Expat health insurance

[Justcruising54]

Hi, I currently have travel insurance with my health insurer in Australia, but believe it would be better to be covered here. I have the Non O retirement extension, I have seen numerous adverts for expat health, can anyone advise which one would be the best, and why. I am in good health at present. Thanks.

 

 

 

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[sqwakvfr]

That is a very broad question.  To start with:

 

1.  How much coverage do you want?  1 Million Baht? 3 Million Baht?

2.  How much do you want to pay in Insurance Premiums?

 

One can go the bare bones route of Health Insurance and purchase some the policies offered by Bangkok Life or go higher end with a company like Aetna(they bought BUPA). 

[Sheryl]

1. How old are you? (Different companies have different cut offs for issuing new policies)

 

2. Do you plan to live permanently in Thailand, i.e. will you grow old here? (Big issue - some policies automatically stop at a certain age, some guarantee for life but will price you out if you develop a chronic disease, etc).

[Justcruising54]

1. How old are you? (Different companies have different cut offs for issuing new policies)
 
2. Do you plan to live permanently in Thailand, i.e. will you grow old here? (Big issue - some policies automatically stop at a certain age, some guarantee for life but will price you out if you develop a chronic disease, etc).

Thanks posters, I forgot to mention, am aged 64
and I tend to live here with sporadic trips back to Australia,


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[Sheryl]

64 years already reduces your options.

 

I would suggest;

 

1. Luma (Thai based but does nto increase premiums based on claim history ir heath, or so they say)

 

2. Cigna Global- UK based expat policy. the least expensive international policy but their administrative procedures tend to be weak and often  necessary to call them to get any sort of prompt attention (i.e. when you need pre-authorization or to follow up on processing of a claim - it is nto an attempt to avoid paying on their part,   just some inefficiency

 

3. AXA PPP plan https://www.axapppinternational.com/en/personal/expat-health-insurance/whats-covered/

 

All of these have direct pay arrangements with Thai hospitals and will issue a new policy at your age. Most or all of them offer options with deductibles which will reduce premiums.

 

You might like to consider working through an Insurance Broker. This does nto cost you anything, either in fee or in policy premium, and the broker can put together comparison tables tailored to your needs. perhaohttps://www.axapppinternational.com/en/personal/expat-health-insurance/whats-covered/

 

You should ocnsider working with an Insurance Broker. It will ntoi cost you anything, either in fees or in policy premium, and broker can put together simple comparison tables for you to help in selection. Perhaps most important, a good broker will help you later in dealings with the insurer if needed. I got my own policy on my own and have had occasion to wish I had not, as it would have been useful to have been able to call on a broker to help expedite getting a response to request for pre-authorization.

 

However  broker services do nto remove the need for your own due diligence. Once you have narrowed down your choice it is essential that you yourself read through the policy conditions.  I am always astounded by how many people have health insurance policies  which they have never even read.

[scubascuba3]

64 years already reduces your options.
 
I would suggest;
 
1. Luma (Thai based but does nto increase premiums based on claim history ir heath, or so they say)
 
2. Cigna Global- UK based expat policy. the least expensive international policy but their administrative procedures tend to be weak and often  necessary to call them to get any sort of prompt attention (i.e. when you need pre-authorization or to follow up on processing of a claim - it is nto an attempt to avoid paying on their part,   just some inefficiency
 
3. AXA PPP plan https://www.axapppinternational.com/en/personal/expat-health-insurance/whats-covered/
 
All of these have direct pay arrangements with Thai hospitals and will issue a new policy at your age. Most or all of them offer options with deductibles which will reduce premiums.
 
You might like to consider working through an Insurance Broker. This does nto cost you anything, either in fee or in policy premium, and the broker can put together comparison tables tailored to your needs. perhaohttps://www.axapppinternational.com/en/personal/expat-health-insurance/whats-covered/
 
You should ocnsider working with an Insurance Broker. It will ntoi cost you anything, either in fees or in policy premium, and broker can put together simple comparison tables for you to help in selection. Perhaps most important, a good broker will help you later in dealings with the insurer if needed. I got my own policy on my own and have had occasion to wish I had not, as it would have been useful to have been able to call on a broker to help expedite getting a response to request for pre-authorization.
 
However  broker services do nto remove the need for your own due diligence. Once you have narrowed down your choice it is essential that you yourself read through the policy conditions.  I am always astounded by how many people have health insurance policies  which they have never even read.

Is Luma a well known established big company? I've not heard of it.

[Sheryl]

5 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

Is Luma a well known established big company? I've not heard of it.

Yes - it was until recently called MSH.  Same company, new name

[ding]

I was hoping Thai medical insurance didn't increase rates if you actually use it. :sad face:

There's a site that lists different medical insurance companies' rates and levels of coverage so you can shop. I just got a new iMac and my Thai bookmarks didn't migrate over and I can't find it for you - sorry.

I guess it's better than how it was in the US - they'd not let you buy insurance if you had issues.

Edited April 9, 2018 by ding
lost link

[bluewavesam]

Yes Cigna is quite good. I have it. Not a retiree but most of my friends who are on retirement in the LOS prefer Cigna. 
 

Edited April 9, 2018 by bluewavesam

[HampiK]

5 hours ago, bluewavesam said:

Yes Cigna is quite good. I have it. Not a retiree but most of my friends who are on retirement in the LOS prefer Cigna. 
 

But now you also have to take care, because Cigna start to open Cigna Thailand offers. I don't know yet if they are good as the Cigna Global or they have a different approach because they can….

[Sheryl]

Cigna will not raise rates based on claim history, neither will Luma (MSH) or AXA. Basiclaly EU-based insurers cannot do this. Luma/MSH, though Thailand-based, states that they do not as well. However many Thailand based insurers do and it is critical to ferret that out before committing to a policy.

 

Cigna's rates are competitive relative to other international insurers (i.e. lower) but that may be due to lower administrative costs and that in turn affects the efficiency of same (high turnover, less experienced staff) so be prepared to have to invest in international calls and follow up on your part to get things processed.

[Sheryl]

1 minute ago, HampiK said:

But now you also have to take care, because Cigna start to open Cigna Thailand offers. I don't know yet if they are good as the Cigna Global or they have a different approach because they can….

The Thailand Cigna office does not currently involve in any capacity with their Expat policies. The Expat policies are issued out of the UK and the Thai office does not even help administer them. I know, because I have Cigna and recently went through the process of trying to get pre-authorization for a minor day surgical procedure.

 

The Thai office website and telephone menu are exclusively in Thai language and they have no role in processing claims or requests for pre-authorization for expat policies.

 

Whether this will later change, I do not know.

 

 

[scubascuba3]

Cigna will not raise rates based on claim history, neither will Luma (MSH) or AXA. Basiclaly EU-based insurers cannot do this. Luma/MSH, though Thailand-based, states that they do not as well. However many Thailand based insurers do and it is critical to ferret that out before committing to a policy.
 
Cigna's rates are competitive relative to other international insurers (i.e. lower) but that may be due to lower administrative costs and that in turn affects the efficiency of same (high turnover, less experienced staff) so be prepared to have to invest in international calls and follow up on your part to get things processed.

Does Cigna and the others increase premiums every year due to age?

[simon43]

Does Cigna and the others increase premiums every year due to age?

That's a bit like asking if bears sh*t in the woods... :)

There are 2 rate increases that are applied:

- The age band increase, where by your premium will increase as you enter a new age band, such as moving from 55-60, to 61-65 years old. That premium increase is basically down to the increased risk of claims as you (meaning everyone in that age band) gets older.

- An annual increase applied to everyone which takes into account inflation, additional costs etc etc (basically anything they can think of to justify a premium increase).

That annual premium increase should not be large - the age band increase could be.

But as Sheryl mentioned, these increases are applied 'across the board' with UK/European insurers, because they are not allowed to apply an individual increase if you've made a claim. (Sheryl will correct my statements if I've said something incorrect).

I have an HCI (Healthcare International) policy, which is a UK-managed policy. Their 'Emergency+' policy provides $500,000 cover and international evacuation cover, with a compulsory excess of $2,000 (that excess reduces the annual premium to IMHO a competitive amount - I pay about $900 USD per year at age 58.

[Sheryl]

All insurers increase rates with age, they have to because the likelihood of payout increases with age.

 

Some do this annually and some do it in 5 year bands. The  5 year band increases can be very substantial - it will be at elasta s much as the 5 year total of annual increases would have been.

 

In addition, insurance companies may periodically do across the board rate increases to reflect rising costs of medical care, if for example their average pay out per claim has become significantly higher.

 

there is no avoiding either of these things (and there are solid. practical reasons why all insurance companies have to do them).

 

What you can guard against, is the practice of raising an individual policyholder's rate based on their claims history or change in their state of health. Most but not all Thai based insurers do this as the regulatory environment (which is weak regarding health insurance here) allows them to.

[4MyEgo]

On 4/10/2018 at 2:54 PM, simon43 said:

 

 

That's a bit like asking if bears sh*t in the woods... :)

There are 2 rate increases that are applied:

- The age band increase, where by your premium will increase as you enter a new age band, such as moving from 55-60, to 61-65 years old. That premium increase is basically down to the increased risk of claims as you (meaning everyone in that age band) gets older.

- An annual increase applied to everyone which takes into account inflation, additional costs etc etc (basically anything they can think of to justify a premium increase).

That annual premium increase should not be large - the age band increase could be.

But as Sheryl mentioned, these increases are applied 'across the board' with UK/European insurers, because they are not allowed to apply an individual increase if you've made a claim. (Sheryl will correct my statements if I've said something incorrect).

I have an HCI (Healthcare International) policy, which is a UK-managed policy. Their 'Emergency+' policy provides $500,000 cover and international evacuation cover, with a compulsory excess of $2,000 (that excess reduces the annual premium to IMHO a competitive amount - I pay about $900 USD per year at age 58.

 

I just had a look at your policy as the annual price you pay, considering we are of the same age, interests me, i.e. having been quoted by another insurer $4,350 USD

 

The cover looks standard, but $500,000 is a reasonable figure for the annual fee payable and what they offer, but excludes Elective Home Country Treatment, although Emergency Medical Evacuation and Medical Repatriation are covered as you say, so as long as you don't want to have Elective Home Country Treatment, sounds like good value.

 

I will look into this, thanks for the heads up

[thaibeachlovers]

My Thai insurance was good, but wouldn't allow me to join after 65. I joined at 64, and they kept me on it, but increased price year on year. Over 60,000 baht last time I paid.

[altcar bob]

Q has to asked how long are you going to live?  Put this on before,as aging individual the coverage is a one shot pony...cancer,heart forget it...body clock speeds up,likewise rapidly falling ill with something else,  death not far off,...see if insurance covers the bits that are left,as far as Cigna they did double the premiums from 60 to 100 gbp per week for 57 ish aged man.......accident I guess,(broken leg) can be fixed,but can at govt.hospital too...bottom line its time to go back home if illness stalks you,but do it before flying becomes impossible

Edited April 17, 2018 by altcar bob