Change of permanent address on immigration file nightmare

[rumak]

yes, the small office at the airport has been known to be much more polite and efficient.   Some people have said, though, that they were instructed to go to promenade (maybe depends on the "circumstances ?).........

If many people start going to the airport office I fear that the IO there might change their position on handling the tm30....

especially if they encounter the occasional argumentative type

[rumak]

Oh,  and Grumpy.......congratulations.     Seems like your wife could make a good living from assisting the multitudes

of Farangs  who encounter our beloved  CMI  nightmare

[Grumpy Old Man]

36 minutes ago, BuddyDean said:

Sure would be easy if you could do a walk in there after getting off the plane at CNX.  I thought the hut was closed down, but that isn't the first report of people getting g service there after everything was moved.  What did he tell you about coming back from BKK?

 

This was my first and hopefully last visit to the immigration offices near the airport therefore I don't know about "The Hut" ; the site is a total building site and I was walking over mud piles and planks.

 

My return to Chiangmai from Bangkok was never discussed and it seems like I have a clean and up to date TM30 immigration file if there is such a thing. . . . . 

[Thailand]

At one point when both the the airport and Prom immigration were open at the same time nearly everyone reporing TM 30 at the airport office were getting fined 800-1600 baht whilst reporting at Promenada was "free".

 

BTW,I now have stapled in my passport a TM28,change of address. TM30 based on the property I rent,a TM30 I submitted on behalf of a tenant,90 day receipt of notification, and a departure card.

is that the whole set or am I missing anything?

[MaeJoMTB]

5 hours ago, jak2002003 said:

So, let me get this straight....

 

If I go out of the country for a holiday... then arrive back to my home in Chiang Mai... I have to go to the immigration office within 24 hours to.... tell them I am back in the country?  

 

It seems to only happen to men who look like 'victims'.

More to do with corrupt CM immigration extorting, than anything else as far as I can see (doesn't seem to happen elsewhere).

Do I care if the person whose house I live in gets fined .......... not my problem IMHO, can't see anywhere that specifies a fine for me.

 

Here we go

https://perfecthomes.co.th/tm030-registration-thailand/

"Let’s put it this way, it’s the owner that will be fined, so the overall responsibility is with the owner. "

No obligation on foreigners to report under the 'Hotel Act 2005', only the property owners.

Edited October 4, 2017 by MaeJoMTB

[Dante99]

 

 

55 minutes ago, Thailand said:

 

 

BTW,I now have stapled in my passport a TM28,change of address. TM30 based on the property I rent,a TM30 I submitted on behalf of a tenant,90 day receipt of notification, and a departure card.

is that the whole set or am I missing anything?

No, you need 3 photos of your great aunt Amy in color with a green background 2.35 cmX2.47cm and 2,000 Baht in the back, no staples.  If Amy is hot none of that will be returned and must be refilled again for your next visit.

[Grumpy Old Man]

1 hour ago, Thailand said:

At one point when both the the airport and Prom immigration were open at the same time nearly everyone reporing TM 30 at the airport office were getting fined 800-1600 baht whilst reporting at Promenada was "free".

 

BTW,I now have stapled in my passport a TM28,change of address. TM30 based on the property I rent,a TM30 I submitted on behalf of a tenant,90 day receipt of notification, and a departure card.

is that the whole set or am I missing anything?

 

How about your TM28 & TM30 receipt of notification . . . . .  

[balo]

I stayed in CM for 6 months , but did my 90 day report in Chonburi since I also owned a condo there. I would never even consider walkng into CM immigration, sounds like hell. Yes I broke the law since I did not report but couldnt care less.

 

Chonburi immigration never asked for TM 30 , just my adress and a few clicks on the computer. No fines . In and out in 10 minutes , life is good here.

Edited October 4, 2017 by balo

[Dan5]

I have 2 thoughts on this. Why did you volunteer so much information  Just give them the minimum and see if they ask for more. I've been doing that for many years and have never been asked for more.

 

Second. It's only 1600 Baht. Forget about it. 

[Thailand]

1 hour ago, Grumpy Old Man said:

 

How about your TM28 & TM30 receipt of notification . . . . .  

BTW,I now have stapled in my passport a TM28,change of address. TM30 based on the property I rent,a TM30 I submitted on behalf of a tenant,90 day receipt of notification, and a departure card.

[rumak]

anyone who follows what maejo  says will be in for a shock (and fine) if they wait for the owner of where they rent

to report to immig. each time they leave and return.  like i posted before, at CM they really only "get you"  if you leave

the country , return and do not report to promenade as soon as possible ( 24 hrs or monday am).

Many posters here will verify that they have to go to do this in person , especially because the office must see your

passport ! If you do not do it they will usually catch you when you do 90 day report or for sure when extending visa.

according to CMI....owner must do the FIRST report  only (within 24 hours of someone renting)

I am just saying how CMI  (and landlords)  handle the law

[Dan5]

4 hours ago, Grumpy Old Man said:

 

How about your TM28 & TM30 receipt of notification . . . . .  

I've been here something like 9 years and I've never seen a TM28 or TM30 or been asked for one.

[Dan5]

2 hours ago, rumak said:

anyone who follows what maejo  says will be in for a shock (and fine) if they wait for the owner of where they rent

to report to immig. each time they leave and return.  like i posted before, at CM they really only "get you"  if you leave

the country , return and do not report to promenade as soon as possible ( 24 hrs or monday am).

Many posters here will verify that they have to go to do this in person , especially because the office must see your

passport ! If you do not do it they will usually catch you when you do 90 day report or for sure when extending visa.

according to CMI....owner must do the FIRST report  only (within 24 hours of someone renting)

I am just saying how CMI  (and landlords)  handle the law

I've left the country for short vacations many times since I've lived here and never done anything but 90 day reports and have never had a problem. But I'm on a retirement visa and have lived the same place for all of the nine years or so I've been here. But I live in Bangkok and I really get the impression Bangkok immigration is a lot more easy going than many of the other provinces.

[jak2002003]

The more I read the more confused I get.  Here is my situation... 

 

In one week we leave the county.  Come back in 3 weeks time... and are going to stay in a HOTEL on return for a few weeks... and NOT stay at the rented property we are currently in... (where the owner has not registered us staying, and we have not registered this address as we were ignorant to this rule until now) We only did the 90 day reporting and put the address on there.  

Will the hotel register us at the address for the hotel, or do we have to go to Immigration within 24 hours to say we are staying in the hotel?

 

I am thinking to leave the mess about this rented property, go out for couple weeks, come back and stay in hotel.  

 

Then when go out to new property in the future from the hotel I can start again with register new address?  

 

Would this be a good idea?  

 

 

[Grumpy Old Man]

10 minutes ago, jak2002003 said:

The more I read the more confused I get.  Here is my situation... 

 

In one week we leave the county.  Come back in 3 weeks time... and are going to stay in a HOTEL on return for a few weeks... and NOT stay at the rented property we are currently in... (where the owner has not registered us staying, and we have not registered this address as we were ignorant to this rule until now) We only did the 90 day reporting and put the address on there.  

Will the hotel register us at the address for the hotel, or do we have to go to Immigration within 24 hours to say we are staying in the hotel?

 

I am thinking to leave the mess about this rented property, go out for couple weeks, come back and stay in hotel.  

 

Then when go out to new property in the future from the hotel I can start again with register new address?  

 

Would this be a good idea?  

 

 

 

I am giving the information I have received from the Thai Immigration Police in Chiangmai but as I have found out over these last few weeks each Thai Province seem to make their own rules up on a daily basis 

 

1. If you traveling out of Thailand and you are on a Visa or Extension to Stay you need to get a "Re-Entry Permit" before you leave or you will lose your Visa or Extension to Stay entitlements on returning to Thailand.

 

2. On returning to Thailand or being a tourist the HOTEL, GUEST HOUSE or RENTED ACCOMMADATION are required to give notice they have an "ALIEN" staying; you have no requirements to give notice you are there.

 

3. When you return to your rented home in Thailand YOU are required to give notice on a TM 28 within 24 Hours.     

"FORM FOR ALIENS TO NOTIFY THEIR CHANGE OF ADDRESS OR THEIR STAY IN THE PROVINCE FOR OVER 24 HOURS"

4.The property owner / Blue Book registered person is required to give notice on a TM 30 within 24 Hours.

"NOTIFICATION FORM FOR HOUSE-MASTER, OWNER OR POSSESSER OF THE RESIDENCE WHERE ALIEN HAS STAYED"

 

The TM 30 is NOT your responsibility and any fines of not doing the TM 30 are also NOT you responsibility. 

 

There are also NO fees for doing a TM 28 or TM 30 report.

 

    I hope this helps clear things up a bit 

[BuddyDean]

1. TM30 is the owner's responsibility, but you will be the one refused an extension if you don't have it.   

Farang landlords should make sure they are in compliance with rent tax before they sign...stories circulating about years of taxes and penalties..

[evenstevens]

 

around Jan this year, I was faced with the TM.30. saga

when all the cards were dealt to me, i had no hesitation in paying the 1600 baht fine,and since then, been in out of the country, on 3 ocassions,and on my return  , reported to the TM30 officer, who in a couple minutes updated my TM30 ,on their computer,and  Bobs your uncle,  the whole exercise  took  approx 30 mins(no agents involved)from stepping into their  office

to save any member,  the  O/P  nightmare (LOL) roll with the punches, that are thrown ,and you will come out fighting, for the next round

BTW

i have a number of times since Jan, spent a night or two from my TM address ( major hotel) and never ever, have any repercussions, from doing so, as in my view i have paid my TM30 fine,and my house is in order (touch wood)   my advice ,is   to pay the  TM30 fine ,whether right or wrong, and just for 1600 baht   the O/P  nightmare, will become a dream

a Tom Petty  R.I.P .lovely evening to all

[BuddyDean]

Did they ever even say they knew you had stayed at a hotel?

[MaeJoMTB]

On 10/4/2017 at 5:37 PM, rumak said:

anyone who follows what maejo  says will be in for a shock (and fine) if they wait for the owner of where they rent

to report to immig. each time they leave and return.  like i posted before, at CM they really only "get you"  if you leave

the country , return and do not report to promenade as soon as possible ( 24 hrs or monday am).

Many posters here will verify that they have to go to do this in person , especially because the office must see your

passport ! If you do not do it they will usually catch you when you do 90 day report or for sure when extending visa.

according to CMI....owner must do the FIRST report  only (within 24 hours of someone renting)

I am just saying how CMI  (and landlords)  handle the law

As I never visit CM immigration, how would they 'get me' ...... nearly 8 years now and they've shown no interest at the airport when I arrive. And when I renewed my DL used their own VISA agent to get the CofR.

Edited October 5, 2017 by MaeJoMTB

[evenstevens]

1 hour ago, BuddyDean said:

Did they ever even say they knew you had stayed at a hotel?

no, not at all , as i have just posted ,  no repercussions at all!!!

from my experiences ,  the one,s who have nightmares /problems   or  are against the Immgr  Dept  policy,s  or services etc etc  in place for what ever reason ( which can change over nite ) are the problem themselves,  over many years ,i have just adjusted to their policys,, whether good or bad, and got on, with a very happy retirement in C/mai, and the most expats that i know  do the same, C/mai a great place for the  retiree,s with good commonsense,and with no axe to grind with Immgr Dept ,and to put it bluntly those who have,have been  beaten up ,  good and proper, as,there is only one winner,and rightly so the Immgr Dept,

its a    Tom Petty and  the Heartbreakers. good nite to all

[cloudhopper]

I live on my sail boat for several months every year during the smoky season and usually check out for Malaysia and back in to LOS at Phuket for some of that that time, and stay aboard for weeks after that before returning to our home here in the North. There is no way I can possibly comply with their TM30 requirement, so I when it's 90 day time at Promenada I shut up, smile and pay the fine or whatever hoops they want me to jump through. We live among ignorant corrupt savages - play their game or they'll tear you to pieces.

Edited October 5, 2017 by cloudhopper

[amvet]

14 minutes ago, cloudhopper said:

I live on my sail boat for several months every year during the smoky season and usually check out for Malaysia and back in to LOS at Phuket for some of that that time, and stay aboard for weeks after that before returning to our home here in the North. There is no way I can possibly comply with their TM30 requirement, so I when it's 90 day time at Promenada I shut up, smile and pay the fine or whatever hoops they want me to jump through. We live among ignorant corrupt savages - play their game or they'll tear you to pieces.

Why would you do your own 90 day report?  Wouldn't it be easier to have it done for you as that is within the law as I remember it.

[BuddyDean]

I think the agents might be more than willing to help open the TM30 can of worms for you...definitely at extension time anyways...IOW, the 300 fee to do a 90, isn't nearly enough to fix a 1600 THB TM 30 problem.

[MaeJoMTB]

4 hours ago, BuddyDean said:

I think the agents might be more than willing to help open the TM30 can of worms for you...definitely at extension time anyways...IOW, the 300 fee to do a 90, isn't nearly enough to fix a 1600 THB TM 30 problem.

When you DIY, they are looking for reasons to 'fine' you.

When you use their VISA agent, they process the 100 applications he hands them without any checks, and take the bribe.

 

What is it you don't understand about an essentially corrupt system?

[evenstevens]

4 hours ago, BuddyDean said:

I think the agents might be more than willing to help open the TM30 can of worms for you...definitely at extension time anyways...IOW, the 300 fee to do a 90, isn't nearly enough to fix a 1600 THB TM 30 problem.

my Visa Agent i engage (when needed) the  fee is 300 baht  to secure a TM30 ,with provision that your papers are correct etcetc, done in approx 15 minutes

in my case due to my papers not being in order or that my landlord was not present, i had to pay the fine of 1600 baht ,my agent was very apolegetic asking for this fine ,as i already posted on this thread i immediately paid it to get my house in order ,to avoid any nightmares

and received a official receipt from the R.T.P,  which is now placed in my passport, along side my TM30,and to date have not been questioned at all when reporting in, when returning from another country,or staying in a major hotel (Chiangmai)for a nite or two ,so far the 1600 baht fine,  in my view has been more then justified,others think otherwise and thats entirely up to them

a very nice morning to all

[worgeordie]

One of our tenants arrived at our house yesterday,they had been out

of the country and arrived back a month ago,and they had forgotten to

advise us,I said we will most likely get fined 1600 THB,but you will have

to pay it,as it was your fault for not telling us,they agreed. 

 

It seems this requirement to report tenants coming and going,puts

the responsibility on the landlord,we are not the Starzi,as long as they

pay the rent,we leave them to get on with their lives,and only expect to

see them if something needs repairing.so how are we supposed to know

when they have been on holiday if they dont tell us.

 

So off to immigration ,fully expecting to be fined,the officer listened to

the story,gave a warning, next time you will be fined for late reporting,

so dont know if he was having a good day,or we were,so in this case they

were fair ,never had any problems with staff there at all,maybe its the way

one presents oneself and your attitude. P.S. the tenant was pleased not to be fined

                                                                               just hope they take more care in future.

Regards Worgeordie

 

 

Edited October 6, 2017 by worgeordie
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