loonodingle

Very unlikely that a speedboat had left from the main pier, it is used by larger vessels; speedboats normally operate directly from the beach or from small piers at some resorts.

Irrelevant dont you think, the point is the cctv was not checked in a double murder case and to this day know body knows. We also know they were looking and checking local fishing boats but failed to check the pier cctv..............

No, I don't think it's irrelevant.

As I said the pier is normally used for larger vessels and it would be easy to check if any left during the relevant time.

Before things get even more twisted it should be pointed that this:

"The court in Koh Samui heard that the senior investigating police chief and his officers did not believe the killer would have taken that boat, which left an hour or so after the estimated time of death of the pair.

"We have the footage, but we never checked it," Police Colonel Cherdpong said."

Is conflating two things, one the footage from the pier and two the allegations that a speedboat left the island from somewhere else one hour after the murder. They way it has been edited it makes it look as if there is footage of that boat leaving from the pier that the police refused to examine.

Having said that the defense should ask for the footage from the pier and examine it to their full satisfaction.

How can you seriously defend the fact that the cctv was not looked at in a very high profile double murder when they had at the time no clue of who carried out the crimes. ALL cctv should have been checked

All depends what story you are trying to concoct doesn't it. Something's fit like 3 lads going in a supermarket or riding around with how many others that night? 100's maybe so lets release that cctv to show them about. As for cctv in the AC Bar the owner refused to hand it over.

Make of that what you will but I would say as that was the last place David and Hannah are seen alive it should be a major focal point of the investigation.

But Hey I am a Falang so what do I know

I've said many times if this is a case made of whole-cloth, with any kind of reasonable media access, the Prosecution will not be able to pull it off. Media access, at least so far, is greater than many on here have predicted.

Not to many media getting access to the small courtroom.

Reuters, BBC, SkyNEWS, and 2 freelancers (Mairs and Yuen) among maybe others are reporting from the Courthouse on the island whether from inside or not and none have had their work permits revoked.

Jonah Fisher (BBC) and Jonathon Samuels (Sky) are not there.

Read there twitter feeds

Ok colonel Cherdpong , if this is true , that they actually have the footage , then for god sake check it now. So we at least can find out who the passengers on the boat were.

Very unlikely that a speedboat had left from the main pier, it is used by larger vessels; speedboats normally operate directly from the beach or from small piers at some resorts.

What did you do Ali G borrow your brain from the same police officer while he went for a P.

Really come on.

No stone left unturned......

How do you check for DNA traces with a magnifying glass ? Didn't think the killer(s) would have taken the boat that left 1 hour after the murders and didn't think that the B2 wearing different clothes than the suspect shown on CCTV was relevant !!!!!!!!! Oh my Buddha !

The earlier references to the Keystone Cops and Laurel & Hardy no longer apply, this is a real murder trial and even the most silly script writer could not have thought of such an all mighty cock-up. The RTP losing face has just gone thermo-nuclear. How on earth are they ever ever going to live this down !

Do you think they really care that much. Business is booming on Koh Tao. Its history. The Sky man doesn't show at the court daily as he did before. Cant say I have seen the BBC guy Johah Fisher either. I do wonder whether they have been scared off and report from a distance. The tentacles of the Mafia stretch far and wide

Such a travesty of justice

http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1437573990

Three judges oversaw the trial today. The lead judge, who was highly engaged throughout the hearing, suggested that the verdict in October is unlikely to settle the matter once and for all; he personally advised the prosecutor to prepare the CCTV footage in a more simple format “so that it will be easy for both of you in the Appeal Court.”

https://www.facebook.com/heidi.a.zimmerman?hc_location=ufi

Video interview about 6 storys down with Andy Hall.

Hannah entered the AC Bar 1 hour before David entered. She was alone. She also left her phone with her friend so she obviously didn't want to be disturbed. David left his mate Chris Ware at the room and went back out.

All CCTV stops at the AC Bar.

Make of that what you will.

If you was so bothered about your status then you would release it. Unless you had something to hide. Moreover its a legal requirement to have CCTV in Bars in Thailand.

Had a nice stay in the Naughty room now unleashed upon you all again.

The lab wasn't able to work out what colour the hair was that was sent for testing!?!

The court hearing the trial of two Burmese migrant workers charged with the murder of British backpackers David Miller and Hannah Witheridge has ordered the re-testing of forensic evidence collected at the murder scene.

The Samui Provincial Court, in allowing the defence team's request, ordered the public prosecutors to work with investigators to send all remaining forensic evidence, including a shovel, to the Justice Ministry's Central Institute of Forensic Science for re-testing.

The trial has been adjourned to 22 July.

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/thailand-backpacker-murders-court-orders-re-tests-forensic-evidence-1510520

Perhaps like a Dyed Blond Hair which was actually Black?

I think the confusion with the B2 and blonde hair for one of the suspects was earlier in the year Wei had blonde highlights. However CCTV from the store clearly shows otherwise and the link was made because of his earlier colour change.

Unfortunately when you try to build a case by using selected cctv or statements and cant back it up with DNA results it would leave any reasonable person to be concerned the true killers are the 2 in court.

I don't know who done as none of us on here does but if they were my kids I would want to know the 2 people who get the death sentence are the correct ones. Not just a feeling I would want irrefutable evidence and I fear the familys will never get this as it stands at the moment.

The weight will always swing towards the police account despite DNA being used up, so the B2 really need the defence to throw a spanner in the works by introducing new evidence to dispute the version of events and I have a hunch that's what's going on now. I know they had they Autopsy results and it will have included the X-Rays.

Highlights you intelligence. The pack has been released again I see.

It's "Your" and like You I am entitled to an opinion however you have gone over board hence the Red Card. Enough is enough sometimes. If you cant bring something constructive to the thread about Hannah and Davids tragic death why u go forth and multiply somewhere else

Well I know what I shall be doing in the future on the way back from the Pub.

Packet of mints and a " I haven't had a drink man how foolish can you be" Cant you smell the minty breath............

Amazing Thailand

Text in Burmese removed............

I just saw a photo of Hannah's younger sister, Laura. Yet another of the many peripheral victims of that savage event of early morning Sept 15, 2014. Laura has had her elder sister ripped off. Let's hope Laura and other pretty girls like her act carefully if they go visit a Thai beach resort. Sorry to say, it's just not safe. We, the decent farang who reside in Thailand would love to welcome you with open arms, but you'd be safer going to other vacation areas. Try Burma or Laos, for example. Less tourists get murdered in Burma in a full year, than in one week at a little Thai island.

I meet a lot of backpackers during the run of the year. I met two pretty young gals who were traveling from NW USA. As they were leaving Haat Rin at Ko Pa Gnan (near KT), a motorbike with two Thai guys drove alongside, grabbed the girls' handbags and tried to pull it off. Luckily, the girls were in excellent physical shape (both were contenders for the US Winter Olympic team), and got away without crashing. When they got back to their guest house, they saw both their packs had been stolen. The Brit who owned the g.h. commenced to yell at them to not tell police, as it would reflect badly on him and his business. A week later (it took them a week in smoggy Bkk to get new passports), I met the gals at my work-exchange farmstead, a bit worse for wear. During a week with me at my farm, they lost their jitters and we had good times going to waterfalls and such, but it's doubtful they or their friends will ever want to visit Thailand ever again.

Agree ... Thailand is a VERY dangerous place and nothing like its presented by TAT and other loony institutions - The frequenzy of deaths among foerigners are sky high compared to e.g. Bali, Vietnam, Laos, Cambodia etc.

i can only advice all I know to stay away unless they are seeking for more "Adventure" than a normal person would ask for ... Stay away ...

The problem Is not many people care anymore. Look at Koh Tao pub crawl page. The place is heaving. Other than us band of merry men and women and a few on other sites the only people who are concerned is the parents. It's old news in a sense times passed and people have moved on. Whilst there also a bit on the news it's not got the traction it had before.

Personally I expected them to be found hanging in the cell. Still if the Polee read these threads that might still happen a day case closed. Guilt proven problem solved.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scapegoating

suggest you check out ~

So.. whats the truth ... Sean M seems to contradict himself more than once and had to 'fix' some of his 'heat of the moment' social media comments on more than one occasion. I'm totally convinced he has all the answers

Sean also said he was among a group of people playing guitar on the beach near the scene.

The group was also suspected by the police as they were near the scene.

But Montriwat discredited the Britons claim saying in fact on the night of the murder an employee of a spa has told him she helped to wash and clean blood from the face and body of Mr Sean who is a friend of the murdered David Miller.

He said he asked Mr Sean about the blood on his face and body and insisted on asking where he was that night.

Mr Sean claimed he did not go out anywhere but slept in the room, Montriwat said.

This is very suspicious, Montriwat told reporters while insisting in his innocence.

There was also a Bristolian Chris Cooper from a Koh Tao dive school who came out and said he was drinking with Sean Mcanna that night. He then deleted his post from Facebook and had CSI remove the copy's as well. David CSI will verify this

http://news.sky.com/story/1339247/thai-murders-hannah-dna-matches-asian-men

McAnna said he had arranged to meet up with David that night but he didn't make it because he was sleeping off a hangover. McAnna's no wallflower. He's not got the face, physique or attitude to fade into the background from what I've seen in the press and on social media. If he was out that night drinking on Koh Tao in public there will be witnesses. Maybe he was in one of his strange costumes and donning a wig as per some of the photos and was unrecognisable. Maybe he is one of the British witnesses for the defence. Who knows?

you won't find him as a witness. I already advised u there was one witness but he deleted his comments. In fact the whole island has been wiped clean of witness testimony and instead we have had to endure taxi men and gardener's report being order to lie by the police.

Mcanna done a runner that night IMHO when it all kicked of and he suffered his injuries. Koh Tao was his second home and after a few days he couldn't help himself and blabbed. He upset the wrong people and only by luck really he got away.

I don't think for one minute he was paid off. 100 baht for a bullet or a pile of cash to silence him. You don't know Thailand I suggest.

Anyway we will never know I suspect. The main thing is if the B2 are innocent then they get released and i am waiting the revelations due in September to be able to rub some TV members face right in it. I will start with JTJ perhaps.

So.. whats the truth ... Sean M seems to contradict himself more than once and had to 'fix' some of his 'heat of the moment' social media comments on more than one occasion. I'm totally convinced he has all the answers

Sean also said he was among a group of people playing guitar on the beach near the scene.

The group was also suspected by the police as they were near the scene.

But Montriwat discredited the Briton’s claim saying in fact on the night of the murder an employee of a spa has told him she helped to wash and clean blood from the face and body of Mr Sean who is a friend of the murdered David Miller.

He said he asked Mr Sean about the blood on his face and body and insisted on asking where he was that night.

Mr Sean claimed he did not go out anywhere but slept in the room, Montriwat said.

‘This is very suspicious,’ Montriwat told reporters while insisting in his innocence.

There was also a Bristolian Chris Cooper from a Koh Tao dive school who came out and said he was drinking with Sean Mcanna that night. He then deleted his post from Facebook and had CSI remove the copy's as well. David CSI will verify this

http://news.sky.com/story/1339247/thai-murders-hannah-dna-matches-asian-men

snip ...

Show me any source from after September 26 that suggested Panya had any intention of going after the real culprits. Panya took up his new position October 1.

Good Piece here

http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/new-twist-murder-two-brits-koh-tao

The investigation into the murder of two British tourists in Koh Tao sees a new twist after the police questioned two prime suspects they earlier said have enough evidence to prove their connection.

Sure. That was on September 24. They were supposedly completely exonerated after being proven guilty September 23. This was not because of the scheduled promotions October 1.

I don't know Brit Tim things have moved at such a pace. It was a very strange time though it jumped from we have cctv of 2 people and they were adamant about that. Very very adamant and then at the drop of a hat forgotten.

Moved on as though someone threw a switch. But heyho what do I know. Personally I think Sean Mcanna hold some very important pieces. he was in protective custody whilst one of the suspects was in jail which is why he had had a shave etc before he left the island. he hadn't been in a jungle sleeping out that was aloada bs.

Then you have the reports of the fight in the bar that night. all disappeared into never never land never to be mentioned again. like it never happened. they have made evidence fit the story. released selected cctv to portray the suspects as the killers. lets face you don't dispose of dna sample. a condom for example. its a solid object and you swab it. you don't bin it <deleted> how daft do they think we are. I was at on the fence until recently. a lot of things didn't stack up but the cappers of the last 3 days trial has reinforced my belief that they are scapegoats. Even the diehard tv members who supported the RT Polee Farce have been subdued they don't know how to fight their corner anymore.

Anyway you wait to the revelations from the UK autopsy. Backed by the CSI expert who is contracted to the MOD and the UN. A forensic heavyweight in more than one sense hey!!!.

This is "worrying" to you! Why? Are you part of the Defensive Team or a Relative to one of the accused that you should worry about this? Or is it that you are just the type of person afraid to look at both sides of a coin to get at the truth?

"Uncontested"? Sure! So far! The beauty of my post is that in a few short weeks it will either be "contested" by the Defense if it is brought out in court, or it will not be. Ending it all.

But your Grand Conspiracy Theory lives on for many Generations. You can even pass this down to your Grandchildren. This is because none of it is based on actual fact or evidence, so it cannot be contested in a Court of Law anywhere because it does not exist. The is the "worrying" part!

If you don't know what is worrying to me about you wanting to be "Uncle Goldbuggy", and talking like you were one of a dead girl's close friends,(by calling her by a name that "only a few" of her friends used) then maybe you should ask someone else if this is normal behaviour, because I certainly don't think it is!

And your ramblings about "Grand Conspiracy Theories" (Your words, your capital letters, which by the way, are frowned upon by the Mods - check the Thai Visa Rules) are wearing a bit thin now in the light of recent events regarding key evidence.

Go SamBum....LOL... u don't mince your words hey!!

http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/one-tourist-murder-suspect-now-arrested-another-run

The police have arrested a suspect in the murder of two British tourists in Koh Tao and are still hunting for a second suspect who has escaped into Bangkok.

Eighth Region Police Command commissioner Pol Lt-Gen Panya Mamen identified the first suspect as Mon.

He is the brother of a village headman in Koh Tao.

He was arrested after evidence which police collected were examined and proved he was involved, he said.

He also said another suspect is also a son of that village headman. But he has already to Bangkok.

He said both suspects were captured by CCTV cameras and the police have gathered enough evidence to implicate them in the murders.

He said the southern police were coordinating with the metropolitan police to hunt him down, and expected to apprehend him today.

The southern police chief also assured the public that there was no arrest of scapegoats in this murder case as it now is a focal attention of the world.

He also dismissed any suggestion of local mafias or influential people that could twist the investigation with promise that local influence would pose no obstacle to the police investigation.

Instead the police will eliminate all these mafias, he said.

Meanwhile a police source said the police are also looking into the cooperation of those who helped to arrange the suspect to escape. They also will be arrested.

Sigh! This has been repeated so often, and is so wrong. Panya was as guilty as any of the other cops at making claims that he then changed a few hours later. At the time of his (announced prior to the murders, and taking place on schedule) promotion, he had already given the instruction to find scapegoats. Just look at any of his statements from immediately prior to and following his promotion.

September 23:

(Source http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/one-tourist-murder-suspect-now-arrested-another-run)

September 25:

Pol Lt Gen Panya Mamen, chief of Provincial Police Region 8, told Thai Rath Online on Thursday that investigators had exluded the son of Woraphan Tuwichian from the suspect list as investigations found...

(Source: find it via a Google search on Panya Mamen Woraphan Tuwichian)

September 27:

(Source: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/webmobile/national/Koh-Tao-murder-probe-85-complete-Panya-30244247.html)

October 1:

(Source: http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/police-confident-arrest-suspects-koh-tao-murder-2-days)

Show me any source from after September 26 that suggested Panya had any intention of going after the real culprits. Panya took up his new position October 1.

Good Piece here

http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/new-twist-murder-two-brits-koh-tao

The investigation into the murder of two British tourists in Koh Tao sees a new twist after the police questioned two prime suspects they earlier said have enough evidence to prove their connection.

Well well what do you know when the police have to put up or shut up they have absolutely <deleted> all worth a rub. So I guess we will soon see an eye whiteness step forward for the police or who knows some Devine intervention to provide them with a conviction. After all they can't be seen to be what they are and I can't say it or I could be arrested too. Thailand is a scary place these days.

Welcome to the fold O Enlightened One.

No thanks I moved out two years ago when having lived there for a few years I released that to live in Thailand one could not expect to see real justice or be treated in any way other than a foreigner / sucker ready to be taken advantage of.

So did I lock stock and barrel. Nearly lost my life there and shaken down by the Polee on a spurious attempted murder charge that cost me a fortune to extricate myself from.

I am enlightened though.

Thailand...Its just an illusion

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TnfHdZrmMAw

^{These are worth a read in order below}

^{http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1410768025&section=12}

^{Island On Lockdown After Gruesome Murder of British Tourists}

^{http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1410951357&section=12}

^{Autopsy of Murdered Britons Shows Struggle, Drowning}

^{http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1410943513&section=12}

^{Police Misidentify Murdered Britons in CCTV Footage}

^{http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1411039863&section=12}

^{Prayuth Apologises For 'Bikini Remark,' Shifts Blame to Migrant Workers}

^{http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1411120709&section=12}

^{Britons' Murder: Lacking Evidence, Police Target Burmese Migrants}

^{http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1411277826}

^{BANGKOK — Thailand’s chief of police says DNA tests reveal that two “Asians” were behind the murder of British tourists on a resort island in southern Thailand last week.}

^{"The DNA tests reveal that the two culprits are Asians," said Pol.Gen. Somyot Pumpanmuang after visiting the crime scene on Koh Tao yesterday. "We will try to find the culprits for prosecution in a timely manner."}

^{http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1411635247&section=12 Island leader's son goes from 'primary suspect' to 'innocent' in a day}

^{Police hunt down the 22-year-old son of a local village leader on Koh Tao, who they say fled the island shortly after the murder and is now a "primary suspect." On the following day, he is cleared of a connection to the case because police determine that he was in Bangkok at the time}

^{http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1411463212&section=12}

^{BANGKOK — Thailand’s new police chief has brushed off media reports that there is "mafia" network on the resort island in Southern Thailand where two British tourists were murdered last week}

^{.http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1412314798}

^{Police Say Forensic Tests Implicate 2 Burmese in Koh Tao Murder}

^{http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1413896452}

^{Koh Tao Murder Suspects Retract Confessions, Describe Torture}

^{http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1415711380&section=12}

^{The United Kingdom dispatches a team of detectives to observe the murder investigation after human rights groups raised concerns about Thai police’s handling of the case. The three UK police officials said they were granted 'observer status' to limited parts of the investigation, did not provide any advice or assistance, and relied on a translator provided by Thai police}

^{http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1436360221&typecate=06&section=}

^{Year in Prison Has Been 'Torture,' Says Koh Tao Suspect}

^{http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1436774626}

^{Court approves re-test of remaining evidence}

^{The court approves a re-testing of the limited forensic evidence still available, which includes a shoe, sock, bags, and the bloodied garden hoe found nearby. Police say that other key evidence, including DNA samples taken from Witheridge's body and cigarettes found near the crime scene, are no longer availabe because they were "used up" during the original testing}

^{May They R.I.P and May Justice Be Served}

Well well what do you know when the police have to put up or shut up they have absolutely <deleted> all worth a rub. So I guess we will soon see an eye whiteness step forward for the police or who knows some Devine intervention to provide them with a conviction. After all they can't be seen to be what they are and I can't say it or I could be arrested too. Thailand is a scary place these days.

Welcome to the fold O Enlightened One.

I'm making assumptions again but get the feeling from one poster that he knows critical evidence will be shown and hopefully prove the innocence of the two burmese.

The whole thing reminds me of the book To Kill A Mockingbird, or the Angola 3 case

I have the same feeling...

I have not seen any discussion of the testimony of Dr. Chasit Yoohad as reported in http://bigstory.ap.org/urn:publicid:ap.org:eab0f9d26be242048e4dae7a83a9334e.

A second witness, Dr. Chasit Yoohad, gave testimony about his examination of the victims' bodies. He said he also performed a medical checkup of the two accused, and found them in good health. He said he asked through a translator if they had committed the crime, and they replied that they had.

This strikes me as strange. Why would the doctor be interrogating the Burmese? Of course, if the doctor was part of a frame up, the testimony is extremely convenient. It also does not state when this examination of the Burmese took place. I assume the translator was the pancake seller who has been accused of participating in the torture of the two accused. Even if the doctor's interrogation was carried out fairly, the two Burmese kids would probably not have dared risk renewed torture by claiming innocence. Further, how does anyone know that questions and answers from the pancake seller were correct translations?

Will the "translator" give evidence at the trial? Should this claim of the Burmese admission of guilt be regarded as hearsay if he does not?

Do the RTP not have recording equipment ?

Would they have wanted the "questioning" recorded? Also, recall that the original interrogation was not on RTP premises. It look place at a "safe house".

Actually the Polee claims that they left them with the Roti seller seller for a period of time and then he came out and they confessed.. tis was a deflection to avoid the charge of torture maybe?