For people not married to a Thai and have a Usufruct or Superficies

[zeekgarcia]

For people that are not married to a Thai and have a Usufruct or Superficies: Did you make an official payment to the Thai person giving you the Usufruct or Superficies or do you pay them monthly or _____________ ?

 

Or another words in Usufruct or Superficies or any other documents is there any mention of you paying the Thai person any money?

[BEVUP]

Have Usufrut on my wifes EX property ( new owner )

Didn't have to pay any money just paid the Lawyers when we were all at the land department 

3 Copies

Land Office

Wife

Me 

[oobar]

I hold the right of superficies on two rai of land in a 30/60 year lease and on which I have constructed a house.  Everything is spelled out in the contract, including my ownership of the house and the right to pass it and the lease to my heirs.   A single payment listed in the lease agreement determines the (small) filing fee charged by the land department. 

[sead]

Waste of time. All family is going to move inside in case of divorce and you dont want to be there then. Sorry little offtopic. If someone wants you out then you gonna go out for sure. There aint many successful storys.

[topt]

59 minutes ago, sead said:

All family is going to move inside in case of divorce

Suggest you read the OP again -

6 hours ago, zeekgarcia said:

For people that are not married to a Thai and have a Usufruct or Superficies

and there have been many "stories" in previous threads of posters who have usufructs and have yet to have the issue you mention.

 

To answer the Ops question - no payment. 

[Golden Triangle]

6 hours ago, sead said:

Waste of time. All family is going to move inside in case of divorce and you dont want to be there then. Sorry little offtopic. If someone wants you out then you gonna go out for sure. There aint many successful storys.

Got your fingers burnt did you ? 

[cheeryble]

8 hours ago, oobar said:

I hold the right of superficies on two rai of land in a 30/60 year lease and on which I have constructed a house.  Everything is spelled out in the contract, including my ownership of the house and the right to pass it and the lease to my heirs.   A single payment listed in the lease agreement determines the (small) filing fee charged by the land department. 

Hi Oobar

 

Wondering why you have superficies.....a right of access.....when you have real rights with your lease.

Is it as belt and braces as the lease might not be recognised after 30 years?

Also wondering about the small charge as aren't leases supposed to be liable to a realistic fee for each year?

I myself am wondering whether to get ownership of a future house..... drawn up but of course I would have to be able to pass to it and have the right to keep it there and use it.

 

Thanks

[timewilltell]

You cannot beat a system designed to fleece foreigners of their money, power and rights. You can live within it with consent but once consent is withdrawn you can no longer. The facts are usually obscured as otherwise the intent (to fleece the foreigner) would not be met. 

[ricklev]

17 hours ago, oobar said:

I hold the right of superficies on two rai of land in a 30/60 year lease and on which I have constructed a house.  Everything is spelled out in the contract, including my ownership of the house and the right to pass it and the lease to my heirs.   A single payment listed in the lease agreement determines the (small) filing fee charged by the land department. 

Should your children inherit the remainder of the lease are you expecting that they have a legal right to  register the second 30 year lease renewal if the land owner refuses?  Or that you have the right to register the second 30 years if the land owner refuses to register it?

Edited May 20, 2018 by ricklev

[oobar]

16 hours ago, cheeryble said:

Hi Oobar

 

Wondering why you have superficies.....a right of access.....when you have real rights with your lease.

Is it as belt and braces as the lease might not be recognised after 30 years?

Also wondering about the small charge as aren't leases supposed to be liable to a realistic fee for each year?

I myself am wondering whether to get ownership of a future house..... drawn up but of course I would have to be able to pass to it and have the right to keep it there and use it.

 

Thanks

Superficies is not just about access.  It allows actual ownership of any construction on or below the ground throughout the duration of the lease, at which time one could (I won't) destroy the structure(s) with impunity -- or sell it to the land owner.  I'll likely be dead before this issue comes up.

 

The charge was essentially what the two rai of land would fetch, if sold, at the market rate when the lease was signed.  This is considered realistic.  Had I been Thai, the owner would have sold me the land outright.

[oobar]

7 hours ago, ricklev said:

Should your children inherit the remainder of the lease are you expecting that they have a legal right to  register the second 30 year lease renewal if the land owner refuses?  Or that you have the right to register the second 30 years if the land owner refuses to register it?

My heirs would have the same rights as I now have, the lease agreement essentially passing into their hands, the right to negotiate a second 30-year lease included.  A difficult landowner, however, could possibly make this a bit knotty if determined to do so, although in my case I do not expect any such problem (keeping in mind the country in which my wife and I, both farang, live).  As the second 30-year period approaches, the leasee(s) would always have leverage, in that as a last resort they could dismantle all structures and sell them for scrap.   Removing a several-million-baht house, depending on location, could be a severe blow to the value of the property overall, maybe enough to encourage the landowner to consider working something out.

[sangtip2]

Timewilltell  is correct  .    If they want you out   you are out .      Fight the system and lose a bunch more money to the lawyers and you will lose double .     You can not win . 

[zeekgarcia]

On 5/19/2018 at 4:49 AM, oobar said:

 

Edited May 25, 2018 by zeekgarcia
saw the answer I was looking for

[zeekgarcia]

On 5/20/2018 at 6:07 AM, oobar said:

My heirs would have the same rights as I now have, the lease agreement essentially passing into their hands, the right to negotiate a second 30-year lease included.  A difficult landowner, however, could possibly make this a bit knotty if determined to do so, although in my case I do not expect any such problem (keeping in mind the country in which my wife and I, both farang, live).  As the second 30-year period approaches, the leasee(s) would always have leverage, in that as a last resort they could dismantle all structures and sell them for scrap.   Removing a several-million-baht house, depending on location, could be a severe blow to the value of the property overall, maybe enough to encourage the landowner to consider working something out.

What jangwat did you register this in?

[zeekgarcia]

On 5/19/2018 at 6:28 AM, topt said:

Suggest you read the OP again -

and there have been many "stories" in previous threads of posters who have usufructs and have yet to have the issue you mention.

 

To answer the Ops question - no payment. 

Do you have a Usufruct or Superficies?   

Which amphere and jangwat was it registered?

Thanks

[topt]

9 hours ago, zeekgarcia said:

Do you have a Usufruct or Superficies?   

Which amphere and jangwat was it registered?

Thanks

Usufruct

Pattaya - but I understand they do not/will not register any more. It was 8 years ago.