They are a very busy department the Ministry of crackdowns.  

Edited November 14, 20178 yr by sammieuk1

Put them up north to get processed at the detention centres cram them into small mini bus and on these wonderful dangerous roads might make a bit of money rather than processed for overstay, better to charge relative’s for cremation then send them back by courier think of the savings urn rather than flight seat.  

1 hour ago, hotchilli said:

200,000 over-stayers is an embarrassing admission.

 

Why?  We've got something like 11 million back home.

 

7 hours ago, darksidedog said:

Ignoring for a moment how people get into overstay, Thailand has itself largely to blame for the amount of long term over stayers. Once someone has gone into overstay, they have no attractive options. Face jail, get blacklisted etc. If they were to offer a short window, no questions asked, amnesty, many people would take the option to leave, either permanently, or long enough to obtain the correct visas. This would be far cheaper and efficient than the current, largely incompetent efforts, that barely scratch the surface of the problem and free the police up to actually target serious criminals. And God knows, there are plenty of them around.

So....don't overstay, very simple! What Country offers attractive Options for Overstayers? A Visa is a Visa with clearly stated rules in every Country. Don't blame Thailand for the Fault of Overstayers. 95% of them play the Game duck and cover, know the Consequences. Many are Criminals, so Police target them for right.

1 hour ago, overherebc said:

1 hour ago, impulse said:

 

Not if you have no savings left, make $1,000 a month and support a family (or drinking habit) on it.  I'm not passing judgment on anyone's situation (there but for the Grace of God...).  But there are lots of guys in situations where they cannot possibly afford get legal and stay that way for more than a single visa validity. 

So that's Thailands fault then ?

 

Not at all.  But to contend that anyone should be able to clear up a visa problem in 90 days isn't accurate.  And that's the point I was replying to.  (For any grammar Nazis, That's the point to which I was replying.)

3 hours ago, RayD said:

Immigration is computerised. If it can't give an exact number of people stamped in and not stamped out or extended, what's the point?

 

Dream on, they know it

                                                                                                   

7 hours ago, Thaiwrath said:

The numbers have doubled overnight ?

 

 

                                                                                                    Only in Phuket:

Police Station	Arrested	Reported to immigration	Unaccounted for
Sakoo Police Station	76	3	73
Thalang Police Station	78	16	62
Chalong Police Station	171	52	119
Karon Police Station	344	95	249
Kamala Police Station	269	145	124
Tha Chatchai police Station	20	2	18
Cherng Talay Police Station	75	60	15
Patong Police Station	862	52	810
Kathu Police Station	98	27	71
Wichit Police Station	248	59	189
Phuket City Police Station	174	174	0
Total	2,415	685	1,730

So far 15 police officers across Phuket have been removed from active duty pending an investigation into the report. (See story here.)

30 minutes ago, ujayujay said:

So....don't overstay, very simple! What Country offers attractive Options for Overstayers? A Visa is a Visa with clearly stated rules in every Country. Don't blame Thailand for the Fault of Overstayers. 95% of them play the Game duck and cover, know the Consequences. Many are Criminals, so Police target them for right.

Most countries if you have overstayed and voluntarily turn up at the airport, will just allow you to go, with no penalty. I have seen many people here on overstay, through circumstances beyond their control. What do you do, when your missus hides your passport? Case in point. A guy I know has an overstay. He had a 30 Million baht house, which he stupidly put in the wifes name. She borrowed against it to fund her brothers gambling habit. He lost the house. She also stole loads of money from him then pissed off and left him alone with the kids and took his passport. He is OK again now, has a new passport, but also has overstay. He can't take the kids without her permission, which she won't give. If he leaves, he can't come back, so loses the kids. Not his fault, but the system means he has to hide and hope. Now tell me again, that providing occasional amnesties is wrong and that all over stayers are criminals!

Edited November 14, 20178 yr by darksidedog

8 hours ago, Thaiwrath said:

The numbers have doubled overnight ?

 

 

 

                                                                       ONLY IN PHUKET:

Police Station	Arrested	Reported to immigration	Unaccounted for
Sakoo Police Station	76	3	73
Thalang Police Station	78	16	62
Chalong Police Station	171	52	119
Karon Police Station	344	95	249
Kamala Police Station	269	145	124
Tha Chatchai police Station	20	2	18
Cherng Talay Police Station	75	60	15
Patong Police Station	862	52	810
Kathu Police Station	98	27	71
Wichit Police Station	248	59	189
Phuket City Police Station	174	174	0
Total	2,415	685	1,730

So far 15 police officers across Phuket have been removed from active duty pending an investigation into the report. (See story here.)

 

Edited November 14, 20178 yr by nasa123

5 hours ago, Get Real said:

That´s great! Maybe they can deport all this sickness in the country. Implement better security systems, and make it easier on the people that stays here legally.

I would respectfully suggest you are a bit long in the tooth to believe in fairy stories

Of course there is no harm in dreaming

22 minutes ago, darksidedog said:

Most countries if you have overstayed and voluntarily turn up at the airport, will just allow you to go, with no penalty. I have seen many people here on overstay, through circumstances beyond their control. What do you do, when your missus hides your passport? Case in point. A guy I know has an overstay. He had a 30 Million baht house, which he stupidly put in the wifes name. She borrowed against it to fund her brothers gambling habit. He lost the house. She also stole loads of money from him then pissed off and left him alone with the kids and took his passport. He is OK again now, has a new passport, but also has overstay. He can't take the kids without her permission, which she won't give. If he leaves, he can't come back, so loses the kids. Not his fault, but the system means he has to hide and hope. Now tell me again, that providing occasional amnesties is wrong and that all over stayers are criminals!

That is a sh-t awful situation.

 

24 minutes ago, darksidedog said:

 She also stole loads of money from him then pissed off and left him alone with the kids and took his passport. He is OK again now, has a new passport, but also has overstay. He can't take the kids without her permission, which she won't give. If he leaves, he can't come back, so loses the kids. Not his fault, but the system means he has to hide and hope. Now tell me again, that providing occasional amnesties is wrong and that all over stayers are criminals!

 

I follow your story but not its meaning for this discussion.

 

AFAIK, if someone has their passport lost or stolen, they ought to be able to have it replaced and/or have an emergency travel document issued by their country's consulate in Bangkok.

 

I don't see how losing a passport somehow automatically pushes someone into overstay status, and especially into the longer overstay categories where more serious blacklisting occurs.

 

 

6 hours ago, Tilacme said:

I would suggest a complete rethink on visas and making Thai citizenship more attainable which would take most of the "good guys" out the current bureaucracy so freeing up resources to round up the miscreants.

An idea yes but I would say it won't happen due to a few reasons.

The main one being that a lot of Thailand would be bought up by certain nationalities, the rules were brought in to cover such a good few years ago to prevent/stop it. I'm quite sure most could take a stab in the dark and hit the target re' nationality.

It would be nice to allow someone who is married to a Thai to own enough to build a house on with the right to stay until you you go toes up or sell etc but I'm sure even that would be abused.

Yes an idea but that's all it ever will be.

 

34 minutes ago, darksidedog said:

Most countries if you have overstayed and voluntarily turn up at the airport, will just allow you to go, with no penalty. I have seen many people here on overstay, through circumstances beyond their control. What do you do, when your missus hides your passport? Case in point. A guy I know has an overstay. He had a 30 Million baht house, which he stupidly put in the wifes name. She borrowed against it to fund her brothers gambling habit. He lost the house. She also stole loads of money from him then pissed off and left him alone with the kids and took his passport. He is OK again now, has a new passport, but also has overstay. He can't take the kids without her permission, which she won't give. If he leaves, he can't come back, so loses the kids. Not his fault, but the system means he has to hide and hope. Now tell me again, that providing occasional amnesties is wrong and that all over stayers are criminals!

You make a good point, too many here are quick to cast judgement based upon their own perceived false sense of security.

8 hours ago, darksidedog said:

Ignoring for a moment how people get into overstay, Thailand has itself largely to blame for the amount of long term over stayers. Once someone has gone into overstay, they have no attractive options. Face jail, get blacklisted etc. If they were to offer a short window, no questions asked, amnesty, many people would take the option to leave, either permanently, or long enough to obtain the correct visas. This would be far cheaper and efficient than the current, largely incompetent efforts, that barely scratch the surface of the problem and free the police up to actually target serious criminals. And God knows, there are plenty of them around.

 

Or people could just not overstay. Why blame Thailand instead of those knowingly breaking the law? Bizarre.

Your scenarios  are inevitable for sure but it's better to have a grand plan than a fire fighting plan.

49 minutes ago, darksidedog said:

Most countries if you have overstayed and voluntarily turn up at the airport, will just allow you to go, with no penalty. I have seen many people here on overstay, through circumstances beyond their control. What do you do, when your missus hides your passport? Case in point. A guy I know has an overstay. He had a 30 Million baht house, which he stupidly put in the wifes name. She borrowed against it to fund her brothers gambling habit. He lost the house. She also stole loads of money from him then pissed off and left him alone with the kids and took his passport. He is OK again now, has a new passport, but also has overstay. He can't take the kids without her permission, which she won't give. If he leaves, he can't come back, so loses the kids. Not his fault, but the system means he has to hide and hope. Now tell me again, that providing occasional amnesties is wrong and that all over stayers are criminals!

An extreme example. I don't think the other 199,999 have a similar experience.

35 minutes ago, oldlakey said:

I would respectfully suggest you are a bit long in the tooth to believe in fairy stories

Of course there is no harm in dreaming

No offence taken, and I understand your opinion. Though, it´s only an opinion and a very wrong one. I, on the other hand, can base my statement on both historical facts and modern downfall.

For many years ago, when the criminality was lower or well hidden and sometimes overseen. Then it was much simpler to get a visa for staying long time in Thailand, fewer questions and not same many controls. Means the dream you are talking about once existed.
Today the criminal activities have risen to the surface and getting bigger and more day after day. That have resulted in harder controls, more scrutiny and more paperwork and rules to pass for qualifying for the different visas.
If they once again can get the amount of illegal persons and international criminality in Thailand down, I then see it as a bigger chance to get back to an easier system regarding visas and possibilities to stay for people from other countries.

If you can not see the red line in what has been, what is and what once again can become. Yeah, then it´s respecfully you that are deep down in dreamland. It´s just not even dreamland anymore. You have succeeded to go beyond this world into parallell universe. Still sleeping and dreaming good, though.

Edited November 14, 20178 yr by Get Real

1 minute ago, Get Real said:

No offence taken, and I understand your opinion. Though, it´s only an opinion and a very wrong one. I, on the other hand, can base my statement on both historical facts and modern downfall.

For many years ago, when the criminality was lower or well hidden and sometimes overseen. Then it was much simpler to get a visa for staying long time in Thailand, fewer questions and not same many controls. Means the dream you are talking about once existed.
Today the criminal activities have risen to the surface and getting bigger and more day after day. That have resulted in harder controls, more scrutiny and more paperwork and rules to pass for qualifying for the different visas.
If they once again can get the amount of illegal persons and international criminality in Thailand down, I then see it as a bigger chance to get back to an easier system regarding visas and possibilities to stay for people from other countries.

If you can not see the red line in waht has been, what is and what once again can become. Yeah, then it´s respecfully you that are deep down in dreamland. It´s just not even dreamland anymore. You have succeeded to go beyong this world into parallell universe. Still sleeping and dreaming good, though.

5555555555

OK I will try again

This is Thailand, its not going to happen

In fact you have not got a cat in hells chance

1 hour ago, darksidedog said:

Most countries if you have overstayed and voluntarily turn up at the airport, will just allow you to go, with no penalty. I have seen many people here on overstay, through circumstances beyond their control. What do you do, when your missus hides your passport? Case in point. A guy I know has an overstay. He had a 30 Million baht house, which he stupidly put in the wifes name. She borrowed against it to fund her brothers gambling habit. He lost the house. She also stole loads of money from him then pissed off and left him alone with the kids and took his passport. He is OK again now, has a new passport, but also has overstay. He can't take the kids without her permission, which she won't give. If he leaves, he can't come back, so loses the kids. Not his fault, but the system means he has to hide and hope. Now tell me again, that providing occasional amnesties is wrong and that all over stayers are criminals!

Come on! Yeah! Let´s say it again. It´s actually a criminal activity to overstay, so according to the law. All overstayers are criminals.

About your friend. First he put a 30 million house in her name. Then he probably give access to his money or spread them everywhere for her to steal. He also do not keep track on his passport, or report his wife as a thief to the police. He also wait so long time to get a new passport, so he get such an overstay so if he leaves he can not come back and will lose his kids.
Seems to me that he not only were stupid in putting the house in her name. Stupidity seems to continue to run like a never ending river of lost hope.

Much of this is also his fault. He could have prevented almost all of this from ever happening.

"What do you do, when your missus hides your passport?" I guess you report it stolen or lost, and get a new one asap.

What you just wrote and the statement you were trying to make, is according to me total rubbish. Although, your friend seems to be in a very difficult position after all this. I sincerely hope that he manage to stay under the radar. For his kids sake, not for him personally.

11 minutes ago, oldlakey said:

5555555555

OK I will try again

This is Thailand, its not going to happen

In fact you have not got a cat in hells chance

That was really an overhelming amount of relevant information. Would you like to elaborate on that based on some of your fine facts? 

Edited November 14, 20178 yr by Get Real

1 hour ago, impulse said:

 

Not at all.  But to contend that anyone should be able to clear up a visa problem in 90 days isn't accurate.  And that's the point I was replying to.  (For any grammar Nazis, That's the point to which I was replying.)

I reckon the point is that many looked at the cost of visa runs and new visas every year and decided that it was cheaper to go on overstay and pay the twenty on the way out then do it all again.

I would also suggest that many of them thought that the blacklisting when it went officially on the books would only be enforced in the case of long term overstay. When it became known that it was actively being applied they had no other option than stay on overstay.

Of course there may be cases ( see darksidedogs post ) where it has been impossible to correct a bad situation but most in the overstay trap are there because they didn't believe it would happen and was only a threat.

Comparing it to the system in UK, EU or USA means nothing.

Thailand is not a Nanny state so Nanny state rules mean diddlysquat.

These are the people that neglect the monthly brown envelopes.

I was reading in the Bangkok Post today about this.  The sentence (paraphrased) that stood out in my mind was that Thai snitches (well, my word there) should be vigilant for foreigners who don't work or have no visible income.  
Laugh my buns off - That's describes about all of us retirees.  I don't work, and outside of my family and bank (well, and the US Treasury to whom I report to religiously each year), my sources of income from the US are my business and my business alone.  I keep seasoned funds in my Thai bank account - that's all Thai Immigration requires - But!  I guess we're all soon to be the object of a xenophobic fuel home visit campaign soon - again! Evil foreigner that we are.
No problem.  I have twice the dogs that I had the last time they came around. (No! Not Thai soi dogs.  Four dogs which are extremely well cared for and fenced 24/7 in a 1/2 rai yard - and territorial)
"ARFFFF ARFFF arggghhhh bark bark bark Hong hong hong GRRRRRRR....."
Hey, you guys want to get out of the sun and come into the house?
"Mai bpen rai, mai bpen rai!"  
Whatever - more fun and games.  The locals know I'm a Wat attending Buddhist so Immigration shouldn't have me on the 'ISIS watch list.'     
(However - I keep kicking myself for not retiring in South America.  I could have had permanent residency by now and on the way to citizenship with a hot Latina.  Perfect 20/20 hindsight!)

Edited November 14, 20178 yr by connda

3 hours ago, overherebc said:

Out of interest why did your son overstay 6 years ?

Personal choice maybe, because the Thai government appeared at the time to be turning a blind eye to if not actually encouraging it

Hench six years overstay, exit with 20,000 payment, return next day with new visa

Much less bother than doing it legally over the six years not to mention the savings

Now what would you read into that situation

The only problem with that I can see is the possibility of being captured

For the record I have never had an overstay anywhere I have not got the bottle for it, I am not counting lock-ins down the boozer though

 

9 hours ago, darksidedog said:

Ignoring for a moment how people get into overstay, Thailand has itself largely to blame for the amount of long term over stayers. Once someone has gone into overstay, they have no attractive options. Face jail, get blacklisted etc. If they were to offer a short window, no questions asked, amnesty, many people would take the option to leave, either permanently, or long enough to obtain the correct visas. This would be far cheaper and efficient than the current, largely incompetent efforts, that barely scratch the surface of the problem and free the police up to actually target serious criminals. And God knows, there are plenty of them around.

So they would need to offer amnesty about every 3 months. 
Those people that need to obtain the correct visas already had time to obtain them, why provide them with a way out for their own negligence. 

Up to last year, Thai government has been very lenient where it comes to overstayers. But the problem becomes worse, you won't solve it with being even more lenient. Overstayers need to face the consequences for what they have caused. These harsh punishments aren't caused by legal tourists or immigrants. 

 

6 hours ago, Get Real said:

That´s great! Maybe they can deport all this sickness in the country. Implement better security systems, and make it easier on the people that stays here legally.

OK here we go again, as the Brits say third time lucky

I first quoted YOUR Post 10, in my Post 72 and to make it easier for the both of us I have quoted it here again

Now all you have to do is refresh your memory as regards what your post contained

Your hopes and wishes are certainly admirable, BUT in my opinion are just NOT going to happen EVER

That would be so out of character, in fact on its way to becoming a nanny state

If you insist on breasting forward with them, I am afraid I am going to have to accuse you of dreaming again, and its day dreaming in your case which receives no remission on conviction 

To end thank goodness, on a mutual point of agreement, you are correct it is JUST my opinion

I believe I have sorted it, what say you

7 hours ago, bkkcanuck8 said:

The link is that overstayers who have no legitimate source of income and who apparently did not even have enough money to exit and get a tourist visa and re-enter legally... provide a pool of desperate people that can then recruited for illegal activities etc.

...........and who in their right mind would want anyone like that living in their country anyway??  If they can't afford  bus ticket and the price of  visa, they should go home.

45 minutes ago, Bastos60 said:

So they would need to offer amnesty about every 3 months. 
Those people that need to obtain the correct visas already had time to obtain them, why provide them with a way out for their own negligence. 

Up to last year, Thai government has been very lenient where it comes to overstayers. But the problem becomes worse, you won't solve it with being even more lenient. Overstayers need to face the consequences for what they have caused. These harsh punishments aren't caused by legal tourists or immigrants. 

 

I'm just curious.  How do you feel about illegals in other countries?  I mean, the Western press lambasts anyone who may think that illegal immigration should be enforced in our own countries  Amnesty cities, free tuition for the children of illegals, 'they only come here to better their lives', etc, etc. 
I really am just curious.  How many folks are vehemently pro-illegal immigration in their own countries, but are vehement overstay opponents and overstay critics here in the LOS, especially should a fellow foreigner attempt to work.
Then how about Thais who travel to, say, Korea (or the US or the EU) with a tour group with the intent purpose of finding a job?  This has been one of my wife's favorite topics in the last couple of day as she discusses all of the locals here in our village who have gone to Korea to work by blending in with tour groups, and then staying.

All I'm saying is that this is a multifaceted issue and one that is not even slightly seen in the bigger picture of illegal immigration, and it stinks of double standards.   It really does irk me that Thais seek to illegally stay and work in my country (and others), and I'm suppose to accept that hypocrisy or I'm a <enter your own pejorative term here>, but if I question the utter heartlessness and xenophobia of Thai immigration policy, I'm some sort of a cheap-charlie jerk seeking to suck the life out of the teats of Prathet Thai, and I'm probably at least a suspected overstayer at that, well unless I get my once or twice a year visit from immigration or the BIB, even though I reapply each year for a visa extension and report to immigration every 90 days? 
How about: "Some farang only come here to better their lives because they have been priced out of living in their own countries and need a less expensive country to reside in?"  It's the exact same argument that people from other countries enter the US, EU, and UK to better their lives.
Tell me there is no hypocrisy here?  Then explain it to me - I'm sort of simple and stupid.

Edited November 14, 20178 yr by connda