UK voters should make final Brexit decision if talks with EU collapse: poll

[Patriot1066]

1 hour ago, Jip99 said:

 

 

Indeed Bill; but, frankly, it is not much of a beauty parade!  ????

No it’s not????

[Patriot1066]

2 minutes ago, mommysboy said:

Yes, payback is ok if it was just against the Government but Labour have done little to encourage the Remain cause. Perhaps the public will vent their fury against the establishment with some protest vote.  Maybe SNP could stand in England and pull a coup on Westminster.????

Yea SNP they have loads of funding and can’t get anything right, they will be hated in the UK 

[mommysboy]

2 minutes ago, Patriot1066 said:

When we can better control our bordered there will be less to keep as we won’t be feeding the poor of the EU

 

You'll just have more immigrants from outside the EU, and anyway the EU migrants already here will be staying. One advantage for a Labour supporter like me is that they'll likely get a vote and it won't be Tory.

[mommysboy]

2 minutes ago, Patriot1066 said:

Yea SNP they have loads of funding and can’t get anything right, they will be hated in the UK 

It was a joke!!

[vogie]

31 minutes ago, whatsupdoc said:

Another view on Brexit from outside the UK:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/nov/06/britain-foolish-decline-boris-johnson 

I don't know much about the author Jan Fleischhauar, but it appears he upset the whole of Italy, now he is trying to do the same to the UK, can you find someone more credible than these people?

Here is a snippet from wiki.

 

In January 2012 Jan Fleischhauer in S.P.O.N. – Der Schwarze Kanal compared the Italian people to Francesco Schettino, the captain of the Costa Concordia.^[12] Italian newspapers criticized this comparison, considering his tone "racist".^[13][14] The Italian Ambassador in Germany, in a direct reaction to what SPON published below the column, recommended to "leave generalizations for the sake of race", and criticized Fleischhauer's contribution as "vulgar and banal assertions.".^[15] The Italian newspaper Il Giornale titled on the following 27 January, the Tag des Gedenkens an die Opfer des Nationalsozialismus, with "We have Schettino, you have Auschwitz".^[16][17]

 

[sandyf]

The UK, supposedly one of the richest countries in the world, is now under investigation by the UN for extreme poverty. Bottom line is the UK government has little concern for the people, otherwise they would not have embarked on a course of action that will only increase the numbers in poverty.

The money wasted on the administration of the brexit fiasco could have gone a long way to help resolve the ever growing problems in essential services. From day one it was brexit means brexit whatever the cost, and people are now starting to realise what the cost could actually look like.

 

London (CNN)The United Nations has launched an investigation into extreme levels of poverty in one of the richest countries in the world: the United Kingdom.

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/11/05/uk/uk-austerity-un-rapporteur-intl/index.html

 

[sandyf]

13 minutes ago, Patriot1066 said:

Yea SNP they have loads of funding and can’t get anything right, they will be hated in the UK 

So you think the SNP have got it wrong in promoting the campaign on frozen pensions.

[Patriot1066]

3 minutes ago, sandyf said:

So you think the SNP have got it wrong in promoting the campaign on frozen pensions.

I don’t know this campaign, but in general Scotland has more funding per head than the rest of the UK under the Barnet formula and the extra since the last referendum decision on independence.

Details

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-northern-ireland-38077948

unfortunatly outcomes from the spending are generally poor and wasted such as the baby boxes now found unsafe.

[Patriot1066]

15 minutes ago, vogie said:

I don't know much about the author Jan Fleischhauar, but it appears he upset the whole of Italy, now he is trying to do the same to the UK, can you find someone more credible than these people?

Here is a snippet from wiki.

 

In January 2012 Jan Fleischhauer in S.P.O.N. – Der Schwarze Kanal compared the Italian people to Francesco Schettino, the captain of the Costa Concordia.^[12] Italian newspapers criticized this comparison, considering his tone "racist".^[13][14] The Italian Ambassador in Germany, in a direct reaction to what SPON published below the column, recommended to "leave generalizations for the sake of race", and criticized Fleischhauer's contribution as "vulgar and banal assertions.".^[15] The Italian newspaper Il Giornale titled on the following 27 January, the Tag des Gedenkens an die Opfer des Nationalsozialismus, with "We have Schettino, you have Auschwitz".^[16][17]

 

????????

[Patriot1066]

20 minutes ago, mommysboy said:

It was a joke!!

Ooooooo well I fell for it lol ????????????

[CanterbrigianBangkoker]

44 minutes ago, vogie said:

I don't know much about the author Jan Fleischhauar, but it appears he upset the whole of Italy, now he is trying to do the same to the UK, can you find someone more credible than these people?

Here is a snippet from wiki.

 

In January 2012 Jan Fleischhauer in S.P.O.N. – Der Schwarze Kanal compared the Italian people to Francesco Schettino, the captain of the Costa Concordia.^[12] Italian newspapers criticized this comparison, considering his tone "racist".^[13][14] The Italian Ambassador in Germany, in a direct reaction to what SPON published below the column, recommended to "leave generalizations for the sake of race", and criticized Fleischhauer's contribution as "vulgar and banal assertions.".^[15] The Italian newspaper Il Giornale titled on the following 27 January, the Tag des Gedenkens an die Opfer des Nationalsozialismus, with "We have Schettino, you have Auschwitz".^[16][17]

 

From this so called 'journalist' 's ????  article in, you guessed it - The Guardian.:

 

'First the trucks will be jammed all the way to Wales, because the borders are back. Then the fuel will run out at filling stations and medicines will run out in pharmacies. And once all the Polish plumbers have gone home, there will be nobody to call when the toilet gets blocked.'

 

'Go ahead. A hard Brexit will cost the rest of us a lot – there’s no question about that – but it is nothing compared to what is awaiting you Britons'.

 

'So there you are: left in your water-damaged homes, without fuel and aspirins, but with extremely bad-tempered Russians as neighbours'

 

...the government in London wouldn’t speak up for right-thinking people who want to stay close to the EU.' 

 

Pure conjecture, insult and unfounded scaremongering. Typical BS, but it's worrying that a load of partisan horse**** like this passes for journalism these days and is taken seriously / circulated in a broadsheet anywhere in Europe. Highly hypocritical too, considering the state of Germany in recent years and the views of an increasing number of his compatriots. He is a dodgy, dodgy character himself who has managed to enrage large portions of foreign nations with his bizarre diatribes and histrionic nonsense.

 

 

Edited November 6, 2018 by CanterbrigianBangkoker

[melvinmelvin]

37 minutes ago, sandyf said:

The UK, supposedly one of the richest countries in the world, is now under investigation by the UN for extreme poverty. Bottom line is the UK government has little concern for the people, otherwise they would not have embarked on a course of action that will only increase the numbers in poverty.

The money wasted on the administration of the brexit fiasco could have gone a long way to help resolve the ever growing problems in essential services. From day one it was brexit means brexit whatever the cost, and people are now starting to realise what the cost could actually look like.

 

London (CNN)The United Nations has launched an investigation into extreme levels of poverty in one of the richest countries in the world: the United Kingdom.

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/11/05/uk/uk-austerity-un-rapporteur-intl/index.html

 

surprised?

this is the fruits of the continues embrace of Tory - sometimes I think pommy is beyond help

[vinny41]

41 minutes ago, vogie said:

I don't know much about the author Jan Fleischhauar, but it appears he upset the whole of Italy, now he is trying to do the same to the UK, can you find someone more credible than these people?

Here is a snippet from wiki.

 

In January 2012 Jan Fleischhauer in S.P.O.N. – Der Schwarze Kanal compared the Italian people to Francesco Schettino, the captain of the Costa Concordia.^[12] Italian newspapers criticized this comparison, considering his tone "racist".^[13][14] The Italian Ambassador in Germany, in a direct reaction to what SPON published below the column, recommended to "leave generalizations for the sake of race", and criticized Fleischhauer's contribution as "vulgar and banal assertions.".^[15] The Italian newspaper Il Giornale titled on the following 27 January, the Tag des Gedenkens an die Opfer des Nationalsozialismus, with "We have Schettino, you have Auschwitz".^[16][17]

 

He not a fan of Brexit Here an article he wrote 28 June 2016

But it seems simply unimaginable that a person with a university education and promising employment could possibly vote to leave the EU. If people voluntarily leave a club that the other members praise as being heaven on earth, then a slight of that nature can best be coped with by repudiating the stupidity of the naysayer.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/brexit-is-merkel-to-blame-a-1100303.html

[vinny41]

2 hours ago, SheungWan said:

One might almost hope that here was an academic who had written peer-reviewed research papers on bias and accuracy of opinion polls rather than the default uneducated Brexiteer know-nothing.

Clearly someone that understands more about opinion polls than yourself lets see poll sample 20,000 , 650 Parliamentary constituencies  = 30 people per Parliamentary constituencies , were the people that were polled eligible to vote answer unknown , how many people were interviewed in the street answer zero Survation interviewed 20,000 people online between October 20 and November 2.  How were people selected to take part  If you would like to be part of the conversation, and participate in our future polling join us; https://panel.survation.com/ 

As stated pointless poll not a true representation of eligible voters

[Patriot1066]

2 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

Clearly someone that understands more about opinion polls than yourself lets see poll sample 20,000 , 650 Parliamentary constituencies  = 30 people per Parliamentary constituencies , were the people that were polled eligible to vote answer unknown , how many people were interviewed in the street answer zero Survation interviewed 20,000 people online between October 20 and November 2.  How were people selected to take part  If you would like to be part of the conversation, and participate in our future polling join us; https://panel.survation.com/ 

As stated pointless poll not a true representation of eligible voters

Not a representative sample far too small.

[Guest]

At this point I wonder wether it will be full cancellation of brexit or UK going towards EU's customs union solution.

 

Brexit seems to have made an full u-turn over the past few weeks.

 

Sober thoughts finally. 

[tebee]

 

[nontabury]

10 hours ago, tebee said:

Brexit is teaching Britain its true place in the world

Politicians and voters alike have nourished delusions about the nation’s global role

 

https://www.ft.com/content/29468d52-e0e5-11e8-8e70-5e22a430c1ad

 

 

The philosophy of Brexit was that, freed of EU constraints, the UK would take its rightful place in the world. This is indeed what is happening, but alas that place is not as the great power of their imagination. The UK’s place in the world is hardly terrible but, as Mr Johnson learnt during his brief but undistinguished term as foreign secretary, our emissaries no longer bestride summits like Castlereagh.
 

 

 

Nobody thinks we are a now a powerful country, but neither are we a lightweight, except for the remoaner element in our population.

Unfortunately these same remoaners are giving hope to the Bureacrats in Brussels, that they will still be able to block the democratic will of the people,as has happened in other countries,R.I, France, The Netherlands,Denmark, and in so doing,ensure that we continue to make our charitable contributions to the despised E.U.

  

[nontabury]

10 hours ago, tebee said:

Politicians have not been honest about Brexit.

 

All the paths available at this point will damage us. They will damage the poorest most. 

But nobody has been honest. They are still promising great things just over the horizon.

 

 

To weather the kind of pain that is coming, the government need people to believe in them. Enough people believed austerity was necessary - including a fair number who were hard hit - for them to survive.

 

 

But, many people don't  believe in Brexit. If people have changed their mind before we even start.  Then, boy, a hard rain's a-gonna fall.

 

Some MPs are  fond of telling us we must back Chequers because stopping Brexit would lead to unrest and the rise of the far right. 

I rather fear he may have the right fear, but the wrong path to avoiding 

Try and be honest, what you really mean, when you say Brexit will be damaging, is that it may be damaging to selfish remoaners, who are residents in the E.U. 

[nontabury]

8 hours ago, SheungWan said:

The important thing is the trend and that is moving against Brexit.

 

I would be very surprised if it was otherwise, seeing that the establishment and their lap dogs are so afraid of the decision taken by the British people.

[BwindiBoy]

11 hours ago, Patriot1066 said:

We area place in London called white collar boxing. I'd love to meet Owen there ????

You're letting yourself down now, Patriot, as you just sound like a wanna be hard man bully.

[billd766]

2 hours ago, whatsupdoc said:

Another view on Brexit from outside the UK:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/nov/06/britain-foolish-decline-boris-johnson 

What a load of cobblers. Of course it IS the Guardian and it IS only an opinion from a columnist of Der Spiegel so we must take as the truth and totally unbiased.

Edited November 6, 2018 by billd766
edited for bad spelling after I had posted it.

[nontabury]

2 hours ago, mommysboy said:

You'll just have more immigrants from outside the EU, and anyway the EU migrants already here will be staying. One advantage for a Labour supporter like me is that they'll likely get a vote and it won't be Tory.

The biggest losers in the Brexit debate is Labour.

Historically Labour has always relied upon the loyalty of the traditional Labour supporters. This I sense is now changing. Many now realise that the Labour Party does not in fact represent their interests, and if the people’s vote were to be overturned,the backlash against Labour, could well see a replication of events in Scotland.

Edited November 6, 2018 by nontabury

[nontabury]

1 hour ago, sandyf said:

The UK, supposedly one of the richest countries in the world, is now under investigation by the UN for extreme poverty. Bottom line is the UK government has little concern for the people, otherwise they would not have embarked on a course of action that will only increase the numbers in poverty.

The money wasted on the administration of the brexit fiasco could have gone a long way to help resolve the ever growing problems in essential services. From day one it was brexit means brexit whatever the cost, and people are now starting to realise what the cost could actually look like.

 

London (CNN)The United Nations has launched an investigation into extreme levels of poverty in one of the richest countries in the world: the United Kingdom.

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/11/05/uk/uk-austerity-un-rapporteur-intl/index.html

 

Is this the same country, that is enduring greater poverty, while being a member of the hated E.U.?

We are continually told by remoaners that the E.U.protects workers rights. Well I‘ve  got news for you. The reality is anything but so, when you have temporary contracts, sometimes of only 4hrs a week,paying wages of £7.83 per hour. It reminds me of the workers rights from the 50’s.

And no, I don’t automatically think it will improve when we leave the E.U.

but neither do I think that the E.U has worked for the lower paid, BIG businesses yes, and of course for those in the establishment.

 

 

[nontabury]

2 hours ago, sandyf said:

So you think the SNP have got it wrong in promoting the campaign on frozen pensions.

The SNP can support anything, while not being in power in Westminster, same goes for the Labour Party. It’s just empty support. Remember Steve Webb MP who while a Liberal backbencher, 100% supported all pensioners, having their state pensions increased yearly. He then  completely changed his veiw, when he was the pension minister during the coalition government.

 Would it not be possible for Holyrood to make the difference up for those ex-pat Scottish pensioners, as they seem very keen to spend other people’s money.

Edited November 6, 2018 by nontabury

[Patriot1066]

1 minute ago, nontabury said:

The SNP can support anything, while not being in power in Westminster, same goes for the Labour Party. It’s just empty support. Remember Steve Webb MP who while a Liberal backbencher, 100% supported all pensioners, having their state pensions increased yearly. He then  completely changed his veiw, when he was the pension minister during the coalition government.

 Would it not be possible for Holyrood to make the difference up for those ex-pat Scottish pensioners, as they seem very keen to spend other people’s money.

No they are too busy encouraging more 'new Scotts, that in the long term might cost them independence!

[kwilco]

It beggars belief tht anyone can be so paranoid prejudiced and twisted to think Brexit was ever a good idea or even practical.

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/11/01/brexit-could-cause-serious-damage-for-foreign-investment-into-the-uk-new-study-says.html?fbclid=IwAR2JDpKmfbSbAatUE6hbFURKk2896uwYRaoy1Afo9XnTreQ5XSKL6Lv4qYk

 

[mommysboy]

Disquieting. 

 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-latest-deal-lawyers-letter-final-say-peoples-vote-second-referendum-a8617506.html

 

“In 2016, the nature of the negotiation process and its outcome were unknown. Voters faced a choice between a known reality and an unknown alternative.

“In the campaign, untestable claims took the place of facts and reality.”

 

This has always been my beef!

[Patriot1066]

20 minutes ago, nontabury said:

Is this the same country, that is enduring greater poverty, while being a member of the hated E.U.?

We are continually told by remoaners that the E.U.protects workers rights. Well I‘ve  got news for you. The reality is anything but so, when you have temporary contracts, sometimes of only 4hrs a week,paying wages of £7.83 per hour. It reminds me of the workers rights from the 50’s.

And no, I don’t automatically think it will improve when we leave the E.U.

but neither do I think that the E.U has worked for the lower paid, BIG businesses yes, and of course for those in the establishment.

 

 

It does nothing for the poor it just moves people around so the fat cats can make more money. A big fat Ponzi scheme.

[BwindiBoy]

2 hours ago, sandyf said:

The UK, supposedly one of the richest countries in the world, is now under investigation by the UN for extreme poverty. Bottom line is the UK government has little concern for the people, otherwise they would not have embarked on a course of action that will only increase the numbers in poverty.

The money wasted on the administration of the brexit fiasco could have gone a long way to help resolve the ever growing problems in essential services. From day one it was brexit means brexit whatever the cost, and people are now starting to realise what the cost could actually look like.

 

London (CNN)The United Nations has launched an investigation into extreme levels of poverty in one of the richest countries in the world: the United Kingdom.

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/11/05/uk/uk-austerity-un-rapporteur-intl/index.html

 

And this poverty occurred whilst in the E.U. right? So much for the E.U. Protecting its citizens! P.S. How much does it cost to move the E.U. Parliament from Brussels to Strasbourg every month? Considerably more than the cost of administering Brexit!