Has Pattaya Reached Tipping Point

[britmaveric]

I lived in Soi 6 for 9 months, owned Gang's Pub (as a partner), back in 2003, and I looked for the library all the time, never found it! Does it exist? Not that I'm going back to Pattaya any time soon.

Check out the Map - yes we weren't winding you up about the library!!

As for brit cuisine - its called catering to what sells. Luckily there always will be thai menu unlike Spain or other spots in the world.

However I do agree bit bad in Spain - asked for Tapa(s) and got a bizzare look and told oh we only serve english food.

[Mobi]

After the pissup at the Caddy Shack the other week, when Mrs Mobi joined with the other Mrs(s) TV's in a very long exchange of views on all matters relating to husbands, boyfriends, how big their peckers are, how many times have they have been caught doing something they shouldn't, and when and where...

... she said to me:

Have you ever heard of Soi 6?

Soi Six? what about it?

I hear it's very famous

Famous... sorry no understand....

Yes.. full of girls sitting outside bars, you must have heard of it - everyone has - except me!

Oh. Soi 6 - that Soi - er..yes I do sort of know about it

Have you ever been there?

Well I've driven through it a couple of times, but never stopped - except to go to the library.

LIBRARY!! what you talking about?

There's a library on Soi six - it's not all girlie bars you know.

I don't believe you!

It's true - look, here's a map.

Hm.. Not sure. So where are the books then?

Oh.. the books .. well I couldn't find any to my taste could I? Been there and read most of them!

[NanLaew]

After the pissup at the Caddy Shack the other week, when Mrs Mobi joined with the other Mrs(s) TV's in a very long exchange of views on all matters relating to husbands, boyfriends, how big their peckers are, how many times have they have been caught doing something they shouldn't, and when and where...

... she said to me:

Have you ever heard of Soi 6?

Soi Six? what about it?

I hear it's very famous

Famous... sorry no understand....

Yes.. full of girls sitting outside bars, you must have heard of it - everyone has - except me!

Oh. Soi 6 - that Soi - er..yes I do sort of know about it

Have you ever been there?

Well I've driven through it a couple of times, but never stopped - except to go to the library.

LIBRARY!! what you talking about?

There's a library on Soi six - it's not all girlie bars you know.

I don't believe you!

It's true - look, here's a map.

Hm.. Not sure. So where are the books then?

Oh.. the books .. well I couldn't find any to my taste could I? Been there and read most of them!

fabulous body swerve you have there Mobi... nice work!

[chanchao]

Well.. I think a simple "It's yet another soi with bars; what else is new in Pattaya."

Honestly I think most Thai women wouldn't think of it as any worse than sois 7, 8, Pattayaland, etc. (etc, etc, etc, etc) It has bars with girls; News at 11.

Cheers,

Chanchao

Edited February 1, 2007 by chanchao

[Humphrey Bear]

You cant blame it all on the brits,, but do agree about the egg and chips.

I had a good friend over at Christmas, we agreed to go out to the library in soi 6 for some reading. He suggested we go for some food first, ok so what did he insist on having , that’s it poached eggs on toast in a brit bar.

Obviously your friend is a man of exquisite taste and perspicacity.

British grub is served throughout the world because it is nouurishing, tasty and popular. Made with good quality ingredients that do not require the embellishment of multiple sauces like the French muck (the sauces were developed to disguise the poor quality food after the revolution and counteract the meat being rotten).

Neither does British grub need to be served with delicate little poofy portions of coloured sauce as in Nouvelle Cuisine, nor covered in garlic like so many Mediterranean dishes.

Just imagine a nice roast beef lunch on Sunday, with yorkshire pudding, roast potatoes, brussels, cauliflower (without the cheese), followed by a well-filled apple pie and custard. Of course, I forgot ..... AAAHHHHHH Bisto!

[icecubes]

I lived in Soi 6 for 9 months, owned Gang's Pub (as a partner), back in 2003, and I looked for the library all the time, never found it! Does it exist? Not that I'm going back to Pattaya any time soon.

Check out the Map - yes we weren't winding you up about the library!!

As for brit cuisine - its called catering to what sells. Luckily there always will be thai menu unlike Spain or other spots in the world.

However I do agree bit bad in Spain - asked for Tapa(s) and got a bizzare look and told oh we only serve english food.

Library is one of those yorkshireism.

L Last

I In

B Buys.

R Round

A And no

R Reading of

Y Young farmers weekly .

Library in Soi Six

[JR Texas]

Has Pattaya reached tipping point with respect to its development? Do you think it's now all downhill because of increased street crime, wanton violence, drugs, increasing dissatisfaction with public utility services (water supply, public transport, garbage collection), no user friendly green areas, dirty beaches, stinking drains, traffic increase, traffic signals not working, air pollution, stressed out Thais?

This morning I walked along Dongtan beach. The walking road is filthy. The smell of sour garbage hung over everything. Palm trees are unkempt. Green corrugated iron fence looks awful and garbage is being dumped behind it wherever it's open. I looked at the faces of all the tourists I met and didn't see one smiling. If I were a regular tourist there's no way I would make a return visit. In Jomthien and Pattaya outside of the hotel grounds everything is soooo dirty!!

JR Texas to Tammi: Yes, Pattaya-Jomtien has reached a negative tipping point. It is downhill.......too bad because it used to be a good place to live.

The only people that would disagree are the foaming at the mouth real estate hounds that want to portray it as an expat "paradise" and the "grandfathered in" expats that have already invested too much in the region to acknowledge anything negative is happening (reality is often painful).

The basic problems: 1) too many people (especially foreigners that have ruined the place), 2) too much development (mainly caused by a plague of real estate pathogens), 3) infrastructure development not keeping pace with demand, and 4) air and water pollution.

I really miss the Pattaya-Jomtien that I knew between 1986-1999. Those were good years.......a period of growth but not too much growth. The area was still a "frontier" of sorts.

Now I am looking for an alternative to Pattaya-Jomtien........I think Cambodia and Vietnam will soon have places that will attract expats........it will take time, but it will happen.

If only Myanmar would get its act together! Imagine the potential there for coastal development.....but it has a long way to go.

[Mobi]

On a serious note, putting the library on Soi 6 to one side, I have to say that over the past 6 months I have changed from being more of a basher than a defender.

Right now there are 2 main reasons that keep me in Thailand. The first is that I have invested a lot of cash in a beautiful house, and the second is that I speak enough Thai to get around pretty well. If it were not for these 2 factors I would at least be having a look at alternative retirement places in Cambodia, Vietnam, Malaysia or even Philippines.

If push comes to shove I could walk away from my property, and still be OK. But it will be a hard wrench because I am very happy there, and am enjoying an idyllic lifestyle.

Then why am I a basher?

For starters, I don’t live in Pattaya – my home is a good 20kms from the sea front and located in a genuine Thai village, with it’s own Wat, local community, market and the lake just around the corner. Metaphorically speaking, a million miles from ‘sin city’

As for Pattaya itself, well we will always have loads of sex tourists who still think Pattaya is the greatest city on the planet, and there will also always be a fair number of residents/temporary residents (the Britmavericks and Kerry D's of this world) who love the seedier aspects of the city, and enjoy their drinking and whoring. If I was 20 years younger I'd probably be saying the same thing.

But the fact remains that the down town area is a traffic congested, cesspit of a dump, with appalling roads and infrastructure, a rising crime rate, filthy beaches, unbelievable slums and depravation and a police force and local authority who couldn't give a sh..t, except lining their own pockets... etc etc etc. All of this is undeniable, and has been detailed ad nausium in this thread, and slowly but surely the word will without, and Pattaya will start to suffer a slump in its fortunes.

Many of Pattaya’s problems can and probably will be eventually corrected - but we are talking 5 to 10 years - and that's from the time when the authorities finally get their wake up call - but right now their heads are so deep in the corruption trough, they wouldn't know a disgruntled tourist if they saw one.

Very little of this effects me. I live out in the fresh and cooler air of Mabprachan, and the lakeside restaurants and bars provide a lovely setting for afternoon get tog ethers with fellow expats, families, and even dogs, and I never need to go near a bar in Pattaya. I am happy to drive into Pattaya 3 times a week to do my shopping and sort out various errands, and occasionally I will enjoy the culinary delights of the myriad "ethnic" restaurants that abound in the Pattaya region.

The negative for me personally, is the increasingly hostile attitude towards foreigners and the distinct feeling that one day the goal post might be changed yet again and I'll be out on my ear. I have a bad sense of security right now. Against that - I speak the lingo, and to me that is a huge advantage when living in a foreign land. At my time of life that would be difficult to achieve second time around.

So right now, I will stay put, enjoy what I have and hope that it lasts. But for Pattaya City - well I reckon it'll get worse before it gets better. And Just wait until some of these TV holiday programmes and magazines start to say/print negative stuff: The game will be up and many of the tourist dollars will move on to the next tropical paradise. Sihanokville maybe?

The tipping point is not yet reached, but I don’t think it’s too far off.

Edited February 2, 2007 by Mobi D'Ark

[buriramboy]

brilliant totaly spot-on well written post Mobi, just wish i was as articulate as you myself.

I too live east of sukhumvit road, IMO it is the only place to live in pattaya, quiet and basically trouble free and at the same time, all the mayhem is easily reached in under 10 minutes as and when required.

[bmanly]

Sihanokville maybe?

Not a bad place there Mobi, I could easily spend a bit more time there. Clean beaches, few farangs and definitely not over crowded. Has some good Indian restaurants there too as well as a few nice quiet bars.

[Tammi]

A friend lives in Sihanoukville area and loves it. Also have friends who live a lot of the time in Kep which is where the French had their seaside villas. Very pretty. Phnom Penh used to be OK but the traffic is awful now. What impact will the discovery of oil have on Cambodia?

Am told the Philippines welcome retirees - all sorts of perks. But Manila is dreadfully polluted - but fun. I once happened to be in Manila on Valentines Day and was staggered when the news reader on TV wished "all you fornicators a very Happy Valentine's".

Vietnam is a possibility. But I've only ever been to Hanoi and found the locals not very friendly.

Know somebody retired to South India and he loves it.

Sri Lankans are nice.

Nepal has its problems and the valley is so polluted now.

What to do? Move to Isan? Guys up there are always saying how happy they are.

Somewhere on the banks of the Mekong could be nice.

[Tarqin]

Normally I ignore Tammiflu's nonsense but in this case she has a point.

Mobi expressed it all very well.

I live in Jomtien and increasing just don't leave Tarqin Towers from Saturday morning until Monday morning as the traffic goes from bad to insane.

Pattaya/Jomtien are pretty much the same place now. I could point to the massive rise in tattooed yobs, violence etc etc but in truth I can avoid such things easily but the key change for me is as follows and I would like others comments on this point.

There seems to me to have been either a sea change in the Thais attitude to us or different types of Thais are being drawn to Pattaya but there now seems to be a large and growing number of Thais willing to try blatantly to rip off falangs and I'm not talking 5/10 baht here and there I'm talking hundreds or thousands of baht and all the time. A minor example but every time I fill up the car with petrol they try the pump trick on me, I'm sure you all know it they don't zero the pump after the last sale so that amount is added to your fill and they pocket the difference, every time now even though I tend to use the same garage I have to get out and order them to zero the pump, every time. Plus whilst riping off falangs has always been the case when you pointed out the fraud and shown you weren't to be ripped off you used to get a rueful smile and an apology not you get a hard stare and the attitude seem to be 'how dare you stop me stealing from you'.

I doubt I am moving on any time soon but I am thinking about it and wondering whether my condo will actually achieve the price everyone tells me its worth and so I might just put in on the market to see...

[JR Texas]

A friend lives in Sihanoukville area and loves it. Also have friends who live a lot of the time in Kep which is where the French had their seaside villas. Very pretty. Phnom Penh used to be OK but the traffic is awful now. What impact will the discovery of oil have on Cambodia?

Am told the Philippines welcome retirees - all sorts of perks. But Manila is dreadfully polluted - but fun. I once happened to be in Manila on Valentines Day and was staggered when the news reader on TV wished "all you fornicators a very Happy Valentine's".

Vietnam is a possibility. But I've only ever been to Hanoi and found the locals not very friendly.

Know somebody retired to South India and he loves it.

Sri Lankans are nice.

Nepal has its problems and the valley is so polluted now.

What to do? Move to Isan? Guys up there are always saying how happy they are.

Somewhere on the banks of the Mekong could be nice.

JR Texas to Tammi: I just moved to Thailand from China. I really liked China......especially the clean air, clean streets, clean food, nice people, beautiful mountains, and last but not least, PANCAKES AND SAUSAGE AT McDONALDS (why McDonalds in Thailand can't do this is beyond my limited intelligence to understand).

I now live in the N.E. of Thailand and it is good here.

A French friend of mine swears that Vietnam is a great place.......but I have also heard things about them being unfriendly (not sure about it).

I once lived in southern India and would not recommended it to my worst enemy. The girls are beautiful. Culturally they are way too different (but many are very, very kind).

Nepal has way too many problems.............

Many of my friends have already moved to the Philippines and taken their businesses with them--businesses that once hired Thais. I have other friends who are strongly thinking about leaving LOS for the Philippines.

Visa issues are extremely relaxed and easy in the Philippines......no insanity like LOS as the govt. seems to understand that foreigners (rich and middle class and poor) spending money in the country is a good thing.

I stayed in Phnom Penh for one month........a bit boring and dirty, but the food along the river was good....you could actually get a good hamburger, something that you still can't get in Thailand.

I also stayed a month in Sihanoukville and found it a bit isolated and boring, but the ocean was far more beautiful than in places like Pattaya. It really has potential............I wish the govt. would allow it to become the next Pattaya. It would really be popular......in fact, it is like Pattaya was in the early 70s.

The growth/profit potential in Sihanoukville is enormous, especially given the strange/destructive/xenophobic behavior that Thailand's government is expressing towards foreigners.

[Tammi]

Tarqin Posted Today, 2007-02-02 17:31:15

Normally I ignore Tammiflu's nonsense but in this case she has a point.

Who ever said I am a 'her'? Will your opinion of my previous posts change now that you have to consider the possibility that I am a 'him'?

JR Texas to Tammi:

I also stayed a month in Sihanoukville and found it a bit isolated and boring, but the ocean was far more beautiful than in places like Pattaya. It really has potential............I wish the govt. would allow it to become the next Pattaya. It would really be popular......in fact, it is like Pattaya was in the early 70s.

The growth/profit potential in Sihanoukville is enormous, especially given the strange/destructive/xenophobic behavior that Thailand's government is expressing towards foreigners.

The Cambodians have aleady been here to Pattaya to learn tourist lessons. Maybe they came here to learn how not to do it. Sihanoukville is to get a Casino on an offshore island connected to the mainland by a bridge. So what with oil and casino that coastline might go downhill fast if Mr & Mrs Hun Sen can't keep a grip.

[bmanly]

Sihanoukville already has a casino on the mainland so what difference will an offshore one make? Right now Sihanoukville is finding itself, some expats want another Pattaya and other people want a resort. Backpackers just want a cheap bungalow on the beach...... The place is finding itself, I wonder how it will end up? But right now I love it the way it is.

[NanLaew]

ok, i have completed my relocation back to Pattaya, in the same house i lived in +15 years ago. access from soi potisan to the fleshy underparts of the city is much easier now that sai sam now punches clean across town. i reckon the place is even better than before, everywhere takes plastic, satellite TV and broadband is available, cheap, negotiable transportation abounds. i also have mates with big houses and plots of land half-way to Nakhon Nowhere that i can toddle off to visit in my 4x4 when i get bored and fancy the landed gentry experience.

i am back.... the tipping point is now assured!

[moo9]

I have met a lot of tourists who have told me that 1 visit to Pattaya is enough and that they will never come back. Please note that they loved other places, such as Chiang Mai, and many will come back to Thailand, just not to Pattaya.

Thats ok. I wish many Russians would think the same way.

I like Pattaya, so I am waiting desperately for the low season! Don't get me wrong, there are many much more nice beaches and places in Thailand, but as I work in this region, I just use the other destinations for a relaxing holiday. Besides this, Pattaya is fun to stay and live and I hope, this will continue for some time.

[icecubes]

I wish this town would go back to being sin city.

Go home Football thugs

Go home Families, who wish to change pattaya into a home from home

Go home Farang ladies,

Go home Falang tvp,

Go home Back packers,

Go home Trash packers.

GO home Pretend bikers on Quad bikes. (they do look real stupid around town)

Then the girls can be all mine, all mine.

[NanLaew]

I have met a lot of tourists who have told me that 1 visit to Pattaya is enough and that they will never come back. Please note that they loved other places, such as Chiang Mai, and many will come back to Thailand, just not to Pattaya.

Thats ok. I wish many Russians would think the same way.

I like Pattaya, so I am waiting desperately for the low season! Don't get me wrong, there are many much more nice beaches and places in Thailand, but as I work in this region, I just use the other destinations for a relaxing holiday. Besides this, Pattaya is fun to stay and live and I hope, this will continue for some time.

ouch! you have issues with Russians?

ahhh, low season. where stars can be had for a bowl of noodles.... or was that last century?

[helicoptor]

Mobi D'Ark - Spot on Post

I too live in Noungplalai (outskirts) and Pattaya centre seems a world away from my little SP Village bubble, the area is developing and many areas around are constructing new villages, especially around Mabrachan/Siam Country Road/Noungplalai.

The times I do go into Pattaya (shopping) I always find myself in a 'check out that freak' competition with the missus (mainly farangs but occasionally Thais) - but I gather you could play that game in any large city

[clivemh]

If you want to compare us with Europe- well go ahead- but this Asia, and I like it, did you know that the UK is gearing up for an influx of six million immigrants, thats not including the illegal ones. Higher taxes are on the cards and even road tolls far higher than over here. Has Tammi been held up at gunpoint or mugged? I don't think so I think you will find it is the dopey holiday makers who get pissed and flash their 3bht chain in front of the poor Thais down some dark quiet street in the early hours of the morning. As for the guns, you will find that its the Thai gangs,shooting each other up.

here is the link about the tolls in the UK

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/tm_headline=s...-name_page.html

[icecubes]

As for the guns, you will find that its the Thai gangs,shooting each other up.

Do you think it will stay that way??? if so why. do tell, o wise one.

we are all ears. !!!!!

[helicoptor]

As for the guns, you will find that its the Thai gangs,shooting each other up.

Do you think it will stay that way??? if so why. do tell, o wise one.

we are all ears. !!!!!

Maybe not and sure some farangs will get caught up in dealings resulting in getting shot if they put themselves in the zone.

Thai people are aware of the detrimental impact it has on their tourist industry (their primary money source) when incidents - however remote at the moment - involving farangs getting mugged/shot/killed. It is drummed into them at every opportunity by the government.

I dont think it will ever become a problem to the extent that people will stop coming here to holiday or live.

IMO it will always be safer than walking the streets of Manchester at 2am on a saturday from walking down 2nd Road at the same time.

[Robski]

Yep it's all relative Helicopter, the levels of crime and anti-social disorder are far higher in most European and U.S cities.

Patters is what it is, you've just got to look at the positives, and that's easy to do when you compare it to some of the problems back home.

Edited February 10, 2007 by Robski

[helicoptor]

Yep it's all relative Helicopter, the levels of crime and anti-social disorder are far higher in most European and U.S cities.

Patters is what it is, you've just got to look at the positives, and that's easy to do when you compare it to some of the problems back home.

My cup is ALWAYS half full!! not half empty

[NormanW]

I know this is an old post but the same applies today.

Thai's and Pattaya just don't help themselves where the environment is concerned.

Very sad to witness, as it could be such a cleaner place with better infrastructure.

Still better than the west though eh?

Have a great day.

Edited December 16, 2009 by NormanW

[raro]

thanks for your insights and I think it is time to close this almost 3 years old thread for good.