jonstarjon Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 We seem to forget too easily that there is still a very secret war raging around our ears between the civilian side of Thailand and the military side of thailand. Both having a considerable networks for all the little schemes which keep a strange kind of order in Thailand going. Thaksin just got too good at outdoing the military at every level. The military are just there to ensure the protection of those special people above them. Inevitable that he was going to have to be removed. Inevitable that Yingluck would be next, inevitable that democracy would suspended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenny2017 Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 (edited) Please do not throw with stones when sitting in a glasshouse. How can Interpol issue a red note for something that seems to be pretty common in this country. I guess we all know why nobody will ever issue a red notice, don't we? Even if some people are trying to see the country in a different light, Thailand's still well known for certain things and it's not changing anything when a self made soldier and now Junta chief is trying to "bring happiness to Thai people." If you think that Apostle P. has a white west, please do some research. How can somebody point his finger at a "watch lover" if the own family is part of corruption? Link deleted for certain reasons. Edited January 21, 2018 by jenny2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer90210 Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 (edited) I'm not one of the international extradition law gurus, but one could speculate that no European (sorry Ex European .-) or western nation, would wish to extradite an individual, politically engaged and exposed, back to a regime run by the military, no matter to which country. As the consequences of such an extradition could be uncertain for the extradited, it could unleash political and public uproar within the extruding nation. Edited January 21, 2018 by observer90210 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odysseus123 Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 1 minute ago, observer90210 said: I'm not one of the international extradition law gurus, but one could speculate that no European (sorry Ex European .-) or western nation, would wish to extradite an individual, politically engaged and exposed, back to a regime run by the military, no matter to which country. As the consequences of such an extradition could be uncertain for the extradited, it could unleash political and public uproar from the extruding nation. Dinna bother yerself man!It ain't gonna happen in our lifetimes.. "The best laid plans of incompetent chocolate soldiers gang aft agley." Bob Burns, 1795. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
natway09 Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 Most of the Police are "red shirt" people. They want to let sleeping dogs lie. The repercussions of bringing her back could create a civil war. Just leave the family in peace . The Government has over 50 Bil of their money now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sawadee1947 Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 13 hours ago, rooster59 said: extradition ????? will never happen! Yingluck was accused of dereliction and malfeasance of duty = not a case for prosecution in UK, otherwise many of EU got. members would be in jail.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aj Mick Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 6 hours ago, gamini said: So fake rice deals and massive corruption by her cronies is not a crime in your opinion? They are indeed crimes in any country, but are they crimes Yingluck was found guilty of? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lvr181 Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 "“We have to make sure our information is clear and legal, or the requested country may turn us down because we don’t meet their conditions,” Amnart said." Firstly, you need to meet the requirements of Interpol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Loh Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 34 minutes ago, natway09 said: Most of the Police are "red shirt" people. They want to let sleeping dogs lie. The repercussions of bringing her back could create a civil war. Just leave the family in peace . The Government has over 50 Bil of their money now The chief of police is a yellow shirt appointed by the Prawit. They have arranged for her to leave but the pantomime will continue to give impression that the junta want her back. Those watches are not exactly cheap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lincolnshire poacher Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 14 hours ago, steven100 said: Can you just imagine the faces of all the TV farang nayers who said it would never happen ... I'm not saying it will .... but there will be egg on alot of members faces if it ever comes to fruition. however, Prime Minister General Prayut Chan-o-cha recently said that the extradition process was “generally uneasy”. Extradition will never happen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Weird Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 4 hours ago, kingkenny said: Ok, clearly I am dealing with someone with no real legal knowledge, i am happy to share my credentials via pm if required. The commtting of a criminal act makes that person a criminal, a trial would determine if that person commtted a crime should they deny it. Being deemed innocent until proven guilty in court does not mean that person has not comitted the offence, it just means it is not proven yet in court should they deny the offence. The commtting of the crime makes one a criminal. Just keep arguing black is white if that makes you feel better. I do not really care about your claimed credentials but if you've got credentials that you'd like to share, then share them here, on this thread, why do it in a PM? If you won't share them here with everybody there must be something you're afraid of. But bear in mind that just because you may have credentials does not make every opinion that you have factually correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lincolnshire poacher Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 10 hours ago, Tradewind777 said: All they are doing is keeping this in the public domain while flinging enough s&hite to blacken her as much as possible and if you throw enough of the stuff the people will forget/change their minds and some of it will stick. There is however no skerrick of potential for this to result in extradition particularly since the object is a former head of state. Never gonna happen. There are probably some fans of the junta that believe that it could happen. Poor deluded fools Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lincolnshire poacher Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 9 hours ago, Bill Miller said: The Charter of Interpol specifically prevents Red notices from being issued for political crimes. Supreme Court's Criminal Division for Holders of Political Office is the source of Yingluck's conviction. From the existing extradition treaty with the UK: "Article 5. A fugitive criminal shall not be surrendered if the offence in respect of which his surrender is demanded is deemed by the Party on whom the demand is made to be one of a political character, or if he prove that the requisition for his surrender has in fact been made with a view to try or punish him for an offence of a political character." Non solis sed etiam: "Article 7. The requisition for extradition shall be made through the diplomatic agents of the High Contracting Parties respectively. The requisition for the extradition of the accused person must be accompanied by a warrant of arrest issued by the competent authority of the State requiring the extradition, and by such evidence as, according to the laws of the place where the accused is found, would justify his arrest if the crime had been committed there. If the requisition for extradition relates to a person already convicted, it must be accompanied by a copy of the judgment passed on the convicted person by the competent court of the State that makes the requisition. A sentence passed in contumaciam is not to be deemed a conviction, but a person so sentenced may be dealt with as an accused person." "In contumaciam" means essentially the same as "in absentia". Furthermore Interpol does turn down requests for Red Notices in cases which are overtly political. It is not going to happen. The powers keep wriggling, trying to save face. There is no provision for "face saving" in international law. In my opinion they could profit by giving up and moving on to something of greater importance. Like Prawits watches,ha, ha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lincolnshire poacher Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 8 hours ago, BEngBKK said: Maybe in the future she will have a UK passport and become PM in UK. The United kingdom is today so small it could easy become the UKS... "United Kingdom of Shinawatra" Taksin would love that..... Taksin was a king mate. She would have my vote for PM of England and Thailand could have the May woman as a swapsie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tifino Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 (edited) are the Thais lost in the interpretation of falang word - InterPol? they need to get over it - that it has nought to do with Inter(nal)Pol(itics) Edited January 21, 2018 by tifino Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peterphuket Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 Of-course, for the above us placed, it is all a bit difficult, but for the ordinary person, it's a lot easier. Take as an example the data exchange of taxpayer between different countries.. Then there is no impediment. In my opnion, all the countries are the same, and not exactly friendly to their own people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odysseus123 Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Peterphuket said: Of-course, for the above us placed, it is all a bit difficult, but for the ordinary person, it's a lot easier. Take as an example the data exchange of taxpayer between different countries.. Then there is no impediment. In my opnion, all the countries are the same, and not exactly friendly to their own people. JMJ... For the layman Jesus...Mary...and...Joseph. The ultimate response to asininity on such a vast scale that it is galactic rather than inter-planetary. Edited January 21, 2018 by Odysseus123 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenny2017 Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 (edited) The police, especially Interpol, should have the credibility and ability to differentiate between a military junta and somebody who was voted legally into a political system, even when votes were bought. Is it possible for Interpol to arrest somebody because they made the wrong political decisions, justified by a soldier with a corrupt family? Who's telling them who's wrong and who's right? A little solider with a huge problem being so small? If that's possible, then all the politicians from nearly all countries would have to be on their red list and an international warrant must be issued for all. That would be fun.. Interpol can't even find Mr. Red Bull and that goes on for five years. Money can't buy you love, but freedom. Edited January 21, 2018 by jenny2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baerboxer Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 11 hours ago, wakeupplease said: As usually stevie boy you do not do any home work There has to be a case in the UK that is equivalent to the one in Thai. There is not sunshine, now go and polish your bosses shoes. Not case old fruit but crime i.e the crime the wanted person has been convicted of has to also be a crime in the country extradition is being sort from. Now, I don't think they'll find anything like this in the UK. So the request will be denied, should they ever manage to make one properly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SunsetT Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 14 hours ago, Get Real said: If the Prime Minister says that, then I would really recommend that you believe him. As you know, he always has the right facts and are well aware of what he is doing. I guess that makes people save a lot of eggs, anyway. He cant even get the language right: "Generally uneasy" is nonsense English. Probably a Freudian slip as the thought of her actually being returned probably does make him feel uneasy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baerboxer Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 2 minutes ago, jenny2017 said: The police, especially Interpol, should have the credibility and ability to differentiate between a military junta and somebody who was voted legally into a political system, even when votes were bought. Is it possible for Interpol to arrest somebody because they made the wrong political decisions, justified by a soldier with a corrupt family? Who's telling them who's wrong and who's right? A little solider with a huge problem being so small? If that's possible, then all the politicians from nearly all countries would have to be on their red list and an international warrant must be issued for all. That would be fun.. Interpol can't even find Mr. Red Bull and that goes on for five years. Money can't buy you love, but freedom. The fact Yingluck was elected, chose to dissolve parliament and was then removed by a court for an abuse of power, whilst trying to organize a new election, is all irrelevant. The two really relevant things are 1. The crime committed and convicted must be a crime in the country being asked to extradite and 2. Britain, and other Western democracies don't normally favor sending people back to a country whose government came to power in a coup. If, and it's very very unlikely, a British court, Appeals court and Supreme court all amazingly decided extradition was appropriate, she could still fall back on the EU ECJ as UK still a member for now. But more likely UK will reject any application on the grounds of no such crime there, the Junta can say "we tried" but they won't send her back, Yingluck can stay in her brother's mansion and shop to her heart's content. Win/Win - no face lost, no big problem of what to do when she's back and, bonus, they can blame those farang bounders in the UK! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikiea Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 15 hours ago, steven100 said: Can you just imagine the faces of all the TV farang nayers who said it would never happen ... I'm not saying it will .... but there will be egg on alot of members faces if it ever comes to fruition. however, Prime Minister General Prayut Chan-o-cha recently said that the extradition process was “generally uneasy”. generally uneasy = ehhh.... we do not want her back , but we will whine about it anyway . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baerboxer Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 2 hours ago, observer90210 said: I'm not one of the international extradition law gurus, but one could speculate that no European (sorry Ex European .-) or western nation, would wish to extradite an individual, politically engaged and exposed, back to a regime run by the military, no matter to which country. As the consequences of such an extradition could be uncertain for the extradited, it could unleash political and public uproar within the extruding nation. You do realize there is a difference between Europe and the EU don't you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikiea Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 14 hours ago, Aj Mick said: The wheels are not moving at all, and are unlikely to ever move. Yingluck's conviction in Thailand (under the junta that overthrew the government she was elected to lead) was for something that would not be recognised as a crime in the UK..... Get over it. well said ......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baerboxer Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 6 hours ago, jayboy said: So you have no point to make at all.I have already said most of us are aware of the sequence of events in which a judicial coup immediately preceded the military coup.I suppose you think that there was no connection between the two. The following gives an accurate summary of events. https://www.thedailybeast.com/all-you-need-to-know-about-the-thai-coup Judicial coup - are you denying the events that constituted an abuse of power never took place? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonah Tenner Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 10 hours ago, Bill Miller said: In my opinion they could profit by giving up and moving on to something of greater importance. It is a useful distraction from other things the current rulers don't want the population to be aware of or thinking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikiea Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 12 hours ago, wakeupplease said: As usually stevie boy you do not do any home work There has to be a case in the UK that is equivalent to the one in Thai. There is not sunshine, now go and polish your bosses shoes. ouch x 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yellowboat Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 Just now, Baerboxer said: Judicial coup - are you denying the events that constituted an abuse of power never took place? She might have been removed for abuse of power, but was she not impeached and found guilty of knowingly allowing thievery to take place ? Also, judicial systems in the west tend to be very chauvinistic. They tend to either respect or look down upon courts in other countries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Air Smiles Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 Breaking the terms of bail and going on the run is covered by UK law and so is negligence whilst in public office: https://www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidance/misconduct-public-office Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baerboxer Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 Just now, yellowboat said: She might have been removed for abuse of power, but was she not impeached and found guilty of knowingly allowing thievery to take place ? Also, judicial systems in the west tend to be very chauvinistic. They tend to either respect or look down upon courts in other countries. The poster I replied to as a history of ignoring fact by using terms such as "judicial coup" when in fact he knows very well that the abuse of power was committed and for what reasons. As usual PTP like other Thaksin owned parties elected to govern get caught out because the ignore the rules. Not relevant in the slightest to this topic but the pro Shin posters just love trying to cover up their heroes indiscretions! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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