Brexit has created chaos in Britain – nobody voted for this

[malagateddy]

 
It used to the Irish they complained about in Govanhill, then the Pakistanis, now its the Roma, its really nothing new.

It's really nothing new..drugs..protection rackets..people trafficking..child prostitution..that's Govanhill now SADLY!!!!!

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[vogie]

35 minutes ago, PREM-R said:

Wow!  UKIP has six million voters...... how many MP's do they have in the House of Commons?

 

Oh the injustice, the SNP had less than one million votes and grossed 35 seats at Westminster, something is wrong somewhere.

[dick dasterdly]

Just now, Kieran00001 said:

 

It used to the Irish they complained about in Govanhill, then the Pakistanis, now its the Roma, its really nothing new.

And that's partly the point?  'Problem' people (whether because they are lowering wages or because they are causing trouble/criminals etc.) always end up in poor areas.

 

Of course the affect on wages/salaries spreads, as the cheap labour from poor eu countries pours into the uk....  Similar to the way big companies move various operations to countries with a far cheaper work force.  Which is why I agree with soulbundy that globalism has also played a part in the electorate of various, wealthy western countries becoming more bad-tempered at what is happening - and voting accordingly.

[Kieran00001]

10 minutes ago, malagateddy said:

It's really nothing new..drugs..protection rackets..people trafficking..child prostitution..that's Govanhill now SADLY!!!!!

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It was your ilk who said similar things about the Irish and had them forbidden from many public places, turned out they were some of the best workers Glasgow had seen.  Its the same every time, blame your problems on the immigrants right up until they benefit your economy and you start thanking them.

[Kieran00001]

1 minute ago, dick dasterdly said:

And that's partly the point?  'Problem' people (whether because they are lowering wages or because they are causing trouble/criminals etc.) always end up in poor areas.

 

Of course the affect on wages/salaries spreads, as the cheap labour from poor eu countries pours into the uk....  Similar to the way big companies move various operations to countries with a far cheaper work force.  Which is why I agree with soulbundy that globalism has also played a part in the electorate of various, wealthy western countries becoming more bad-tempered at what is happening - and voting accordingly.

 

Except the point is actually that the Irish and Pakistanis turned out to be good for the economy, not the problem people they were being portrayed as by some at the time.

[Kieran00001]

16 minutes ago, malagateddy said:

It's really nothing new..drugs..protection rackets..people trafficking..child prostitution..that's Govanhill now SADLY!!!!!

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None of which the Roma introduced to Glasgow, all old problems, yet it is they you are scapegoating.

[dick dasterdly]

1 hour ago, malagateddy said:

No I do not consider Brexiteers ''thick" and fine well you know that.
Pity that some remainers consider people like me fascists..ultra right wingers racists and all the other "mince" comments.

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Couldn't agree more.

 

Most people are understandably not very interested in politics, and vote according to their media of choice - for some reason trusting their biased views almost entirely.

 

This doesn't necessarily make them "thick" - they just don't have the time or inclination to read up on all the various facets of the arguments involved.

 

Politicians rely on this - and sometimes they badly misjudge the alienation of the electorate, believing that they will always believe the lies and propaganda spread by themselves and the majority of the media.

[malagateddy]

 
None of which the Roma introduced to Glasgow, all old problems, yet it is they you are scapegoating.

Wrong..wrong..wrong..people trafficking/child prostitution are " new scummy crimes"

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[vogie]

18 minutes ago, Kieran00001 said:

 

Except the point is actually that the Irish and Pakistanis turned out to be good for the economy, not the problem people they were being portrayed as by some at the time.

Every thing appears down to money with you, there are more things to worry about in a well balanced society.

[dick dasterdly]

1 hour ago, The manic said:

UKIP's main policy was achieved regarding Brexit and it won 6 million votes in recent national elections. It has changed the narrative and forced dialogue on that which the facist left, radical feminists, etc tried to suppress. 

Can we please give up on the "facist left, radical feminists"/right wing etc. labels??

 

I'm about as left-wing as they come and also a feminist!

 

Consequently it's always annoying to read these 'labels'.

[dick dasterdly]

34 minutes ago, Kieran00001 said:

 

It was your ilk who said similar things about the Irish and had them forbidden from many public places, turned out they were some of the best workers Glasgow had seen.  Its the same every time, blame your problems on the immigrants right up until they benefit your economy and you start thanking them.

When were the Irish "forbidden from many public places"??

[The Renegade]

In a stunning piece of Italian brilliance, the rejected Finance Minister has now been appointed as Minister for the EU  ??

 

According to Politico, he had this to say in 2016

 

Quote

In June 2016, Savona praised the strength of British democracy and described Brexit as an opportunity for the EU to become more democratic. The EU elites “treat the people like a barbaric and ignorant flock, while they implicitly call themselves civilized and integrated, capable of evaluating popular will better than voters,” he wrote. He said the elite want people to vote “only if they vote well.”

https://www.politico.eu/article/who-to-look-out-for-in-the-italian-government-far-right-league-5star-movement-giuseppe-conte/

 

There are a couple of Turkeys clucking about this thread who this also applies to.

 

Then they scratch their heads and wail that '' Populists '' are on the increase.

 

So intelligent ??

[The Renegade]

2 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

When were the Irish "forbidden from many public places"??

As the poster mentions Glasgow, I would think it would have been over 100 years ago.

 

So the poster is either ancient or is talking out the wrong orifice.

[dick dasterdly]

34 minutes ago, Kieran00001 said:

 

Except the point is actually that the Irish and Pakistanis turned out to be good for the economy, not the problem people they were being portrayed as by some at the time.

Not sure that the Irish "turned out to be good for the economy', as it sounds like the same, old argument that they are/were paying taxes and therefore good for the economy?

 

British workers could have had those jobs, and also been paying taxes on their (possibly higher) wages, therefore paying more taxes.

 

But it was before 'my time', and so I don't know.

 

Similarly, I've nothing against the Pakistanis that moved here a few decades ago.  Their corner shops that were open pretty much 24/7 were greatly appreciated by the majority of the populace.  Their 'business dealings could be a bit 'dodgy' - but nothing to worry about.

 

Things have changed since then with the influx of immigrants from poor eu countries.

[dick dasterdly]

Just now, dick dasterdly said:

Not sure that the Irish "turned out to be good for the economy', as it sounds like the same, old argument that they are/were paying taxes and therefore good for the economy?

 

British workers could have had those jobs, and also been paying taxes on their (possibly higher) wages, therefore paying more taxes.

 

But it was before 'my time', and so I don't know.

 

Similarly, I've nothing against the Pakistanis that moved here a few decades ago.  Their corner shops that were open pretty much 24/7 were greatly appreciated by the majority of the populace.  Their 'business dealings could be a bit 'dodgy' - but nothing to worry about.

 

Things have changed since then with the influx of immigrants from poor eu countries.

Plus the moslems bringing in more and more family (offspring?  I don't know) , so that they dominate certain areas.  Sadly, they are becoming more militant in support of their religious beliefs - which shouldn't be allowed to happen IMO.

 

Move to another country?  Moan about different cultural values to each other, but don't try to enforce them upon the country to which you've migrated!

 

Not that this has much to do with the topic, other than as part of the explanation as to why the brit. electorate gave up on the 'expert' advice offered to them by politicians and the media - and voted brexit.

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, dick dasterdly said:

This doesn't necessarily make them "thick" - they just don't have the time or inclination to read up on all the various facets of the arguments involved.

Nicely put; far more diplomatic than me ?

 

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-43301423

 

or

 

https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=populist

 

Pedants should understand that usage changes over time. Nothing wrong with language evolution IMHO.

 

 

Edited June 4, 2018 by Grouse

[dick dasterdly]

1 hour ago, dick dasterdly said:

Couldn't agree more.

 

Most people are understandably not very interested in politics, and vote according to their media of choice - for some reason trusting their biased views almost entirely.

 

This doesn't necessarily make them "thick" - they just don't have the time or inclination to read up on all the various facets of the arguments involved.

 

Politicians rely on this - and sometimes they badly misjudge the alienation of the electorate, believing that they will always believe the lies and propaganda spread by themselves and the majority of the media.

 

11 minutes ago, Grouse said:

Nicely put; far more diplomatic than me ?

 

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-43301423

 

You misunderstand.

 

I consider most remain complainers (in general - not on this forum) as even more deficient when it comes to a general understanding of the issues involved.

 

Or perhaps I've misunderstood, and you agree that:-

 

"This doesn't necessarily make them "thick" - they just don't have the time or inclination to read up on all the various facets of the arguments involved.

 

Politicians rely on this - and sometimes they badly misjudge the alienation of the electorate, believing that they will always believe the lies and propaganda spread by themselves and the majority of the media."

 

In which case, why on earth do you keep insisting that those who voted leave were 'thick/uneducated' etc. etc.? Whereas remain voters were the opposite?

Edited June 4, 2018 by dick dasterdly

[Eloquent pilgrim]

1 hour ago, Kieran00001 said:

 

Except the point is actually that the Irish and Pakistanis turned out to be good for the economy, not the problem people they were being portrayed as by some at the time.

Rotherham, Peterborough, Newcastle, Rochdale, Oxford and Telford ……..

personally, I put these appalling problems way before any economic benefits that male Pakistani immigrants have brought to the UK

[CG1 Blue]

On ‎6‎/‎2‎/‎2018 at 3:45 AM, candide said:

https://www.npr.org/sections/alltechconsidered/2016/06/24/480949383/britains-google-searches-for-what-is-the-eu-spike-after-brexit-vote

?

I'm not sure what your message is here.  So those people who didn't bother to vote started googling Brexit stuff.  And no doubt some of those who did vote also googled Brexit stuff, perhaps to get a better idea of the impact.

Or are you trying to suggest only those who voted Leave used Google that day?

[Kieran00001]

3 hours ago, vogie said:

Every thing appears down to money with you, there are more things to worry about in a well balanced society.

 

Quite the assumption, the Irish were being accused of being thieves, turned out they were bloody hard workers, now the Roma are being accused of being people traffickers and pimps of child prostitutes, lets see what the future holds for them, that has nothing at all to do with money, but never mind.

[Kieran00001]

2 hours ago, dick dasterdly said:

When were the Irish "forbidden from many public places"??

 

No dogs and Irish, ring any bells?

[Kieran00001]

2 hours ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

Rotherham, Peterborough, Newcastle, Rochdale, Oxford and Telford ……..

personally, I put these appalling problems way before any economic benefits that male Pakistani immigrants have brought to the UK

 

And did you even consider that despite the enormous media coverage of the Asian sex gangs, the demographics of sex offenders still show white British men clearly in the lead?  The thing is, there have always been men committing sex offences in the UK, it did not start when the Pakistani's came to the UK, so to attempt to blame them for a social issue is just scapegoating, much like trying to blame people trafficking on the Roma.

[Kieran00001]

3 hours ago, malagateddy said:

Wrong..wrong..wrong..people trafficking/child prostitution are " new scummy crimes"

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Try Larchgrove if you think it wasn't going on in Glasgow before immigration, it was being done by white Scottish men, trafficking children all over the country for the sexual pleasure of other white British men, its not related to immigration, all races and all nationalities have this perversion present in their communities.

[Kieran00001]

3 hours ago, The Renegade said:

As the poster mentions Glasgow, I would think it would have been over 100 years ago.

 

So the poster is either ancient or is talking out the wrong orifice.

 

Hardly, it was happening again in the 60's.

[The Renegade]

1 minute ago, Kieran00001 said:

Hardly, it was happening again in the 60's.

How do you know ?

 

You were still in nappies at the 1975 Referendum.

[Kieran00001]

2 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

How do you know ?

 

You were still in nappies at the 1975 Referendum.

 

Did you know that there were a people called the Romans who brought us many things, no of course you didn't, they were before your time, right?  Ever heard of books?

[StreetCowboy]

4 minutes ago, Kieran00001 said:

 

Did you know that there were a people called the Romans who brought us many things, no of course you didn't, they were before your time, right?  Ever heard of books?

Most books are printed by the establishment to cow you into obedience to faceless foreign bureaucrats.  

 

If it's not printed on recycled paper on an old roneostat machine, you can't trust it; not unless its published anonymously on the  web.

 

EDIT: Look at the first book ever printed: The Bible, intended to cow you into obedience to a faceless foreign bureaucrat allegedly appointed by God through the mystic wisdom of a bunch of cardinals.

 

[StreetCowboy]

7 minutes ago, Kieran00001 said:

 

Did you know that there were a people called the Romans who brought us many things, no of course you didn't, they were before your time, right?  Ever heard of books?

What have the Romans ever done for us?

[Kieran00001]

18 minutes ago, StreetCowboy said:

Most books are printed by the establishment to cow you into obedience to faceless foreign bureaucrats.  

 

If it's not printed on recycled paper on an old roneostat machine, you can't trust it; not unless its published anonymously on the  web.

 

EDIT: Look at the first book ever printed: The Bible, intended to cow you into obedience to a faceless foreign bureaucrat allegedly appointed by God through the mystic wisdom of a bunch of cardinals.

 

 

How absurd, are you seriously trying to deny the history of the 1960's?  It isn't long ago, I may read about in books but I am reading the testimonies of living witnesses, it happened.

[StreetCowboy]

5 minutes ago, Kieran00001 said:

 

How absurd, are you seriously trying to deny the history of the 1960's?  It isn't long ago, I may read about in books but I am reading the testimonies of living witnesses, it happened.

Some people are sceptical whether the 60s ever happened.  I very much doubt England ever won the World Cup.