Israel indicts Palestinian teenage girl who punched soldier - army

[Morch]

@JingerBen

 

"A few more years" have nothing to do with it.

You're just on auto-deflection mode, nothing of substance to add and unable to relate to points made.

[PattayaAngel]

Brave, wonderful girl if only we had such souls in Thailand.

[JingerBen]

11 minutes ago, JingerBen said:

Give her a few more years... you never know.

 

4 minutes ago, Morch said:

@JingerBen

 

"A few more years" have nothing to do with it.

You're just on auto-deflection mode, nothing of substance to add and unable to relate to points made.

A few more years will see changes that we can't imagine now.

The whole world is against the Israeli occupation of Palestine.

[Morch]

2 minutes ago, JingerBen said:

 

A few more years will see changes that we can't imagine now.

The whole world is against the Israeli occupation of Palestine.

 

You can keep posting nothing comments. It won't make them any more meaningful or insightful. You cannot provide any coherent support for your nonsense, nor do you offer any insight as to how things would change, if at all. That the world, in general, does not support the Israeli occupation is neither new nor indicative of any relevant upcoming changes.

[Truth2W]

5 hours ago, sanemax said:

What do you suggest that Israels policy should be ?

Should Israel make it legal for pretty young girls to attack other people ?

Or should Israel disregard the laws about violent attacks in the situation where pretty young girls carry out the attacks ?

My suggestion for Israel is to be sincere and occupy only their real ancient territories. (if someone has a problem understanding this, dozens of publications are available). Punching is not good, but if we can weight the things for a moment, shooting demonstrators, using weapons forbidden even the UN again civil people, arresting young teenagers for no reason, seem to be also unfair.

Actually, what is news here?  Israel  can do whatever they want.....

[Jonmarleesco]

And Israel and its supporters wonder why it doesn't garner the level of support it claims to merit? 

[Truth2W]

1 hour ago, Old Croc said:

This girl has been using her gender and age for years to get away with assaulting soldiers. A web search shows her raising fists at, and trying to incite, Israelis from about the age of 12. There is a video of her biting a soldier attempting to arrest a stone thrower. In the current incident she kicked this man before slapping him across the face.

She has led demonstrations, and is a stone thrower, as is her whole family.

The likes of Abbas  and the Turkish dictator, rather than sending her home to finish school, have awarded and encouraged her behavior. 

Incidentally, many believe, and there is some evidence, she is actually 18yo based on pictures taken 5 years ago when she was 13. However, it makes for better press to pretend she's 16. They often use photos of her as a child to garner sympathy.  Look at recent photos and judge for yourself.

 

Judged.

She is a hero. Her country has been occupied by an extremely unfair aggressor. She wants to live in her own country, freely. Where can you see the problem?  Is it she has never used up-to-date weapon bought from US taxpayers’ pockets? Maybe, she had to use forbidden ammunitions against Israeli army? Or, … where?

As if Israelis could use photos and their gender instead of their arms.

[Old Croc]

2 minutes ago, Truth2W said:

Judged.

She is a hero. Her country has been occupied by an extremely unfair aggressor. She wants to live in her own country, freely. Where can you see the problem?  Is it she has never used up-to-date weapon bought from US taxpayers’ pockets? Maybe, she had to use forbidden ammunitions against Israeli army? Or, … where?

As if Israelis could use photos and their gender instead of their arms.

So what age did you judge her to be? .I was asking people to judge about her age, not about your thoughts on her actions. 

In case you think I have come down on a particular side in this conflict, I can tell you that from personal experience I have little time for Palestinians nor Israelis.

[F4UCorsair]

2 hours ago, Morch said:

 

Would be helpful if you could support such assertions with anything indicating relevant trends in the Middle East. Are there many examples of women in effective positions of political power and leadership? Are women rights issues improving?

 

 

 

 

Women's rights will never improve in islamic countries, including Palestine....end of story.

 

Ben Caspit called for her to be sexually assaulted, saying, “we should exact a price at some other opportunity, in the dark, without witnesses and cameras.”

 

So that's saying she should be sexually assaulted?     Give me a break!!  The problem with the left is they just invent stories.  I bet his nickname is Bu**$hit Ben, and if not, it should be.

Edited January 2, 2018 by F4UCorsair

[Ron19]

A post against forum rules has been removed.

[simple1]

13 minutes ago, F4UCorsair said:

 

Women's rights will never improve in islamic countries....end of story.

Ridiculous comment, completely ignoring recent history, elected female politicians, etc etc etc. 

[Truth2W]

1 hour ago, Old Croc said:

So what age did you judge her to be? .I was asking people to judge about her age, not about your thoughts on her actions. 

In case you think I have come down on a particular side in this conflict, I can tell you that from personal experience I have little time for Palestinians nor Israelis.

Age cannot determine if someone is a hero or not. If this question was that, than, sorry, but your question is inappropriate   

[khunken]

Palestine is not an Islamic country. Contrary to what Israeli propaganda portrays the long-standing conflict is Israeli-Palestinian, not Jew-Muslim.

 

The girl in the Op is a member of a family of activists who are targets of the Israeli authoritarian rulers of Palestine and, if she was male, would have been beaten up or worse. When Israeli police, military or settlers intimidate & beat up Palestinials regularly they do it with total impunity.

 

BTW to those who think that women can't rise to powerful positions in Palestine, I give you Hanan Ashwari - a long time member of the Palestinian 'government', activist and negotiator. I know,  'one swallow etc etc.......' but Palestine (or Lebanon) is more likely than most to have a future female leader, if it (Palestine) is ever allowed to be a free country.

 

 

[Morch]

36 minutes ago, simple1 said:

Ridiculous comment, completely ignoring recent history, elected female politicians, etc etc etc. 

 

It may be a ridiculous comment, but so were the previous assertions as to the girl's supposed future role. Or using the politicians cited as examples.

[Morch]

15 minutes ago, khunken said:

Palestine is not an Islamic country. Contrary to what Israeli propaganda portrays the long-standing conflict is Israeli-Palestinian, not Jew-Muslim.

 

The girl in the Op is a member of a family of activists who are targets of the Israeli authoritarian rulers of Palestine and, if she was male, would have been beaten up or worse. When Israeli police, military or settlers intimidate & beat up Palestinials regularly they do it with total impunity.

 

BTW to those who think that women can't rise to powerful positions in Palestine, I give you Hanan Ashwari - a long time member of the Palestinian 'government', activist and negotiator. I know,  'one swallow etc etc.......' but Palestine (or Lebanon) is more likely than most to have a future female leader, if it (Palestine) is ever allowed to be a free country.

 

 

 

Got to love them wide brush straw-man comments. The Hamas, which effectively rules over the Gaza Strip, and about half of the Palestinians - is an Islamic movement. Ignoring that the Hamas holds considerable sway in the West Bank as well, or that religious sentiment and motivation is a a major factor among Palestinians indicates either ignorance or being intentionally misleading. And just to head off expected comments about it being just the Hamas etc., here's Article 4, section 2 in the Palestinian Constitutions - "The principles of Islamic Shari’a shall be the main source of legislation.". It doesn't mean all Palestinians are religious extremists, of course - it just means things aren't as easily defined as some try to present.

 

The girl's family is a lot of things, some of them not all that savory, may wish to look up Ahlam Tamimi, as a prime example (there are others). May also wish to have a look at their various social media etc. (especially in Arabic), kinda ruins the enlightened resistance image.

 

others pointed out, are you familiar with situations in which, as a rule, security forces do not respond to violence? Not go back to the OP and try to figure out where Unless you missed it, she wasn't actually a bit different to the  he girl in the Op is a member of a family of activists who are targets of the Israeli authoritarian rulers of Palestine and, if she was male, would have been beaten up or worse. When Israeli police, military or settlers intimidate & beat up regularly they do it with total impunity.

 

Hanan Ashrawi come from a Christian family, and had better opening conditions, background and education (like most women cited as examples). That aside, she's been effectively sidelined a long time ago. If that's the best you can come of with, the OP's girl's prospects aren't too bright. I don't know that Lebanon is likely to have a woman at the helm, or that the future Palestine will, but each to his fantasies.

[khunken]

36 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

Got to love them wide brush straw-man comments. The Hamas, which effectively rules over the Gaza Strip, and about half of the Palestinians - is an Islamic movement. Ignoring that the Hamas holds considerable sway in the West Bank as well, or that religious sentiment and motivation is a a major factor among Palestinians indicates either ignorance or being intentionally misleading. And just to head off expected comments about it being just the Hamas etc., here's Article 4, section 2 in the Palestinian Constitutions - "The principles of Islamic Shari’a shall be the main source of legislation.". It doesn't mean all Palestinians are religious extremists, of course - it just means things aren't as easily defined as some try to present.

 

The girl's family is a lot of things, some of them not all that savory, may wish to look up Ahlam Tamimi, as a prime example (there are others). May also wish to have a look at their various social media etc. (especially in Arabic), kinda ruins the enlightened resistance image.

 

others pointed out, are you familiar with situations in which, as a rule, security forces do not respond to violence? Not go back to the OP and try to figure out where Unless you missed it, she wasn't actually a bit different to the  he girl in the Op is a member of a family of activists who are targets of the Israeli authoritarian rulers of Palestine and, if she was male, would have been beaten up or worse. When Israeli police, military or settlers intimidate & beat up regularly they do it with total impunity.

 

Hanan Ashrawi come from a Christian family, and had better opening conditions, background and education (like most women cited as examples). That aside, she's been effectively sidelined a long time ago. If that's the best you can come of with, the OP's girl's prospects aren't too bright. I don't know that Lebanon is likely to have a woman at the helm, or that the future Palestine will, but each to his fantasies.

Unsurprising to see you attempt your usual takedown of anything that doesn't follow the Israeli line.

 

There's nothing straw-man about the propaganda (supported by you) portraying the Israeli-Palestinian conflict in religious terms. It's not really on-topic - I was responding to another poster who used the Islamic tag for Palestine.

 

Your third paragraph is nonesense - I don't mean the content but the language is gibberish.

 

You didn't bother to read or just ignored what I wrote about Hanan Ashwari, namely the bit where I said 'One swallow....' Again this was a response to a poster who seemed almost as bigoted as you about females in Muslim countries. I have no opinion on whether the girl in the Op is future PM material but majority Muslim countries (as alluded to by Simple1) have not been shy of electing female leaders - those that are democratic or partially so, that is.

Edited January 2, 2018 by khunken
wrong para ref

[Sir Dude]

Hamas just gives the Israelis an excuse. The Palestinians should disband Hamas and go collectively under the PLO and Abbas, as that would make things much more difficult for the Israelis. As long as Hamas is in existence and a labeled terrorist organisation by the EU, US and others then it seriously restricts the PLO's hand which is the recognised authority. Hezbollah  and Hassan Nazrallah need reigning in too. 

[Morch]

3 minutes ago, khunken said:

Unsurprising to see you attempt your usual takedown of anything that doesn't follow the Israeli line.

 

There's nothing straw-man about the propaganda (supported by you) portraying the Israeli-Palestinian conflict in religious terms. It's not really on-topic - I was responding to another poster who used the Islamic tag for Palestine.

 

Your second paragraph is nonesense - I don't mean the content but the language is gibberish.

 

You didn't bother to read or just ignored what I wrote about Hanan Ashwari, namely the bit where I said 'One swallow....' Again this was a response to a poster who seemed almost as bigoted as you about females in Muslim countries. I have no opinion on whether the girl in the Op is future PM material but majority Muslim countries (as alluded to by Simple1) have not been shy of electing female leaders - those that are democratic or partially so, that is.

 

More of your wide brush straw men nonsense. My positions, as anyone not completely ignorant or bent on misleading could tell, are not really in line with those of Israel's government.

 

That you cannot address complex issues is nothing new. There was no claim that the Israeli-Palestinian conflict is solely religious one. That it incorporates a religious aspect is a fact, whether some like acknowledging it or not. Like most such things, not as easily defined as some would have it. What was rejected was the wholesale denial offered. It is not an either/or, a black and white proposition.

 

Unsurprisingly, another  wholesale deflection ("gibberish") is offered in lieu of facing facts. The Tamimi family has got quite a history, not all of it quite as easily marketed as legitimate resistance (again, may wish to look up such family members as Ahlam Tamimi). Similarly, the content associated with certain family members' online presence (especially in Arabic) carries very different messages to those offered elsewhere, especially when working Western media.

 

I have read your Hanan Ashrawi bit, and augmented your superficial take with additional and relevant information. That you wish to ignore Ashrawi not being Muslim, having different background and opportunities is your  choice. As for "bigoted about females in Muslim countries" - you simply make things up. There was no bigotry expressed, just a take on how things are. With regard to Women leading Muslim countries - there was not claim that there weren't such, just that their backgrounds and circumstances are exceptional. As far as I am aware there was no such case in an Arab country.

 

[khunken]

2 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

More of your wide brush straw men nonsense. My positions, as anyone not completely ignorant or bent on misleading could tell, are not really in line with those of Israel's government.

 

That you cannot address complex issues is nothing new. There was no claim that the Israeli-Palestinian conflict is solely religious one. That it incorporates a religious aspect is a fact, whether some like acknowledging it or not. Like most such things, not as easily defined as some would have it. What was rejected was the wholesale denial offered. It is not an either/or, a black and white proposition.

 

Unsurprisingly, another  wholesale deflection ("gibberish") is offered in lieu of facing facts. The Tamimi family has got quite a history, not all of it quite as easily marketed as legitimate resistance (again, may wish to look up such family members as Ahlam Tamimi). Similarly, the content associated with certain family members' online presence (especially in Arabic) carries very different messages to those offered elsewhere, especially when working Western media.

 

I have read your Hanan Ashrawi bit, and augmented your superficial take with additional and relevant information. That you wish to ignore Ashrawi not being Muslim, having different background and opportunities is your  choice. As for "bigoted about females in Muslim countries" - you simply make things up. There was no bigotry expressed, just a take on how things are. With regard to Women leading Muslim countries - there was not claim that there weren't such, just that their backgrounds and circumstances are exceptional. As far as I am aware there was no such case in an Arab country.

 

Your posts are two-fold: defending Israel against anyone who has the temerity to criticise it and derailing threads - the Chewbacca defence.

 

In another thread you argued that the conflict was Jew-Muslim. So don't try to lie your way out of that one.

 

I have a pretty good idea what the Tamimi family were guilty of - resistance to their oppressors. Gibberish was no deflection - you should re-read what you originally wrote  - it made no sense. Pity you can't even admit that much.

 

Plenty of not well disguised bigotry from you - easy to spot in your defence of others' bigoted comments. You're the one making things up as well as twisting my comments about Hanan Ashwari. Chewbacca again.

[Morch]

Just now, khunken said:

Your posts are two-fold: defending Israel against anyone who has the temerity to criticise it and derailing threads - the Chewbacca defence.

 

In another thread you argued that the conflict was Jew-Muslim. So don't try to lie your way out of that one.

 

I have a pretty good idea what the Tamimi family were guilty of - resistance to their oppressors. Gibberish was no deflection - you should re-read what you originally wrote  - it made no sense. Pity you can't even admit that much.

 

Plenty of not well disguised bigotry from you - easy to spot in your defence of others' bigoted comments. You're the one making things up as well as twisting my comments about Hanan Ashwari. Chewbacca again.

 

As said, you seem to have trouble with concepts, or views, which do not neatly fit some imaginary lines. And, again - do try to read my posts before charging head on, and you'll find many of them are, in fact, critical of Israel's policies - if not quite taking up the same vehemence many seem to favor.  Not that it is expected that you'll actually demonstrate where and how I "derailed" this topic, you just make up things as you go along anyway.

 

I have no idea which "other topic" is referred to, and in which context things were posted. But let's try this once more - the Israeli-Palestinian conflict is multi-faceted, including, among others, a religious aspect. It is not the sole factor or motivation, and I was not claiming it was All I'm saying is that it is there, and that it cannot be ignored or swept under the carpet of denial.

 

I have not doubt that you think you have a good idea on related issues, including the Tamimi family. I just doubt that this is in fact the case. Once more, may want to explore a bit in the directions pointed out, lame deflections aside.

 

Do tell what "plenty of not well-disguised bigotry" was evident in my posts. Couldn't be that hard to point out. I did not make things up nor twist your words - once more, you seem to respond to imaginary comments I did not actually post.

[sanemax]

5 hours ago, Truth2W said:

My suggestion for Israel is to be sincere and occupy only their real ancient territories. (if someone has a problem understanding this, dozens of publications are available). Punching is not good, but if we can weight the things for a moment, shooting demonstrators, using weapons forbidden even the UN again civil people, arresting young teenagers for no reason, seem to be also unfair.

Actually, what is news here?  Israel  can do whatever they want.....

Do try and stay on topic, there have been numerous posters trying to turn this story into a "Israels right to exist" thread and going off topic onto other issues .

  If you want to discuss Israel in general, there is usually an on-going thread about it

[Kevbo]

12 hours ago, sanemax said:

What do you suggest that Israels policy should be ?

Should Israel make it legal for pretty young girls to attack other people ?

Or should Israel disregard the laws about violent attacks in the situation where pretty young girls carry out the attacks ?

Pretty ??? 

[katana]

Here's the video in question where she hits and kicks the Israeli soldiers:

 

[Jingthing]

Separating the legitimate issue about occupation which of course justifies protest, back in the real world, if you confront a soldier that way, you're risking your life. Some such people do have knifes or worse. Kudos to the soldiers for showing restraint. 

[Thorgal]

 

Got to love them wide brush straw-man comments. The Hamas, which effectively rules over the Gaza Strip, and about half of the Palestinians - is an Islamic movement. Ignoring that the Hamas holds considerable sway in the West Bank as well, or that religious sentiment and motivation is a a major factor among Palestinians indicates either ignorance or being intentionally misleading. And just to head off expected comments about it being just the Hamas etc., here's Article 4, section 2 in the Palestinian Constitutions - "The principles of Islamic Shari’a shall be the main source of legislation.". It doesn't mean all Palestinians are religious extremists, of course - it just means things aren't as easily defined as some try to present.

 

The girl's family is a lot of things, some of them not all that savory, may wish to look up Ahlam Tamimi, as a prime example (there are others). May also wish to have a look at their various social media etc. (especially in Arabic), kinda ruins the enlightened resistance image.

 

others pointed out, are you familiar with situations in which, as a rule, security forces do not respond to violence? Not go back to the OP and try to figure out where Unless you missed it, she wasn't actually a bit different to the  he girl in the Op is a member of a family of activists who are targets of the Israeli authoritarian rulers of Palestine and, if she was male, would have been beaten up or worse. When Israeli police, military or settlers intimidate & beat up regularly they do it with total impunity.

 

Hanan Ashrawi come from a Christian family, and had better opening conditions, background and education (like most women cited as examples). That aside, she's been effectively sidelined a long time ago. If that's the best you can come of with, the OP's girl's prospects aren't too bright. I don't know that Lebanon is likely to have a woman at the helm, or that the future Palestine will, but each to his fantasies.

Arrest and story of Palestinian girl from OP is from a little Palestinian town in the West Bank named Nabi Saleh. An isolated Palestinian town populated with 600 people.

Constant aggression and bullying from the Israeli authorities has been detailed on social media : see link below.

https://nabisalehsolidarity.wordpress.com

No linkage of OP from Nabi Saleh located in the West Bank to Hamas, Gaza strip, or even Islamic aspirations.
The girl wears a Palestinian scarf around the shoulders as a symbol of the Palestinian resistance.
Another deflection from yours,to falsely connect OP with radical Islamic movements...from Lebanon or elsewhere...

From a judicial POV you described it very well that she was lucky of not being a male...as a standard under Israeli occupation...



Sent from my iPad using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Morch]

@khunken

 

I have to apologize for misunderstanding and subsequent comments regarding the "gibberish" bit. You were correct, and a part of the post in question was garbled. As I was working with quite a few tabs on, failed to notice it at the time. That said, the rest of my comments and posts stand.

[Morch]

 

@Thorgal

 

Another one of your lame spin attempts.

 

I don't think that I have linked the girl in the OP to the Hamas, the Gaza Strip or "Islamic aspirations". These were broader issues raised in the context of the topic. Most of my related comments were made in response to posters who made assertions pertaining to these matters. For example, Lebanon, in as much as it was discussed, was introduced to the topic by @khunken, rather than by myself.

[F4UCorsair]

On 1/2/2018 at 9:03 PM, khunken said:

Palestine is not an Islamic country. Contrary to what Israeli propaganda portrays the long-standing conflict is Israeli-Palestinian, not Jew-Muslim.

 

 

 

 

Many sources would disagree.   Here's just one

 

https://www.google.com.au/search?q=is+palestine+a+muslim+country&oq=is+palestine+a+muslim+country&aqs=chrome..69i57j0l2.8894j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

 

From the link

 

What is the main religion of the Palestinians?

Palestine is today perhaps the most homogeneous society in the Middle East in matters of religion, being the only country with close to 100% of its population belonging to Sunni Islam. Things were different earlier, when Judaism, Christianity and Druze religion were strong elements.

[F4UCorsair]

On 1/2/2018 at 8:40 PM, simple1 said:

Ridiculous comment, completely ignoring recent history, elected female politicians, etc etc etc. 

 

One swallow does not a summer make!!

[JingerBen]

This fearless girl who slapped the face of Israeli authority now stands ten feet tall.

What provoked such outrage?

Go ask Ahed.