BigStar

Rose-tinted rearview mirror, love it. Fortunately, we have contemporary accounts to tell us how it really was. Not so great, as it turns out: There are two types of articles appearing in the Pattaya Mail with regularity: those where business and political leaders decry the decline in tourism and propose ways to improve the situation; and a steadily increasing number of reports of tourists being insulted, assaulted, drugged, robbed and extorted. . . . It doesn’t matter if the streets are cleared of garbage, no one is going to walk down them if doing so leaves them open to being insulted and assaulted. Having a beach promenade doesn’t matter if strolling along it means taking the risk of being knocked down and robbed. No one is going to participate in the vibrant night-life if there is a good chance that they will wake up three days later in the hospital with all their possessions gone, or in some cases, not wake up at all. No one is going to seek an exotic experience if it means they might be set up by girls with both a legal age and under age ID, and then extorted for immense sums by the police. Pattaya is being inundated with rude obnoxious thugs who do not care about the city or its visitors. They do not listen to the community leaders, and the police do not have the budget or manpower to control them. They are driving away the tourists and the income and jobs that they bring. Inevitably, this rabble will win as they reduce everyone to their level of poverty. Meanwhile, tourism to Cambodia is increasing by 50% every six months... --Lawrence Neal, "Down on Pattaya," Pattaya Mail, Vol. V No.5, Friday 31 January 1997 - 6 February 1997. The beneficent Golden Egg Layers supporting the entire Thai economy had run out of golden eggs and, driven away, were heading for the exits to the paradise of Cambodia. Tourism down. Rude obnoxious thugs inundating the streets, police powerless. Tourists insulted, assaulted, drugged, robbed and extorted. Thais being reduced to poverty! OMG!!! What to do? Took about a decade to figure out.

Good, then you can just have sex on the bar or at your barstool. We need some old timers to tell us about barfine prices in the good old days and rejoice that they're back!

My addition to the Big Ben thread. More interesting than listening to chimes is learning how they're made. BTW, it's hand wound, you know.???? One of those jobs that probably doesn't have a lot of applicants.

A few artists' impressions of questionable accuracy probably ain't worth an orgy of the usual knickers soiling. We do enjoy pot stirring quite a lot, however. We've seen the "drawings effect" before. In general, we should try to avoid another outbreak of the dreaded incurable Tic-Related Promenade OCD (TRPOCD). After that 40-page muthah of all doomster threads Widening Of Beach Rd Started At North End, many of our posters were left decimated that their Death prophecies failed to come true and more tourists than ever were using the Promenade. Well, except for now, what with COVID.???? TRPOCD seems to be have been contained, finally, except in one of our posters, compelled to write the occasional Tic now and then. Happily, that Ultimate Doom thread did serve as the usual reliable inverse indicator. The DESTRUCTION of Dead Pattaya had been chanted, confirmed, echoed, celebrated, and blessed for an entire year. So, about three months later, Holiday Inn started accepting bookings for its new Executive Tower. The following year, 8.1 million tourists ("overnight international visitors") stayed in Pattaya, representing a 10% growth from 2014, according to MasterCard’s Inaugural Asia Pacific Destinations Index. Then the share price of Central Pattana rose sharply to an all-time closing high set on May 7 of 57.25: an increase of 39% off the low in one month! But nowadays we got a new Death thread every week or so. This should be quite an economic revival when it comes. 'Course, there's hardly any place to go but up--from here, right? WELL ANYWAY. . . This ain't no big redevelopment of the Promenade, no "new Promenade" as our pot-stirrers are trying to portray it. It's merely a few delayed upgrades we all so much enjoyed sneering at last year: 160 million baht Pattaya beach renovation to be started at the end of this year The renovation will consist of repaired and renewed footpaths, more green zones, more parking areas and underground toilets. Which, on its face, addresses some long-standing whinges voiced here. The lack of parking was decried as early as two decades ago. We'll see how it goes, if it goes this time. As @champers wisely counseled at the end last time, Patience is a virtue and Geena is a punk rocker! —champers, 2014-04-30 01:29:07 Yeah. Sheena, too.

When the Promenade was redone on Gone since 2014?

In a world where Filipinos speak like pigeons, it's certainly possible.???? I'll try to remember that when our members ask about the boarders over in the Visa forum. Should help clarify things. Thank you!

Quite enough for the nightlife of the time when Pattaya was much smaller when you include all the other cheapo accommodation. Few mongers were staying at the Dusit.???? Hence one our most distinguished Economists prophesied that Central Festival would bankrupt because those fools were charging Bangkok prices. It was a town of cheapo tourists seeking cheap accomodation, cheap sex, cheap beer, and cheap baked beans on toast. That, but you see only a relatively small percentage of mongers were Americans.

SHOCK! But illogical conclusion, of course. Crime, yes, perpetrated by the corrupt. It's less expensive to cooperate in the corruption than fight it. On the other hand, if the bars don't comply with the law, pretty much, they'll be shut down. So mongers are finding things so much less convenient and more expensive than they used to be, though compliance isn't the only reason. It actually takes some slight effort under Thai law to prove prostitution without entrapment. Very possible, of course, but hardly worth it for the BIB, as the mere act of selling sex for money isn't defined as such and isn't illegal. Enforcement, such as it is, is designed so that sex can be sold, legally, without obvious evidence of actual prostitution--under Thai law. Very Thai. That is, what our farangs think of as "prostitution" is in fact condoned. So convenient. Which blows your little narrative but as I noted, do keep repeating it. Plays well.???? Normally, our members understand this perfectly, as they do the same all the time when they pay off the cops in traffic stop scams. Or so they claim; personally I've never been scammed by traffic cops or Immigration. Life just ain't fair, is it? Now I did pay too much for veggies once at a local market, but to a very charming lady. <Mindless repetition and assertions lacking evidence to get the last word snipped>

In Jomtien, right? Oh, they might very well close a busy road. Street festivals are common throughout the world. But then it must have been illustrative of our leaders' outstanding competence that they didn't in fact close busy roads at all! ???? That was the point. Sometimes, it's hard to understand the mind of the consumer. Lot of markets around selling a lot of that same cheap stuff already, if not here then in BKK. But tourists, including domestic tourists, are coming to Beach Rd., partly attracted by the mall, and it turns out they like walking around visiting all those booths right there by the beach on THE main road that defines Pattaya. Those festivals were attracting specialty vendors (such as they are) and surprisingly good money. 'Course, now, we don't want anyone killed, now do we? Better give 'em a little more space and improve the traffic flow at all times, not just during the festivals.

Oh. I get it: you may only know illiterate forum English pidgin. One of my fave is "boarders" for "borders." Gives new meaning to "closed boarders." ????

A friend of mine who used to love his Kindle now recommends a tablet for e-reading and much else besides. Followed his advice and am happy enough with a cheap 8'' Huawei.

Hate to spoil all the fun we're having stirring this pot, but what we have here isn't actually a "new promenade," but merely a few delayed upgrades we all so much enjoyed sneering at last year: 160 million baht Pattaya beach renovation to be started at the end of this year The renovation will consist of repaired and renewed footpaths, more green zones, more parking areas and underground toilets. Which, on its face, addresses some long-standing whinges voiced here. The lack of parking was decried as early as two decades ago. We'll see how it goes, if it goes this time.

I just hate hearing people trying to talk like pigeons. They never do it well.

Rather proves my point, thank you, and further illustrates your own lack of knowledge. As an aside, note that none will be convicted after arrest. And what you almost never see, incredibly in view of the huge and obvious scene, is any bars or girls while working in the bars busted, and convicted, on a simple prostitution charge. WOT??? Where's the xenophobia? That's 'cause they're basically following the law. Note the contrast with frequent drugs and gambling busts, both notably hidden from sight. There's law against drugs and gambling but none forbidding trading sex for money. (Which would turn many of our married members into common criminals, horrors! ????) You may define it as prostitution all day, but Thai law doesn't. Oh--corruption also does exist! Nobody knew that. Hence this fatuous "hint" Hint: Prostitution is illegal in Thailand, yet the Thai elite earn billions from it. Remains false. It just ain't gonna become true no matter how much smoke you wish to blow and little emojis pasted. Such nonsense does play well with our peanut gallery and trollerariat of course, contributing to further page views, so feel free to continue repeating it. Are we done wasting time?

But it appears few are able to pay to circumvent it, as almost all go to some lengths and expense to comply with the legal definition--contrary to ignorant opinions such as your own here. Enforcement really tightened up in the past two decades, too. That's one reason things aren't nearly as convenient as they once were for our mongers.

True premise, wrong conclusion. The narrow definition of prostitution under Thai law isn't the same as that understood by, and adamantly insisted upon, by our barstool lawyers applying the usual home country legal definition. So, when police report finding no evidence of prostitution, they're technically correct, to peals of fatuous laughter here. Billions are made from the sex industry, yes, and it's mostly legal. Sorry to burst that little balloon, but it'll be quickly forgotten or ignored. Not to say the police extortion isn't applied even to legal activities. All our posters know that. ???? Knowledgeable posters have issued this correction over the years but by now have given up or can't be a.r.sed. Rebuttals will always quote the old law, which was superseded.

We had numerous posters last time soiling their knickers over some drawings and making countless nonsensical claims. One old Doomster claimed that the beach hotels would thereafter be deserted, etc. In fact more tourists walked on and enjoyed the new promenade than ever used the old one. It has sufficient shade--the palm trees did grow out, shockingly--and seating in the north end. No seating in the south end owing to the old being taken up by vile mongers drinking beer from 7/11s as they negotiated with and fondled hookers. I liked the old one better, too, but time marches on. More tourists, a greater population, the need for less congestion and more safety during festivals motivated the redevelopment. It's surprising how jams arise whenever one of the lanes is closed now. Wait and see.

That's the real question that will answer the poster's puzzlement. What you have there is merely a non-question illustrating the fallacy of reification so that you may pontificate. There's no mythical entity known as Pattaya determining its needs and attempting to achieve them. Ergo, you can't either. So, hot air. What exists are individual business people, or groups, finding underserved markets and developing ways to profit by meeting the wants and needs of those markets. Why, when for a fraction of the cost you can tweak an existing economy near BKK and the major int'l airport with a high probability of success? Would make no sense of course. How's your money management coming along? Yet 9.4 million tourists were coming anyway. Maybe if stuff got fixed better, then we could have another 5 or so!

Let's do compare. Here's Pattaya in 1995 at the zenith of the prosperity conferred by the benevolent Golden Egg Layers (GEL), showering free Golden Eggs on all the poor grateful Thais: See that incredible wealth? Beer bars crowded at all hours every day. Thais had everything then. Just a couple of satang flipped their way meant smiles all the time and fitting servility. Barked orders were instantly obeyed. Then, DISASTER. It's terribly embarrassing and never spoken of, but fact is them Golden Egg Layers staying in fleabag hotels on Soi Buakhao ran out o' golden eggs. The GBPeso sank etc. Golden Egg Layer straining out a last one They were forced to head for the exits by thuggery, scams, pollution, corruption, and the INSANE xenophobic rise in the pittance visa fees in 2003. All the Thais once basking in the beneficence left to go work in rice fields! As a result, after the Golden Egg Layers mostly departed except for a few who only feel alive when bashing Pattaya, we now have only these bleached ruins left: Now that may look like an economy, oh, 5 times wealthier with large shopping malls, large discount stores, expensive hotels, luxury condo buildings, and thousands more Thais employed in actual jobs. But don't be fooled: shrewd posters know it's merely a Potemkin village. No shopper has ever been seen any o' them fake malls. All the indicators of TVF Econometrics have LONG been flashing doom: the lights-on-at-night count, the red-plates-on-cars count, the lines-at-the-bank count, and the shopping bag count. Yeah. I don't see any wealth there now at all, do you?

Good thing you did. That's exactly why Central Festival was built in Pattaya. Regular readers of the forum, as Central Pattana certainly must be, know that the pronouncements of ANF Economists and Doomsters are excellent inverse indicators. So, instead of creating another ruin such as this in Jomtien: http://goo.gl/maps/H9Fw7 they've reaped profits for more than a decade with this: So the rules of ANF Poster Economics such as Fixed Pie (fundamental principle), Only One Needed, Got One Already, Only Farangs Have Money, Looking Not Buying, Just Selling Free Aircon, etc. would dictate. But then, after learning of Central Pattana's successful method of forecasting, LHMH took heed and developed T21, which has revitalized the whole N. Pattaya area. Keep up the good work!

I prefer Lazada when possible. Deliveries from China via Lazada are always faster, though there's always a delivery charge. Sometimes Lazada prices are equivalent to Aliexpress prices or shock! even a bit cheaper. However, other times Lazada prices for the same item are absurdly higher than those of Aliexpress prices or Lazada doesn't have an acceptable equivalent of the product you want. Aliexpress also has international reviews & questions and a lot more of them, in greater detail. Some of them can be pretty hard, too. Russians.???? Aliexpress deliveries can be tracked all the way your local PO, or they may not be, esp. for really cheap items. All in all, Aliexpress has its place.

LegS. No problem with mine. It's pretty good quality, however. I think in general the solution of elevating the rear legs can be made viable one way or the other.

Need to offer the option for air only. Breatharianism has been working quite well for some: I think the one on the left has died already but TVF ANF Longevity Experts know that it was merely owing to her genes or fate, over which she has no control, and she successfully avoided the misery of living in a nursing home, so all's well.

Absolutely no point in discussing this subject w/ our TAT: TVF members cause all they see and think about is sex for farangs. Been done many times, always ignored, met with specious solipstic arguments, bigotry, selection bias, and quickly forgotten. Soon the same assertion is repeated again by the same posters after their silly arguments have been thoroughly shredded--year after year. Just cannot believe it's not the 90s anymore. Still waiting for Central to fall down or go bankrupt as predicted 'cause them mongers staying in fleabag hotels won't spend there.???? In 2019, Bangkok ranked 1st surpassing Paris and London in Mastercard's list of "Global Destination Cities Index 2019" with 22.78 million visitors. Phuket was 14th with 9.89 million visitors and Pattaya 15th with 9.44 million visitors. --https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tourism_in_Thailand Unusually, TAT: TVF has blessed these numbers as accurate in order to better enjoy portraying the economic devastation and doom under COVID. Note that they don't include the domestic tourists, which now make up about 25%. So, when some of the 9 million int'l tourists return, and the domestics, the vast majority of whom aren't sex tourists, you might ask some of them why they visited--suggest starting in the lobbies of the Hilton, Holiday Inn, and Centara Grand Mirage--and argue that they don't really want that.????

This. Buy products w/ good ratings, read reviews, upgrade the shipping if the purported difference seems significant for a little more. I got refunds on a couple of things that never showed up, no problem. Got a refund on a product w/ poor quality, no problem. Vendor sent me a T-shirt one size too large, I negotiated a 50% discount. Satisfied. I'm getting ready to order more stuff.???? Like other noobs, I had to get used to Aliexpress (and Lazada), but I feel comfortable now.