Trump tells Kim a 'terrific relationship' beckons as summit begins

[Jingthing]

5 minutes ago, tonbridgebrit said:

...
Trump is actually a man of peace.

Canadians might think differently about that. 

[Morch]

2 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Just to address that point : I simply asked the question about whether the anti-Trump brigade would have a different opinion of the meeting in Singapore, had it been Obama there instead of Trump .

   Would the Obama supporting anti-Trump brigade have poured so much scorn on Obama , had he been there instead of Trump ?

 

Try reading my post again, instead of quoting just one line of it. Already answered your "point". Naturally, you simply deflected the issue about Trump's track record and credibility, and went for the Obama spin.

[sanemax]

3 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

You're simply making stuff up. This did not happen, but may happen. In time.

There was no World War averted, and tensions between some Asian countries (notably, China) didn't go anywhere.

I am not making anything up .

I did say "possible" World war.

Trump had sent the U.S. Navy to the coast of NK with the threat of attacking NK , China had stated that any attack on NK would be an attack on them and they will respond in that manner .

   NK were sending rockets over Japan and also threatening to nuke Hawaii .

May have just been a regional conflict  , but this meeting between the USA/NK bought all the hostilities to an end

[sanemax]

1 minute ago, Morch said:

 

Try reading my post again, instead of quoting just one line of it. Already answered your "point". Naturally, you simply deflected the issue about Trump's track record and credibility, and went for the Obama spin.

I did state that I would address that point first .

I mentioned Obama's supporters and how their would react and asked a question.

We all know the answer to that question .

Obama would be viewed in a positive light .

Which was my point .

People should be judged on their actions , each particular action .

Maybe Trump should have taken Obama along to Singapore , just so that the anti -Trump brigade can give this meeting some praise 

[Jingthing]

It's worth noting that there is wide consensus that Kim did much better than "trump" in this opening gambit of a so called deal. People in the know already get that "trump" is a great negotiator in his mind only and also the people he has conned saying that he is over and over again. Not in reality. 

Arguably, "trump" came into this with the stronger, better hand but still Kim came out ahead. Who's surprised? Not many that have been paying attention to the real "trump" vs. the fantasy cooked up by his propaganda. 

Before people say I'm only about dissing "trump" (he totally deserves it most of the time so no apologies) I've already said it's possible that giving this PR gift to Kim might be just the thing (over time) to actually move things forward. We don't know yet either way. 

Edited June 12, 2018 by Jingthing

[DM07]

“I learned he’s a very talented man and I also learned he loves his country very much.”

Trump about Kim!

Oh deary me!

?

[Morch]

3 minutes ago, sanemax said:

I am not making anything up .

I did say "possible" World war.

Trump had sent the U.S. Navy to the coast of NK with the threat of attacking NK , China had stated that any attack on NK would be an attack on them and they will respond in that manner .

   NK were sending rockets over Japan and also threatening to nuke Hawaii .

May have just been a regional conflict  , but this meeting between the USA/NK bought all the hostilities to an end

 

Trump didn't "defuse the whole aggressive , confrontational attitude from the area". That something that you made up. It may, if things advance  positively, come to that. In time. Presently, this is a false statement.

 

There was no World War on the line, that's just some scaremongering nonsense which was part of the hype. At worst, and even that's questionable, there would have been a regional conflict - most likely a conventional one.

 

You have no idea if hostilities will actually end, regardless of announcements and hopes. Neither leader being particularly trustworthy or enjoying a credible track record.

 

You are confusing what might have been, what may be and what is.

[InMyShadow]

4 hours ago, scorecard said:

 

Did trump actually generate this meeting or was it un who made the initial noises about a meeting?

Trump threatening to nuke north Korea and turn him into a Gaddafi might have got the sphincter twitching 

[Morch]

4 minutes ago, sanemax said:

I did state that I would address that point first .

I mentioned Obama's supporters and how their would react and asked a question.

We all know the answer to that question .

Obama would be viewed in a positive light .

Which was my point .

People should be judged on their actions , each particular action .

Maybe Trump should have taken Obama along to Singapore , just so that the anti -Trump brigade can give this meeting some praise 

 

I don't care much for what you "stated". You simply deflected a valid point made. Then claimed your "point" wasn't answered, when in fact it was. Try to spin it as much as you like being about Obama, it isn't. You wish to ignore how Trump came by the attitude he generates, go right ahead. You wish to pretend having no idea why Obama (not that he got much to do with the topic) was perceived differently - be my guest.

[mfd101]

Let's just agree that the journey from the ridiculous to the sublime is a whole lot tougher than the other way round. For both parties.

[tonbridgebrit]

30 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

You're simply making stuff up. This did not happen, but may happen. In time.

There was no World War averted, and tensions between some Asian countries (notably, China) didn't go anywhere.

Morch, can you stop being so negative, and stop trying to put a downer on all this.

We're here, watching history in the making, a new era of peace, and people like you are trying to say that it's all rubbish. North Korea previously detonated nukes, that's because they was scared that Washington might attack them. Kim knew that his nukes were vital to his survival. Kim now knows that Trump has no plans to remove the North Korean regime.

Everybody is happy. The only people who are not happy are the die-hard Hillary Clinton supporters. That's because, it's not Hillary who is in Singapore, it's not Hillary who is part of this massive event. If it was Hillary doing this, if we had photos and news footage of Hillary shaking hands with Kim, then, all the Hillary supporters would be cheering this on. But, oh no, because it's Trump who has grabbed the limelight, well, some people are against it.

Edited June 12, 2018 by tonbridgebrit

[Enoon]

 

Looking forward to "an agreement to meet at a future date for more talks".

 

 

[tonbridgebrit]

35 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

You're simply making stuff up. This did not happen, but may happen. In time.

There was no World War averted, and tensions between some Asian countries (notably, China) didn't go anywhere.

And stop having a pop at China. Beijing provided the transport for Kim to go to Singapore. Yes, it was an "Air China" plane that flew Kim to Singapore. Yes, Beijing wants to see peace in the Far East, Beijing does not want a nuclear war in the Korean peninsular, Beijing does not want a nuclear war in it's own backyard.

[sanemax]

5 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

Trump didn't "defuse the whole aggressive , confrontational attitude from the area". That something that you made up. It may, if things advance  positively, come to that. In time. Presently, this is a false statement.

 

There was no World War on the line, that's just some scaremongering nonsense which was part of the hype. At worst, and even that's questionable, there would have been a regional conflict - most likely a conventional one.

 

You have no idea if hostilities will actually end, regardless of announcements and hopes. Neither leader being particularly trustworthy or enjoying a credible track record.

 

You are confusing what might have been, what may be and what is.

I do believe that Trump sending the U.S . Navy to the Korean peninsular triggered the whole peace talks .

   Last year , Trump and Kim were squaring up to each, threatening to attack each others Countries with nuclear weapons .

   Today , they are talking, shaking hands and making plans for future talks .

That is indeed a diffusion from hostiles , and the whole area is affected.

Hostilities may flare yup again in the future , but now, the hostilities have been defused .

   I do believe that all hostilities will cease (in the future) and that NK will now join the world community 

[tonbridgebrit]

2 minutes ago, sanemax said:

I do believe that Trump sending the U.S . Navy to the Korean peninsular triggered the whole peace talks .

   Last year , Trump and Kim were squaring up to each, threatening to attack each others Countries with nuclear weapons .

   Today , they are talking, shaking hands and making plans for future talks .

That is indeed a diffusion from hostiles , and the whole area is affected.

Hostilities may flare yup again in the future , but now, the hostilities have been defused .

   I do believe that all hostilities will cease (in the future) and that NK will now join the world community 

Hello there.
I agree with most of what you're saying. But, you've got to realise that there's people out there, who don't actually want to see peace. There are warmongers on planet earth, they want to see war, they are against this summit. They would never admit that they want to see hostilities continue, but that is exactly what they want. These people, the warmongers, they are the real enemy. They need to be removed, taken out.

[sanemax]

7 minutes ago, tonbridgebrit said:

And stop having a pop at China. Beijing provided the transport for Kim to go to Singapore. Yes, it was an "Air China" plane that flew Kim to Singapore. Yes, Beijing wants to see peace in the Far East, Beijing does not want a nuclear war in the Korean peninsular, Beijing does not want a nuclear war in it's own backyard.

China doesnt want NK building nukes on its borders .

It was suggested that China was furious with NK , because of that explosion on its borders a few months ago .

   China quite possibly told Kim to stop making nukes and make peace with USA 

[Rarebear]

BBC now. Trump stop war games. Kim gives up nukes.  

 

Seems like a good start to me.

[ravip]

 

[sanemax]

4 minutes ago, Rarebear said:

BBC now. Trump stop war games. Kim gives up nukes.  

 

Seems like a good start to me.

Donald Trump appears to have secured a commitment from North Korea's leader Kim Jong Un to denuclearise the secretive state.

In a document, released shortly after the summit, the leaders agreed to take steps to improve their relations and to promote peace and prosperity.

Here's the full detail of the text

 

 

 

 

President Donald J Trump of the United States of America and Chairman Kim Jong Un of the Democratic People's Republic of Korea held a first historic summit in Singapore on June 12, 2018.
President Trump and Chairman Kim Jong Un conducted a comprehensive, in-depth and sincere exchange of opinions on the issues related to the establishment of new US-DPRK relations and the building of lasting and robust peace regime on the Korean peninsula. President Trump committed to provide security guarantees to the DPRK and Chairman Kim Jong-Un reaffirmed his firm and unwavering commitment to complete denuclearisation of the Korean Peninsula.

 

 

 

Convinced that the establishment of new US-DPRK relations will contribute to the peace and prosperity of the Korean peninsula and of the world, and recognising that mutual confidence building can promote the denuclearisation of the Korean Peninsula, President Trump and Chairman Kim Jong Un state the following:

 

 

 

1.      The United States and the DPRK commit to establish new US-DPRK relations in accordance with the desire of the peoples of the two countries for peace and prosperity.
2.      The United States and the DPRK will join their efforts to build a lasting and stable peace regime on the Korean Peninsula.
3.      Reaffirming the April 27, 2018 Panmunjom Declaration, the DPRK commits to work toward complete denuclearisation of the Korean Peninsula.
4.      The United States and the DPRK commit to recovering POW/MIA remains, including the immediate repatriation of those already identified.

 

 

 

Having acknowledged when the US-DPRK summit - the first in history - was an epochal event of great significance in overcoming decades of tensions and hostilities between the two countries and for the opening of a new future President Trump and Chairman Kim Jong Un commit to implement the stipulation in this joint statement fully and expeditiously. The United States and the DPRK commit to hold follow-on negotiations, led by the US secretary of state Mike Pompeo and a relevant high-level DPRK official at the earliest possible date to implement the outcomes of the US-DPRK summit.

 

 

 

President Donald J Trump of the United States of America and Chairman Kim Jong Un of the State Affairs Commission of the Democratic People's Republic of Korea have committed to cooperate for the development of new US-DPRK relations and the promotion of peace, prosperity and security of the Korean Peninsula and the world.

[Morch]

 

@tonbridgebrit

 

<removed>

 

You have no idea if you're "watching history". Both leaders have a history of not living up to their statements and words. That you assure this time it's different carries very little weight. I prefer to judge this on how it pans out, rather than on how it may pan out. That difference.

 

You have no particular insight as to why Kim did or does anything. All the more so with regard to what he may or may not do in the future. Same goes for what he "knew" or "knows".

 

Once more, you're not speaking for "everybody", even if you pretend you are. And you "but but but Hillary" nonsense is about as pointless as it ever was.

 

Edited June 12, 2018 by ubonjoe
removed a personal attack on a member

[ravip]

 

[ubonjoe]

A abusive personal attack post has been removed. Please keep the discussion civil.

[Morch]

20 minutes ago, sanemax said:

I do believe that Trump sending the U.S . Navy to the Korean peninsular triggered the whole peace talks .

   Last year , Trump and Kim were squaring up to each, threatening to attack each others Countries with nuclear weapons .

   Today , they are talking, shaking hands and making plans for future talks .

That is indeed a diffusion from hostiles , and the whole area is affected.

Hostilities may flare yup again in the future , but now, the hostilities have been defused .

   I do believe that all hostilities will cease (in the future) and that NK will now join the world community 

 

You can believe what you will. What we're dealing with here are facts. Not what "may", but what "is".

 

You announcing that Trump "defused the whole aggressive , confrontational attitude from the area" is not factual. Are all countries involved fully subscribed to whatever was agreed upon? Is it even clear what was agreed upon? Is there nothing in the two leaders past, and the dynamics of the conflict which gives reason to doubt such changes are a reality? 

 

You can try and spin it as an anti-Trump thing. Whatever. The point made is simple - wait and see how things pan out. Apparently, that's not good enough for some. Full adulation need to be engaged or something.

 

 

[sanemax]

2 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

You can believe what you will. What we're dealing with here are facts. Not what "may", but what "is".

You announcing that Trump "defused the whole aggressive , confrontational attitude from the area" is not factual. Are all countries involved fully subscribed to whatever was agreed upon? Is it even clear what was agreed upon? Is there nothing in the two leaders past, and the dynamics of the conflict which gives reason to doubt such changes are a reality? 

You can try and spin it as an anti-Trump thing. Whatever. The point made is simple - wait and see how things pan out. Apparently, that's not good enough for some. Full adulation need to be engaged or something.

Trump sending the U.S navy to the Korean peninsular is a fact .

Trump subsequently meeting with Kim is a fact .

Trump meeting with Kim has diffused the hostile environment , that is a fact .

USA & NK today signed an agreement for future peace and prosperity and security in the region , that is a fact .

   That seems to be what everyone wanted , everyones happy .

China , USA , NK , SK ,E.U., & Japan will all be content with that

The only unhappy ( with the outcome)people seem to be the anti Trump brigade

Those are facts .

Suggesting that it all may go wrong in the future is just a non factual prediciction

[Briggsy]

39 minutes ago, tonbridgebrit said:

Yes, Beijing wants to see peace in the Far East, Beijing does not want a nuclear war in the Korean peninsular, Beijing does not want a nuclear war in it's own backyard.

Beijing does not want U.S. forces on its border. Beijing wants Taiwan under its control.

 

All this bluster of a threat of nuclear war to big up Trump and his yet unknown achievement or failure. The Japanese, the South Koreans, the North Koreans, the Americans, the Chinese are all having their interests served by the status quo. The "threat of a nuclear war" was just a fiction to sell to the American electorate. It suits all American administrations, particularly the current one.

[Morch]

 

@tonbridgebrit

 

This here isn't China, so you don't get to tell posters not to post about China. Even if they don't care much for China's policies.

 

The poster I replied to claimed Trump defused all aggression etc. - the fact stands that there's still a whole lot of that around. And that China is involved in quite a bit of it.

[sanemax]

6 minutes ago, Briggsy said:

The "threat of a nuclear war" was just a fiction to sell to the American electorate. It suits all American administrations, particularly the current one.

North Korea did threaten to attack Guam , in America .

That is a fact .

[Morch]

20 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Trump sending the U.S navy to the Korean peninsular is a fact .

Trump subsequently meeting with Kim is a fact .

Trump meeting with Kim has diffused the hostile environment , that is a fact .

USA & NK today signed an agreement for future peace and prosperity and security in the region , that is a fact .

   That seems to be what everyone wanted , everyones happy .

China , USA , NK , SK ,E.U., & Japan will all be content with that

The only unhappy ( with the outcome)people seem to be the anti Trump brigade

Those are facts .

Suggesting that it all may go wrong in the future is just a non factual prediciction

 

The first two are facts. The third isn't. There was a meeting between two apparently volatile leaders, who aren't known for keeping their word, and acting belligerently. I prefer to pronounce such things a fact, after it's proven that they are. Not all that interested in the instant, ready-made reality tv version.

 

The agreement signed (or at least what was made public) doesn't specify anything much. More a deceleration of intents. Worth bearing in mind the same POTUS tossed aside a much more comprehensive and in-depth agreement just a short while back. To imagine that the papers signed amount to anything resembling the scope of that other, discarded agreement is a joke.

 

I don't know that all the countries named are "happy", or that they fully buy into this without knowing details. Once more, that's something you allege, rather than a fact. IMO, most will carry a supportive outer display while reserving judgement until details are known and advances made. 

 

Suggesting that it might go wrong is based upon both parties track record, which you insist very hard on ignoring. On the other hand assuming it will all go well is somehow a "fact" rather than "non factual prediction". About as consistent as they get.... 

Edited June 12, 2018 by Morch

[Morch]

5 minutes ago, sanemax said:

North Korea did threaten to attack Guam , in America .

That is a fact .

 

If one ignores them North Korean propaganda clips about attacks carried out on the US, including the White House....

[sanemax]

10 minutes ago, Morch said:

The poster I replied to claimed Trump defused all aggression etc. - the fact stands that there's still a whole lot of that around. And that China is involved in quite a bit of it.

I did mean all the hostilities surrounding NK's quest for nuclear bombs .