British man beats wife to death in Ubon Ratchathani

[bert bloggs]

2 hours ago, Johnniey said:

Not at all, they(sexpats, mafia, hell's angels, general criminals, drug dealers, alcohol abusers) are concentrated in one specific city. The rest of Thailand is a lovely place. 

 

 

you mean they are in Bangkok?

Edited April 18, 2018 by bert bloggs

[Sumarianson]

Now what happens to those children, no mother and no father and a bad legacy to live with. It's the children that suffer most for the thoughtlesness of an enraged selfish man. 

RIP

[soalbundy]

5 minutes ago, robblok said:

Lot of empathy for the guy, i feel more for the woman he killed with his bare hands.. the fear she must have gone through.. her last moments.. horrible.. 3 kids no longer a mother.. 

 

I am not disputing that but these things sometimes happen and when they do that person and especially this man I think, are no longer in control, he obviously isn't a calculating murderer who tried to hide his deed. His wife has lost her life and indeed one could say so has he and his children have lost their parents, a switch was flicked and he couldn't deal with it, what led up to this we don't know.

[robblok]

Just now, soalbundy said:

I am not disputing that but these things sometimes happen and when they do that person and especially this man I think, are no longer in control, he obviously isn't a calculating murderer who tried to hide his deed. His wife has lost her life and indeed one could say so has he and his children have lost their parents, a switch was flicked and he couldn't deal with it, what led up to this we don't know.

I agree, certainly no calculating murderer.  Still i see no reason to go soft on him. (I don't mean he has to be charged with murder). Just feel he should be punished for the killing.

[robblok]

4 minutes ago, Johnniey said:

Are you disputing the fact that alcoholism is a disease? 

Are you disputing that alcies should seek help, especially if they are violent alcies ? 

 

A violent alcoholist repeat offender should be punished harder. Thankfully they do that if he is a repeat offender. They don't go with your soft.. he could not help himself excuse. (as i said only exception is when someone is under treatment and falls off the wagon.. that can happen.. not guys who seek no treatment)

Edited April 18, 2018 by robblok

[soalbundy]

1 minute ago, robblok said:

I agree, certainly no calculating murderer.  Still i see no reason to go soft on him. (I don't mean he has to be charged with murder). Just feel he should be punished for the killing.

He undoubtedly will be but his biggest punisher will probably be himself.

[Eloquent pilgrim]

1 hour ago, soalbundy said:

A lot of moral outrage in the air lately, a tragedy has occurred, things happen for a reason however obscure they may seem. They had 3 children together so this was obviously what one could call a serious marriage with commitment. Everyone has a breaking point and for some reason, which we don't know, his was reached, helped no doubt by alcohol. It wasn't premeditated otherwise he would have tried to conceal the body, he seemingly wanted to be caught. I believe that he didn't want to kill her, in his rage he was on a roll, he was out of control. It is something that he and his children will have to live with for the rest of their lives. It is easy to judge from an armchair, save your moral outrage for your own deeds which although haven't 'yet' attained manslaughter status, won't look good in the light of day.

Not sure why you are surprised by the outrage; kicking and beating someone in such a violent manner that you kill them, whether or not  it was your intention to kill, is beyond the moral compass of most normal people.

 

You say that “everyone has a breaking point” well, I suggest that very few people have a breaking point, that, if reached, would cause them to beat someone to death.

 

You, however, seem to think there is something more intrinsically wrong with people being morally outraged by this violent crime, than the crime itself; and as for suggesting that other people's deeds haven’t ‘yet’ attained manslaughter status …… what ??

[mauGR1]

9 minutes ago, Happy enough said:

those organizations apart from the WHO are all yank organisations, are there any british ones you can name to give to give it some credibility ; )

well, as much as i love the doctors, one has to admit that they have a vested interest in calling alcoholism a disease.

in the same way sheer brutality can be called mental illness, and so on.

in the case of mental illness, i guess it's impossible to have a final word, still, it's good material for a debate.

[Johnniey]

4 minutes ago, robblok said:

I think you should grow up.. 

 

Your the one suggesting alcoholics should get less punishment if they commit a crime while drunk. Like if this lovely guy was an alcoholic he should get less punishment because he could not help it. It was the alcohol that made him do it 

 

If your a repeat offender your punishment should always go up because you did not learn from the first punishment (unless you seek help)

I think they should get the same, but certainly not more, like you said.

 

In most countries, one's mental condition is taken into account when a judge sentences them.

 

The guy maybe wasn't an alkie, maybe just a heavy drinker(though you might not know the difference). 

 

 

 

 

[robblok]

9 minutes ago, Johnniey said:

I think they should get the same, but certainly not more, like you said.

 

In most countries, one's mental condition is taken into account when a judge sentences them.

 

The guy maybe wasn't an alkie, maybe just a heavy drinker(though you might not know the difference). 

 

 

I think they should get more IF they are repeat offenders. My point is if its known your violent and you don't seek its an extra risk you pose to others. Its your duty to seek help if you don't then yes I feel more punishment is needed because you put your own needs above those of others.

 

In most countries repeat offenders are punished harsher, so if someone is known to be a violent alcoholic from previous actions that is seen as something to increase punishment. 

 

I don't really care if the guy is an alcoholic or heavy drinker.. if he was known to be violent on alcohol that should be taken into account, instead of an excuse. 

 

Personally I am all for drinking and using drugs whatever people want as long as they don't bother others. 

 

In my time I seen violent drunks and those people always got violent when drinking... They knew it but they still got drunk and got into fights hurting others. If you know about it and you don't do anything to change it then yes someone like that should be punished harsher then someone who gets in a one time off fight. (repeat offender theory)

 

*edit* 

 

So I don't mean an alcoholic with a first offence should get punished extra... but if he had bouts of aggression before caused by alcohol and he did not seek help and kept on drinking ending up in fights he should be punished extra.. just like someone who is not an alcoholic and gets into fights all the time. 

Edited April 18, 2018 by robblok

[metisdead]

Posts containing oversize and insulting emojis have been removed as the use of such emojis/emoticons don't offer anything of value to the discussion.  

 

Other off topic posts and replies about alcoholism and fighting alcoholism have been removed.  You can discuss that issue in the I drink too much Forum.

 

 

[soalbundy]

2 hours ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

Not sure why you are surprised by the outrage; kicking and beating someone in such a violent manner that you kill them, whether or not  it was your intention to kill, is beyond the moral compass of most normal people.

 

You say that “everyone has a breaking point” well, I suggest that very few people have a breaking point, that, if reached, would cause them to beat someone to death.

 

You, however, seem to think there is something more intrinsically wrong with people being morally outraged by this violent crime, than the crime itself; and as for suggesting that other people's deeds haven’t ‘yet’ attained manslaughter status …… what ??

I am not condoning the man's actions but everybody does have a breaking point, some people are prepared to kill if their car is damaged, see road rage. As for moral outrage, a lot of it is senseless shouting, "hold me back,hold me back, hang him high etc. You don't know what caused this, why he snapped. They obviously did have a harmonious marriage in order to have had 3 children together so I don't think that he was some kind of a monster who wanted this outcome. Yes it happened and yes it was reprehensible but why throw stones, because the sum of your own reprehensible actions in the past haven't resulted in a death, yet, perhaps. 

[meatboy]

5 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

I am not condoning the man's actions but everybody does have a breaking point, some people are prepared to kill if their car is damaged, see road rage. As for moral outrage, a lot of it is senseless shouting, "hold me back,hold me back, hang him high etc. You don't know what caused this, why he snapped. They obviously did have a harmonious marriage in order to have had 3 children together so I don't think that he was some kind of a monster who wanted this outcome. Yes it happened and yes it was reprehensible but why throw stones, because the sum of your own reprehensible actions in the past haven't resulted in a death, yet, perhaps. 

yes SB something snapped big time,we all know that thai 's have a melting pot,and cant empty it,they are always right never wrong.untill we get the full story we have a murdered mother of three children,and a father who sadly might never see them again.to do what he did he must have been pushed to the point of no return.as we all now to spend one day in a thai prison is definately one too many never mind the rest of your life.being involved here for over 35yrs. I cant condem him yet.but can guess whats goner come.

just an after thought think back to the people who have been killed and the perpetrator's that have never spent a minute behind bars.

[nausea]

Move on. Fifty-one, hardly an old man. How many guys are there with broken marriages and kids floating in the background? 

[Eloquent pilgrim]

39 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

I am not condoning the man's actions but everybody does have a breaking point, some people are prepared to kill if their car is damaged, see road rage. As for moral outrage, a lot of it is senseless shouting, "hold me back,hold me back, hang him high etc. You don't know what caused this, why he snapped. They obviously did have a harmonious marriage in order to have had 3 children together so I don't think that he was some kind of a monster who wanted this outcome. Yes it happened and yes it was reprehensible but why throw stones, because the sum of your own reprehensible actions in the past haven't resulted in a death, yet, perhaps. 

You are not condoning the man’s actions, but neither do you condemn them; you merely find them reprehensible, ie, to be of blame, criticism or rebuke.

Not everyone has a breaking point, maybe you have one, but you don't have the right to say that everyone does, and even those that do, don't need to beat someone to death if they reach that point.

 

“You don't know what caused this, why he snapped” ….. do you mean I don't know what his excuse is for beating his wife to death ?? ….. correct I don't know if it was refusal of sex, alleged affair, not cooking him fish and chips, or whatever else can make a human being beat another one to death. I do know one thing for sure, there is no valid excuse for it whatsoever; but you keep being his apologist if you must.

 

In the meantime, maybe you can recalibrate your own moral compass before you accuse me of any past reprehensible actions, when you know nothing about me

[Eloquent pilgrim]

8 minutes ago, nausea said:

Move on. Fifty-one, hardly an old man. How many guys are there with broken marriages and kids floating in the background? 

Do you mean, how many guys are there with dead wives, that they themselves have killed, and kids floating in the background ??

[soalbundy]

1 minute ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

You are not condoning the man’s actions, but neither do you condemn them; you merely find them reprehensible, ie, to be of blame, criticism or rebuke.

Not everyone has a breaking point, maybe you have one, but you don't have the right to say that everyone does, and even those that do, don't need to beat someone to death if they reach that point.

 

“You don't know what caused this, why he snapped” ….. do you mean I don't know what his excuse is for beating his wife to death ?? ….. correct I don't know if it was refusal of sex, alleged affair, not cooking him fish and chips, or whatever else can make a human being beat another one to death. I do know one thing for sure, there is no valid excuse for it whatsoever; but you keep being his apologist if you must.

 

In the meantime, maybe you can recalibrate your own moral compass before you accuse me of any past reprehensible actions, when you know nothing about me

You are not Jesus Christ and apparently even he didn't throw stones. You won't agree with me but none of us are in control of our lives, events happen, the source of these events are unknown, a butterfly flapping its wings in Hong Kong contributing to a hurricane in New York, that isn't factual but it illustrates what I mean. If a man hadn't been delayed for a few seconds because he dropped his car keys while leaving the house he wouldn't have had the accident. Causality is the key here, we don't know what happened and I rather suspect even he doesn't know why, his action obviously wasn't typical of him, I say that without knowing but he was a family man and they had been together for some time, this wasn't some nasty psychopath with a hooker. 

[Media1]

22 hours ago, mauGR1 said:

Pls, stop digging..

All my best friends in Thailand are from UK, all of them good guys, still, i never thought that all people from UK are good people.

Cool l will stop Just for you

[Eloquent pilgrim]

44 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

You are not Jesus Christ and apparently even he didn't throw stones. You won't agree with me but none of us are in control of our lives, events happen, the source of these events are unknown, a butterfly flapping its wings in Hong Kong contributing to a hurricane in New York, that isn't factual but it illustrates what I mean. If a man hadn't been delayed for a few seconds because he dropped his car keys while leaving the house he wouldn't have had the accident. Causality is the key here, we don't know what happened and I rather suspect even he doesn't know why, his action obviously wasn't typical of him, I say that without knowing but he was a family man and they had been together for some time, this wasn't some nasty psychopath with a hooker. 

What on earth are you talking about “a butterfly flaps its wings in Hong Kong” ….. “a man drops his car keys”  “none of us are in control of our lives” …… well, some of us are !!

 

“we don't know what happened”

 

….. er, yes we do; a man beat and kicked his wife to death, dragged her limp body out of the house, covered her with a blanket and went to sleep, leaving her dead body to be found by somebody else. Meanwhile, all you keep doing is offering excuses for his appalling act of violence, as if he wasn't responsible at 51 years of age for his own actions …… even now resorting to existentialist theories.

[soalbundy]

3 minutes ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

What on earth are you talking about “a butterfly flaps its wings in Hong Kong” ….. “a man drops his car keys”  “none of us are in control of our lives” …… well, some of us are !!

 

“we don't know what happened”

 

….. er, yes we do; a man beat and kicked his wife to death, dragged her limp body out of the house, covered her with a blanket and went to sleep, leaving her dead body to be found by somebody else. Meanwhile, all you keep doing is offering excuses for his appalling act of violence, as if he wasn't responsible at 51 years of age for his own actions …… even now resorting to existentialist theories.

I don't have to offer any excuses, like you, I am not involved, it is pointless getting all emotional, I disagree with you, I presume you aren't going to knife me because of that, and no you don't have control although you may, even on your deathbed, say you have.

[sanemax]

4 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

I don't have to offer any excuses, like you, I am not involved, it is pointless getting all emotional, I disagree with you, I presume you aren't going to knife me because of that, and no you don't have control although you may, even on your deathbed, say you have.

Although everyone is physically capable of doing the same as the murderer and some may sometimes feel doing likewise , most people would not do what he did 

[soalbundy]

5 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Although everyone is physically capable of doing the same as the murderer and some may sometimes feel doing likewise , most people would not do what he did 

Given the right circumstances a killer lurks in us all, wars aren't caused by pacifists, you need someone to give the sheeply the right motivation.

[Eloquent pilgrim]

22 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

Given the right circumstances a killer lurks in us all, wars aren't caused by pacifists, you need someone to give the sheeply the right motivation.

 ............. "a killer lurks in us all" ............... I think you may have finally gone right off the rails 

[sanemax]

19 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

Given the right circumstances a killer lurks in us all, wars aren't caused by pacifists, you need someone to give the sheeply the right motivation.

Probably so, if you were in a life or death situation yourself .

But most people wouldnt kill their wives , the mother of their Children, for any reason

[catman20]

23 hours ago, Kadilo said:

Exactly. Life’s too short to worry about <deleted> like that. 

spot on mate.

[nausea]

3 hours ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

Do you mean, how many guys are there with dead wives, that they themselves have killed, and kids floating in the background ??

No, I mean how many guys have been in this situation and don't beat their wives to death, although they may feel like doing so. "Move on" is advice. At 51 there's at least one more life to live.

[soalbundy]

1 hour ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

 ............. "a killer lurks in us all" ............... I think you may have finally gone right off the rails 

you have a right to your opinion. what would you do if you saw someone had just murdered your child and you had access to a knife or a gun ? I would kill, I couldn't save my child but rage would take over. Ordinary people kill in war, quite cold bloodily, they have no personal dispute with an enemy a 100 meters away but they would pull the trigger. With some you would only need to press one button to cause a killing rage, with others maybe 10, but push enough buttons and an ordinary peace loving person can become a killer.

I have a friend in Germany who had been studying for many years,he was almost through his masters degree when his girlfriend with whom he had lived with for 5 years told him she was leaving him for another man, he was heartbroken but they were able to talk things through, however she pushed the wrong button when she told him that the affair had been ongoing for two years, he flipped out and beat her up so badly she had to go to hospital. of course it went to court, he was normally a gentleman, I had never ever known him any other way, he was fined heavily and had to pay his girlfriend recompense (which she gave back to him) who stood up for him in court. He is what one would call a liberal tree hugger, she pressed the wrong button.

He also thought he was in control of his life but he wasn't in control when she by chance met someone else and he wasn't in control of himself when he flipped out. If you are in control you would always be happy, never know disappointment,never have an accident, never want for money, you wouldn't even have a tooth ache, but we aren't.

[AdamTheFarang]

On 4/16/2018 at 3:32 PM, RoyDee said:

Why does LOS attract some many English scum? I blame Brexit.

So sad and you make a joke about it. 

Edited April 18, 2018 by AdamTheFarang

[Eloquent pilgrim]

2 hours ago, soalbundy said:

you have a right to your opinion. what would you do if you saw someone had just murdered your child and you had access to a knife or a gun ? I would kill, I couldn't save my child but rage would take over. Ordinary people kill in war, quite cold bloodily, they have no personal dispute with an enemy a 100 meters away but they would pull the trigger. With some you would only need to press one button to cause a killing rage, with others maybe 10, but push enough buttons and an ordinary peace loving person can become a killer.

I have a friend in Germany who had been studying for many years,he was almost through his masters degree when his girlfriend with whom he had lived with for 5 years told him she was leaving him for another man, he was heartbroken but they were able to talk things through, however she pushed the wrong button when she told him that the affair had been ongoing for two years, he flipped out and beat her up so badly she had to go to hospital. of course it went to court, he was normally a gentleman, I had never ever known him any other way, he was fined heavily and had to pay his girlfriend recompense (which she gave back to him) who stood up for him in court. He is what one would call a liberal tree hugger, she pressed the wrong button.

He also thought he was in control of his life but he wasn't in control when she by chance met someone else and he wasn't in control of himself when he flipped out. If you are in control you would always be happy, never know disappointment,never have an accident, never want for money, you wouldn't even have a tooth ache, but we aren't.

I think it's time you put the shovel down

 

Your crusade to proffer logical or sympathetic excuses for this man’s brutality have now become truly witless

 

To juxtapose people killing in a war zone or someone witnessing their child being murdered, with this man’s savage beating to death of the mother of his three children is quite bizarre.

 

You seem happy to blame anyone and anything that can somehow diminish his responsibility for this savage and violent act. He alone is responsible for killing her and all your pseudo philosophising about people not having control over their own actions is crass, cheap and irresponsible.

[richard_smith237]

4 hours ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

4 hours ago, soalbundy said:

Given the right circumstances a killer lurks in us all, wars aren't caused by pacifists, you need someone to give the sheeply the right motivation.

 ............. "a killer lurks in us all" ............... I think you may have finally gone right off the rails

 

Not really... the quoted caveat is 'Given the right circumstances'.....  not for revenge or anger perhaps, but to protect one's family from an imminent and grave threat our resources and actions know no bounds.... 

 

However, the subject of this thread does not involve threat or any other situation in which a person fit for society would react to physically... 

Edited April 18, 2018 by richard_smith237