Put your cards on the table, EU makes last Brexit call to Britain

[CG1 Blue]

28 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

Is that 6 percent by revenue or just by separate incorporation? I think the answer to that is pretty clear. Most business registered in the UK are very small and local. So of course they don't do business abroad. But in terms of revenue it seems highly likely that the numbers are quite different.. And it's really no different from the situation in the USA where most businesses are small and unlikely to engage interstate trade. Still, they have to abide by Federal law. Otherwise regulation would be a nightmare.

 

"And it's really no different from the situation in the USA where most businesses are small and unlikely to engage interstate trade. Still, they have to abide by Federal law."

Do you see the EU evolving into a United States of Europe then - and you're ok with that?

 

The 6% is on number of businesses, so you're right it doesn't represent revenues.

 

[CG1 Blue]

29 minutes ago, tebee said:

That very much a straw man argument - numerically a good deal of British businesses  are small local traders who don't even trade outside their own town. But you wouldn't expect them not to have to obey the laws of the UK because of that.

 

You need to know that a pork pie you buy from a bakery in Bolton is made to same safety standards as one from London or one in Prague.

 

Rules are there for a purpose - what EU rules do you want to get rid of ?   

 

Personally I think the UK is capable of making it's own rules, and doesn't need rules imposed on it by an outside entity made up of overpaid egotistical civil servants.

[The Renegade]

19 minutes ago, CG1 Blue said:

As far as I'm aware a large majority of Tory MPs are Remainers. So if there were to be a leadership challenge, the Remain candidate would always win. Therefore as I see it, it's impossible for a Brexiteer Tory to become PM.

 

I'd love to be wrong though!

 

No need for a leadership challenge.

 

1. The EU rejects her Chequers bog roll.

 

Or

 

2. The EU accepts it and it is vetoed in Parliament.

 

Either way, its Taxi for May.

[nauseus]

23 minutes ago, tebee said:

That's no longer true - lowest avg monthly wage in EU is Bulgaria at $1,350 (PPP) just over half the UK at $2,500. Highest is Luxembourg at $3,850 - 10 of the 28 EU countries now have higher average wages than the UK.

  

You have to consider numbers of people - not average salaries - what about all the unemployed in southern Europe?

[nauseus]

17 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Kind of blows a hole in the Brexiteer argument that MPs that don’t support Brexit will lose their seats.

No, it doesn't. Being reelected in the next GE is not the same as the election for the next Tory party leader. Many of these manifesto-benders will lose next time. The great downside is the prospect of the Corbyn Clown getting in.

[CG1 Blue]

29 minutes ago, tebee said:

That's no longer true - lowest avg monthly wage in EU is Bulgaria at $1,350 (PPP) just over half the UK at $2,500. Highest is Luxembourg at $3,850 - 10 of the 28 EU countries now have higher average wages than the UK.

  

Could it be that the UK average wage has been dragged down by migration into the country from lower paid eastern European nationals?

Also, the first table I got from Google paints a different picture, with Bulgaria at just €586 per month, and with 12 countries having less than €1000 take home pay per month:

 

https://www.reinisfischer.com/average-salary-european-union-2018

 

 

 

[My Thai Life]

Whether we like it or not the UK is genuinely divided on this issue, as are the major parties.

 

It’s fairly obvious that any kind of Brexit is going to cause short to mid-term economic damage, but the long-term is less clear. It’s also fairly obvious that the EU has serious long term economic issues too.

 

But it’s not all about economics. I can’t be the only one who remembers Tony Benn’s speeches about the EU eroding sovereign democracy, and the EU has progressed further in that direction since then. And Benn is a million miles from Boris Johnson.

 

UK citizens are going to have to live with each other whatever the shape of the final agreement between the UK and the EU, so a reduction in the remainer-Brexiter nastiness would be a good idea.

[bristolboy]

21 minutes ago, CG1 Blue said:

"And it's really no different from the situation in the USA where most businesses are small and unlikely to engage interstate trade. Still, they have to abide by Federal law."

Do you see the EU evolving into a United States of Europe then - and you're ok with that?

 

The 6% is on number of businesses, so you're right it doesn't represent revenues.

 

It's not a matter of evolving towards a tighter union. It would be impossible to administer a system where only those companies that traded outside of the union - whatever that union is - were regulated.

[vogie]

4 minutes ago, My Thai Life said:

But it’s not all about economics. I can’t be the only one who remembers Tony Benn’s speeches about the EU eroding sovereign democracy, and the EU has progressed further in that direct

And what do you think Tony Benn would think of his son Hilary stance on us remaining in the EU. But you made some good points never the less.

[aright]

1 hour ago, tebee said:

That's no longer true - lowest avg monthly wage in EU is Bulgaria at $1,350 (PPP) just over half the UK at $2,500. Highest is Luxembourg at $3,850 - 10 of the 28 EU countries now have higher average wages than the UK.

  

 

48 minutes ago, nauseus said:

You have to consider numbers of people - not average salaries - what about all the unemployed in southern Europe?

Cost of living index also has to be considered. From my experience Teebee and you would know better than anyone a joint of beef in France or a chicken is much more expensive than the UK.

Luxembourg COLI  is 86.44, UK is 67.18 and Bulgaria 37.83.

Edited July 11, 2018 by aright
figure correction

[nontabury]

This sums up Appeaser May and the remainers Brexit strategy, 

Petfectly articulated up by the Eagles.

“ you can check out anytime,but you cannot leave”

 

 

[nontabury]

40 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Kind of blows a hole in the Brexiteer argument that MPs that don’t support Brexit will lose their seats.

Those remainers who voted against the Democratic wishes of their constituents,will soon find out at the next G.E.

[nontabury]

26 minutes ago, nauseus said:

You have to consider numbers of people - not average salaries - what about all the unemployed in southern Europe?

To think of those, and the lower paid in our own country,would entail him to be non selfish. Not going to happen.

 

 

[stephenterry]

58 minutes ago, nontabury said:

Those remainers who voted against the Democratic wishes of their constituents,will soon find out at the next G.E.

1. Even in democracies today, crucial knowledge is available to only a few individuals … —Jared Diamond,  Guns, Germs, and Steel,  1997

[stephenterry]

I hope brexiteers/remainers will realise that the main reason unemployed people north of the watford gap, caused by successive governments not supporting traditional British industries and letting them sink into oblivion, voted to leave because anything would be better than it is now. Not for ideology, or even because they want a return to Rule Britannia, but because their projected future living under yet another uncaring government (which this Tory government is) would never change for the better. 

Edited July 11, 2018 by stephenterry
addition to text.

[bristolboy]

5 minutes ago, stephenterry said:

I hope brexiteers/remainers will realise that the main reason unemployed people north of the watford gap, caused by successive governments not supporting traditional British industries and letting them sink into oblivion, voted to leave because anything would be better than it is now. Not for ideology, or even because they want a return to Rule Britannia, but because their projected future living under yet another uncaring government (which this Tory government is) would never change for the better. 

And it's the fault of the EU that the Tories are dismantiling social programs and becoming more like the United States? Because it doesn't seem like there is anything as cruel happening in the rest of the EU.

[nontabury]

24 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

And it's the fault of the EU that the Tories are dismantiling social programs and becoming more like the United States? Because it doesn't seem like there is anything as cruel happening in the rest of the EU.

Then why is their a growing hostility to the E.U. In other parts of Europe?

[nauseus]

36 minutes ago, stephenterry said:

I hope brexiteers/remainers will realise that the main reason unemployed people north of the watford gap, caused by successive governments not supporting traditional British industries and letting them sink into oblivion, voted to leave because anything would be better than it is now. Not for ideology, or even because they want a return to Rule Britannia, but because their projected future living under yet another uncaring government (which this Tory government is) would never change for the better. 

Does this make any sense to anyone else except Stephen? 

[nauseus]

30 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

And it's the fault of the EU that the Tories are dismantiling social programs and becoming more like the United States? Because it doesn't seem like there is anything as cruel happening in the rest of the EU.

Might have known.

[billd766]

2 hours ago, nontabury said:

The British people are not a race. Therefore we must just assume that those die hard remainers,such as yourself, are simple anti British.

 

 

 

Slightly off topic.

 

However I don't wear T shirts but I would love to own a shirt like that.

 

It sort of gets a message across in a subtle way.

[stephenterry]

28 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

And it's the fault of the EU that the Tories are dismantiling social programs and becoming more like the United States? Because it doesn't seem like there is anything as cruel happening in the rest of the EU.

You're quick to jump in and make conclusions. No matter that the EU is loved/reviled, the motivation for the large leavers vote in those constituencies was 'one of change' would be better than the status quo.

 

And if there is another referendum, and despite more understanding among the people of what Brexit means - and to their detriment - they'll still vote the same. 

[billd766]

2 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Kind of blows a hole in the Brexiteer argument that MPs that don’t support Brexit will lose their seats.

 

No it doesn't.

 

MPs may be selected by the party but their first duty is to their constituents and not to themselves or their party. Otherwise at the next election they can be kicked out.

 

My MP is a Remainer but the constituency voted to leave.

[RuamRudy]

2 hours ago, nontabury said:

The British people are not a race. Therefore we must just assume that those die hard remainers,such as yourself, are simple anti British.

 

 

Off topic, but is that a photo of you, Nontabury? If so, I better tread lightly in future because you could probably knock 7 bells out of me...

[billd766]

2 hours ago, CG1 Blue said:

Could it be that the UK average wage has been dragged down by migration into the country from lower paid eastern European nationals?

Also, the first table I got from Google paints a different picture, with Bulgaria at just €586 per month, and with 12 countries having less than €1000 take home pay per month:

 

https://www.reinisfischer.com/average-salary-european-union-2018

 

 

 

 

What a silly man you are. You put in a link to the subject and you know that Tebee never does that. He will be lost now.

[nontabury]

12 minutes ago, stephenterry said:

You're quick to jump in and make conclusions. No matter that the EU is loved/reviled, the motivation for the large leavers vote in those constituencies was 'one of change' would be better than the status quo.

 

And if there is another referendum, and despite more understanding among the people of what Brexit means - and to their detriment - they'll still vote the same. 

In 1975 we did not have the benefits of social media etc., 

Now we do,and the majority of people are far more aware of how the establishment along with the media has basically lied and conned us. Thus they democratically voted OUT.

 

Edited July 11, 2018 by nontabury

[stephenterry]

14 minutes ago, nontabury said:

In 1975 we did not have the benefits of social media etc., 

Now we do,and the majority of people are far more aware of how the establishment along with the media has basically lied and conned us. Thus they democratically voted OUT.

 

oh, you mean like Boris/ And that guy who met Putin 17 times, and the criminal use of excess referendum money to support and influence the leaver's vote. That sort of lies and cons?

[nontabury]

11 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

Off topic, but is that a photo of you, Nontabury? If so, I better tread lightly in future because you could probably knock 7 bells out of me...

No it’s not me. And anyhow I intend to keep knocking you out with the truth, backed up with facts.

 

 

 

[The Renegade]

5 minutes ago, stephenterry said:

And that guy who met Putin 17 times,

What guy ? 

 

6 minutes ago, stephenterry said:

and the criminal use of excess referendum money to support and influence the leaver's vote.

What criminal use ?

 

A tebee special. Waffle with nothing to back it up.

 

Stick to trying to rabble rousing for another Referendum for under 45's only.

[stephenterry]

Also, it would be a democratic vote if parliament (who voters democratically elected) rejects May's plan and advises the government to think again. And then there will be an election and Corbyn will win and keep the UK in the single market and customs union, at the very least.

 

That's democracy in real life.

[stephenterry]

3 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

What guy ? 

 

What criminal use ?

 

A tebee special. Waffle with nothing to back it up.

 

Stick to trying to rabble rousing for another Referendum for under 45's only.

You should keep up with the UK news, before making an inane comment.