Can I own a unit in a commercial building?

[cncltd1973]

My wife of 14 years and I have bought 4 units in a commercial building, the kind where you open a business on the ground level and live above it (3 stories total). She will transfer the units to her name next week, but needs me there to sign that I will allow her to buy the units - presumably since my name can't be on the property. Of the 14 million baht purchase, 10 million is hers from before our marriage. She has no children, we met and married in the USA where she was living for 20 years before, and we've been married for 14 years and have registered our marriage in Thailand a couple years ago.

 

I presume I'm secure in case of divorce or death, since her only living parent is 85 years old, and she's childless. We plan to make a will before I return to the states next month. I've read so many heartbreakers on this forum, and it makes me a little paranoid. I'd feel better if my name can somehow be on the deed, but I think the units come with the land it sits on. Does someone know or have some advice on this process?

[ukrules]

6 minutes ago, cncltd1973 said:

needs me there to sign that I will allow her to buy the units

This sounds like the form you need to sign stating that every Baht of the money used to purchase the land / buildings comes from the Thai national.

 

I believe it's compulsory if a Thai is married to a foreigner but I'm sure someone will come along and correct me if I'm mistaken.

 

[NCC1701A]

you should talk to a good attorney and get this set up properly.

 

14 mil baht is a lot of money.

[blackcab]

You can own a commercial unit in any building that is registered as a condominium, whether on the ground floor or not. In some cases, commercial buildings are registered as condominiums to enable each business to own their own unit, have a blue book and receive their own government electricity meter.

 

If the building you are referring to is registered in this way, then yes, you can own the unit, subject to the standard conditions that:

 

• the ratio of foreign unit ownership does not exceed 49 per cent (this almost never happens with commercial buildings)
• the building management provide the seller with a letter stating this
• the unit is debt free
• the building management provide the seller with another letter stating this
• the funds used to purchase the unit are brought into Thailand as foreign currency and exchanged here, and you as the purchaser have a Foreign Exchange Transaction form from the bank to prove this (or a letter from the bank if the amounts brought in were less than USD 50,000 per transaction)

[smutcakes]

As Blackcab mentions if they are registered as Juristic you can buy. Many of the older office buildings are strata title with the office being individually titled chanotes which can be sold and bought like condominium units, with the restrictions on foreign ownership as per a residential condominium.

 

Sathorn Thani Building (Standard Chartered) CTI Tower on Asok, The Lakes and Charn Issara Tower are some like this.

[3421abc]

The commercial units are talk about sound like a ”shophouse”. I have been wanting to purchase those and it seems to be off limits for foreigners. I was looking into open a company and purchase them.

You could open a company and have a certain amount of shares under your name to cover the unit you purchased.

I am not sure how much more complicated it would become to purchase as a company instead of an individual.

[NCC1701A]

On 9/6/2018 at 4:42 PM, cncltd1973 said:

My wife of 14 years and I have bought 4 units in a commercial building, the kind where you open a business on the ground level and live above it (3 stories total).

you mean you supplied some of the money but your wife is actually buying it, correct?

 

On 9/6/2018 at 4:42 PM, cncltd1973 said:

She will transfer the units to her name next week, but needs me there to sign that I will allow her to buy the units - presumably since my name can't be on the property.

transferred from the previous owners correct? this is a confusing statement about allowing to buy

 

On 9/6/2018 at 4:42 PM, cncltd1973 said:

I presume I'm secure in case of divorce or death, since her only living parent is 85 years old, and she's childless.

brothers sisters? everybody in her family will come after that 14 million baht. a huge sum of money here.   

[cncltd1973]

3 hours ago, 3421abc said:

The commercial units are talk about sound like a ”shophouse”. I have been wanting to purchase those and it seems to be off limits for foreigners. I was looking into open a company and purchase them.

You could open a company and have a certain amount of shares under your name to cover the unit you purchased.

I am not sure how much more complicated it would become to purchase as a company instead of an individual.

Yes, "shophouse" seems to describe the function.

The lawyer we met went through the steps to maintain a corporation, and as he describes, it requires monthly bookkeeping by an accountant and annual tax filing by a CPA, along with 30% tax rate on profit. The lawyer is recommending a will instead, and mentioned a new policy change in wills that is coming in 6 months time that can give foreigners up to 100% of the assets. He mentioned the Thai gov't is making moves to protect foreigners' investments more and the laws are changing in the very near future.(?)

[cncltd1973]

57 minutes ago, NCC1701A said:

you mean you supplied some of the money but your wife is actually buying it, correct?

 

transferred from the previous owners correct? this is a confusing statement about allowing to buy

 

brothers sisters? everybody in her family will come after that 14 million baht. a huge sum of money here.   

Correct on #1

Correct on #2

She has 2 sisters: one is rich with businesses - has a new Benz, gold shop and a few plastic goods shops, the other sister isn't. Does a will protect me?

[blackcab]

14 hours ago, cncltd1973 said:

Yes, "shophouse" seems to describe the function.

The lawyer we met went through the steps to maintain a corporation, and as he describes, it requires monthly bookkeeping by an accountant and annual tax filing by a CPA, along with 30% tax rate on profit. The lawyer is recommending a will instead, and mentioned a new policy change in wills that is coming in 6 months time that can give foreigners up to 100% of the assets. He mentioned the Thai gov't is making moves to protect foreigners' investments more and the laws are changing in the very near future.(?)

 

Firstly, as a foreigner, you cannot own land in Thailand. You can, however, set up a company structure that enables you to maintain control of the land. You should be aware, though, that while many people do this, there is considerable discussion over whether setting up a company in this way is a wise move. Some people argue that everything is ok, while others argue that the government will crack down one day, and people who have used these corporate structures will regret their actions.

 

Moving on, the corporate income tax rate is either 15 or 20 per cent. Check section 5 here:

 

http://www.rd.go.th/publish/6044.0.html

 

That's a very basic error your lawyer made.

 

As for the law changing in 6 months, I think you need to ask your lawyer exactly which law he is talking about, and at exactly what stage is the law at in the National Legislative Assembly (NLA). He should be able to give you a direct answer without procrastinating.

 

What you need to understand is that as a sole beneficiary you have always been able to receive 100 per cent of the assets. If you inherit real estate (except a condo), however, you have one year to sell the property.

 

I can assure you that the law regarding a foreigner being required to dispose of inherited property is not going to change in 6 months or 6 years.

[KittenKong]

Whilst there are laws/rules in place to oblige a foreigner to declare zero interest in property that is purchased in their spouse's name, I wonder to what extent these would apply to a loan made by the foreigner to the Thai spouse after the purchase, with the property used as security? Or are such loans unenforceable due to the marital shared asset concept?

 

As someone who would never have a Thai life partner or business partner under any circumstances it isnt something that concerns me personally so I have never given it much thought, but I can see how it might be of interest to others.

[digbeth]

I've seen buildings where there's a shared carpark on the first level making a sort of 'basement' and there's a shophouse or town house like office block that appears detached/semi-detached above the car park level, some with garden or swimming pool in the middle above the car park, they must definitely be using condo title as there's a need for common upkeep. But when does a condo / moo baan definition lies? there's both juristic person, even house in a moo baan will share walls(fence) with the common area/neighbor just like a condo building.

 

Enterprising developers could try to make a village with condo title and sell sort of detached house to expats this way.

[NanLaew]

8 hours ago, blackcab said:

As for the law changing in 6 months, I think you need to ask your lawyer exactly which law he is talking about, and at exactly what stage is the law at in the National Legislative Assembly (NLA). He should be able to give you a direct answer without procrastinating.

I would suggest the OP ask ANOTHER lawyer since the one he's already communicating with has already blown smoke up his kilt with the 30% tax bullsh!t. Maybe the lawyers 'very basic error' was actually the lawyers planned 10-15% annual bonus?

[blackcab]

1 hour ago, digbeth said:

But when does a condo / moo baan definition lies?

 

To be a legal condominium the property must be registered as a condominium at the Land Office.

 

A moo baan is a private housing project where each house has it's own title deed. There is no formal definition or statutory regulation that can be compared to a registered condominium.

[blackcab]

1 hour ago, KittenKong said:

Whilst there are laws/rules in place to oblige a foreigner to declare zero interest in property that is purchased in their spouse's name, I wonder to what extent these would apply to a loan made by the foreigner to the Thai spouse after the purchase, with the property used as security? Or are such loans unenforceable due to the marital shared asset concept?

 

That's a tricky one. This article (last paragraph) gives some support to the argument that a non-Thai lending money to a Thai person is illegal:

 

http://www.khaosodenglish.com/news/crimecourtscalamity/crime-crime/2016/11/25/1464782716/

 

However, you specifically mentioned lending to a Thai wife. In normal marital relations it is usual for the husband to support their wife.

 

There is no problem with the wife being able to cancel the loan if it was legally registered on the title deed. The wife cannot cancel as a mortgage is a real property right. 

 

The problem would be getting to the Land Office to register a mortgage in favour if the non-Thai husband. I'm not going to say it's impossible, but in my opinion I don't think it's going to happen. I would be happy to be proved wrong on this though.

 

So, if a non-Thai has loaned their Thai wife money and the loan was legally secured against a property title as a mortgage and recorded on the back of the title at the Land Office, please do speak up as your experience would be helpful to others.

[mogandave]

If you’ve been married 15 years and it’s mostly her money, what’s the big deal?

Get an attorney.