E-cigarettes linger despite legal threats

[fasteddie]

2 hours ago, wealthychef said:

 

OMG I go so crazy over idiotic climate denialism.  Off topic though.  Still, come on, really?  

Is it off topic though? surely if you're gullible enough to believe the Agenda 21 driven AGW scam then maybe you can be convinced that breathing out whatever cocktail of whatever from e-gigs mixed with the Co2 is also somehow managing to compete with the Sun in driving climate change.

[mrfill]

Ban kettles.

Ban vegetable steamers

Ban hot water

 

Get rid of all these awful vapour producing things.

 

Burn more plastic. That can't be dangerous as it hasn't been banned.

[overherebc]

29 minutes ago, willr said:

Its Not smoke its Vapour,steam.

Go back a few posts, that's been done already.

70% water vapour and 30% unhealthy crap and chemicals.

Steam is actually almost invisible, what your describing is condensed steam, water droplets.

Check what comes out of a kettle spout, about the first inch or so where you see nothing then it condenses into water droplets.

[giddyup]

22 hours ago, overherebc said:

So does a baked bean fart but I don't like sitting in the middle of it.

???

Really, and how often does this happen, once a week, ten times a day? Yet if you are outside you are breathing petrol and diesel fumes that are far more harmful.

[giddyup]

21 hours ago, overherebc said:

The other 30% has nicotine glycerin, heavy metal particles and nanoparticles etc etc.

Maybe not that much healthier than cigs themselves.

Just sayin'

Wrong! Most of the damage from cigarette smoking is the fact that you are taking very hot smoke laden with all kinds of toxic chemicals into your lungs. The heat is one of the things that does the most damage. It is also proven that vapers don't find the need to get their nicotine hit as often as cigarette smokers and are far more likely to kick the habit. Just sayin'

[curlylekan]

As a happy ex-smoker for 6 years and counting, I would much rather have someone around with an e cigarette than a real one. 

 

Wherever this bit about, "The growing health  concerns over e cigarettes" has got me wondering the agenda of the writer. I tried to find anything about the negative's, and while their are some, they are no where near as bad as cigarettes. Also, little, if any evidence exist's to point that second hand smoke has the potential harm as a cigarette does. 

 

Personally, I see them as a positive if someone wants to use on to quit smoking. 

 

I think someone with too much money and power is pulling strings here, but as a non-smoker, I'm glad to not be in the cross hairs. It's the cigarette smoking when living/traveling in Taiwan and China that really worries me. 

[Neeranam]

On 13/10/2017 at 2:12 PM, Just1Voice said:

Why are they illegal?   Because the Thai Tobacco Cartel has a monopoly and they don't want any competition.  Simple as that. 

Snuss is much better for substituting fags, or for quitting

 

I think we all know that. Similar to why Snuss is banned in the UK.

Edited October 14, 2017 by Neeranam

[Neeranam]

Snuss is much better for substituting fags or quitting.

[giddyup]

14 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Snuss is much better for substituting fags or quitting.

Just get cancer of the mouth instead of the lungs.

[overherebc]

 Just to go completely off topic here it seems that 20 popular beaches in Thailand are going to be classed as non smoking.

This will put them on the same status as most of the popular beaches around Sydney in Oz.

When do you think the 20 most popular beaches in Thailand will also follow the popular Oz beaches and not allow food on the beaches as well.

Just imagine the millions of Ozzie tourists who save all year so they can come to Thailand and smoke and eat on the beaches cancelling because they can't do it here anymore. Good god, the tourist industry in Thailand will collapse. ( not ).

I actually don't give a BRA whether you smoke, vape or whatever, just do it where it's legal to do it. 

I don't go to non smoking areas and smoke so don't vape if it's illegal and try to justify it by proclaiming you know it's harmless. My smoking would annoy people in non smoking areas as would vaping, non smokers would/do see it as the same thing.

I love/loved driving fast cars/bikes and thought I was Stirling Moss but that didn't stop me getting fined when I did it where I shouldn't have.

Let's decide that smoking and vaping annoy non smokers to an equal extent so just learn to live with it.

?

[giddyup]

I actually don't give a BRA whether you smoke, vape or whatever, just do it where it's legal to do it. 

Fine, just don't try and suggest that vaping is a bigger health hazard than smoking, and no, I don't agree that vaping and smoking are equally annoying.

Edited October 14, 2017 by giddyup

[wealthychef]

7 hours ago, fasteddie said:

Is it off topic though? surely if you're gullible enough to believe the Agenda 21 driven AGW scam then maybe you can be convinced that breathing out whatever cocktail of whatever from e-gigs mixed with the Co2 is also somehow managing to compete with the Sun in driving climate change.

 

Or you could go learn some science.  Your ignorance is breathtaking. 

 

[MrTee]

21 hours ago, bizboi said:

not true - tests prove it contains 10X the normal safe levels of methane and propane which ARE carcinogenic! (want a link)?

Sure post a link - I'll call that BS right. There is no  Methane or Propane in E-cigarette vapour. 

[MrTee]

16 hours ago, overherebc said:

Go back a few posts, that's been done already.

70% water vapour and 30% unhealthy crap and chemicals.

Steam is actually almost invisible, what your describing is condensed steam, water droplets

.

Check what comes out of a kettle spout, about the first inch or so where you see nothing then it condenses into water droplets.

 

We already had this - I said at least 70% H2O..   and it is beyond idiotic to say the remaining 30% is "unhealthy crap and chemicals."   do some research so you  don't keep making a a dicky of your self. 

I know for a fact the Vape I use is nearer 90% H2O and has  < 2%  Nicotine,  <  8% flavouring.  The flavours use have no known carcinogens. 

Go research the chemical analysis of E-Cigarette vapour, and stop spouting hot air. 

 

[overherebc]

29 minutes ago, MrTee said:

 

We already had this - I said at least 70% H2O..   and it is beyond idiotic to say the remaining 30% is "unhealthy crap and chemicals."   do some research so you  don't keep making a a dicky of your self. 

I know for a fact the Vape I use is nearer 90% H2O and has  < 2%  Nicotine,  <  8% flavouring.  The flavours use have no known carcinogens. 

Go research the chemical analysis of E-Cigarette vapour, and stop spouting hot air. 

 

Fine, 

So you can justify vaping on the beach after the 1st and the authorities will Wai you, say sorry and let you carry on.

All these posts about vaping being harmless are just attempts to somehow argue against a law in Thailand.

Of course my cigs are much worse for me than vaping but that's as far as the arguement can go.

It's illegal full stop. Arguing your case against the police here on the health benefits of your habit would hold as much water as me arguing my case on how little of each cigarette I smoke or that I only smoke 2 a day.

At the moment I have places where I can legally smoke, vapers don't have that luxury, for want of a better word.

[MrTee]

47 minutes ago, overherebc said:

Fine, 

So you can justify vaping on the beach after the 1st and the authorities will Wai you, say sorry and let you carry on.

All these posts about vaping being harmless are just attempts to somehow argue against a law in Thailand.

Of course my cigs are much worse for me than vaping but that's as far as the arguement can go.

It's illegal full stop. Arguing your case against the police here on the health benefits of your habit would hold as much water as me arguing my case on how little of each cigarette I smoke or that I only smoke 2 a day.

At the moment I have places where I can legally smoke, vapers don't have that luxury, for want of a better word.

I think the reason that vaping continues to be relatively ubiquitous in the Thailand is that young people that vape  are more likely to be educated and understand that the difference in the risks between vaping and smoking. 

Maybe I should point out I do not vape in Thailand, nor do I smoke cigarettes in Thailand.  The Thai Junta is well within it's rights to ban vaping. there is nothing in any nation's constitution that says  it is wrong to make stupid rules, and who am I to disagree with a ruling by a sovereign state that will directly affect the health of its citizens. "up to you" as they say.   It does piss me off that they care little about the health of those forced to 'secondary smoke'.  Multiple Research has shown  'secondary vapers' to have almost zero ill effects even in a sealed room with ' bare cloudz' .

Banning E-cigs is not likely  to affect tourist numbers -  somewhere around 5% of Brits vape, so getting the message out to those not to come to Thailand will hardly affect visitors from the UK.. I guess the number are far higher for Chinese\Koreans - but that is not something I know much about. I am sure those that made the decision to ban E-cigs careful considered the health risks, and associated health costs, and loss of tourist income. Surely nobody is that stupid to just decide to ban something, are they?

 

< 17% of Brits are still smart enough to be using cigarettes even though much less harmful delivery systems are readily available.  I guess this is down to the misinformation and  stupid posts they read on the interwebz, which is my motivation to correct your assertion.  Like it or not Vaping E-cigarettes is  much less harmful than smoking tobacco.. 

I do not smoke on beaches,  and I fully support banning cigarette smoking in public places (Clubs, Discos, Bus, Beaches, Restaurants, Airports, etc) , not just banning but enforcing the ban too.  Boils my piss that my nice clothes stink like an ash tray if I chose to go out to a bar in the evening.  Smokers stink. 

I do vape in my home country. 
 

I do not advocate vaping, other than as a replacement for cigarettes.  I'm not advocating for  vaping or not, nor, for smoking or not.  I am advocating for honest, knowledgeable debate -
 
Enjoy your legally smoking places  :) 

Edited October 15, 2017 by MrTee

[overherebc]

I've seen the old adverts for cigarettes, you know the one, 

'more doctors smoke camels than any other brand'

Back in the days when smoking was good for you.

Can't say it will happen but at the moment lots of studies going on the effects of vaping as it is a fairly new idea.

Can't quite see the 'more doctors vape with xxx than any other vaper' 

I'll go with vaping is much less unhealthy than smoking as far as we know at this time.

?

[NOWHERE]

I've been vaping for over 5 years. As a sideline I sell vaping equipment and make the eliquid for resale. 

Though the sale of nicotine is illegal here, (Australia) if I was to make it, this would be the make up;

94% varying mixture of Australian made propylene glycol and vegetable glycerin. You vary the ratio to either produce clouds or get a throat hit. 

2%  flavour concentrates. Chemical based but food grade. 

4% nicotine. Gives the equivalent of a 4 mg cigarette. It comes as 100% liquid nicotine. 

Completely understand non smokers objections to vapes. But I'm thankful for the technology, I'm healthier for it. 

[carlyai]

Is Vaping illegal in Thailand?

Many/most say it is, but if you buy the product from a seller in Thailand, won't you pay the VAT when you buy the product here? That would mean you have been taxed on the product, so does that now make it legal?

Can anyone quote the law that says vaping is illegal or is it not paying tax on something classed as a cigarette that us illegal?

I want to buy one for SWMBO to stop her smoking, but I'm confused.


Sent from my SM-J700F using Tapatalk

[anon789561]

On 10/13/2017 at 10:27 AM, overherebc said:

Walked behind one guy who had one stuck in his gob and had to stop to let him get further ahead so I could then see where I was going. It brought to mind the old Navy movies when the order ' make smoke' was issued. 

Why do the user love to produce those huge volumes of the 'smoke'?

Just askin'

 

i think in a year or 2 everyone will be using the philip morris ones. not going to be cheap but they will take over. 

[Nemesis7]

Sisha is illigal unless you manage the authority, now Vapping is illegal, but xxx is not?

[Seismic]

On 10/13/2017 at 6:17 PM, fasteddie said:

I was just about to give you a like until your last inane statement, if you're not aware of the dangers of vaccinations and the very obvious climate scam you need to do some research.

If you are not aware of the ridiculous claims and misinformation put out by anti vaccination people I suggest it is you who needs to do some research. even though all their claims have been thoroughly debunked, they still make the same idiotic statements.

[The manic]

On 14/10/2017 at 2:28 PM, nchuckle said:

So throughout history bad laws never changed because people had something to say about them?

It depends on how many people a dcwhich people support the laws. Vaping is vile and is only supported by smokers who wont give up normally like most people do.

[The manic]

On 14/10/2017 at 11:06 PM, overherebc said:

 Just to go completely off topic here it seems that 20 popular beaches in Thailand are going to be classed as non smoking.

This will put them on the same status as most of the popular beaches around Sydney in Oz.

When do you think the 20 most popular beaches in Thailand will also follow the popular Oz beaches and not allow food on the beaches as well.

Just imagine the millions of Ozzie tourists who save all year so they can come to Thailand and smoke and eat on the beaches cancelling because they can't do it here anymore. Good god, the tourist industry in Thailand will collapse. ( not ).

I actually don't give a BRA whether you smoke, vape or whatever, just do it where it's legal to do it. 

I don't go to non smoking areas and smoke so don't vape if it's illegal and try to justify it by proclaiming you know it's harmless. My smoking would annoy people in non smoking areas as would vaping, non smokers would/do see it as the same thing.

I love/loved driving fast cars/bikes and thought I was Stirling Moss but that didn't stop me getting fined when I did it where I shouldn't have.

Let's decide that smoking and vaping annoy non smokers to an equal extent so just learn to live with it.

?

The majority of people do not smoke nor do they wish to see  or smell it or have the selfish morons who do smoke set a dreadful example to their kids. Vaping also sets an awful example. I do not care if  people want to smoke smack off tin foil...but do it at home.

[nikotin]

19 hours ago, The manic said:

The majority of people do not smoke nor do they wish to see  or smell it or have the selfish morons who do smoke set a dreadful example to their kids. Vaping also sets an awful example. I do not care if  people want to smoke smack off tin foil...but do it at home.

Smokin smack off tin foil aint legal where i come from!So what do i have to do now?Are you thai national or what exactly elevates you to an position that allows you to tell people what they can or can not do in thailand?

[bizboi]

On 15/10/2017 at 10:53 AM, MrTee said:

Sure post a link - I'll call that BS right. There is no  Methane or Propane in E-cigarette vapour. 

I agree with your last post above and I actually DO vape at home in Thailand. However, i have to say your wrong about vapes being innocent steam. Not only do they contain small amounts of methane and propane by the way but also formaldehyde which constitutes from methane at high temperatures…and also dopamine. As you can see Ive provided links and references

 

There is also some evidence that the vapor may contain some toxic compounds like carbonyls, traces of nitrosamines, or particles of heavy metals (Bullen et al., 2010; Dawkins & Corcoran, 2013; Etter & Bullen, 2011; Goniewicz, Knysak, et al., 2013; Goniewicz, Kuma, Gawron, Knysak, & Kosmider, 2013; Trehy et al., 2011; Vansickel & Eissenberg, 2013; Vansickel, Cobb, Weaver, & Eissenberg, 2010; Williams, Villarreal, Bozhilov, Lin, & Talbot, 2013).

 

Here are some links for you, as I prefer to act on educated study rather than my own BS opinions!!

https://www.sciencenewsforstudents.org/article/concerns-explode-over-new-health-risks-vaping

http://www.oregonlive.com/health/index.ssf/2015/01/embargoed_study_on_e-cigarette.html

http://www.cancercenter.com/discussions/blog/e-cigarette-dangers-lurking-in-a-smokescreen-experts-say/

http://www.philstar.com/headlines/2013/01/21/899285/e-cigarettes-not-advisable-smokers-doh

Edited October 18, 2017 by bizboi

[Seismic]

2 minutes ago, bizboi said:

 

 

Here are some links for you, as I prefer to act on educated study rather than my own BS opinions!!

https://www.sciencenewsforstudents.org/article/concerns-explode-over-new-health-risks-vaping

http://www.oregonlive.com/health/index.ssf/2015/01/embargoed_study_on_e-cigarette.html

http://www.cancercenter.com/discussions/blog/e-cigarette-dangers-lurking-in-a-smokescreen-experts-say/

http://www.philstar.com/headlines/2013/01/21/899285/e-cigarettes-not-advisable-smokers-doh

The problem with these studies is the language they use, every one speaks in the same vague way without giving any proven statistics they speak of "some data, may suggest, may contain, possibly harmful,  may pose risks, potentially affect, some studies show", So why do none of these studies actually come out and in clear and unequivocal terms state proven facts??, because they dont actually seem to have enough data to make a claim. One thing i do know, Tobacco and chemicals in Cigarettes has killed millions and is still killing. There is no evidence that anyone has died or been seriously affected by vaping. I managed to quit cigarettes by vaping and was able to stop even that after a single year.

[bizboi]

1 minute ago, Seismic said:

The problem with these studies is the language they use, every one speaks in the same vague way without giving any proven statistics they speak of "some data, may suggest, may contain, possibly harmful,  may pose risks, potentially affect, some studies show", So why do none of these studies actually come out and in clear and unequivocal terms state proven facts??, because they dont actually seem to have enough data to make a claim. One thing i do know, Tobacco and chemicals in Cigarettes has killed millions and is still killing. There is no evidence that anyone has died or been seriously affected by vaping. I managed to quit cigarettes by vaping and was able to stop even that after a single year.

I totally agree that vaping is a million times better than smoking cigarettes …..but at least two of the articles as well as limited research of the British Medical Association has shown actual measurable traces of the chemicals mentioned - having said that I will continue to vape when the swolen gland on my neck gets better and my sore throat goes away!!

[The manic]

On 13/10/2017 at 2:12 PM, Just1Voice said:

Why are they illegal?   Because the Thai Tobacco Cartel has a monopoly and they don't want any competition.  Simple as that. 

 

They are illegal because they are a gateway to regular tobacco smoking; they  are dirty; they stink and pollute; they normalize th act of smoking to young people; they cause cancer and as they are new the full health implications are not known. These idiots who foul up their bodies and our environmt would be better off smoking mild marijuana...though at home in private or special smoking dens like they have at some airports.

[giddyup]

55 minutes ago, The manic said:

They are illegal because they are a gateway to regular tobacco smoking; they  are dirty; they stink and pollute; they normalize th act of smoking to young people; they cause cancer and as they are new the full health implications are not known. These idiots who foul up their bodies and our environmt would be better off smoking mild marijuana...though at home in private or special smoking dens like they have at some airports.

You epitomise the height of ignorance.