Agency Sponsorship for Financial Requirement of Reirement Visa

[onera1961]

I have seen agency ads claiming they can sponsor Thai retirement extension without fund requirement. Are these agents reliable, are they doing anything outside the legality of Thai laws? Anybody has any experience with them? Or this is the topic that shall not be spoken in public forum?

[Jingthing]

My opinion --

Some are reliable

They're operating in a legal grey area.

The ethics are not so grey.

You end up applying with a legit looking case but in reality you didn't actually follow the rules of immigration law.

So it's AYOR but based on years here, the R for clients isn't much. 

Some have reported issues with address reporting (agency used another office) or later applications when application is done without an agency.

[a977]

As the money is supposed to be seasoned for 2-3 months and the agency only puts it in your account for 1 day, there could be problems if Immigration investigate you. 

[Phuket Man]

It is illegal and you will be the one who takes the can.

[Jingthing]

As the money is supposed to be seasoned for 2-3 months and the agency only puts it in your account for 1 day, there could be problems if Immigration investigate you. 

Yeah.
But they don't.
Because they "worked" with the agency.

Sent from my [device_name] using http://Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Jingthing]

It is illegal and you will be the one who takes the can.

Name the law that technically says it's illegal.
I'm against the practice so don't get the idea that I'm promoting it.

Sent from my [device_name] using http://Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[JOC]

It is really very simple: It is cheating, Using an agent who is paying a corrupt immigration officer, doesn't make it legal...!!

It is illegal and is making fools out of everyone actually following the law...

When the crackdown comes, and it will come...The immigration officers involved will used their jobs...and their clients will be kicked out of the country.

Can't understand how the subject is even allowed on a public forum...

[overherebc]

7 hours ago, a977 said:

As the money is supposed to be seasoned for 2-3 months and the agency only puts it in your account for 1 day, there could be problems if Immigration investigate you. 

Not unlike stating you have the qualifications for a job and using anothers with your name on them.

All fine until you upset the wrong person and

[yuiop]

7 hours ago, a977 said:

As the money is supposed to be seasoned for 2-3 months and the agency only puts it in your account for 1 day, there could be problems if Immigration investigate you. 

 

there's no law requiring this, as far as I know it's a Police order, not a law, that's why the agencies can operate it, they're actually breaking any laws. It's a grey area, anyway.

[yuiop]

45 minutes ago, JOC said:

Can't understand how the subject is even allowed on a public forum...

Because it isn't something illegal.

[Jingthing]

I'll add something else.

I've been following the rules religiously for several years and would never consider using such an agency unless totally desperate.

But I don't have hostility towards those that use the agency scheme which is obviously easier to do even though there is that extra large fee.

The reason is that I don't lose any sleep about how I did it.

Most of the agency clients might not being be losing any sleep either, but that's them  ... I would.

So for me that's easier. 

There hasn't been a crackdown on this scheme but that doesn't predict whether there ever will be one either way. 

I won't get any pleasure if there is and I understand that so many people do use the agencies and don't feel it is very high risk.

I imagine some of them don't even realize what they're doing. The agency takes care of it ... better not to think about the details. 

Edited April 3, 2018 by Jingthing

[onera1961]

So they put the money (800K) in your account for a day and then withdraw it the next day after you get the extension? But the extension stamps etc. are all genuine and entered into immigration system? This agents must have some kind of license, I guess to operate a business.

[overherebc]

6 minutes ago, onera1961 said:

So they put the money (800K) in your account for a day and then withdraw it the next day after you get the extension? But the extension stamps etc. are all genuine and entered into immigration system? This agents must have some kind of license, I guess to operate a business.

licence to collect money I reckon.

[Just Weird]

4 hours ago, JOC said:

Can't understand how the subject is even allowed on a public forum...

Yes, it would be interesting if a mod or admin could clarify the discussion of illegal activities.

[jackdd]

7 minutes ago, Just Weird said:

Yes, it would be interesting if a mod or admin could clarify the discussion of illegal activities.

Maybe an IO simply has discretion regarding the "seasoned for 2 months" rule and thus this is not illegal?

[Peterw42]

29 minutes ago, jackdd said:

Maybe an IO simply has discretion regarding the "seasoned for 2 months" rule and thus this is not illegal?

Yes, thats right, all the immigration law is discretionary, its not done in some back alley by a rouge officer, its done at the immigration office with the full knowledge of the office. I used an agent a couple of years ago after I forgot to put the 800k in the bank ontime. I run into the agent at the office sometimes and he isnt hiding and passing brown envelopes, he is upstairs having a coffee with the boss of immigration while his assistant sits at the extension desk and hands over 6-8 applications. If you ask at immigration, they consider it a "pay for extra service"and I have seen them advise to go to an agent.

The elite visa's are paying extra and skipping a lot of the regular process.

Edited April 3, 2018 by Peterw42

[JOC]

18 minutes ago, jackdd said:

Maybe an IO simply has discretion regarding the "seasoned for 2 months" rule and thus this is not illegal?

Doubt it very much...

I can post hundreds of links to sites all saying the money has to be seasoned......Some of those sites are official Thai Immigration websites..

The  "discretion" of the officer depends on the money he is paid to facilitate the fraud...!!

Have any of you ever heard of a person, who actually had the money needed, and deposited them in the bank the day before applying for an extension, and actually got the extension.....No I thought so...

Just last week a friend of mine was refused, because the money in his account dipped below 800k 10 weeks prior to his extension (Was okay at the day of the extension) He have been here 15 years and never had any problems before....He had to start all over again.

What the agencies do is illegal.....If you want to use them to circumvent the law...Up to you.....But there may be a price to pay down the line....!!

[Jingthing]

Yes, it would be interesting if a mod or admin could clarify the discussion of illegal activities.

Because it's not technically illegal. Maybe should be but isn't.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Wang Lalker]

there have been cases where ppl have lived happily for years doing visa runs and spending time outside the country, all the while having an amiable relation with immigration, then they switch to legit retirement visa and shit hits the fan at every required and non required visit to any immigration point. this shit continues even after they go back to their previous visa run mode
up to you.

you want to add a  semi legit retirement visa into that shit mix, you gotta be crazy

Edited April 3, 2018 by Wang Lalker

[Jingthing]

there have been cases where ppl have lived happily for years doing visa runs and spending time outside the country, all the while having an amiable relation with immigration, then they switch to legit retirement visa and shit hits the fan at every required and non required visit to any immigration point. this shit continues even after they go back to their previous visa run mode
up to you.
you want to add a  semi legit retirement visa into that shit mix, you gotta be crazy

Then a lot of people are happily crazy then. I'm not promoting it. Just what I see. I objectively think it's mostly safe even though I would avoid doing it myself.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[JOC]

4 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Because it's not technically illegal. Maybe should be but isn't.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

Nonsense...!!

Please provide a link to an immigration website saying that the money don't have to be seasoned.......Of course it is illegal...Anyone saying something else are just fooling themselves (and their bar stool mates)

[JOC]

25 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

The elite visa's are paying extra and skipping a lot of the regular process.

Seriously.....Comparing owners of Thai Elite Card with people, who can not meet the financial requirements and have to bribe corrupt officers to stay in the country.....Not really the same thing.....

[jackdd]

6 minutes ago, JOC said:

I can post hundreds of links to sites all saying the money has to be seasoned......Some of those sites are official Thai Immigration websites..

The  "discretion" of the officer depends on the money he is paid to facilitate the fraud...!!

Have any of you ever heard of a person, who actually had the money needed, and deposited them in the bank the day before applying for an extension, and actually got the extension.....No I thought so...

You don't have to post links to hundred of sites... all you have to is to tell us the name and the paragraph in the Thai law or the id of a ministerial order which says that seasoned funds are a mandatory requirement. I doubt this exists, and so it's up to the discretion of the IO.

(And even if a law exists the immigration offices still do what they want, just look on the TM30 handling in Phuket, what they are doing is against the law, but they don't care)

I've never heard of somebody doing this, but i'm quite sure that if my GF were working at the immigration police office handling Visa stuff i would get all extensions that i wanted without ever providing any documents.

[wgdanson]

5 hours ago, yuiop said:

they're actually breaking any laws

Did you miss out NOT?

[Peterw42]

12 minutes ago, Wang Lalker said:

there have been cases where ppl have lived happily for years doing visa runs and spending time outside the country, all the while having an amiable relation with immigration, then they switch to legit retirement visa and shit hits the fan at every required and non required visit to any immigration point. this shit continues even after they go back to there previous visa run mode
up to you.

you want to add a  semi legit retirement visa into that shit mix, you gotta be crazy

If you are doing Visa runs etc, you dont have any relationship with the local immigration office as you dont go there, even for 90 day reports.

[jackdd]

1 minute ago, Peterw42 said:

If you are doing Visa runs etc, you dont have any relationship with the local immigration office as you dont go there, even for 90 day reports.

Visa extensions and certificate of residence

[Jingthing]

Nonsense...!!

Please provide a link to an immigration website saying that the money don't have to be seasoned.......Of course it is illegal...Anyone saying something else are just fooling themselves (and their bar stool mates)

It is not nonsense. It's a legal grey area. A loophole if you prefer. The applications are presented with seasoned funds. The applicants didn't season it but it's still seasoned. The law does not explicitly prohibit that. Call it cheating and corruption if you like too. People are still doing it in droves without consequences. Might as well face that.

 

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

 

 

[chrisinth]

Its actually worse if people make a sworn statement at their embassies/consulates about their income using this as a base for extension.

 

Not that any 'expat' would ever do that........................

 

Using an agency, IMO if you need to, is a much safer bet.

[JOC]

2.18(6) Police Order 327/2557     states...

For the retirement extension, there is no room for doubt. The English translation of clause 2.22(4) reads "On the filing date, the applicant must have funds deposited in a bank in Thailand of no less than Baht 800,000 for the past three months"

[Jingthing]

2.18(6) Police Order 327/2557     states...
For the retirement extension, there is no room for doubt. The English translation of clause 2.22(4) reads "On the filing date, the applicant must have funds deposited in a bank in Thailand of no less than Baht 800,000 for the past three months"

Like I said the application shows the seasoning and technically meets the requirements. It's not rocket science.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app