Turning right on Green

[wprime]

This might seem like an obvious question but can you turn right in this situation:

 

You're at a traffic light, you have a green straight light and the turn right light is off but present. There is no red turn signal.

 

In Australia you can turn right but you must give way to oncoming traffic but when I did at an intersection in Pattaya a cop pulled me over and told me it's illegal.

 

I showed him the Land Traffic Act (in Thai) on my phone and asked him to point out what law I broke and he said he's illiterate (he said 'aan mai pen').

 

 

So anyone know this for sure? Is it asked on the driver's license test (I use an IDL for driving here)

 

[VocalNeal]

Hmmm. Unlucky if you are the first guy there. I would have been looking at the light before I got there to see if it was green before.  I suppose if there is no red then OK,  if traffic permits. The guy behind will "honk" if it is OK.

Driving here is done by being  observant, using common sense (yours) and if all else fails do what the locals do.  Accidents happen when we make decisions based on "western" logic  or based on what "western" drivers would do.

[KhunBENQ]

1 hour ago, wprime said:

You're at a traffic light, you have a green straight light and the turn right light is off but present. There is no red turn signal.

No, I don't think you are allowed to turn right.

In the district town we have a similar configuration on the frontage road.

 

Is the green light a disc or an arrow?

"straight light" sounds like an arrow, which would even more support the "not allowed".

 

Is there no sign for right turn below the lights?

 

White script on blue, right turn arrow also white.

Might look like an "allowed" sign BUT the script in Thai (only) says "right turn, wait light".

 

 

[janclaes47]

It would be good to sat which intersection this was.

 

If it was where Pattaya Klang connects to second road, yes there it is illegal, because first you will get a green light for traffic that goes towards the beach and some time later a green arrow to turn right will light up

[topt]

8 minutes ago, janclaes47 said:

It would be good to sat which intersection this was.

 

If it was where Pattaya Klang connects to second road, yes there it is illegal, because first you will get a green light for traffic that goes towards the beach and some time later a green arrow to turn right will light up

Yes same half way up third road between Klang and Nua except it is both ways so straight on goes to red first before the green to go right.

[VocalNeal]

46 minutes ago, KhunBENQ said:

No, I don't think you are allowed to turn right.

In the district town we have a similar configuration on the frontage road.

 

Is the green light a disc or an arrow?

"straight light" sounds like an arrow, which would even more support the "not allowed".

 

Is there no sign for right turn below the lights?

 

White script on blue, right turn arrow also white.

Might look like an "allowed" sign BUT the script in Thai (only) says "right turn, wait light".

 

 

OK.  If it is busy one could tell also by the traffic and the placement of the actual light itself. Also if the on coming traffic has not stopped that would be a give away.  I was thinking more dark deserted junction at night with little or no traffic which would give no actual clues. 

[richard_smith237]

I think you are correct, but each junction is controlled by its own individual 'traffic box' and subject to variation. 

 

There is a junction in Bangkok on Rama IV (Kluanamthai) where this exact situation is an issue. 

 

A set of traffic lights with a turn right light that is rarely illuminated. 

 

I see busses turn right all the time when none of the right turn lights are on green or red, I always used to turn without the lights on (green or red) and so would the majority of other vehicles (of course, when its safe to do so). It would be a regular issue with a taxi who didn't know the area, I would have to tell him that the 'green turn right light' never worked.

 

 

The real issue of course is that: 

- There is no consistency - the rules at each junction are often individual, commonly time dependent and often change.

- There is no maintenance - It cannot me known if the lights have simply failed or have been turned off for a reason.

- There are no clear signs - approaching and navigating some junctions requires pure guess work.

- Road design is awful - the roads are not designed to 'help the driver' which often creates hesitancy. 

 

Of course, the BiB don't really mind this as the frequent 'mistakes' can be a little earner, especially on situations such as this. 

 

 

 

In this case below from google maps the 'Right Turn Signal' is red so ambiguity is removed. However, more commonly the right hand lights were not illuminated at all leading to confusion. 

 

 

[wprime]

7 hours ago, KhunBENQ said:

No, I don't think you are allowed to turn right.

In the district town we have a similar configuration on the frontage road.

 

Is the green light a disc or an arrow?

"straight light" sounds like an arrow, which would even more support the "not allowed".

 

Is there no sign for right turn below the lights?

 

White script on blue, right turn arrow also white.

Might look like an "allowed" sign BUT the script in Thai (only) says "right turn, wait light".

 

 

No signs, by straight light I mean just a solid green.

 

I was pulled over on Thaphraya/Jomtien Sai 2 but there are heaps of other situations like this in Pattaya.

 

I understand what is commonly done here (i.e. they wait until a green light appears) but I can't find anything legislated making it illegal (unless there is a sign which says to wait or a red turn arrow) so I was more curious as to whether this situation is questioned (or taught?) in the driving test.

[NanLaew]

8 hours ago, VocalNeal said:

The guy behind will "honk" if it is OK.

The guy behind will also honk if it is not OK and he's just in hurry.

[NanLaew]

7 hours ago, janclaes47 said:

It would be good to sat which intersection this was.

 

If it was where Pattaya Klang connects to second road, yes there it is illegal, because first you will get a green light for traffic that goes towards the beach and some time later a green arrow to turn right will light up

I have made an 'illegal' right on the straight-ahead green early in the day when you can see all the way down to the beach and there's nothing coming. I wouldn't chance it in busier traffic though as the cops will be awake by then and a bit hungry.

[janclaes47]

7 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

I think you are correct, but each junction is controlled by its own individual 'traffic box' and subject to variation. 

 

There is a junction in Bangkok on Rama IV (Kluanamthai) where this exact situation is an issue. 

 

A set of traffic lights with a turn right light that is rarely illuminated. 

 

I see busses turn right all the time when none of the right turn lights are on green or red, I always used to turn without the lights on (green or red) and so would the majority of other vehicles (of course, when its safe to do so). It would be a regular issue with a taxi who didn't know the area, I would have to tell him that the 'green turn right light' never worked.

 

 

The real issue of course is that: 

- There is no consistency - the rules at each junction are often individual, commonly time dependent and often change.

- There is no maintenance - It cannot me known if the lights have simply failed or have been turned off for a reason.

- There are no clear signs - approaching and navigating some junctions requires pure guess work.

- Road design is awful - the roads are not designed to 'help the driver' which often creates hesitancy. 

 

Of course, the BiB don't really mind this as the frequent 'mistakes' can be a little earner, especially on situations such as this. 

 

 

 

In this case below from google maps the 'Right Turn Signal' is red so ambiguity is removed. However, more commonly the right hand lights were not illuminated at all leading to confusion. 

 

 

 

The difference with the case of the OP is that the go straight is a solid green light ( not an arrow ) and that there is no red arrow for traffic going to the right.

 

So it is pretty confusing when you get a full green light, and no red arrow, so people not familiar with the location will not even know that is an arrow to the right.