I want to open a (cheap) (Thai) steak restaurant, any idea ?

[poanoi]

4 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

If you buy good quality meat sauce is not needed.  Some of the top steak houses in the world have no sauce.

i cant recall a single dish i had to put up with without a nice sauce

when i grew up, i will never like a dish dry,

and i will never accept ketchup as an excuse for a sauce, specially not on a fillet

Edited July 10, 2018 by poanoi

[Bassosa]

1 hour ago, catman20 said:

You may fail once, or twice, but it's the risk takers who end up, going broke and going back home with their tail between their legs.

 

 

yer right mate you have to play the odds if you had any brains you would know in Thailand the odds are stacked well against farang here. you must be new here or not living here.

I live and do business here.

 

I actually agree with you that the odds are stacked against the average farang, but it has nothing to do with the opportunities, which are plentiful and potentially lucrative, but more with the individuals themselves.

 

They fail because they have no business experience, are under pressure from their other half (get me a business!) or are running out of money to sustain themselves. Entry barriers are low too, especially if you're American and this causes people to have a go, who probably shouldn't.

 

Just like this steakhouse guy, I actually quite like the idea in an area overpopulated with Thai food. There's money to be made if you can find the right cuts of meat and prepare them in such a way that they taste a lot more expensive. Stuff like brisket, hanger steak, beef short ribs etc. Unfortunately this guys just wants to do what everyone else does and sell Thai shoe sole, so I give him little chance. The opportunity is there though!

 

 

 

-

Edited July 10, 2018 by Bassosa

[bkk6060]

Just now, poanoi said:

i cant recall a single dish i had to put up with without a nice sauce

when i grew up, i will never like a dish dry,

and i will never accept ketchup as an excuse for a sauce

Because you probably grew up on cheap meat...

?

Kidding, I get it I like some A1 sauce also.

But at a high end place like Peter Luger's in the states the quality of the meat and the way they cook it nothing is needed I do not think just pure meat flavor.

[Bassosa]

I agree with the points raised about leasing. Make sure it's bulletproof and at least 3+3. And even then you run the risk of become the victim of Thai greed.

[Farangwithaplan]

37 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

If you buy good quality meat sauce is not needed.  Some of the top steak houses in the world have no sauce.

A simple jus of pan juices with maybe a touch of butter and a flour after a deglaze is all I ever need... Although I am partial to a roux based mushroom sauce for potatoes.

[JAZZDOG]

1 hour ago, seancbk said:

 

Really?   

Ok 49 THB for the cheapest meal promoted to bring people in, but then in the menu there are higher priced meals often with a high margin.

But let's assume they only sell the 49 baht meals.  You'd expect a 30% food cost (14.70 THB) so gross profit of 34 THB per meal (rounded down).    100 covers per day (covers is F&B speak for customers) = 3400 THB per day gross. 

3400 THB x 24 days (closed 1 day per week) = 81,600 THB Gross

That doesn't include additional revenue from drinks, sides or higher margin meals. 

Even after paying rent, utilities and staff there should be a pretty decent profit coming out of a place like this.  

 

 

looks great on paper but it never is reality. subtract 30% from your Income and add 30% to expenses and convince a thai girl to work her ass off 14 hours a day. I have yet to see a Thai multi-task or exhibit any analytical planning ability. living in a fantasy world thinking he can have a staff of one and he does nothing. With that business model he can expand to twenty locations in no time. 

[Bassosa]

12 minutes ago, JAZZDOG said:

looks great on paper but it never is reality. subtract 30% from your Income and add 30% to expenses and convince a thai girl to work her ass off 14 hours a day. I have yet to see a Thai multi-task or exhibit any analytical planning ability. living in a fantasy world thinking he can have a staff of one and he does nothing. With that business model he can expand to twenty locations in no time. 

30% cost of goods seems ambitious considering the intended price point and cost of meat in Thailand.

 

But OK, let's go with the 81,600 THB gross.

 

Can we assume a few costs too?
 

Fit out cost and potential loan repayment? Equipment, stock, decor etc. 

Labour? Or is this a one man show?
Rent? 10.000 THB I mean? Nothing upfront, key money, property tax paid obo landlord?

Electricity & water?

Tax?

 

 

Edited July 10, 2018 by Bassosa

[Ks45672]

Around bkk there is a lot of 49thb steak places, franchises too

 

They are usually busy but margins must be razor thin and they're probably buying their pork and chicken collectively in metric tonnes so I don't think you will be able to compete 

 

Seems like a lot of work and headaches for potentially small rewards.... 

 

 

[GSFGSF]

16 minutes ago, Bassosa said:

30% cost of goods seems ambitious considering the intended price point and cost of meat in Thailand.

 

But OK, let's go with the 81,600 THB gross.

 

Can we assume a few costs too?
 

Fit out cost and potential loan repayment? Equipment, stock, decor etc. 

Labour? Or is this a one man show?
Rent? 10.000 THB I mean? Nothing upfront, key money, property tax paid obo landlord?

Electricity & water?

Tax?

 

 

 

10000 tb for monthly rent.

Let's say 50000 thb maximum for decor or other startup things.

No key money because only idiots pay it.

Electricity and water cost nothing.

No other cost.

I repeat that staff has already worked for me 12 hours a day for years, and for a lot less money that she will make in her own shop, I know that it's hard to understand for many foreigners in this country, but we are not all buffalo idiots.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 10, 2018 by GSFGSF

[Bassosa]

20 minutes ago, Ks45672 said:

Around bkk there is a lot of 49thb steak places, franchises too

 

They are usually busy but margins must be razor thin and they're probably buying their pork and chicken collectively in metric tonnes so I don't think you will be able to compete 

 

Seems like a lot of work and headaches for potentially small rewards.... 

 

 

 

Yes, especially keeping in mind that with cost of goods at 30% his budget for a meal is 14.70 THB. 

I had a look at what Makro charges for frozen chicken breasts and saw 156 THB for 2kg. If we assume 200 grams of chicken per serving we're already at 15.6 THB food cost per plate!!

No sides yet.

I don't think you can achieve 30% COG with this particular "concept" and intended price point.

 

Possibly go with 50% COG (not sure if that's even achievable actually) so 2500 gross per day x 24 days = 60.000 gross per month.

Deduct your rent 10.000 THB and this leaves you 50.000 THB to start paying your bills.

We know rent but how many staff do you intend to use daily and at what daily rate?

If we assume 3 at 350 THB per day you're already looking at ~1000THB per day x 26 days = 26.000 THB per month, leaving you with 24.000 THB to pay the other bills.

Let's say you want to pay back your initial investment of 50.000 THB over the first 12 months, then you're looking at ~4000 THB per month, so now 20.000 THB left.

Edited July 10, 2018 by Bassosa

[Briggsy]

2 minutes ago, Bassosa said:

 

Yes, especially keeping in mind that with cost of goods at 30% his budget for a meal is 14.70 THB. 

I had a look at what Makro charges for frozen chicken breasts and saw 156 THB for 2kg. If we assume 200 grams of chicken per serving we're already at 15.6 THB food cost per plate!!

I have worked at a lot of factories in Thailand. Very often they outsource the canteen catering. Typically nowadays the company is looking for a cost per meal per worker of around 20 - 25 Baht. The meals are awful. The meat is cheaper than you could possibly imagine and there's not much of it.

 

This 20-25 Baht is of course equivalent to the OP's 49 Baht as we are talking about the selling price. However, the outsourced canteen company does not have to provide seating as the canteen is provided by the host company. My point is cost of sales at 30% of revenue on food is not realistic, I think.

[mike324]

1 hour ago, BigT73 said:

Thats so true,  it boils down to how much of that stinky stuff you can smear on the meat.  I took my misses to the sky tower in singapore and had a roof top steak all she could do is complain how under cooked it was and didnt have some special sauce.  Took her down jomtien market and she was guzzling some god awful stuff telling me how much better it was.  go figure.

well, thais each chilli sauce like spoonful of soup when they eat their fries .... lol

[poanoi]

1 hour ago, bkk6060 said:

Because you probably grew up on cheap meat...

?

Kidding, I get it I like some A1 sauce also.

But at a high end place like Peter Luger's in the states the quality of the meat and the way they cook it nothing is needed I do not think just pure meat flavor.

if i was told to waste a fillet on some butter and/or ketchup,

i would i all likelihood refuse to eat it,

i just hate ruining otherwise good food,

its something deep, maybe a sense of heresy,

somewhat similar as to the first reaction of mixing red wine or beer with ice,

but it goes so much deeper when it concerns food, maybe same as an act of homosexuality,

getting rogered, a kind of depraved way of life itself, it goes against everything i stand for,

all my virtues etc

 

Edited July 10, 2018 by poanoi

[JAZZDOG]

13 minutes ago, Bassosa said:

30% cost of goods seems ambitious considering the intended price point and cost of meat in Thailand.

 

But OK, let's go with the 81,600 THB gross.

 

Can we assume a few costs too?
 

Fit out cost and potential loan repayment? Equipment, stock, decor etc. 

Labour? Or is this a one man show?
Rent? 10.000 THB I mean? Nothing upfront, key money, property tax paid obo landlord?

Electricity & water?

Tax?

 

 

After suffering thru this thread it is clear few if any of you have actually run a restaurant. The OP is clueless and is in a fantasy world. He intends to compete in the most saturated sector of the food service industry without anything to set him apart. If his plan was even remotely viable every Tom , Dick & Harry would invest 300K baht in a store front and have his bar girl partner working solo 12 hours a day serving over 100 meals per day. Even if you somehow manage to stay open on such a shoestring your help is going to vanish and you will hire people off the street for a month or two then pull a runner. If you don't have something to augment your budget food joint you stand very little chance. That's why you see so many 4 story shops with a restaurant and rooms to rent above. The overhead and staff costs are split and if your lucky one portion pays the bills while the other is pure profit. One just needs to look around at all the restaurants suffering. If you call making US$1000/month working 80 hours /week successful then you may have a 50/50 chance of lasting one year. That is if you open in October, Lol

[ELVIS123456]

One of the first pieces of advice given is the most important - dont, but if you must - dont rent. If somehow you are successful, that 10,000 baht will quickly increase to 15,000 or 20,000.  If you buy a townhouse with sleeping/family rooms upstairs and the restaurant below, then you have a chance long term. And if food doesnt work out, maybe try hairdressing or somemthing else in high demand.  Thai landlords see a successful business as reason to increase rent - and they will do without a second thought. Many many stories to prove this - including several of my wife's family - yes they do it to Thais as well.  Some close after 6 months because the rent has been doubled. 

[BigT73]

33 minutes ago, poanoi said:

it goes so much deeper when it concerns food, maybe same as an act of homosexuality,

getting rogered, a kind of depraved way of life itself, it goes against everything i stand for,

all my virtues etc 

Just so I'm on the right track did you or didnt you get rogered? and if you did will you be able to eat steak with tomatoe sauce after?

[Bassosa]

He got sauced.

[catman20]

2 hours ago, Bassosa said:

I live and do business here.

 

I actually agree with you that the odds are stacked against the average farang, but it has nothing to do with the opportunities, which are plentiful and potentially lucrative, but more with the individuals themselves.

 

They fail because they have no business experience, are under pressure from their other half (get me a business!) or are running out of money to sustain themselves. Entry barriers are low too, especially if you're American and this causes people to have a go, who probably shouldn't.

 

Just like this steakhouse guy, I actually quite like the idea in an area overpopulated with Thai food. There's money to be made if you can find the right cuts of meat and prepare them in such a way that they taste a lot more expensive. Stuff like brisket, hanger steak, beef short ribs etc. Unfortunately this guys just wants to do what everyone else does and sell Thai shoe sole, so I give him little chance. The opportunity is there though!

 

 

 

-

good luck to all those who are nickel and diming it here, not my idea of a good life. 

[Bassosa]

6 minutes ago, catman20 said:

good luck to all those who are nickel and diming it here, not my idea of a good life. 

I mean, if it's something on your bucket list and you have no real expectations then why not? Throw some money at it and be OK if you lose it all. That I can respect.

[poanoi]

11 minutes ago, BigT73 said:

Just so I'm on the right track did you or didnt you get rogered? and if you did will you be able to eat steak with tomatoe sauce after?

i feel like i'm getting rect when i'm served meat without a nice sauce,

but it goes beyond that, i feel like i commit rape too when i

dont honor the meat with a treat

[BritManToo]

8 minutes ago, catman20 said:

good luck to all those who are nickel and diming it here, not my idea of a good life. 

It beats living in a bedsit in London.

[bkk6060]

2 hours ago, Bassosa said:

I live and do business here.

 

I actually agree with you that the odds are stacked against the average farang, but it has nothing to do with the opportunities, which are plentiful and potentially lucrative, but more with the individuals themselves.

 

They fail because they have no business experience, are under pressure from their other half (get me a business!) or are running out of money to sustain themselves. Entry barriers are low too, especially if you're American and this causes people to have a go, who probably shouldn't.

 

Just like this steakhouse guy, I actually quite like the idea in an area overpopulated with Thai food. There's money to be made if you can find the right cuts of meat and prepare them in such a way that they taste a lot more expensive. Stuff like brisket, hanger steak, beef short ribs etc. Unfortunately this guys just wants to do what everyone else does and sell Thai shoe sole, so I give him little chance. The opportunity is there though!

 

 

 

-

You are right.  Just a weak male who would fold under a Thai girl saying: Get me a business.

Come on guys stop being the weak western male.

On the big picture, it is why so many of these places fail.

And I do not agree that the opportunity is there.  Plenty of these places in BKK and Pattaya over kill.

 

 

Edited July 10, 2018 by bkk6060

[theguyfromanotherforum]

I don't understand why he leaves haha reaction to every post that makes sense. I bet he'll lol at this one too.

[smutcakes]

Is this not what Santa Fe steakhouse provide who are opening in more and more locations?

[catman20]

10 minutes ago, Bassosa said:

I mean, if it's something on your bucket list and you have no real expectations then why not? Throw some money at it and be OK if you lose it all. That I can respect.

ok each to there own 

[catman20]

9 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

It beats living in a bedsit in London.

wouldn't know never done that in the UK or here. i made something of my life.

[bkk6060]

11 minutes ago, Bassosa said:

I mean, if it's something on your bucket list and you have no real expectations then why not? Throw some money at it and be OK if you lose it all. That I can respect.

Did a Thai girl convince you of this..?

[Bassosa]

9 minutes ago, smutcakes said:

Is this not what Santa Fe steakhouse provide who are opening in more and more locations?

I think SF is a bit more expensive, but yes, quite cheap overall.

 

Reviews are terrible though. Like really really bad.

And as others in this topic have alluded too, they probably buy their meats collectively and therefore can negotiate low low prices.

Edited July 10, 2018 by Bassosa

[Bassosa]

1 minute ago, bkk6060 said:

Did a Thai girl convince you of this..?

Don't be silly now. A Thai girl would take it more seriously than that.

[Farangwithaplan]

7 minutes ago, smutcakes said:

Is this not what Santa Fe steakhouse provide who are opening in more and more locations?

And spending a hell of a lot more capital than 50k on fitout, 10k on rent per month and a massive advertising budget. And charging more for the product. The likes of Santa Fe also have supply chain arrangement in place.

 

Chalk and cheese.