Hunt on for baht bus driver who killed 5, injured 9

[Just Weird]

3 hours ago, Russell17au said:

Most other countries operate a proper constructed bus and not a converted pick up like Thailand does plus the drivers in most countries are trained and licensed as bus drivers plus Thailand's road rules enforcement is s**t compared to most other countries plus most other countries have a lower road toll than Thailand does. It is Just Weird how you can agree with such carnage on the roads in Thailand, but maybe you are one of these unlicensed, untrained drivers that just don't know how to care about and respect other peoples loves. I just hope you do not have any children because by your own posts it shows the you would not keep them in a safe environment. 

"I just hope you do not have any children because by your own posts it shows the you would not keep them in a safe environment."

 

I just hope that you realise what a fatuous thing to say that was.

[Russell17au]

7 hours ago, Just Weird said:

"I just hope you do not have any children because by your own posts it shows the you would not keep them in a safe environment."

 

I just hope that you realise what a fatuous thing to say that was.

The hard fast truth is that if you love your children then you will protect your children. Here in Thailand when you see the parents on a bike wearing helmets to protect them and the children on the bike with them without a helmet to protect the child. If those parents really loved their children then they would put helmets on those children to protect them. Children die easier from head injuries than am adult does because the skull bone has not developed and hardened so it needs more protection. Do you put a helmet on your child when you get on a bike?

[Russell17au]

7 hours ago, Just Weird said:

What's even more weird is that I made no mention of the number of deaths or Thailand's position in the league tables or my view about that aspect yet you seem able to magically deduce something from my lack of comment.

 

From your first sentence, the only logical deduction that can be made is that you must think all the road accidents, and that is what they are, are deliberate acts.

 

There are not such things as accidents on the roads, it does not matter if it is a single vehicle collision or a multi vehicle collision they can all be proven as negligence by either the driver for single car, one driver for multi car or even a company being negligent with its maintenance. An accident is when nobody has control over the circumstances. In this case the driver was negligent in allowing his safe driving of this vehicle to be distracted by his fight with his wife so he therefore was not concentrating on his job of driving, he has either taken his eyes off the road or taken his hands off the wheel to allow that vehicle to run off the road. That is negligence it is not an accident. You can research every country of the world and you will find the every incident has been caused by negligence.

[Just Weird]

4 hours ago, Russell17au said:

The hard fast truth is that if you love your children then you will protect your children. Here in Thailand when you see the parents on a bike wearing helmets to protect them and the children on the bike with them without a helmet to protect the child. If those parents really loved their children then they would put helmets on those children to protect them. Children die easier from head injuries than am adult does because the skull bone has not developed and hardened so it needs more protection. Do you put a helmet on your child when you get on a bike?

What are you on?

 

Thanks for your unsolicited and unnecessary infant physiological lecture which is irrelevant not only to me but also to the comments that I made and the comment that I was responding to. 

 

Your vision of the "hard fast truth" (what?) and your assumptions about my family are just as fatuous as your previous remark.  What has your opinion of my concerns about my children got to do with you or the accident involving the baht bus that crashed following an in-car domestic dispute?   You are also assuming that I would be stupid enough to put my children on a motorbike, regardless of the equipment that they wore.

[Just Weird]

4 hours ago, Russell17au said:

There are not such things as accidents on the roads, it does not matter if it is a single vehicle collision or a multi vehicle collision they can all be proven as negligence by either the driver for single car, one driver for multi car or even a company being negligent with its maintenance. An accident is when nobody has control over the circumstances. In this case the driver was negligent in allowing his safe driving of this vehicle to be distracted by his fight with his wife so he therefore was not concentrating on his job of driving, he has either taken his eyes off the road or taken his hands off the wheel to allow that vehicle to run off the road. That is negligence it is not an accident. You can research every country of the world and you will find the every incident has been caused by negligence.

"You can research every country of the world and you will find the every incident has been caused by negligence".

 

Every accident, in every country of the world, is caused by negligence?  Garbage.

 

To credibly make that claim would require that every accident in the world had been investigated and the results reported to somewhere that collates the data and publishes it.  That's just garbage.

[Jack100]

On 12/1/2017 at 3:12 PM, hobobo said:

Hunt him down with a pack of Rottweilers and let them tear him apart, limb from limb - but slowly. 

Seems you don't like the guy hobo

[hobobo]

6 minutes ago, Jack100 said:

Seems you don't like the guy hobo

You got that right Jack, 11 out of 10!

[Russell17au]

29 minutes ago, Just Weird said:

"You can research every country of the world and you will find the every incident has been caused by negligence".

 

Every accident, in every country of the world, is caused by negligence?  Garbage.

 

To credibly make that claim would require that every accident in the world had been investigated and the results reported to somewhere that collates the data and publishes it.  That's just garbage.

you do not know what you are talking about, there is no such thing as an accident, all vehicle incidents are caused through negligence.

you tell me where one accident has happened and how it happened and I will show you that it was caused by negligence but maybe you cannot accept it when you are told that you are wrong. you are the one that carried on about accidents happen in other countries but you cannot handle it when you are shown you are wrong.

I will put my experience up against yours if you like. I have had 17 years removing dead bodies and badly injured people from vehicle collisions and the same amount of time at those collisions working with the New South Wale Police, Vehicle Incident Investigation Squad and every incident there is a cause and that cause always points back to negligence of some type.

I sorry if you cannot accept the facts and you want to call everything garbage because you cannot understand it

[Just Weird]

18 minutes ago, Russell17au said:

you do not know what you are talking about, there is no such thing as an accident, all vehicle incidents are caused through negligence.

you tell me where one accident has happened and how it happened and I will show you that it was caused by negligence but maybe you cannot accept it when you are told that you are wrong. you are the one that carried on about accidents happen in other countries but you cannot handle it when you are shown you are wrong.

I will put my experience up against yours if you like. I have had 17 years removing dead bodies and badly injured people from vehicle collisions and the same amount of time at those collisions working with the New South Wale Police, Vehicle Incident Investigation Squad and every incident there is a cause and that cause always points back to negligence of some type.

I sorry if you cannot accept the facts and you want to call everything garbage because you cannot understand it

"you do not know what you are talking about, there is no such thing as an accident, all vehicle incidents are caused through negligence".

Clearly, neither do you.

 

"...maybe you cannot accept it when you are told that you are wrong".

Of course I wont accept it when I am "told it" by someone who is wrong themselves.

 

So what if you've had centuries of experience of accident victims?  That doesn't make your assertion about negligence being the cause of every accident correct, neither does it make it a fact.

 

I think that the problem here may be that it's you that doesn't understand what you are claiming.

[gandalf12]

On 12/2/2017 at 2:44 PM, Just Weird said:

Don't comment to me if you don't want a response.  I'll explain why it wasn't stupid; it's because accidents do happen everywhere, and in similar circumstances, not only in Thailand.

Not like they do in Thailand

[Russell17au]

13 minutes ago, gandalf12 said:

Not like they do in Thailand

Do mind if I change your response to Read

"Not as many as in Thailand"

[jacko45k]

On 12/1/2017 at 2:29 PM, pegman said:

Your right it hits close to home. I try to do an over nighter in Ban Chang ever month. If a van doesn't stop on Suk in say 15 mins I'll take one of these songthauw to Sattihip then a  ฿100 motorbike taxi the rest of the way. They do a lot of stop and go just like the vans and I have always felt safe. When school gets out I've seen these absolutely jammed with kids. The thing is how do you prevent a. madman from doing this. 

Regular police stops or surveillance during the times schoolkids are traveling to stop and punish drivers who overload their vehicles? Actually at any time, I have seen them overloaded on Sukhumvit after picking up tourists at The Ambassador.

[whitemouse]

On 12/1/2017 at 3:12 PM, hobobo said:

Hunt him down with a pack of Rottweilers and let them tear him apart, limb from limb - but slowly. 

 

It's exactly your kind of  cave man, savage attitude of 14th century that keeps this country from becoming country of laws, a country where people have respect for laws, laws that exist in books already, but no one cares to follow. Many people in Thailand  behave like  cave men, and what you are suggesting as punishment for this driver would not advance Thailand into civilized part of the world, it doesn't help Thailand become land of laws. Instead you advocate  Thailand to remain lawless 3rd world country of mid evil times. 

 

 

 

 

[whitemouse]

7 hours ago, Jack100 said:

Seems you don't like the guy hobo

 

Seems he would chose to move back to times of Vlad the Impaler. 

 

He better hope he won't be target of of justice system,  and law enforcement in his dream land's criminal code and sentencing guid lines, should he cross he law in his  fantasy land's criminal code.

 

What we need here is land of laws, laws that are enforced, what we don't need is what we currently have, and what he cheers for. Mob violence, using Rottweilers is not a path to society where laws prevail. 

[gandalf12]

6 hours ago, Russell17au said:

Do mind if I change your response to Read

"Not as many as in Thailand"

Feel free to I don't mind at all

[chickenslegs]

23 hours ago, Just Weird said:

From your first sentence, the only logical deduction that can be made is that you must think all the road accidents, and that is what they are, are deliberate acts.

 

Not many road injuries or deaths are "accidental" (i.e.- unavoidable). Also, not many are "deliberate" (i.e. - with malicious intent).

 

I would suggest that, in most cases, the correct description would be "careless" or  "reckless", meaning that insufficient thought or attention was given to the overall road conditions at the time, by at least one of the people involved.

[champers]

In the UK I briefly worked for a company whose policy was that there was no such thing as an accident. Instead, they used the term "avoidable incident" and had a very strong safety culture which seemed repressive at times, but resulted in excellent safety records and an enviable reputation within their industry. Their safety culture was inherited from their previous US owners.

The development of a safety culture amongst road users in this country would make a great difference. It should start in schools.

[chickenslegs]

1 hour ago, Father Fintan Stack said:

If they really cared they wouldn't let kids ride in these songteaws or take them on scooters with no helmets etc.

 

They are either thick as pigsh*t or don't give a sh*t.

 

You decide. 

In this case the "kids" (young adults) were attending Technical College and had to travel 5 - 25+ km there and back to home and used the regular baht bus. I cannot think of any other way they could complete those journeys, bearing in mind that almost all cannot afford cars and many cannot even afford motorcycles.

 

I doubt that there are any statistics available, but it seems to me that songteaws are pretty safe if driven at a reasonable speed and not overloaded. There are hundreds of them in the Pattaya, Naklua, Sattahip areas and it is extremely rare to hear of a serious incident.

 

It is emerging that this tragedy was caused by the driver and his wife having a bust up and fighting over the steering wheel. I don't think that any reasonable person could blame the passengers or parents of the deceased.

 

Regarding helmets. I can't disagree. But the topic here is 10+ people killed in a baht bus crash.

 

[gk10002000]

4 hours ago, chickenslegs said:

Not many road injuries or deaths are "accidental" (i.e.- unavoidable). Also, not many are "deliberate" (i.e. - with malicious intent).

 

I would suggest that, in most cases, the correct description would be "careless" or  "reckless", meaning that insufficient thought or attention was given to the overall road conditions at the time, by at least one of the people involved.

Or as is sometimes ruled on death certificates:  "Death by misadventure".  No specific single cause, but many contributing factors.

[David Walden]

7 hours ago, Father Fintan Stack said:

If they really cared they wouldn't let kids ride in these songteaws or take them on scooters with no helmets etc.

 

They are either thick as pigsh*t or don't give a sh*t.

 

You decide. 

It may well be that Thai People are not aware of accidents that occur on the roads in Thailand.  Even in my town in Australia frequently the State Police have on show displays of wrecked cars and vehicles at prominent positions around town especially at holiday time to drive home the message about road safety, if you speed or break rules you will get caught,...In Thailand I would suggest that in a serious fatal car accident people who live in the same street as the deceased may understand the outcome but I think the people in the next street would have no idea about what has happened.  Road safety and education would be good start but there is a long long way to go. 

[David Walden]

8 hours ago, Father Fintan Stack said:

If they really cared they wouldn't let kids ride in these songteaws or take them on scooters with no helmets etc.

 

They are either thick as pigsh*t or don't give a sh*t.

 

You decide. 

An experience in Thailand recently when I got on a songteaw at 8 am 26 km out of Chiang mai and going down town quite lovely by the time we got to the Super Hwy there were 22 adults (2 monks in the front) 9 children and a driver=32 people...quite normal in Thailand.   6 nice young gentlemen were hanging off the back by the shin of their teeth.  A few times we got close to 100 kph...TIT

[Pattaya28]

400 baht fine, for each death. 500 baht fine, doing a runner, 1000 baht sundries, make merit, bla bla bla and that should be it. Done and dusted. 

[hobobo]

11 hours ago, whitemouse said:

 

It's exactly your kind of  cave man, savage attitude of 14th century that keeps this country from becoming country of laws, a country where people have respect for laws, laws that exist in books already, but no one cares to follow. Many people in Thailand  behave like  cave men, and what you are suggesting as punishment for this driver would not advance Thailand into civilized part of the world, it doesn't help Thailand become land of laws. Instead you advocate  Thailand to remain lawless 3rd world country of mid evil times. 

 

 

 

 

Blah blah blah. Your first two lines show you haven't thought this through really. Do remain an apologist for total absence of legal responsibility in Thailand, but leave the farang out of the equasion!