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[webfact]

Trump says rich might pay more in taxes, talks with Democrats

By Steve Holland and David Morgan

 

U.S. President Donald Trump meets with a bipartisan group of members of Congress, including U.S. Representative Josh Gottheimer (D-NJ) (L) and Representative Tom Reed (R-NY) (R), at the White House in Washington, U.S. September 13, 2017. REUTERS/Jonathan Ernst

 

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - President Donald Trump said on Wednesday that taxes on rich Americans might rise, as he pursues a tax code overhaul and reaches out to both Democrats and Republicans in a push to win support for a plan still far from complete.

 

Trump met with the two top congressional Democrats over dinner at the White House in a search for common ground that could make it easier to get a tax-cut package through Congress.

 

Both sides said the meeting, which covered an array of legislative issues, was productive.

 

Earlier, Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin said tax reductions would be paid for by faster economic growth.

 

The White House and the Republican-led Congress have yet to put forth a detailed tax plan, despite months of high-level talks that had until recent days excluded Democrats.

 

House of Representatives Speaker Paul Ryan said an outline of a plan would be unveiled during the work week beginning Sept. 25, with congressional tax-writing committees crafting detailed legislation in the subsequent weeks.

 

Mnuchin told Fox News Channel the Trump administration would use its own economic assumptions to gauge the impact of its tax cuts on the federal budget deficit and the $20 trillion national debt, a key issue in Washington's intensifying tax debate.

 

"It will be revenue neutral under our growth assumptions," Mnuchin said. "So, we can pay for these tax cuts with economic growth."

 

The administration believes tax cuts will lead to much faster growth than do congressional analysts or most private forecasters, a likely fault line in the debate ahead.

 

As for taxing the rich, Trump said during a meeting with a bipartisan group of lawmakers - his second in as many days - that the wealthy "will not be gaining at all with this plan. ... If they have to go higher, they'll go higher, frankly."

 

In a phone call with a small group of reporters, Marc Short, Trump's legislative affairs director, said the president was not talking about higher tax rates, but that other changes in the tax code could affect the wealthy and how much they pay, the publication Roll Call reported.

 

TAXING THE RICH

 

Democrats have criticized Republican tax overhaul efforts as benefiting mainly the wealthiest Americans and corporations.

 

Tax experts said Trump could raise taxes on high-income people by lowering the cap on mortgages eligible for interest deductions to $500,000 from $1 million. Another step might be to close a loophole that lets Wall Street fund managers pay low taxes on much of their income, analysts said.

 

Trump might also propose eliminating the deduction for state and local taxes, then use the revenue raised to fund tax cuts for the middle class, leaving top earners with a higher effective tax bill. There has also been talk in the Senate about increasing tax rates on capital gains and dividends.

 

But even with those changes, analysts said it was not clear top earners would end up paying more overall, partly because Trump has also proposed cutting the top individual tax rate.

 

Steven Rosenthal, a senior fellow at the nonpartisan Tax Policy Center think tank in Washington, said Trump was unlikely to raise taxes on investment income.

 

Instead, he said, Trump could close a loophole that largely benefits super-rich financiers, although they may be able to find other ways to avoid taxes.

 

"That's what I would expect him to do, take a symbolic but ineffective step," Rosenthal said.

 

DINNER WITH 'CHUCK AND NANCY'

 

Trump hosted Senate Democratic leader Chuck Schumer and House Democratic leader Nancy Pelosi on Wednesday evening to discuss tax overhaul plans and other legislative items.

 

A White House official said the meeting was constructive and covered border security and the status of so-called Dreamers who came to the United States illegally as children, as well as infrastructure and trade, in addition to taxes.

 

"The administration looks forward to continuing these conversations with leadership on both sides of the aisle," the official said.

 

In a joint statement, Schumer and Pelosi called the meeting "very productive" and said it focused mainly on the plight of the "Dreamers," nearly 800,000 young immigrants who are able to live and work in the United States legally under the Obama-era DACA programme that Trump recently rescinded.

 

"We agreed to enshrine the protections of DACA into law quickly, and to work out a package of border security, excluding the wall, that's acceptable to both sides," they said. One of Trump's major campaign promises was building a wall the entire length of the U.S.-Mexican border.

 

In his meeting earlier on Wednesday with eight Democratic and five Republican House members, Trump had expressed hope he could bring a fresh bipartisanship to Washington.

 

Asked what his message was to sceptical conservatives who worry he is cosying up to Democrats, Trump said: "I'm a conservative, and I will tell you I'm not sceptical. And I think that if we can do things in a bipartisan manner, that'll be great. Now it might not work out."

 

Trump blindsided Republican leaders last week by striking a deal with Schumer and Pelosi on the U.S. debt limit and federal spending for three months.

 

Ryan said the outline being worked on now would reflect the consensus of the House Ways and Means Committee, the Senate Finance Committee and the Trump administration.

 

"I would love to have the Democrats supporting and working with us in a constructive way on tax reform, but we're going to do it no matter what," Ryan said.

 

There has been no comprehensive U.S. tax code overhaul since 1986, and starkly different visions embraced by the two parties for how to move forward promise to make the task difficult.

 

Asked about Trump’s comment on a possible tax increase for the wealthy, House Ways and Means Chairman Kevin Brady said: "My goal is to lower taxes on every American as much as possible and help them keep more of what they earn."

 

(Reporting by Steve Holland and David Morgan in Washington; Additional reporting by Susan Cornwell, Roberta Rampton, Makini Brice, Richard Cowan, David Morgan and Susan Heavey in Washington; Writing by Will Dunham and Tim Ahmann; Editing by Kevin Drawbaugh and Peter Cooney)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2017-09-14

[craigt3365]

My head is spinning. LOL

[tonray]

3 hours ago, webfact said:

Tax experts said Trump could raise taxes on high-income people by lowering the cap on mortgages eligible for interest deductions to $500,000 from $1 million. Another step might be to close a loophole that lets Wall Street fund managers pay low taxes on much of their income, analysts said.

 

Trump might also propose eliminating the deduction for state and local taxes, then use the revenue raised to fund tax cuts for the middle class, leaving top earners with a higher effective tax bill. There has also been talk in the Senate about increasing tax rates on capital gains and dividends.

All non starters with an election next year....He is heading down the path of getting nothing accomplished again. Jeesh...

[dunroaming]

2 hours ago, craigt3365 said:

My head is spinning. LOL

Mine too!  One thing you can say about Trump is that he will never be crowned "Mr Predictable".

[ilostmypassword]

27 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

Mine too!  One thing you can say about Trump is that he will never be crowned "Mr Predictable".

You should see the new Marc Maron special. It's called Too Real.The opening bit directly addresses this issue.

[boomerangutang]

from the OP:

"It will be revenue neutral under our growth assumptions," Mnuchin said. "So, we can pay for these tax cuts with economic growth."

 

In other words:  Trumpsters want to decrease taxes for the wealthy, but not to worry, because there will be great economic growth.

 

It's like a father of a large family saying: 'Hey y'all.  Great news.  We can spend a whole lot more money. We can buy all sorts of expensive toys! But don't worry that I won't be making any more money at my job - because I hope to get a raise, so later we can pay all our credit card bills.  No problem.'

[ilostmypassword]

Just now, boomerangutang said:

 

 

In other words:  Trumpsters want to decrease taxes for the wealthy, but not to worry, because there will be great economic growth.

 

It's like a father of a large family saying: 'Hey y'all.  Great news.  We can spend a whole lot more money. We can buy all sorts of expensive toys! But don't worry that I won't be making any more money at my job - because I hope to get a raise, so later we can pay all our credit card bills.  No problem.'

Actually, we've heard this from Rebublicans since..well...forever? It's called trickle down economics. And it's at the heart of stand orthodox Republicanism. 

[Proboscis]

What an opportunity Trump has to make things good for everyone except tax/legal experts. Shame congress into getting rid of all special pleading tax rebates/deductions that have been leveraged into the bloated federal tax code by large corporations so as to help themselves enjoy tax-free profits

 

This could be done by reducing corporate tax rate to 25% (from 35%) and getting rid of all the crazy deductions except for normal operating costs and capital costs that go no longer than 5 years. That would be a start.

 

But then, that would really involve draining the swamp - his own company's tax payment would go up and he would have to basically remove the power of the lobbyists. For all his bluster, Trump would never go up against the power of the commercial lobby.

[Srikcir]

53 minutes ago, Proboscis said:

getting rid of all the crazy deductions except for normal operating costs and capital costs that go no longer than 5 years.

Simply use GAAP for corporate tax purposes. No more having to keep two accounting systems. Probably eliminate one-third of the existing tax code.

[ilostmypassword]

1 hour ago, Proboscis said:

What an opportunity Trump has to make things good for everyone except tax/legal experts. Shame congress into getting rid of all special pleading tax rebates/deductions that have been leveraged into the bloated federal tax code by large corporations so as to help themselves enjoy tax-free profits

 

This could be done by reducing corporate tax rate to 25% (from 35%) and getting rid of all the crazy deductions except for normal operating costs and capital costs that go no longer than 5 years. That would be a start.

 

But then, that would really involve draining the swamp - his own company's tax payment would go up and he would have to basically remove the power of the lobbyists. For all his bluster, Trump would never go up against the power of the commercial lobby.

reducing the corporate tax to a 25% and getting rid of all deductions would result in a huge tax revenue increase for the federal government.

[Johpa]

3 hours ago, ilostmypassword said:

reducing the corporate tax to a 25% and getting rid of all deductions would result in a huge tax revenue increase for the federal government.

Given that the Federal government wastes such a large percentage of revenue on defense spending, there is no real benefit to the larger economy by increasing tax revenue. It would not grow the economy in that it would not increase aggregate demand for goods and services.  And it would not address the costs, social and otherwise, of economic inequality. The entire concept that reducing taxes on corporations and the upper income brackets will grow the economy is simply a preposterous lie foisted upon the naive masses. The economy is more likely to grow by lowering the taxes on the lowest 80% who spend the bulk of their income simply to maintain a modest lifestyle.

[sirineou]

He can start by paying some taxes him self.

 

 

[sirineou]

2 hours ago, Johpa said:

Given that the Federal government wastes such a large percentage of revenue on defense spending, there is no real benefit to the larger economy by increasing tax revenue. It would not grow the economy in that it would not increase aggregate demand for goods and services.  And it would not address the costs, social and otherwise, of economic inequality. The entire concept that reducing taxes on corporations and the upper income brackets will grow the economy is simply a preposterous lie foisted upon the naive masses. The economy is more likely to grow by lowering the taxes on the lowest 80% who spend the bulk of their income simply to maintain a modest lifestyle.

well said my friend

The wealthy, might invest it in the US, might invest it oversees growing someone else's economy, or might go on a vacation at the French riviera , On the other hand the poor will spent it all right here reverberating through the economy several time through the multiplier effect.

http://www.economicsonline.co.uk/Managing_the_economy/The_multiplier_effect.html

 

[pegman]

15 hours ago, Proboscis said:

What an opportunity Trump has to make things good for everyone except tax/legal experts. Shame congress into getting rid of all special pleading tax rebates/deductions that have been leveraged into the bloated federal tax code by large corporations so as to help themselves enjoy tax-free profits

 

This could be done by reducing corporate tax rate to 25% (from 35%) and getting rid of all the crazy deductions except for normal operating costs and capital costs that go no longer than 5 years. That would be a start.

 

But then, that would really involve draining the swamp - his own company's tax payment would go up and he would have to basically remove the power of the lobbyists. For all his bluster, Trump would never go up against the power of the commercial lobby.

True, it is as likely to happen as his healthcare solution would cover everyone and cheaper but not really because it turned out 20m would have no coverage. The American Dream has morphed into proudly having the most super rich.

 

It's stunning to see the degree of inequity in that country. So much wealth concentrated in so few. The average/median wealth of Americans is paltry compared to mean wealth in the country or in most other OECD countries. .

 

Think not?

Answer this then: Who has more wealth the average American or average Slovenian?

For the answer checkout the last table/1st column under median wealth.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_wealth_per_adult

 

Anyone who thinks a rich conman is going to change that needs help

[Skywalker69]