the background to the conflict. I can understand that some red people can say "the yellows did it, so why can we not doing it"? A responseble red leader should say, no w cannot, because if we succed and form a new goverment, next yerar maybe 50 000 muslims from the south come inte the streets and claims the same thing. "What am i going to say to them?"

It's simpler than that. But if you want to learn about it rather than try to be clever with these remarks, you have to be receptive to other ideas.

If 50,000 or just 500 Muslims from the south went to the streets, they should be listened to by the Government as well. You just cannot dismiss people because you are the Prime Minister and think you are right.

Try reading more and posting less!

TAWP you are so funny that i am going to honour you with a reply. War raw.... If I die laughing I'll say its Thaksins fault just to please you.

The expat falangs fell out with Thaksin purely because he started shutting bars earlier and brought in rules that limited naked flesh in go-go's and chrome pole dancing in bars.

Thanks for starting off your post with a blatant lie and sad insult, makes it obvious that the rest of the post will be filled with the same BS too.

Sorry for hitting the raw nerve. I remember listening to complaint after complaint about bar closures, chrome poles, entertainment zones.

I once picked up a customer to go fishing at 7 in the morning and he was in a bar with two of the tiredest most miserable looking naked thai girls I ever saw and it haunted me. He was the owner and I enjoyed his anger and frustration when Thaksin finally took away his right to abuse his staff in such a manner.

Its thaksin hating 101, complain about corruption but the mind remembers the bars as they were.... oh yes oh yes oh yes. I hope when he comes back he shuts them all down. Now that will get the posting count up on here.

Threads on here regarding bar closures, alcohol restrictions and prostitute clampdowns always attract a big crowd. Now that is fact!

Wow, selective thinking...

The problem started when the reds started to illegally occupying the downtown areas and later attacked the tv station

yes, that's when the violence began

I thought this particular "problem" began back in 2006, with Sonthi and his yellow shirts trying to get rid of what was one of Thailand's few freely elected governments, and it was then escalated when the yellow shirts occupied the airport a couple of years later.

It was mate but many saw it and didn't believe it.

The expat falangs fell out with Thaksin purely because he started shutting bars earlier and brought in rules that limited naked flesh in go-go's and chrome pole dancing in bars.

I came here in 1994 after they were cleaning up one mess and laying the groundwork for another (the banking crisis). It was as is now, corrupt from top to bottom, but at least back then, the bangkok expats could leer over naked women whilst they drank beer that was so cheap as to be not worth calculating. Flesh is now more expensive to view, and outside of many falangs dwindling pension returns.

Ironically, most Bangkok falangs only dealing with Isaan people are in bars taxis and hotel cleaners. This is why they are so ignorant to the complaints of the poor, namely that their politicians and parties were removed in a coup, banned from effectively running for office (they still got in despite this) and then two further pm's outed by a put up job from the elite via their proxies in the PAD.

Further to this, after the coup, the constitution was changed and laws retroactively enforced. Many human rights reports on this, but that is another matter. The coup became legal and they installed an election court that if it had functioned as they intended, would have prevented any party out of favour with them from ever being elected. This failed miserably.

If Thaksin had only left the poor to their fate of having to dance naked in clubs until dawn..... if only.... then the great expat minds of Bangkok might have seen through the yellow fog.

1) an APC is not a tank

2) the reds attacked and the army and police did their best to avoid casualties

3) look for the hate rhetoric

The one with the heavy cannon on it in the pic is though. Take off the yellow shades man!

This mass attempt at nit picking looks increasingly desperate on your and your allies part.... keep it up.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hpz-ByED6go

In case you can't bear to look, it is troops, on tanks

Another video and another example of "NOT tanks, but armored personnel carriers"

Any others you wish to try?

I think the problem here is lack of understading on your collective parts as to what heavily armed vehicle on tracks means.

Sorry mate, you are on your own now..... but nice try anyway.

An Issan mark three anti tank weapon. Effective against regimes that are so corrupt they cannot get the army to kill it's citizens.

http://d.yimg.com/a/p/ap/20100410/capt.5a8...hfrH5k41vYgPw--

The Nation TV in particular and most of the other Thai Chanels seem at last to be taking this seriously.

Much better and fairer reporting today. I assume they want their licences renewed under the next administration!!!

They were portraying the redshirts as normal people. Families, old and young, all with the same burning sense of passion for their Monarch, Country and religion. Much better all round and might even risk a newspaper tomorrow.

Abhisit was portrayed as he was. Nervy, hesitant, twitching, worried and unsure of himself. So regardless of the PTV being down, the countries population are getting and idea of what went on last night.

The Government version lacks credibility for many reasons, but the one true visual truth that is apparant is that the Army planned an assault and sent in the tanks. They are all their for the world to see, empty, ransacked and abandoned by their occupants who lack the elitist outlook of their commanders. They were ordered there, but like the proverbial horse that you can lead to water, they wouldn't, when it came to it, drink!

Please direct me to photos or video of tanks involved in last night's skirmishes.

there are clips with vehicals that looks like tanks, but they are not involde in any actions

Maybe they were put their by the reds, or beamed down this morning. There is video footage of monks on them last night, of people blocking their paths.

Sorry you seem to have lost your argument so badly that you have to post in this fashion.

Maybe next year the PAD will give your heart joy again. I think though, that the PAD will never put themselves in the way of an organisation that ran the Army out of central Bangkok.

Perhaps some PAD DVD's will help in these troubled times.

Anyway, if you want to torture yourself http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hpz-ByED6go

I suggest you beef up your arguments a bit and stop posting drivel that can be as easily torn apart as this.... mate

In case you can't bear to look, it is troops, on tanks, firing guns being repelled by farmers, taxi drivers, factory workers and other poor dark skinned people that you so obvisouly detest

Was this better Mr Tomaz Bodzner.

The Nation TV in particular and most of the other Thai Chanels seem at last to be taking this seriously.

Much better and fairer reporting today. I assume they want their licences renewed under the next administration!!!

They were portraying the redshirts as normal people. Families, old and young, all with the same burning sense of passion for their Monarch, Country and religion. Much better all round and might even risk a newspaper tomorrow.

Abhisit was portrayed as he was. Nervy, hesitant, twitching, worried and unsure of himself. So regardless of the PTV being down, the countries population are getting and idea of what went on last night.

The Government version lacks credibility for many reasons, but the one true visual truth that is apparant is that the Army planned an assault and sent in the tanks. They are all their for the world to see, empty, ransacked and abandoned by their occupants who lack the elitist outlook of their commanders. They were ordered there, but like the proverbial horse that you can lead to water, they wouldn't, when it came to it, drink!

Please direct me to photos or video of tanks please.

Sorry, are you really serious? It has been on every television bulletin all day and was last on 15 minutes ago With Rachel Harvey walking through them and stating it has become a tourist attraction already.

Just switch on the BBC and Al Jazeera, they are both showing it.

I found this and there are thousands of pics on google, yahoo and youtube is awash with videos

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/8612783.stm

Adios, eurasianthai

Your sixth post is the best.

You're progressing.

At least you've stopped flaming while you await your suspension.

Anyway, for others that can still post, as I stated earlier, it's encouraging that stations such as Channel News Asia and Al Jazeera are portraying the red shirts for what they really are and that the media has caught on to all the various elements of the group.

Also portraying the Government for what it is. Failed, unelected, unnacountable, clinging to power, not in control of the Army and Police and certainly not running the country now.

I hope you continue to post, as it gives other newbies an easy chance to pick amatureish post apart!

!

some will do anything for their dark skinned beauty from udon thani / khon kaen

1. Why is it a problem to be a dark beauty, beauty is only white?

2. Why is it a problem to be from Udon Thani or Khon Kaen?

Anyway, I will never join a red shirt, yellow shirt or pink shirt rally.

No my fight.

But I will do anything for my wife and my son.

And I do not really care whether she's black or white, from Khon Kaen or Bangkok.

Well said. I never understood about white Thai women with nose jobs and translucent skin (from all the whitener) being the preffered option for Bangkok expat falangs.

The racist overtones against poorer darker (from working harder and not having tons of disposable income to whiten their skin) northerners is sickening. As is calling them ignorant, bribed, uneducated, too stupid to vote. It is this that has got the elite into such trouble since the coup.

you, like me have obvisouly learned the joys of life in the north. The warm friendship, the fun and laughter and smiles that contrast so much with the cold detached faces on the bangkok tube every morning.

enjoy it mate as you have something truly worth having!

The Nation TV in particular and most of the other Thai Chanels seem at last to be taking this seriously.

Much better and fairer reporting today. I assume they want their licences renewed under the next administration!!!

They were portraying the redshirts as normal people. Families, old and young, all with the same burning sense of passion for their Monarch, Country and religion. Much better all round and might even risk a newspaper tomorrow.

Abhisit was portrayed as he was. Nervy, hesitant, twitching, worried and unsure of himself. So regardless of the PTV being down, the countries population are getting and idea of what went on last night.

The Government version lacks credibility for many reasons, but the one true visual truth that is apparant is that the Army planned an assault and sent in the tanks. They are all their for the world to see, empty, ransacked and abandoned by their occupants who lack the elitist outlook of their commanders. They were ordered there, but like the proverbial horse that you can lead to water, they wouldn't, when it came to it, drink!

Well, at least from where I'm sitting it seems clear who instigated the violence. Dude, they were calling for it for days and pushing the red followers harder and harder towards violence. All they needed to get the action the red leaders were longing for was the government to start dispersing rallies and a spark here and there to set it off. There was only one way it would go, then throw in some grenades, the petrol bombs they have been telling the reds to prepare for weeks and shoot off a few live rounds and you now they can proudly present their martyrs! Sick is a grave understatement of the mindset of those dirtbags!

I don't normally reply to posts like yours, but it is so funny and rabid I simply had to.

The bit "all they needed to get the action .... was the government to start dispersing rallies" is incredible. You have basically agreed with us that the government started it yet toned it as if it was unimportant. So who instigated it? You really think a column of tanks, gas grenades (it was live on TV when it kicked off) and 5000 bullets to be a mere detail? Such posts should be pinned.

Your last sentence says so much about you and your ilk.

The reds upset about the interference with their propaganda tv. OK, understandable. But today they kick out legitimate objective reporters from their stage. They don't like objective journalists? Just like their puppet master Thaksin who hated a free press, and was setting up a total dictatorship. Double standard? Of course, the reds love free speech but only their false Truth Today speech, other speech, shut up!

As you obvisouly don't watch or understand much Thai language TV, I'll explain.

The general media are giving the reds fair coverage!! Well, fairer than before and they are coming over well on all most stations.

At the end of the day, journalists have standards and don't want to be tarred for the rest of their careers as servants of the elite.

I only turn to PTV to see if it is actually broadcasting. We get out news from the other Thai Chanels so it was not worth the fight to turn it off. Nor come to that, is it that important to the cause now to have it turned back on. The general media in fair mode is much more useful.

The Nation TV in particular and most of the other Thai Chanels seem at last to be taking this seriously.

Much better and fairer reporting today. I assume they want their licences renewed under the next administration!!!

They were portraying the redshirts as normal people. Families, old and young, all with the same burning sense of passion for their Monarch, Country and religion. Much better all round and might even risk a newspaper tomorrow.

Abhisit was portrayed as he was. Nervy, hesitant, twitching, worried and unsure of himself. So regardless of the PTV being down, the countries population are getting and idea of what went on last night.

The Government version lacks credibility for many reasons, but the one true visual truth that is apparant is that the Army planned an assault and sent in the tanks. They are all their for the world to see, empty, ransacked and abandoned by their occupants who lack the elitist outlook of their commanders. They were ordered there, but like the proverbial horse that you can lead to water, they wouldn't, when it came to it, drink!

Change of tactics by the apologists

Looks like they are going for a good old fashioned conspiracy theory. And because Animatic and a few newbies are regurgitatinng what JD is saying... it must be true.

Looks from the evidence like the army moved in with Tanks and not as a retaliation to some imagined attack from red shirts. The EVIDENCE is there, lines of tanks on video with reporters and reds crawling all over them.

It was a planned attack on the Reds Stage and was repelled. How many conscripts and police have relatives in Red Shirts? Probably most of them.

The strength of the resistance to this all out assault must have shaken the installed Government to its core.

Time to move on Abhisit and plan a come back in 10 years time when the stains of the peoples blood you put on the Bangkok Streets has started to fade. Remember, these reds have left their farms to sort out yours and you cronies corruption and nepotism. They are on away terrirotory and have shown you just what is possible should you try to cling on to power.

Just watch these sick Bangkok soap operas and dramas with all the elites in their lovely mansions with 2 or four cars and lots of servants. Then compare it to the real people who live on less than 200 baht per day.... if they are luck enough to have a job that actually pays. Real contrast and the people seem to have had enough of it.

BANGKOK (AFP) -- "People started running and screaming. We were being shot at," says 19-year-old Briton Sarah Colvin, one of the many foreign tourists caught up in the political violence sweeping Bangkok.

"It shook us up a lot. We needed valium to sleep," she says, surveying the aftermath of Saturday's bloody battles just by Khaosan Road, Bangkok's iconic backpacker strip. "A lot of people we've spoken to are getting out of here."

You needed Valium (Diazepam) to sleep? Where did you get that then? It is illegal for pharmacies to sell it. What on earth were you doing in Bangkok when so many countries are advising against travel to Red areas?

If there is one group of people who know more than even the Great pundits of Thai Visa.... it is student backpackers.

Fresh from a few hours a week "Social Studies", "Wimmins Studies" and other wastes of education budgets, they set out to see that their view of the world is correct.

Khao San Road gives them the opportunity to prove to the expat community just how clever they are. 100 baht plus for pad thai, 1000 for the compulsory dreads "mad" the bob marley/canabis/Che (mass murderer Taliban style leader)Guevarra and they are off.

That said, at least they are hardier than the target groups of 5 star tourists. It's not the riots putting them off though, its the possibility that they cannot waste their money at high end malls on gear of inferior quality to most of the knock off goods available at any thai market.

Least they had the sense to do this at end of high season. Unlike some other group who decided that the Tourism industry needed two airports closing down at the beginning of the season during a major world wide recession.

IMHO many people here from yellow and red sides will have enjoyed seeing the police and army on the back foot.

Lets face it, even the most rabid PAD supporter will not suggest that massive corruption carried out nationwide by these entities has decreased with Thaksin's departure. Thaksins influence never made it to the South where I live and it is as totally corrupt as it was back in the mid 90's when I first moved here.

If the current Red leadership ride this populist wave right, keep Thaksin out (you see, I never was a fan of his) there might be a chance of change.

Remember, most Thais have to pay money to one/other/both to carry out trade, open and run businesses and even just drive legally through Bangkok. How many posts on here over the years about corruption and tea money issues on highways?

Might not be that dart, and after all, the darkest hour is just before dawn!

It

Read the news! The red shirts STILL refuse to negotiate! All of this blood is on the hands of the red shirt leaders. Now they have another chance to stop this by following the LAW and talking. Yet they refuse.

Whats to negotiate? The balance of power seams to have taken a seismic shift this past week. Army commader saying troops tired and he is not sure how much longer they can stand this. Anupong saying they are all Thais (troops - and reds). Abhisit balling army out is not winning him any friends either.

Why negotiate with an illegal and murderous regime? Just tell em to leave the country (which they have told Abhisit) and thatas much as they deserve.

Reds were saying last night that even if the Army prevails (they didn't), it was only a battle in any event and the war would continue. If hospitalizing 800 of them didn't work, just what are you proposing next?

A COUP! A period of everyone taking a step back and reevaluating this mess. At this point a 1 year cool down period would be the biggest benefit to Thailand.

It could be, but only if they dismantle the court structures and un-elected, election commisions during this time.

Free elections that are seen to be free and observed by outside agencies.

The only way forward for Democracy in Thailand seems to be for Abhisit to hang on to power and clear the reds from the streets.

Get real, man! Come here and have a look at the situation on the streets right now. Your proposal would mean more deaths to hundreds of people and thousands more injured. Is this really what you want? Your proposal doesn't get any better after it is repeated on and on by so many simple minded TV members.

I'm happy that the overwhelming majority of Thai people takes a more level headed approach and requests an end to violence no matter from whom and wants to give peace talks and finding a compromise another chance.

You have a good handle on this. Problem is that some intellectuals on here are worried that Thaksin is hiding under their beds!

I am not sure Thaksin could come back. I really don't think it likely that the current red leadership (who have manged this protest very cleverly) would or should give up the powers that they have won.

Maybe the way forward is elections and keep Thaksin out!!!! Am sure many on both sides of the divide could agree on this.